76ers back to fining Ben Simmons

[Ryoga Hibiki]

Not a mental health professional, but it seems highly unlikely there's a legitimate mental health issue he has that would vanish instantly when he's traded to another team.

I'm not a mental health professional either but it wouldn't surprise me at all. Work environments can definitely turn toxic and when that happens what someone needs to do is to remove themselves from that environment.

There's nothing toxic about his work environment. Are we still talking about very reasonable post-game comments made by Doc and Embiid five months ago? Because 1) that's not toxic, and 2) the organization has tried to accommodate him plenty since then. It was only after he decided not to show up, and after his salary was withheld, and after he showed up to collect his salary that he started making these claims.

You don't know enough about the work environment to say that so blatantly.
On the other hand, to be considered toxic I think there should be way more smoke, more people burning out or in general wanting to leave.

"Toxic work environment" is a strong expression, it's not just about what Simmons feels or likes, his perception. It should be about habits, culture, behaviours that make *people* uncomfortable

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[Celts17Pride]

Ya, Rich is just murdering Ben's value.

If he isnt faking this, then there is no guarantee he recovers mentally for whichever team he is traded to. So teams must look at this as even more of a gamble, thus relegating them to offering less and making Morey more unlikely to trade him.

If he is faking it, then your a team trading for a guy with a track record of falsifying a mental health issue to allow him to collect checks while not playing. Its a signal of a completley immoral, unethical, loser of a human being. And you dont want to trade for that kind of character.

I just dont see who in their right mind would move serious assets for him at this point. Ben and Clutch totally, fully messed this up. I think he might be sitting for a year at this point.

Simmons/Rich Paul/Sixers all throwing gasoline as Ben Simmons career goes up in flames.

This might be the worst handled holdout situation in the history of sports. Its unbelievable

This I agree with including Morey and Rivers. Just move on already.

[Ryoga Hibiki]

As somebody who works in mental health, there are times when you assume somebody is manipulating the system, but there isn't much you can do about that because it is too hard to prove they are lying. The part I turn to is the idea that most companies in the US don't continue to pay you while you are on a mental health leave. During a leave, your job is protected, you can apply for some assistance from your state (Good luck qualifying for that, Ben), and you can continue receiving benefits (that you still pay for). I don't know what systems are in place in the NBA regarding mental health leaves, but the idea that not getting paid while on mental health leave is causing worse mental health would not fly in most other places.

I think the nba owners need to tighten up their cba regarding holdouts.

In the real world Ben Simmons wouldnt get paid a cent with his situation(refusing to work/due to mental anguish , he would be fired and become an issue for social services.

That's not true. In the majority of the EU you are covered by some kind of insurance (either private or public) in this case plus if they fire you you could sue and probably win fairly easily. (The only caveat is that you need to prove that you are not faking.)

And that's just right. These issues are not that different from other illnesses, therefore treating them similarly is the right approach.

As we already agreed, you would need to provide some serious evidence for it to happen.
And I am not sure how sports stars are covered, anyway.

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[Myth]

If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck...you get the point.

We all know this is BS. Once he gets traded, he's playing very soon for that team. I'll make a wager with anyone on the other side he plays within a week once he gets traded

If his mental health issues are with being in and playing for Philly like reported then why would you be surprised if he played once the situation is resolved and he’s gone ?

Not liking a place and finding it to be a stressful environment is not the same thing as a diagnosable mental health concern. Diagnosable mental health concerns don't just go away the moment you leave an environment.

[NRSV]

Rich Paul is a scumbag.

Needs to go back to selling fake Jordan’s out of his trunk like he did before LeBron found him.

[Myth]

As somebody who works in mental health, there are times when you assume somebody is manipulating the system, but there isn't much you can do about that because it is too hard to prove they are lying. The part I turn to is the idea that most companies in the US don't continue to pay you while you are on a mental health leave. During a leave, your job is protected, you can apply for some assistance from your state (Good luck qualifying for that, Ben), and you can continue receiving benefits (that you still pay for). I don't know what systems are in place in the NBA regarding mental health leaves, but the idea that not getting paid while on mental health leave is causing worse mental health would not fly in most other places.

I think the nba owners need to tighten up their cba regarding holdouts.

In the real world Ben Simmons wouldnt get paid a cent with his situation(refusing to work/due to mental anguish , he would be fired and become an issue for social services.

That's not true. In the majority of the EU you are covered by some kind of insurance (either private or public) in this case plus if they fire you you could sue and probably win fairly easily. (The only caveat is that you need to prove that you are not faking.)

And that's just right. These issues are not that different from other illnesses, therefore treating them similarly is the right approach.

