Pat Williams Discussion - Out 4-6 Mo (late Feb to late April)

[Dresden]

Do we even miss him? I know he's missing valuable development time, but from a team standpoint, I don't really see any dropoff with him not in there.

[gardenofsound]

Do we even miss him? I know he's missing valuable development time, but from a team standpoint, I don't really see any dropoff with him not in there.

I think the playoffs are where it really comes in. Having a guy with the size and athleticism to be able to defend the marquee 3/4's of the league in a 7 game series is really important, even if he's not a great defender yet. He still has 6 fouls to burn and won't be a complete pushover on that end.

Looking at the eastern conference landscape, the Bulls could easily see any of the following players in the playoffs: Giannis, Durant, Randle, Miles Bridges, Tatum/Brown, Sabonis, Collins, etc.

Javonte Green and DJJ are really good players to have off of the bench, but some of the above guys are just going to put our smaller players into foul trouble because there isn't much of an alternative to effectively defend them at such a size disadvantage.

[fleet]

Read on Twitter

That’s funny. Billy told us he shouldn’t be with the team because he had to do things like sleep with his hand in the air motionless, like any false move and his wrist could blow apart. Now this….

[HomoSapien]

Read on Twitter

That’s funny. Billy told us he shouldn’t be with the team because he had to do things like sleep with his hand in the air motionless, like any false move and his wrist could blow apart. Now this….

Yeah, this seems like a bad idea.

[DuckIII]

Do we even miss him? I know he's missing valuable development time, but from a team standpoint, I don't really see any dropoff with him not in there.

No, we don’t. But the troubling part is we aren’t any better without him either. Green really isn’t very good at all despite his bizarre fan-favorite status. Thank god we have DJJ who is actually the one meaningfully filling in for Pat to the point that his absence is a short term non-issue.

But here’s the problem: Williams was playing like crap and, despite that, replacing him did not help. As such, even if he had improved over the course of the season only to become “better crap than the crap he had been” we’d still be better as a team by playoff time. And the safe money would be bet on him improving quite a bit more than that by the end of the year.

So do we miss him in early November? Not at all. Will we miss him in May? The answer to that is almost certainly yes.

[MalagaBulls]

Read on Twitter

That’s funny. Billy told us he shouldn’t be with the team because he had to do things like sleep with his hand in the air motionless, like any false move and his wrist could blow apart. Now this….

About as odd as a tweet about Niko weight lifting without a spotter a few years back.

[sco]

Well if he isn't contributing on the court...kudos to Pat

https://ontapsportsnet.com/2021/11/13/patrick-williams-to-partner-with-clorox-company-donate-25000-to-chicago-teachers/

[madvillian]

Looks like his wrist is healing well. I always thought the timetable was a bit stretched. I bet he's back practicing in April and will probably be able to play the last few regular season games.

The injury was bad but for a young athlete like this the body will heal incredibly well given the quality of the surgeons available to him. Unlike with White, Pat will be able to do most core lifting routines (most importantly squat) and won't lose as much muscle. If he can keep his cardio up he should hit the ground running in April.

[JohnnyTapwater]

His right hand dribbling should be impeccable.

[logical_art]

Do we even miss him? I know he's missing valuable development time, but from a team standpoint, I don't really see any dropoff with him not in there.

Of course we do. We miss his shooting and size on defense. Green can't shoot and is 6'4".

Let's not overreact to him having a slow start to the season before getting injured.

Other than rim protection, he's basically the template for what the Bulls should look for at PF.

[madvillian]

Do we even miss him? I know he's missing valuable development time, but from a team standpoint, I don't really see any dropoff with him not in there.

Of course we do. We miss his shooting and size on defense. Green can't shoot and is 6'4".

Let's not overreact to him having a slow start to the season before getting injured.

Other than rim protection, he's basically the template for what the Bulls should look for at PF.

Yea we def miss him. What he brings to the starting lineup at the 4 is basically the perfect fit in theory with the other players. I'm not going to sit here and say he was a good player, he wasn't even an average player, in fact he was a poor player, but the fit was there and at 20 years old there's plenty of time for him to turn it around, especially given that his role was going to basically be play D and shoot open threes.

