What do we do with the season now?

[Wolf_Cry]

I don't mind people saying we should start over and build around Edwards. But I'm not ready to anoint McDaniels as our second-best player. That's simply a recipe for disaster. He hasn't even proven to this point to be ready to be the third or fourth best player. That is what concerns me most about any blow-it-up scenario.

I think most are saying if we go full rebuild, we'd rather just keep him. His potential is pretty insane. Will he ever reach it is the question, but if we're rebuilding- why not take the gamble.

I think the point people are not talking about is that rebuilds are slow and financially they are losers. Rebuilding teams don’t get a lot of national games. They don’t sell out arenas, and they don’t pull in big money sponsors the way playoff teams do. When Taylor owned the Wolves this wasn’t as much of an issue. But trying a rebuild around 2 or 3 unproven 2020 draftees and taking several money losing years to do it is just not sound for the new owners. They bought into a team they believe is finished with the rebuild and ready to compete. The fastest way to lose basketball in Minnesota is another failed rebuild. Even if the team doesn’t move this time, if Ant fails to deliver we could end up losing it when they blow that team up.

Yeah, I get that. But it's also a bad idea to sit on this team if they're going no where. All we'd be doing is letting our assets lose value. If this team cannot even make the play ins, I do think we need to blow it up. Fans are going to lose interest no matter what at that point. Money is going to be lost. Better to recoup and get started on the rebuild right away.

[winforlose]

I think most are saying if we go full rebuild, we'd rather just keep him. His potential is pretty insane. Will he ever reach it is the question, but if we're rebuilding- why not take the gamble.

I think the point people are not talking about is that rebuilds are slow and financially they are losers. Rebuilding teams don’t get a lot of national games. They don’t sell out arenas, and they don’t pull in big money sponsors the way playoff teams do. When Taylor owned the Wolves this wasn’t as much of an issue. But trying a rebuild around 2 or 3 unproven 2020 draftees and taking several money losing years to do it is just not sound for the new owners. They bought into a team they believe is finished with the rebuild and ready to compete. The fastest way to lose basketball in Minnesota is another failed rebuild. Even if the team doesn’t move this time, if Ant fails to deliver we could end up losing it when they blow that team up.

Yeah, I get that. But it's also a bad idea to sit on this team if they're going no where. All we'd be doing is letting our assets lose value. If this team cannot even make the play ins, I do think we need to blow it up. Fans are going to lose interest no matter what at that point. Money is going to be lost. Better to recoup and get started on the rebuild right away.

Granted, but you cannot build with wet sand. Ant has a high upside but he hasn’t proven himself yet. Same is true of every young Wolf.

[mplsfonz23]

I cannot seem to follow what you are actually arguing here. Of course Jordan had a bond with his players. Of course they followed him, he was hands down the best on their team, and he lead them to success. Ant has done nothing yet. He hasn’t even outplayed Karl this season. If anything Ant spends his time smiling and joking while KAT is leading by example. What exactly makes Ant a real leader?

Jordan had very split relations with players. Half didn't even like him. But they know he was a leader.
That said, I am NOT comparing Ant to Jordan, but just the fact he has called out his bad plays, whereas KAT never did. Sure he has a ways to go before he can take over completely, and I see the qualities in him KAT just DOESN'T have.

Also what exactly has KAT done here in his 7 years?
Don't get me wrong, I like KAT, it's just time for someone new to try and lead. KAT has proven nothing either. Why not give Ant a shot?

The thing about leaders is the only lead when others follow. Ant is not the best player on this team. Ant is sophomore who is having a down year thus far. It was the same problem Ricky had trying to lead last year. Guys want to win, to win they need KAT. If Ant steps on KAT’s toes nothing good will follow. To the 7 year argument, what has Ant done? He emerged in the second half of last season after being invisible for the first half at a time when we badly needed someone to step up. His attitude with the media is all well and good but he takes the most shots of anyone and most of them are low percentage. Ant has neither earned nor proved anything in his time here. You want him to lead he needs to give the others reasons to follow.

