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2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation

Moderators: bwgood77, lilfishi22, Qwigglez

Do you truly expect the Suns to win the finals this year?

Yes
18
55%
No
15
45%
 
Total votes: 33

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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#721 » by bwoolf2 » Thu Nov 4, 2021 11:05 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:David Kevin (@theIVpointplay) Tweeted:
Here's the video.

This is the kinda stuff I love seeing.

https://t.co/qyBIb2MJvo
Read on Twitter
?s=20
Man! Kaminsky has some solid outlier games at times. Imagine if he could find consistency in this though! He'd be a perfect solution to our backup big depth needs once Crowder leaves and Cam takes a starting role. Still needs to work on his strength and vertical burst though for better defensive potential. But his movement and versatility in the post as a scoring option is impressive. Fingers crossed that he can realize his full potential that had him as a lottery pick once. :D


Lets all face it. Kaminsky at the minimum is a STEAL.


Don't tell Frank he Hates him....
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#722 » by sunskerr » Thu Nov 4, 2021 11:26 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
sunskerr wrote:Smith was a bone headed pick. No defending that. He can't crack the rotation over Frank Kaminsky (lol) so we didnt pick up his contract.

Mikal is slightly overrated here too. He's a very good defender but I don't think he's played all NBA defense and it's easy to pick out 5 perimeter defenders who are better than him. I'll wait a few more games to comment on his (apparent) scoring improvement but when I dig further his 2s are assisted 83% and his 3s are assisted 100%, which is up from his career averages. Seems to me it's more just Chris Paul passing (his assists are up). But we'll see. Probably only way to know for sure is if Chris Paul is out for an extended period. I hope for offensive improvement but I wouldn't bet on it.

Cam Johnson...I just dont know what people see in him. A decent role player is his ceiling and I expect nothing else other than good shooting and decent defense. Not a player to withhold from trade discussions.

Devin Booker is just blah right now. He was so good in the finals and he's been our guy for years now so we know he'll bounce back. Need to see improved 3 pt shooting and handles for him to really take the next step. And of course continued defensive improvement because he's still kinda bad there. No reason he shouldn't be averaging 25 ppg on 48-50% with CP3 passing as much as he is right now.

Ayton...you guys already know what I think. Rim runner ceiling on offense because he's not yet shown the ability to anything else. Like that he's taking threes which means he's been working on it. Dunno if it'll be any effective at this stage, but at least there's something there. I want him to be top 10 in defensive RAPTOR in the league of like Gobert/Thybulle/Poeltl, sooner rather than later. I think that's our best chance at staying an elite team along with improvement from Book if CP3 falls off or retires. I think he might just get there this year to be honest.

CP3 has been our best player overall even with his declining defense. He's been spectacular offensively this year seemingly looking to pass quite a bit. Just ride until the wheels fall off I guess.


CP3 is obviously still our best player, but you are WAY too low on Bridges, and probably even Ayton. I really don't get it other than I know you like low % create your own shots over highly efficient assisted ones and focusing on 3s and rim over midrange...shots where you gain ground against smart 3pt shooting and rim finishing teams...where they pull away while you are iso'ing from mid range.

It's something Mikal has added and will continue, but definitely shouldn't be a major part of game as he is taking the smart high IQ looks which everyone should take as many as possible.

Just like Ayton cut out his shot creating mid range shots last year to increase his efficiency..as probably directed by the team. Finish at the rim or take his self creation usually money short range 1 on 1 fadeways, spins or hooks along with occasional drives now.

Booker has been worse than any of those guys, as evidenced by that NBA math stuff. You rely all on iso's, that's going to happen. You need those finishes at the rim and catch and shoot, screening 3s...and in general, become a better 3 pt shooter. I feel he must continue to work on his 1 on 1 2 point shots more than his 3s.


Sorry man that’s bs saying that I prefer low percentage isos to high percentage assisted shots.

looking at guys with high percentage assisted offense and then assuming they
can become great scorers is flawed thinking. I keep seeing people point to efficiency numbers regarding Ayton and it’s just like… he’s a big playing a rim running role… he’s supposed to be highly efficient!! Same with Mikal, he’s creating less of his own offense this year, of course he’s going to be more efficient.

I’m not saying they can’t become offensive creators, I’m just saying you can’t just point to efficiency and assume someone will automatically become a great scorer if given the reigns.

To do that require a deep bag of offensive tricks that as far as I can tell, and particularly in Aytons case, they have not shown to have.

