Ceiling of Evan Mobley

[WeTheNorth123]

Anthony Davis

Exactly. With some body development, that’s exactly who I see him becoming like as well.

He actually seems more nimble/quick on his feet.

I don't think there's a perfect comparison and I already know how I can get flamed for the comparison I'm about to make but defensively the closest thing I can see (and it's definitely rough footage lol) is something like (keywords -- not exact) Bill Russell who actually had VERY similar measurements and overall size.

He seems less athletic/explosive tho!

[hoosierdaddy34]

Anthony Davis

Exactly. With some body development, that’s exactly who I see him becoming like as well.

He actually seems more nimble/quick on his feet.

I don't think there's a perfect comparison and I already know how I can get flamed for the comparison I'm about to make but defensively the closest thing I can see (and it's definitely rough footage lol) is something like (keywords -- not exact) Bill Russell who actually had VERY similar measurements and overall size.

Comparisons going that far back are difficult because the game is played drastically different today and skill sets don’t translate.

[Lalouie]

much to my chagrin mobley took a dumpster fire of a usc program and gave it validity, taking them deep into the playoffs in the process. and he seems to be doing similar @cavs.

lots of players put up numbers and their teams show squat for it. but evan is the real deal, and i'll use my favorite whipping boy, ayton, as a counterpoint. evan seems to know what to do while ayton is all thumbs and did squadoosh for ua

[Golden Knight]

How is he doing vs the rookie year of JJJ?

Mobley is the much better rebounder but the perimeter shooting is not there yet.

[ChuckChilly]

He's Chris Bosh with balls

[hippesthippo]

Basically the Cavs are night and day when Mobility is on the floor. Long season will have his ups and down but one thing is for sure he brings winning impact.

His one of those players that are better than his raw stats and will be an advanced stat darling.

Oooooooo I like that nickname!

So far he's looking like a better pick than Cade Cunningham.

Being wrong on Wiseman soured me on big men prospects and led me to underrate Mobley. Sometimes defense is just really hard to judge.

[sisibilio]

Exactly. With some body development, that’s exactly who I see him becoming like as well.

He actually seems more nimble/quick on his feet.

I don't think there's a perfect comparison and I already know how I can get flamed for the comparison I'm about to make but defensively the closest thing I can see (and it's definitely rough footage lol) is something like (keywords -- not exact) Bill Russell who actually had VERY similar measurements and overall size.

He seems less athletic/explosive tho!

Nothing to be ashamed of. Russell was an olympic level highjumper

[ShootersShoot]

Looks like a perennial all star big but may need a few seasons to get there

[10giz]

The only rookie player that's better than Scottie Barnes right now

No rookie is better than Barnes right now, Mobley included.

Mobley is a clear number one for me. Barnes is obviously two but bigs with Mobleys type ability only come along every 10 years or so.

That's fair.

But this league is no longer about bigs. It's about the biggest wings. Mobley has what, 3 inches on Barnes? That's it and it's entirely possible Barnes can add an inch or three as well.

Same wingspan. Barnes has what, 10-20 pounds on Mobley. Destroyed the combine in terms of agility drills and vertical. Bigger hands.

We've heard this before though. AD, KAT, Ayton, Embiid. Others like KP, JJJ, Then you got the ones who came out of nowhere like Jokic. Not to mention the slew of other bigs taken top 5 year after year who were super hyped to no avail. So definitely not once in every 10 years but his skillset is IMO the most unique of all those bigs sans AD and Jokic. ****, personally, I'd currently take Bam over all of them and if Mobley can become that, it would be considered a massive success as I believe he's the type of big needed to win. There's a reason no elite C's or PGs lead their teams to titles (barring some very particular outliers),

Now conversely, how many huge wings with Barnes skillset have a there been? Ones who can legitimately play PG? Ones who have elite defensive potential. Ones with high basketball IQ? The list is even smaller. Usually those types are far more raw and rarely develop to their full potential.

I just feel that Barnes is a better/more versatile defender (I absolutely do not quantify defensive by blocks and steals), better rebounder, better playmaker, more athletic/mobile/strong. He doesn't''t have Mobleys offensive skillset or potential but so far, that hasn't mattered as he's clearly able to score efficiently however he can. The biggest knock on Barnes was his offence and shooting and he's literally leading our team in scoring essentially with hustle buckets while showing significantly more polish than anyone predicted. He's already shown he can bully players like Sabonis and Vucevic too.

My biggest worry with Mobley is the same as all bigs...unless he somehow becomes a hyper elite scorer from the perimeter, he will need to put on some weight otherwise he's gonna get beat up over the course of the season and that's a very tricky balance as he relies incredibly on his incredibly lateral movement ability.