No doubt we need KAT, but KAT hasn't done anything but complain to refs for 7 years. At least Ant said he can't make the refs give him a call. He understands and understood early. That shows signs of maturity at 20, that has taken KAT 7 years to figure out.

Also...F*CK KAT's toes! Should we wait until he's traded to let someone else take over? How's Lo's toes going to feel? Town's is the reason he's "stuck" here.
I am willing to bet the new management doesn't see Towns as the future....Even if they plan to leave. Again, I love me some Towns, but I just see more passion and upside from Ant. Just hope he doesn't turn out like JR Rider.

[shrink]

Is there a better compliment to Ant in the NBA than KAT?

Ant’s a small, so you want a big. Ant is great at driving inside, so you want that big to be a good three point shooter to spread the floor, and remove a big underneath. Ant is also developing into a volume three point shooter, so the big also needs to be able to score inside. You also need that big to be able to pass, particularly if he is so good that he creates double teams. Oh, and it’d be nice if the compliment was already one of Ant’s good friends.

I never understood the idea of building around Ant’s “timeline.” Towns is still only 26 - he is still entering his prime, and he has plenty of room for more upside. Financially, with a star like Ant locked up on rookie scale, it allows you to afford a max deal player - maybe two. And Towns, even with a history of being surrounded by inferior players, has always seemed like a team-first guy. I remember in his historic eFG% season a few years back, he still passed the ball to Butler and Wiggins, and was fine being third on the team in FGA’s. You don’t want a selfish max guy keeping the ball and not allowing Ant to grow.

The problem with the season hasn’t been KAT or Ant. DLo has been worse than expected. I imagine he has to get better, but even if he was replaced, that doesn’t mean you need to go super-young to match Ant’s timeline. The Suns had comparably aged players, and they brought in Chris Paul. Imagine how much better the season would have started with Towns, Ant, and Chris Paul organizing the offense out there?

[Neeva]

Towns comes with dlo that’s the problem he is the reason the wolves are stuck with DLO.

[Domejandro]

Towns comes with dlo that’s the problem he is the reason the wolves are stuck with DLO.

Rosas is the reason Minnesota is stuck with D'Angelo Russell; Towns did not orchestrate D'Angelo Russell coming to Minnesota.

[jpatrick]

Towns comes with dlo that’s the problem he is the reason the wolves are stuck with DLO.

Rosas is the reason Minnesota is stuck with D'Angelo Russell; Towns did not orchestrate D'Angelo Russell coming to Minnesota.

Yup. Rosas shuffled the deck while here but did more harm than good.

[Klomp]

I think the point people are not talking about is that rebuilds are slow and financially they are losers. Rebuilding teams don’t get a lot of national games. They don’t sell out arenas, and they don’t pull in big money sponsors the way playoff teams do. When Taylor owned the Wolves this wasn’t as much of an issue. But trying a rebuild around 2 or 3 unproven 2020 draftees and taking several money losing years to do it is just not sound for the new owners. They bought into a team they believe is finished with the rebuild and ready to compete. The fastest way to lose basketball in Minnesota is another failed rebuild. Even if the team doesn’t move this time, if Ant fails to deliver we could end up losing it when they blow that team up.

This is why I don't see a tear-down scenario happening.

[mplsfonz23]

Is there a better compliment to Ant in the NBA than KAT?

Ant’s a small, so you want a big. Ant is great at driving inside, so you want that big to be a good three point shooter to spread the floor, and remove a big underneath. Ant is also developing into a volume three point shooter, so the big also needs to be able to score inside. You also need that big to be able to pass, particularly if he is so good that he creates double teams. Oh, and it’d be nice if the compliment was already one of Ant’s good friends.

I never understood the idea of building around Ant’s “timeline.” Towns is still only 26 - he is still entering his prime, and he has plenty of room for more upside. Financially, with a star like Ant locked up on rookie scale, it allows you to afford a max deal player - maybe two. And Towns, even with a history of being surrounded by inferior players, has always seemed like a team-first guy. I remember in his historic eFG% season a few years back, he still passed the ball to Butler and Wiggins, and was fine being third on the team in FGA’s. You don’t want a selfish max guy keeping the ball and not allowing Ant to grow.