The reason this is important is because we all just watched playoffs and how the referees swallow their whistle. You need more players who can get shots off on broken plays which will prevent defenses from just keying in with increased physicality on Paul or Booker. It wasn’t just set plays and neat and crisp passing that won it for Milwaukee, or LA or really any champion going back now for years. It was having guys who (while in addition to being able to play team ball) can create shots under broken play and increased physicality conditions.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#723 » by Ghost of Kleine » Fri Nov 5, 2021 3:01 am

bwoolf2 wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Ghost of Kleine wrote:David Kevin (@theIVpointplay) Tweeted:
Here's the video.

This is the kinda stuff I love seeing.

https://t.co/qyBIb2MJvo
Read on Twitter
?s=20
Man! Kaminsky has some solid outlier games at times. Imagine if he could find consistency in this though! He'd be a perfect solution to our backup big depth needs once Crowder leaves and Cam takes a starting role. Still needs to work on his strength and vertical burst though for better defensive potential. But his movement and versatility in the post as a scoring option is impressive. Fingers crossed that he can realize his full potential that had him as a lottery pick once. :D


Lets all face it. Kaminsky at the minimum is a STEAL.


Don't tell Frank he Hates him....

Ya know that's right!.....lol. :lol:
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#724 » by King4Day » Sat Nov 6, 2021 3:16 pm

Haven't followed him but sounds like he's taken a step back. Anyone know what happened?

Read on Twitter
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#725 » by matt131 » Sat Nov 6, 2021 6:56 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=20

Well this sucks. I thought he was over it.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#726 » by Jdiddy701 » Sat Nov 6, 2021 7:37 pm

matt131 wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20

Well this sucks. I thought he was over it.

I don’t understand why they would play him last game.


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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#727 » by Qwigglez » Sat Nov 6, 2021 9:18 pm

King4Day wrote:Haven't followed him but sounds like he's taken a step back. Anyone know what happened?

Read on Twitter


Probably his shooting. Looking at his advanced stats anything outside of 0-3 feet he is virtually brick city. He's not tall enough to be a center so he just creates a huge disadvantage for the Grizzlies offense and cuts off the driving lane for Ja Morant. Perhaps Clarke could be could with all shooters around him, maybe with the Bulls where Vucevic can spread the floor.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#728 » by bwgood77 » Sat Nov 6, 2021 9:32 pm

In the east we wouldn't be in the top 8 teams, but in the west we are the 4 seed.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#729 » by bigfoot » Sat Nov 6, 2021 10:07 pm

Jdiddy701 wrote:
matt131 wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20

Well this sucks. I thought he was over it.

I don’t understand why they would play him last game.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Leg contusion. Middle leg this time??
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#730 » by Revived » Sat Nov 6, 2021 11:09 pm

Jdiddy701 wrote:
matt131 wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=20

Well this sucks. I thought he was over it.

I don’t understand why they would play him last game.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah I don’t understand this logic either.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#731 » by bwgood77 » Sun Nov 7, 2021 2:33 am

ImNotMcDiSwear wrote:
Puff wrote:I guess we were afraid Jalen would continue to perform based on his 10 minutes of play and would force us to sit one of Mikal, Book and Cam or the teachers pet Landry Shamet.

The decision on Jalen is just freaking stupid. You guys must be the spin doctors working on Bobby's payroll.


While I hate what happened with Jalen and think he still shows tons of promise (more than I ever saw from Dragan or Chriss), I'm not quite as down on the rest of the team as everyone else. For whatever reason, the bench unit was hitting on all cylinders in preseason, and now that the season's started they can't hit a shot. Obviously there's been an uptick in intensity, but I think it's pretty obvious that we've not been able to get in transition, or stop the other team from getting in transition, and as a result we've been forced into rushing shots: no rhythm at all.

It's also worth noting that we'd have been stoked if Jalen had a game like Kaminsky had the other night. I think we decided that if, after a season under his belt, Jalen can't beat out a minimum contract guy for minutes, it's no worth paying him $5 mil per when every dollar counts twice.

Perhaps hindsight is 20/blah and whatever but I really liked Paul Reed on draft night. Clearly we would have been better served trading down and taking a flyer on a player with a much cheaper contract and adding a future pick in the process. I'm not sweating Halliburton the way a lot of people are around here, though. I don't think he's amazing or anything. If you're going to drafterbate you might as well look back to 2018 and wonder what we were thinking passing on Tyler Herro, who came into the draft with a pedigree eerily similar to Devin Booker's. After a sophomore slump, dude once again looks like a budding superstar. Were he on the roster we'd all be debating whether he or Devin (or, for a minority of us, Ayton) is more likely to be our #1 option down the line.


I hadn't realized Paul Reed was playing quite a few minutes for the Sixers. He started tonight.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#732 » by Bogyo » Sun Nov 7, 2021 6:59 am

Qwigglez wrote:
King4Day wrote:Haven't followed him but sounds like he's taken a step back. Anyone know what happened?