Finally, the one factor that clearly separates the two - personality/disposition. Mobley is a quiet, soft spoken type. Nothing wrong with that and doesn't mean you can't be successful like that. Barnes is the polar opposite. He's already the most vocal and emotional leader of the team. That's something he definitely has in common with Kyle Lowry and frankly, although it is something that's hard to quantify, the fact that he's basically leading our team in scoring, rebounding (would be defence too if OG wasn't so **** good) and hustle/energy to me proves that those leadership skills are real. A 20 year old leading by example the way he has is something I put a tremendous amount of stock in.

In the end, I love Mobley too. Wish Raptors had him as well but I'm of the opinion that no matter how good Mobley becomes, even if he reaches MVP levels like Jokic, it's still a wings league. I **** hope they can develop his body the right way because if they can, Ouuuuffff. He'll be special. Even more than he already is.

[God Squad]

No rookie is better than Barnes right now, Mobley included.

Mobley is a clear number one for me. Barnes is obviously two but bigs with Mobleys type ability only come along every 10 years or so.

That's fair.

But this league is no longer about bigs. It's about the biggest wings. Mobley has what, 3 inches on Barnes? That's it and it's entirely possible Barnes can add an inch or three as well.

Same wingspan. Barnes has what, 10-20 pounds on Mobley. Destroyed the combine in terms of agility drills and vertical. Bigger hands.

We've heard this before though. AD, KAT, Ayton, Embiid. Others like KP, JJJ, Then you got the ones who came out of nowhere like Jokic. Not to mention the slew of other bigs taken top 5 year after year who were super hyped to no avail. So definitely not once in every 10 years but his skillset is IMO the most unique of all those bigs sans AD and Jokic. ****, personally, I'd currently take Bam over all of them and if Mobley can become that, it would be considered a massive success as I believe he's the type of big needed to win. There's a reason no elite C's or PGs lead their teams to titles (barring some very particular outliers),

Now conversely, how many huge wings with Barnes skillset have a there been? Ones who can legitimately play PG? Ones who have elite defensive potential. Ones with high basketball IQ? The list is even smaller. Usually those types are far more raw and rarely develop to their full potential.

I just feel that Barnes is a better/more versatile defender (I absolutely do not quantify defensive by blocks and steals), better rebounder, better playmaker, more athletic/mobile/strong. He doesn't''t have Mobleys offensive skillset or potential but so far, that hasn't mattered as he's clearly able to score efficiently however he can. The biggest knock on Barnes was his offence and shooting and he's literally leading our team in scoring essentially with hustle buckets while showing significantly more polish than anyone predicted. He's already shown he can bully players like Sabonis and Vucevic too.

My biggest worry with Mobley is the same as all bigs...unless he somehow becomes a hyper elite scorer from the perimeter, he will need to put on some weight otherwise he's gonna get beat up over the course of the season and that's a very tricky balance as he relies incredibly on his incredibly lateral movement ability.

Finally, the one factor that clearly separates the two - personality/disposition. Mobley is a quiet, soft spoken type. Nothing wrong with that and doesn't mean you can't be successful like that. Barnes is the polar opposite. He's already the most vocal and emotional leader of the team. That's something he definitely has in common with Kyle Lowry and frankly, although it is something that's hard to quantify, the fact that he's basically leading our team in scoring, rebounding (would be defence too if OG wasn't so **** good) and hustle/energy to me proves that those leadership skills are real. A 20 year old leading by example the way he has is something I put a tremendous amount of stock in.

In the end, I love Mobley too. Wish Raptors had him as well but I'm of the opinion that no matter how good Mobley becomes, even if he reaches MVP levels like Jokic, it's still a wings league. I **** hope they can develop his body the right way because if they can, Ouuuuffff. He'll be special. Even more than he already is.

You're way to invested/emotionally charged with this Barnes/Mobley chatter. Go to sleep

[jeeph]

Basically the Cavs are night and day when Mobility is on the floor. Long season will have his ups and down but one thing is for sure he brings winning impact.

His one of those players that are better than his raw stats and will be an advanced stat darling.

Oooooooo I like that nickname!

So far he's looking like a better pick than Cade Cunningham.

Being wrong on Wiseman soured me on big men prospects and led me to underrate Mobley. Sometimes defense is just really hard to judge.

I heard and like the nickname Slim Dunkin.

[10giz]

Mobley is a clear number one for me. Barnes is obviously two but bigs with Mobleys type ability only come along every 10 years or so.

That's fair.

But this league is no longer about bigs. It's about the biggest wings. Mobley has what, 3 inches on Barnes? That's it and it's entirely possible Barnes can add an inch or three as well.