The problem with the season hasn’t been KAT or Ant. DLo has been worse than expected. I imagine he has to get better, but even if he was replaced, that doesn’t mean you need to go super-young to match Ant’s timeline. The Suns had comparably aged players, and they brought in Chris Paul. Imagine how much better the season would have started with Towns, Ant, and Chris Paul organizing the offense out there?

Your post is confusing.
Is KAT a "compliment to Ant? If so, Ants timeline is all that matters. Give Ant the green light, (as it seems they have) And let KAT play second fiddle. Nothing wrong with that if you want the Wolves to win. It becomes a problem when you want "your" team to win. As in I'm the alpha. Let Ant lead the way, and support. That should lead to wins. If he/Ant can't cut it, time for Towns to ask for a trade.

[shangrila]

Is there a better compliment to Ant in the NBA than KAT?

Ant’s a small, so you want a big. Ant is great at driving inside, so you want that big to be a good three point shooter to spread the floor, and remove a big underneath. Ant is also developing into a volume three point shooter, so the big also needs to be able to score inside. You also need that big to be able to pass, particularly if he is so good that he creates double teams. Oh, and it’d be nice if the compliment was already one of Ant’s good friends.

I never understood the idea of building around Ant’s “timeline.” Towns is still only 26 - he is still entering his prime, and he has plenty of room for more upside. Financially, with a star like Ant locked up on rookie scale, it allows you to afford a max deal player - maybe two. And Towns, even with a history of being surrounded by inferior players, has always seemed like a team-first guy. I remember in his historic eFG% season a few years back, he still passed the ball to Butler and Wiggins, and was fine being third on the team in FGA’s. You don’t want a selfish max guy keeping the ball and not allowing Ant to grow.

The problem with the season hasn’t been KAT or Ant. DLo has been worse than expected. I imagine he has to get better, but even if he was replaced, that doesn’t mean you need to go super-young to match Ant’s timeline. The Suns had comparably aged players, and they brought in Chris Paul. Imagine how much better the season would have started with Towns, Ant, and Chris Paul organizing the offense out there?

Myles Turner.

And realistically, I think Towns' offence is overrated in this instance. Having a "traditional" C like Gobert or Bam hasn't stopped Mitchell or Butler from beasting. And I think having enough shooting elsewhere would be more than enough.

My ideal lineup around Ant would be something like;

PG: Prime Beverley - Defensive combo guard that can hit a 3 and doesn't make too many mistakes
SG: Ant
SF/PF: I've got these as interchangeable, but you basically want one 3&D guy (maybe McDaniels?) and the secondary star here
C: Defensive C that rebounds, ideally a THICC guy

And then bench is whatever.

[packforfreedom]

Next 4 are against the Warriors, Lakers, Clippers and Suns. I would be surprised if we won any of these games.

[WhimperWolf]

Let's get an honest to goodness big guy or two before blowing it up.

[winforlose]

I believe in this roster, that said something needs to change. Too much breaks down in the fourth quarter and way too much breaks down in the last 5 minutes. It is not sustainable if a double digit lead is not safe in the final quarter of a game. I don’t know who specifically to blame because the issue seems systemic. Either way, teams have come back from worse starts but the window gets shorter and shorter with every bad loss. Going from up 20 to losing by 20 should be the worst loss of the season, but blowing a 16 point 4th quarter lead is worse.

[Foye]

Next 4 are against the Warriors, Lakers, Clippers and Suns. I would be surprised if we won any of these games.

It wasnt even a week ago that you wanted me to leave and now you sound more depressing than I do.

[Klomp]

I think Dane lays it out pretty well here, and his point about the extension window for Towns is something I hadn't really thought about in that way.

But I do think he's right that we won't see a MAJOR move midseason. Something to balance the roster and bring in a PF is likely, but it probably won't be an earth-shattering move (I'd still contend that Simmons would be the lone in-season objection). Still, it's largely on the current group to figure things out. Whether or not they do will determine the next few years of the franchise.