Read on Twitter


Probably his shooting. Looking at his advanced stats anything outside of 0-3 feet he is virtually brick city. He's not tall enough to be a center so he just creates a huge disadvantage for the Grizzlies offense and cuts off the driving lane for Ja Morant. Perhaps Clarke could be could with all shooters around him, maybe with the Bulls where Vucevic can spread the floor.


Or we could use him as a 3rd string big, kinda like how we are using Elfrid as a 3rd string PG. If one of Ayton or McGee or Crowder has any kind of injury he can play, if not he gets 10 minutes in a blowout, if the game is close he gets 3 minutes or a DNP-CD. Meanwhile he can work on his shot. He had a lot of promise last year, so maybe this is just a sophmore slump...
# waiting for the next chapter
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#733 » by Slim Charless » Sun Nov 7, 2021 5:14 pm

bwgood77 wrote:In the east we wouldn't be in the top 8 teams, but in the west we are the 4 seed.


Yeah, it's been trending that way for awhile and it finally here that the east is stronger than the West. Only took them 2 decades. Lebron knew what he was doing when he went to LAL. Just picked the wrong teammates lol.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#734 » by matt131 » Sun Nov 7, 2021 7:02 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=20

I wonder what's up. If it's really the injury, that's not good for obvious reasons but it's so strange that he played in a game already with the injury. I hope nothing more serious is happening (Ayton boycotting team, team sitting him out to trade him, etc.). Weird.

Or let's hope this doesn't turn out to be a Nader situation where Ayton is out for months with a "leg contusion" and then all of a sudden we hear about ACL surgery or something.


*Edit*

Oh okay this tweet two seconds later clears it up

Read on Twitter
?s=20
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#735 » by lilfishi22 » Sun Nov 7, 2021 10:27 pm

Can't believe I would be saying this but MORE FRANK THE TANK!
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#736 » by Revived » Mon Nov 8, 2021 1:16 am

Qwigglez wrote:
King4Day wrote:Haven't followed him but sounds like he's taken a step back. Anyone know what happened?

Read on Twitter


Probably his shooting. Looking at his advanced stats anything outside of 0-3 feet he is virtually brick city. He's not tall enough to be a center so he just creates a huge disadvantage for the Grizzlies offense and cuts off the driving lane for Ja Morant. Perhaps Clarke could be could with all shooters around him, maybe with the Bulls where Vucevic can spread the floor.

Wonder if a change of scenery swap between him and Jalen Smith would make sense for both clubs.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#737 » by Mulhollanddrive » Mon Nov 8, 2021 5:04 am

Johnson v Clarke turned out well, Jerome isn't bad for pick 20 something, Smith would need a move along though.

That's not a terrible track record, I'd call it neutral which is a good result given it's considered Jones' weakspot.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#738 » by Revived » Mon Nov 8, 2021 6:57 am

I don’t understand why Monty is so stubborn with his lineups. Nader has absolutely sucked and needs to replaced. Last season he played Damian Jones over and over again even when he sucked till James Jones had to basically cut him to make sure Monty doesn’t play him.

Nader was good at first but his injury killed his athleticism and he no longer has any juice. Plus he’s a super selfish player that hates passing the ball.

Give Jalen Smith a chance during non garbage time. What if he’s actually good? If not give Ishmail Wainright a try. He’s supposed to be a PJ Tucker type player and the Suns can sure as hell use somebody like that.

Monty needs to be more adaptable and flexible imo.
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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#739 » by Frank Lee » Mon Nov 8, 2021 1:35 pm

Haven’t been able to watch many games so far.... but yes, it looks as if the Shank has tapped into his inner Shankar. Much needed with the woeful play of Chowder, the slumping CamJo, and the Gimp.

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Re: 2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation 

Post#740 » by King4Day » Mon Nov 8, 2021 2:39 pm

Let's say the Suns flame out this season. Lose in round 1 or 2 and don't look good.
If Simmons hasn't been traded by the summer would anyone consider trying a trade of Paul for Simmons?
I don't like Simmons' personality, but he is still a great defender and would extend our run since he lines up better with our core guys in terms of age.
Again, this would just be if the team looks like it took a big step back compared to last year.

We won't have many ways to improve the team so options like this are things to consider.

This article is worthless, but just talks to the idea of it.

https://www.inquisitr.com/6498242/nba-rumors-suns-could-acquire-ben-simmons-for-package-centered-


If not, I have 2 questions:

1. Who would you replace Paul with in a few years?
2. If you WERE to trade Paul for a PG, who would you look at in a realistic deal?
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