[dougthonus]

No, we don’t. But the troubling part is we aren’t any better without him either. Green really isn’t very good at all despite his bizarre fan-favorite status. Thank god we have DJJ who is actually the one meaningfully filling in for Pat to the point that his absence is a short term non-issue.

But here’s the problem: Williams was playing like crap and, despite that, replacing him did not help. As such, even if he had improved over the course of the season only to become “better crap than the crap he had been” we’d still be better as a team by playoff time. And the safe money would be bet on him improving quite a bit more than that by the end of the year.

So do we miss him in early November? Not at all. Will we miss him in May? The answer to that is almost certainly yes.

I think both Green and DDJ played better than Williams and have helped more than he was. We aren't wasting possessions trying to get Williams shots with those guys, their looks are purely in the flow of the offense. Both are much better defenders IMO too.

We definitely lost out on the potential for Williams to develop considerably over the course of the season and make a more informed decision. In the best case scenario for Williams improvement we lost out on a lot of potential playoff improvement via his own maturation or value he could have brought on the trade market, but even if he completely stagnated, we lost out on the certainty of direction for next year

[logical_art]

I think its a mistake to believe a 20 year old will play the whole season as he played his first 5 games.

[khufure]

if he can get out for a few games end-of-year and maybe get a taste of playoffs it will be really really good for next year.

[panthermark]

The concern for me were the atrocious rebounding numbers.

[WindyCityBorn]

Hopefully we can Pat back by mid-March. Hopefully we acquire a veteran PF to start too so we won’t be depending on him to fix our size weakness though. Just want him to get some experience off the bench this year.

[WindyCityBorn]

The concern for me were the atrocious rebounding numbers.

He will be fine. I feel really confident he can reach potential with the players coaches and management we have now. If will still had GarPax he would have no chance.

[OldSchoolNoBull]

If he makes it back by, like, early March and there's a good six weeks to get him back in the swing of things before the playoffs, then it might make sense putting him back in the starting five(if we haven't traded for a better player at the deadline).

But if he only comes back two or three games before the playoffs, then I really don't see the point in disrupting the chemistry the team would've built all season and trying to re-integrate him in a matter of days before the playoffs start. In that scenario, it would imo be better to bring him off the bench in limited minutes and let him earn his way back.

[MrSparkle]

Sucks it happened, but for a major injury, the timing (beginning of season) and off-hand wrist seem like a best-case scenario. I hope he gets back on the court by April. Nice to get back into the competitive flow so you don't have this long delayed, high pressure return/debut (like Rose).

I get the sense they want(ed) to develop him; not pump and dump. I get the urge to improve the team now, but there are few available guys in the league who make us chip favorites. I'd trade for Lebron of course.

There will be a lot of buyers this deadline. Warriors, Nets, Bucks, and Heat are going for it. Sixers and Lakers are gonna throw the hail-mary if an opportunity presents itself (unless Embiid or Lebron/Davis go down for the entire season). Suns and Jazz are so close; they'll shop. Hell the Cavs and Grizzlies are climbing ranks.

So that's the thing to consider: there's gonna be a bidding war for any high-caliber starter. AKME assembled this team as a win-now product with room for internal improvement (lot of fellas in their young/mid 20s). I guess add young Vuc to that list.

We just need to get this 12-man roster healthy and the 2 elephants playing well. If Coby and Vuc elevate their shooting percentages, we're a whole new beast once Zach and Caruso are back. Add a net-zero Pat to that mix, and all I really need the kid to do is hold his hands up and stay in front of Durant/Giannis/Jimmy for 20 mpg.

I'm also hoping one of these COVID replacements works out and stays (looking at you McKinnie). I've got my scope on the falling Wizards. One of those ex-Lakers would be a good target in a 3-way (Troy and sweetener out). There's also Bertans having an epically horrible season (worse than Vuc surprisingly). Absolutely awful contract. But it could be a way to really fish some assets out of the Wizards, especially if Bulls have a Reinsdorf agreement to pay tax. Maybe we can snag Rui and Kispert or a FRP.

I'd rather cough up expiring salary (DJJ) than Pat.

[sco]

I wonder when he gets his cast off?