Same wingspan. Barnes has what, 10-20 pounds on Mobley. Destroyed the combine in terms of agility drills and vertical. Bigger hands.

We've heard this before though. AD, KAT, Ayton, Embiid. Others like KP, JJJ, Then you got the ones who came out of nowhere like Jokic. Not to mention the slew of other bigs taken top 5 year after year who were super hyped to no avail. So definitely not once in every 10 years but his skillset is IMO the most unique of all those bigs sans AD and Jokic. ****, personally, I'd currently take Bam over all of them and if Mobley can become that, it would be considered a massive success as I believe he's the type of big needed to win. There's a reason no elite C's or PGs lead their teams to titles (barring some very particular outliers),

Now conversely, how many huge wings with Barnes skillset have a there been? Ones who can legitimately play PG? Ones who have elite defensive potential. Ones with high basketball IQ? The list is even smaller. Usually those types are far more raw and rarely develop to their full potential.

I just feel that Barnes is a better/more versatile defender (I absolutely do not quantify defensive by blocks and steals), better rebounder, better playmaker, more athletic/mobile/strong. He doesn't''t have Mobleys offensive skillset or potential but so far, that hasn't mattered as he's clearly able to score efficiently however he can. The biggest knock on Barnes was his offence and shooting and he's literally leading our team in scoring essentially with hustle buckets while showing significantly more polish than anyone predicted. He's already shown he can bully players like Sabonis and Vucevic too.

My biggest worry with Mobley is the same as all bigs...unless he somehow becomes a hyper elite scorer from the perimeter, he will need to put on some weight otherwise he's gonna get beat up over the course of the season and that's a very tricky balance as he relies incredibly on his incredibly lateral movement ability.

Finally, the one factor that clearly separates the two - personality/disposition. Mobley is a quiet, soft spoken type. Nothing wrong with that and doesn't mean you can't be successful like that. Barnes is the polar opposite. He's already the most vocal and emotional leader of the team. That's something he definitely has in common with Kyle Lowry and frankly, although it is something that's hard to quantify, the fact that he's basically leading our team in scoring, rebounding (would be defence too if OG wasn't so **** good) and hustle/energy to me proves that those leadership skills are real. A 20 year old leading by example the way he has is something I put a tremendous amount of stock in.

In the end, I love Mobley too. Wish Raptors had him as well but I'm of the opinion that no matter how good Mobley becomes, even if he reaches MVP levels like Jokic, it's still a wings league. I **** hope they can develop his body the right way because if they can, Ouuuuffff. He'll be special. Even more than he already is.

You're way to invested/emotionally charged with this Barnes/Mobley chatter. Go to sleep

The **** about what I wrote is emotionally charged at all? I'm on a **** basketball forum trying to discuss basketball sensibly by offering my opinion respectfully.

More importantly, who are you to tell anybody to stop posting and go to sleep. The entire point of this place is to discuss basketball amongst like minded people who love basketball.

Go to sleep? Child please. Show some more respect to people you don't know. It's a good habit to build.

Just because I actually try to put some soul and effort into what I post without acting like an entitled chump who's too lazy or incapable or a retort. Useless...

[hoosierdaddy34]

No rookie is better than Barnes right now, Mobley included.

Mobley is a clear number one for me. Barnes is obviously two but bigs with Mobleys type ability only come along every 10 years or so.

That's fair.

But this league is no longer about bigs. It's about the biggest wings. Mobley has what, 3 inches on Barnes? That's it and it's entirely possible Barnes can add an inch or three as well.

Same wingspan. Barnes has what, 10-20 pounds on Mobley. Destroyed the combine in terms of agility drills and vertical. Bigger hands.

We've heard this before though. AD, KAT, Ayton, Embiid. Others like KP, JJJ, Then you got the ones who came out of nowhere like Jokic. Not to mention the slew of other bigs taken top 5 year after year who were super hyped to no avail. So definitely not once in every 10 years but his skillset is IMO the most unique of all those bigs sans AD and Jokic. ****, personally, I'd currently take Bam over all of them and if Mobley can become that, it would be considered a massive success as I believe he's the type of big needed to win. There's a reason no elite C's or PGs lead their teams to titles (barring some very particular outliers),

Now conversely, how many huge wings with Barnes skillset have a there been? Ones who can legitimately play PG? Ones who have elite defensive potential. Ones with high basketball IQ? The list is even smaller. Usually those types are far more raw and rarely develop to their full potential.