Watch on YouTube

[shangrila]

I think the point people are not talking about is that rebuilds are slow and financially they are losers. Rebuilding teams don’t get a lot of national games. They don’t sell out arenas, and they don’t pull in big money sponsors the way playoff teams do. When Taylor owned the Wolves this wasn’t as much of an issue. But trying a rebuild around 2 or 3 unproven 2020 draftees and taking several money losing years to do it is just not sound for the new owners. They bought into a team they believe is finished with the rebuild and ready to compete. The fastest way to lose basketball in Minnesota is another failed rebuild. Even if the team doesn’t move this time, if Ant fails to deliver we could end up losing it when they blow that team up.

This is why I don't see a tear-down scenario happening.

I doubt we're financially "winning" right now anyway.

Besides, I don't think this will be a decision made by the new owners. This will be a Towns trade request after a mediocre season. They won't get that choice.

[King Malta]

Rebuilding teams don't sell tickets, I agree, and personally I've advocated for this team to at least just try to make the play-offs for a few years rather than blowing it up and starting a 'process' again.

But do you know what else won't sell tickets? A team full of mid 20's, weak minded, one-way stars who are playing for a team that's skirting the luxury tax and still missing the play-offs. In that scenario you don't even have hope to sell to the fanbase. Outside of the chance of Ant waking up one morning and deciding he's Jordan.

If we can't make it to at least the play-in with this roster construction then we need to make serious changes IMO.

[jpatrick]

I think Dane lays it out pretty well here, and his point about the extension window for Towns is something I hadn't really thought about in that way.

But I do think he's right that we won't see a MAJOR move midseason. Something to balance the roster and bring in a PF is likely, but it probably won't be an earth-shattering move (I'd still contend that Simmons would be the lone in-season objection). Still, it's largely on the current group to figure things out. Whether or not they do will determine the next few years of the franchise.

Watch on YouTube

Lots of good stuff here. KAT either signs a massive extension or you have to trade him. And do you want Gupta making that call, either on a trade or even to offer KAT 200m if he’s not the longterm POBO.

Rosas was such an epic disaster. Rosas, Thibs, Khan, our list of GMs makes McHale seem competent in comparison.

[King Malta]

I think Dane lays it out pretty well here, and his point about the extension window for Towns is something I hadn't really thought about in that way.

But I do think he's right that we won't see a MAJOR move midseason. Something to balance the roster and bring in a PF is likely, but it probably won't be an earth-shattering move (I'd still contend that Simmons would be the lone in-season objection). Still, it's largely on the current group to figure things out. Whether or not they do will determine the next few years of the franchise.

Watch on YouTube

Lots of good stuff here. KAT either signs a massive extension or you have to trade him. And do you want Gupta making that call, either on a trade or even to offer KAT 200m if he’s not the longterm POBO.

Rosas was such an epic disaster. Rosas, Thibs, Khan, our list of GMs makes McHale seem competent in comparison.

I don't think you can go wrong with a KAT extension though, can you?

I think he remains very tradeable, and it's not like he isn't getting a max wherever he lands. So I don't think that's a concern. The question about whether you want Gupta trading him though, is a valid one. I feel like even with a strong, incumbent GM though, ownership would almost always green light the trade of a team's franchise player.

[Nick K]

I don't see Kat, Ant, or Dlo being the problem with the team. Everybody else is the problem. Most of our problem guys couldn't score in a whorehouse.

The system they run shooting 50 3's per game when only 2 or 3 guys on your team can make them is a huge problem. You might even say it's another definition of insanity.

They generally look great in the 1st half but fall apart when the play slows late and the intensity increases. I love Finch but coaching is an issue. That said I would not fire the coaches.

You'll never get equal value in a trade for Kat so you lose the deal and are worse off.

They are probably using Kat wrong considering his skills. If anybody is going to throw up a 3, I want it to be Kat.

He gets way too few chances late.

We have a terrible supporting cast for the system we run. Simple as that.

I'm absolutely pissed that not one guy improved this past offseason.