I just feel that Barnes is a better/more versatile defender (I absolutely do not quantify defensive by blocks and steals), better rebounder, better playmaker, more athletic/mobile/strong. He doesn't''t have Mobleys offensive skillset or potential but so far, that hasn't mattered as he's clearly able to score efficiently however he can. The biggest knock on Barnes was his offence and shooting and he's literally leading our team in scoring essentially with hustle buckets while showing significantly more polish than anyone predicted. He's already shown he can bully players like Sabonis and Vucevic too.

My biggest worry with Mobley is the same as all bigs...unless he somehow becomes a hyper elite scorer from the perimeter, he will need to put on some weight otherwise he's gonna get beat up over the course of the season and that's a very tricky balance as he relies incredibly on his incredibly lateral movement ability.

Finally, the one factor that clearly separates the two - personality/disposition. Mobley is a quiet, soft spoken type. Nothing wrong with that and doesn't mean you can't be successful like that. Barnes is the polar opposite. He's already the most vocal and emotional leader of the team. That's something he definitely has in common with Kyle Lowry and frankly, although it is something that's hard to quantify, the fact that he's basically leading our team in scoring, rebounding (would be defence too if OG wasn't so **** good) and hustle/energy to me proves that those leadership skills are real. A 20 year old leading by example the way he has is something I put a tremendous amount of stock in.

In the end, I love Mobley too. Wish Raptors had him as well but I'm of the opinion that no matter how good Mobley becomes, even if he reaches MVP levels like Jokic, it's still a wings league. I **** hope they can develop his body the right way because if they can, Ouuuuffff. He'll be special. Even more than he already is.

I’ll push back a bit and say it was a wing league 5 years ago but times are changing again.

Last two champions have had AD and Giannis on them. I think it’s clear that a multi faceted, elite big man is right at the top of the list of things you want to build a champion. Again not a knock on Barnes, I just think a elite mobile big still puts your team right at the top of the league. Not to mention guys like Embiid and Jokic who you mentioned are also good enough to put their teams into deep playoff runs every year. Remember Philly was a Kawhi shot that rattled in at the buzzer from eliminating the Raptors in 2018. Jokic might have been a Murray injury away last year of making the finals. So bigs are starting to take back over this league.

As far as body development for Mobley, these nba strength and conditioning guys are the best in the world at it. Mobleys body won’t look near the same in three years time, look at young pictures of AD till now. It’s huge difference.

[10giz]

Mobley is a clear number one for me. Barnes is obviously two but bigs with Mobleys type ability only come along every 10 years or so.

That's fair.

But this league is no longer about bigs. It's about the biggest wings. Mobley has what, 3 inches on Barnes? That's it and it's entirely possible Barnes can add an inch or three as well.

Same wingspan. Barnes has what, 10-20 pounds on Mobley. Destroyed the combine in terms of agility drills and vertical. Bigger hands.

We've heard this before though. AD, KAT, Ayton, Embiid. Others like KP, JJJ, Then you got the ones who came out of nowhere like Jokic. Not to mention the slew of other bigs taken top 5 year after year who were super hyped to no avail. So definitely not once in every 10 years but his skillset is IMO the most unique of all those bigs sans AD and Jokic. ****, personally, I'd currently take Bam over all of them and if Mobley can become that, it would be considered a massive success as I believe he's the type of big needed to win. There's a reason no elite C's or PGs lead their teams to titles (barring some very particular outliers),

Now conversely, how many huge wings with Barnes skillset have a there been? Ones who can legitimately play PG? Ones who have elite defensive potential. Ones with high basketball IQ? The list is even smaller. Usually those types are far more raw and rarely develop to their full potential.

I just feel that Barnes is a better/more versatile defender (I absolutely do not quantify defensive by blocks and steals), better rebounder, better playmaker, more athletic/mobile/strong. He doesn't''t have Mobleys offensive skillset or potential but so far, that hasn't mattered as he's clearly able to score efficiently however he can. The biggest knock on Barnes was his offence and shooting and he's literally leading our team in scoring essentially with hustle buckets while showing significantly more polish than anyone predicted. He's already shown he can bully players like Sabonis and Vucevic too.

My biggest worry with Mobley is the same as all bigs...unless he somehow becomes a hyper elite scorer from the perimeter, he will need to put on some weight otherwise he's gonna get beat up over the course of the season and that's a very tricky balance as he relies incredibly on his incredibly lateral movement ability.

Finally, the one factor that clearly separates the two - personality/disposition. Mobley is a quiet, soft spoken type. Nothing wrong with that and doesn't mean you can't be successful like that. Barnes is the polar opposite. He's already the most vocal and emotional leader of the team. That's something he definitely has in common with Kyle Lowry and frankly, although it is something that's hard to quantify, the fact that he's basically leading our team in scoring, rebounding (would be defence too if OG wasn't so **** good) and hustle/energy to me proves that those leadership skills are real. A 20 year old leading by example the way he has is something I put a tremendous amount of stock in.

In the end, I love Mobley too. Wish Raptors had him as well but I'm of the opinion that no matter how good Mobley becomes, even if he reaches MVP levels like Jokic, it's still a wings league. I **** hope they can develop his body the right way because if they can, Ouuuuffff. He'll be special. Even more than he already is.

Last two champions have had AD and Giannis on them. I think it’s clear that a multi faceted, elite big man is right at the top of the list of things you want to build a champion. Again not a knock on Barnes, I just think a elite mobile big still puts your team right at the top of the league. Not to mention guys like Embiid and Jokic who you mentioned are also good enough to put their teams into deep playoff runs every year. Remember Philly was a Kawhi shot that rattled in at the buzzer from eliminating the Raptors in 2018. Jokic might have been a Murray injury away last year of making the finals. So bigs are starting to take back over this league.

As far as body development for Mobley, these nba strength and conditioning guys are the best in the world at it. Mobleys body won’t look the same in three years time, look at young pictures of AD till now. It’s huge difference.

Giannis may be big measurement wise, but let's be real...he's a wing. Citing him is literally tipping the scales to Barnes as they are very eerily similar in their movements. Elite Wings are at the top of the list. Not elite big men.

AD - sure, absolutely. Stud. Like I stated - there are some outliers. Having LeBron James on your team averaging a near triple double in the playoffs, I would posit, is the reason AD is a champion. What has AD accomplished without Lebron? 13 total playoff games in 7 years?
Again - elite wing.

You can talk all you want about missed buckets, deep runs, we can go back and forth with variables all we want, in the end they don't get it done. Using last year is a particularly poor example with COVID, so many injuries, and perhaps the weakest path to the finals in years. Not a ringing endorsement.

Especially for your citation of Embiid who literally got embarrassed by an over the hill Marc Gasol. That's why the wings are the ones that win - you think Embiid is taking/making shot like that to win? Doubtful. Kawhi though, different story.

Regarding Mobleys body, I totally agree and fully hope and expect you to be right. That being said history must be taken into account here I'm not saying it's likely, just something to consider. Most of them end up missing lots of games.

Again, I hate to say this because there's no way it can be perceived without it seeming like I'm poo pooing on Mobley, which I'm not, love the kid, but at least right now, Barnes is better, contributing more and is playing a far more central role on his respective team.

FG% - Points - Rebounds - Offensive Rebounds - FGM - FTA...Categories Barnes is currently leading our team in.

[jeeph]

That's fair.

But this league is no longer about bigs. It's about the biggest wings. Mobley has what, 3 inches on Barnes? That's it and it's entirely possible Barnes can add an inch or three as well.

Same wingspan. Barnes has what, 10-20 pounds on Mobley. Destroyed the combine in terms of agility drills and vertical. Bigger hands.

We've heard this before though. AD, KAT, Ayton, Embiid. Others like KP, JJJ, Then you got the ones who came out of nowhere like Jokic. Not to mention the slew of other bigs taken top 5 year after year who were super hyped to no avail. So definitely not once in every 10 years but his skillset is IMO the most unique of all those bigs sans AD and Jokic. ****, personally, I'd currently take Bam over all of them and if Mobley can become that, it would be considered a massive success as I believe he's the type of big needed to win. There's a reason no elite C's or PGs lead their teams to titles (barring some very particular outliers),

Now conversely, how many huge wings with Barnes skillset have a there been? Ones who can legitimately play PG? Ones who have elite defensive potential. Ones with high basketball IQ? The list is even smaller. Usually those types are far more raw and rarely develop to their full potential.

I just feel that Barnes is a better/more versatile defender (I absolutely do not quantify defensive by blocks and steals), better rebounder, better playmaker, more athletic/mobile/strong. He doesn't''t have Mobleys offensive skillset or potential but so far, that hasn't mattered as he's clearly able to score efficiently however he can. The biggest knock on Barnes was his offence and shooting and he's literally leading our team in scoring essentially with hustle buckets while showing significantly more polish than anyone predicted. He's already shown he can bully players like Sabonis and Vucevic too.

My biggest worry with Mobley is the same as all bigs...unless he somehow becomes a hyper elite scorer from the perimeter, he will need to put on some weight otherwise he's gonna get beat up over the course of the season and that's a very tricky balance as he relies incredibly on his incredibly lateral movement ability.

Finally, the one factor that clearly separates the two - personality/disposition. Mobley is a quiet, soft spoken type. Nothing wrong with that and doesn't mean you can't be successful like that. Barnes is the polar opposite. He's already the most vocal and emotional leader of the team. That's something he definitely has in common with Kyle Lowry and frankly, although it is something that's hard to quantify, the fact that he's basically leading our team in scoring, rebounding (would be defence too if OG wasn't so **** good) and hustle/energy to me proves that those leadership skills are real. A 20 year old leading by example the way he has is something I put a tremendous amount of stock in.

In the end, I love Mobley too. Wish Raptors had him as well but I'm of the opinion that no matter how good Mobley becomes, even if he reaches MVP levels like Jokic, it's still a wings league. I **** hope they can develop his body the right way because if they can, Ouuuuffff. He'll be special. Even more than he already is.

Last two champions have had AD and Giannis on them. I think it’s clear that a multi faceted, elite big man is right at the top of the list of things you want to build a champion. Again not a knock on Barnes, I just think a elite mobile big still puts your team right at the top of the league. Not to mention guys like Embiid and Jokic who you mentioned are also good enough to put their teams into deep playoff runs every year. Remember Philly was a Kawhi shot that rattled in at the buzzer from eliminating the Raptors in 2018. Jokic might have been a Murray injury away last year of making the finals. So bigs are starting to take back over this league.

As far as body development for Mobley, these nba strength and conditioning guys are the best in the world at it. Mobleys body won’t look the same in three years time, look at young pictures of AD till now. It’s huge difference.

Giannis may be big measurement wise, but let's be real...he's a wing. Citing him is literally tipping the scales to Barnes as they are very eerily similar in their movements.

AD - sure, absolutely. Stud. Like I stated - there are some outliers. Having LeBron James on your team averaging a near triple double in the playoffs, I would posit, is the reason AD is a champion. What has AD accomplished without Lebron? 13 total playoff games in 7 years?

You can talk all you want about missed buckets, deep runs, we can go back and forth with variables all we want, in the end they don;'t get it done. Using last year is a particularly poor example with COVID, so many injuries, and perhaps the weakest path to the finals in years. Not a ringing endorsement.

KD, Leb

Both sides are ridiculous arguments. Do you know what position is most important? Great players. Any team that has wanted to win for a while has wanted good wing play because....you probably had to through LeBron. Curry won it as the best player with Barnes as their wing. They obviously depended very little on their wing. But Curry's not important. Duncan dominated his era not because he was big, but because he was freaking Tim Duncan. LeBron dominated because he 6'8", not because he was a great player? Shaq dominated because the rules were so different then that they just let him win titles? Talent is king, no matter what the height is.

[Hroz]

Taller Kevin Durant is his ceiling

Honestly see him as a wing not a big.

[10giz]

Last two champions have had AD and Giannis on them. I think it’s clear that a multi faceted, elite big man is right at the top of the list of things you want to build a champion. Again not a knock on Barnes, I just think a elite mobile big still puts your team right at the top of the league. Not to mention guys like Embiid and Jokic who you mentioned are also good enough to put their teams into deep playoff runs every year. Remember Philly was a Kawhi shot that rattled in at the buzzer from eliminating the Raptors in 2018. Jokic might have been a Murray injury away last year of making the finals. So bigs are starting to take back over this league.

As far as body development for Mobley, these nba strength and conditioning guys are the best in the world at it. Mobleys body won’t look the same in three years time, look at young pictures of AD till now. It’s huge difference.

Giannis may be big measurement wise, but let's be real...he's a wing. Citing him is literally tipping the scales to Barnes as they are very eerily similar in their movements.

AD - sure, absolutely. Stud. Like I stated - there are some outliers. Having LeBron James on your team averaging a near triple double in the playoffs, I would posit, is the reason AD is a champion. What has AD accomplished without Lebron? 13 total playoff games in 7 years?

You can talk all you want about missed buckets, deep runs, we can go back and forth with variables all we want, in the end they don;'t get it done. Using last year is a particularly poor example with COVID, so many injuries, and perhaps the weakest path to the finals in years. Not a ringing endorsement.

KD, Leb

Both sides are ridiculous arguments. Do you know what position is most important? Great players. Any team that has wanted to win for a while has wanted good wing play because....you probably had to through LeBron. Curry won it as the best player with Barnes as their wing. They obviously depended very little on their wing. But Curry's not important. Duncan dominated his era not because he was big, but because he was freaking Tim Duncan. LeBron dominated because he 6'8", not because he was a great player? Shaq dominated because the rules were so different then that they just let him win titles? Talent is king, no matter what the height is.

First of all, I said there are outliers. No blanket statements here, but sorry boiling it down to great players just doesn't mean ****. Great players have actually had to buddy up with 1-2 other great players to win. So yeah - if you're argument is having as many great, All-NBA caliber players is the best option, I agree. But not everyone plays fantasy GM like Lebron has for the last decade.

Giannis, Lebron, Kawhi, Curry x 2, Lebron, Curry, Kawhi, Lebron, Lebron, Dirk

Sorry but you're wrong. The only exceptions to the best wing players leading their teams to championships in the last 11 years are:

The greatest shooter of all time, playing with arguably the 2nd greatest shooter of all time, along with one of the best defenders of our generation. (Also with KD as well)

And Dirk who literally had possibly the most impressive and improbably title run in NBA History.

Talent is king, but talent is exponentially more effective and proven to win more when that talent happens to be a particularly type of player who can be elite offensively, defensively, and has the size to be able to create their own shots over whoever is guarding them.

Unless the NBA creates a 4 point line, especially with the rule changes to limit free throws, the league will remain perimeter oriented. Can that change? Absolutely, but until we see it, its not happening.

[10giz]

Taller Kevin Durant is his ceiling

Honestly see him as a wing not a big.

Saying his ceiling is KD....literally one of the greatest and most prolific scorers in the history of the NBA, is both lazy and reaching.

I definitely do agree though, he's nowhere near as "big" as I previously mentioned. He definitely has significantly more zip than a traditional big. He gets off his feet quick and can contort his body very swiftly.

I think a reasonable comp could be a more mobile/athletic young Pau Gasol.

[hippesthippo]

That's fair.

But this league is no longer about bigs. It's about the biggest wings. Mobley has what, 3 inches on Barnes? That's it and it's entirely possible Barnes can add an inch or three as well.

Same wingspan. Barnes has what, 10-20 pounds on Mobley. Destroyed the combine in terms of agility drills and vertical. Bigger hands.

We've heard this before though. AD, KAT, Ayton, Embiid. Others like KP, JJJ, Then you got the ones who came out of nowhere like Jokic. Not to mention the slew of other bigs taken top 5 year after year who were super hyped to no avail. So definitely not once in every 10 years but his skillset is IMO the most unique of all those bigs sans AD and Jokic. ****, personally, I'd currently take Bam over all of them and if Mobley can become that, it would be considered a massive success as I believe he's the type of big needed to win. There's a reason no elite C's or PGs lead their teams to titles (barring some very particular outliers),

Now conversely, how many huge wings with Barnes skillset have a there been? Ones who can legitimately play PG? Ones who have elite defensive potential. Ones with high basketball IQ? The list is even smaller. Usually those types are far more raw and rarely develop to their full potential.

I just feel that Barnes is a better/more versatile defender (I absolutely do not quantify defensive by blocks and steals), better rebounder, better playmaker, more athletic/mobile/strong. He doesn't''t have Mobleys offensive skillset or potential but so far, that hasn't mattered as he's clearly able to score efficiently however he can. The biggest knock on Barnes was his offence and shooting and he's literally leading our team in scoring essentially with hustle buckets while showing significantly more polish than anyone predicted. He's already shown he can bully players like Sabonis and Vucevic too.

My biggest worry with Mobley is the same as all bigs...unless he somehow becomes a hyper elite scorer from the perimeter, he will need to put on some weight otherwise he's gonna get beat up over the course of the season and that's a very tricky balance as he relies incredibly on his incredibly lateral movement ability.

Finally, the one factor that clearly separates the two - personality/disposition. Mobley is a quiet, soft spoken type. Nothing wrong with that and doesn't mean you can't be successful like that. Barnes is the polar opposite. He's already the most vocal and emotional leader of the team. That's something he definitely has in common with Kyle Lowry and frankly, although it is something that's hard to quantify, the fact that he's basically leading our team in scoring, rebounding (would be defence too if OG wasn't so **** good) and hustle/energy to me proves that those leadership skills are real. A 20 year old leading by example the way he has is something I put a tremendous amount of stock in.

In the end, I love Mobley too. Wish Raptors had him as well but I'm of the opinion that no matter how good Mobley becomes, even if he reaches MVP levels like Jokic, it's still a wings league. I **** hope they can develop his body the right way because if they can, Ouuuuffff. He'll be special. Even more than he already is.

Last two champions have had AD and Giannis on them. I think it’s clear that a multi faceted, elite big man is right at the top of the list of things you want to build a champion. Again not a knock on Barnes, I just think a elite mobile big still puts your team right at the top of the league. Not to mention guys like Embiid and Jokic who you mentioned are also good enough to put their teams into deep playoff runs every year. Remember Philly was a Kawhi shot that rattled in at the buzzer from eliminating the Raptors in 2018. Jokic might have been a Murray injury away last year of making the finals. So bigs are starting to take back over this league.

As far as body development for Mobley, these nba strength and conditioning guys are the best in the world at it. Mobleys body won’t look the same in three years time, look at young pictures of AD till now. It’s huge difference.

Giannis may be big measurement wise, but let's be real...he's a wing. Citing him is literally tipping the scales to Barnes as they are very eerily similar in their movements. Elite Wings are at the top of the list. Not elite big men.

AD - sure, absolutely. Stud. Like I stated - there are some outliers. Having LeBron James on your team averaging a near triple double in the playoffs, I would posit, is the reason AD is a champion. What has AD accomplished without Lebron? 13 total playoff games in 7 years?
Again - elite wing.

You can talk all you want about missed buckets, deep runs, we can go back and forth with variables all we want, in the end they don't get it done. Using last year is a particularly poor example with COVID, so many injuries, and perhaps the weakest path to the finals in years. Not a ringing endorsement.

Especially for your citation of Embiid who literally got embarrassed by an over the hill Marc Gasol. That's why the wings are the ones that win - you think Embiid is taking/making shot like that to win? Doubtful. Kawhi though, different story.

Regarding Mobleys body, I totally agree and fully hope and expect you to be right. That being said history must be taken into account here I'm not saying it's likely, just something to consider. Most of them end up missing lots of games.

Again, I hate to say this because there's no way it can be perceived without it seeming like I'm poo pooing on Mobley, which I'm not, love the kid, but at least right now, Barnes is better, contributing more and is playing a far more central role on his respective team.

FG% - Points - Rebounds - Offensive Rebounds - FGM - FTA...Categories Barnes is currently leading our team in.

If you're calling Giannis a wing I think it'd be fair to say the same about Mobley.

[10giz]

Last two champions have had AD and Giannis on them. I think it’s clear that a multi faceted, elite big man is right at the top of the list of things you want to build a champion. Again not a knock on Barnes, I just think a elite mobile big still puts your team right at the top of the league. Not to mention guys like Embiid and Jokic who you mentioned are also good enough to put their teams into deep playoff runs every year. Remember Philly was a Kawhi shot that rattled in at the buzzer from eliminating the Raptors in 2018. Jokic might have been a Murray injury away last year of making the finals. So bigs are starting to take back over this league.

As far as body development for Mobley, these nba strength and conditioning guys are the best in the world at it. Mobleys body won’t look the same in three years time, look at young pictures of AD till now. It’s huge difference.

Giannis may be big measurement wise, but let's be real...he's a wing. Citing him is literally tipping the scales to Barnes as they are very eerily similar in their movements. Elite Wings are at the top of the list. Not elite big men.

AD - sure, absolutely. Stud. Like I stated - there are some outliers. Having LeBron James on your team averaging a near triple double in the playoffs, I would posit, is the reason AD is a champion. What has AD accomplished without Lebron? 13 total playoff games in 7 years?
Again - elite wing.

You can talk all you want about missed buckets, deep runs, we can go back and forth with variables all we want, in the end they don't get it done. Using last year is a particularly poor example with COVID, so many injuries, and perhaps the weakest path to the finals in years. Not a ringing endorsement.

Especially for your citation of Embiid who literally got embarrassed by an over the hill Marc Gasol. That's why the wings are the ones that win - you think Embiid is taking/making shot like that to win? Doubtful. Kawhi though, different story.

Regarding Mobleys body, I totally agree and fully hope and expect you to be right. That being said history must be taken into account here I'm not saying it's likely, just something to consider. Most of them end up missing lots of games.

Again, I hate to say this because there's no way it can be perceived without it seeming like I'm poo pooing on Mobley, which I'm not, love the kid, but at least right now, Barnes is better, contributing more and is playing a far more central role on his respective team.

FG% - Points - Rebounds - Offensive Rebounds - FGM - FTA...Categories Barnes is currently leading our team in.

If you're calling Giannis a wing I think it'd be fair to say the same about Mobley.

Are you saying they are currently comparable athletically and in terms of mobility? Don't think so pal.

Is that why Mobley is always operating inside defensively? Rarely tasked with guarding the perimeter outside of switches. Most of his offence is cutting to the basket for alley oops. Put backs. Some push shots. Few open shots. Lots of PnR rolling.

Outside of the fact that he's clearly very mobile and quick footed for a 7 footer, he's (at least right now) not playing the role of a wing so I can't really call him a wing. I just watched all his highlights just because I didn't wanna talk out of my ass but he's a big, playing the role of a big (killing it too), but he clearly has tons of wing skills - I can't argue that.