The EU is much better at taking care of its citizens. Here in the US, that is not how things go. As I mentioned with FMLA (the most common organization protecting people in the US with issues like this), you have 12 weeks of unpaid leave, but then they absolutely can let you go and you are not going to win a lawsuit after those 12 weeks.

[Nuntius]

Not a mental health professional, but it seems highly unlikely there's a legitimate mental health issue he has that would vanish instantly when he's traded to another team.

I'm not a mental health professional either but it wouldn't surprise me at all. Work environments can definitely turn toxic and when that happens what someone needs to do is to remove themselves from that environment.

There's nothing toxic about his work environment. Are we still talking about very reasonable post-game comments made by Doc and Embiid five months ago? Because 1) that's not toxic, and 2) the organization has tried to accommodate him plenty since then. It was only after he decided not to show up, and after his salary was withheld, and after he showed up to collect his salary that he started making these claims.

1) That's not an accurate timeline. Simmons has sought and received mental health help ever since this summer, long before the fines started. Just because we didn't know about it (because it wasn't disclosed to the team since it's sensitive information) doesn't mean that it didn't happen.

2) I have no idea what may have cause the environment to turn toxic for him. Maybe it was these comments. Maybe it was something else entirely that we know nothing about. Maybe his issues are with one particular person. Maybe are with the overall atmosphere and not with anyone in particular. We simply do not know what may have caused this and that's fine. We don't know a lot of stuff that happens in the locker rooms and there's usually a reason for that. For example, we still have no idea what happened in the Pacers locker room in 2013-2014 and caused the team to implode internally. There will be a 30 for 30 for that eventually and we'll learn then. Some version of it, at least.

[jokeboy86]

Wow people really don't like Rich Paul lol. Can't imagine what type of heat he would get if him and Adele broke up. Especially since you know the next album would be about him.

[NBA Moses]

I'm just totally surprised that the other 6ers players can survive in that obviously toxic environment. BS has the perfect initials cause he's full of BS

During games Sixers fans were great with Ben Simmons, incredibly supportive. Philly media + social media probably another story but you have to be able to block that nonsense out.

Just my opinion but I believe Ben Simmons has always been jealous that Embiid is a fan favorite and the Sixers franchise player. Hes always wanted out of Philly and thought he could strong-arm the Sixers . If he didnt want to be in Philly he shouldnt have signed the $170 M extension. You cant have the security of the contract/money and then refuse to honor that contract.

[Myth]

Was just thinking about another thing regarding Rich Paul's statement. What Rich Paul "believes" is going on with Ben Simmons' mental health should be irrelevant to the 76ers. He is not a licensed mental health expert. Last I heard, the 76ers want more access to Simmons' mental health information and for them to have that, Ben Simmons would need to sign a release. No way they accept mental health reports second hand from Rich Paul and make decisions based on that. If Ben Simmons wants to supply documentation about his mental health concerns to justify not being fined, I'm sure that is fine by the 76ers since that is what they were asking for. Ben Simmons and Rich Paul don't get to withhold mental health information and request changes based on Simmons' mental health at the same time. It just doesn't work that way.

[Nuntius]

No way they accept mental health reports second hand from Rich Paul and make decisions based on that. If Ben Simmons wants to supply documentation about his mental health concerns to justify not being fined, I'm sure that is fine by the 76ers since that is what they were asking for. Ben Simmons and Rich Paul don't get to withhold mental health information and request changes based on Simmons' mental health at the same time. It just doesn't work that way.

How about the mental health specialist that they themselves recommended? Do they accept reports from him? Because Simmons has met with a mental health specialist that the 76ers themselves recommended -> https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/264668/Ben-Simmons-Meets-With-76ers-Recommended-Mental-Health-Specialist

So, yeah, not sure what you're trying to say here.

[Childs]

Wow people really don't like Rich Paul lol. Can't imagine what type of heat he would get if him and Adele broke up. Especially since you know the next album would be about him.

Adele is dating him? Sheesh

[Jkam31]

Why would it be the "best thing" for the Sixers to lose an asset for nothing in return?

After what his agent said today, ie Simmons is not mentally fit to play in the NBA, I don't see how Simmons is an asset anymore. I don't believe Simmons should concentrate on playing professional basketball at this stage of his life. There is no shame in that. Many young promising players had to call it quits at a young age due to injuries/health. This is nothing different.

Then he shouldn't get paid step away and retire. He's always had that option.

But no, he wants 30+ million to sit on his ass

**** that. He's a lying POS

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It’s comical how some on here defend him like oh maybe he does have a mental illness. Guess what so do a lot of other Americans and they can go sit at home for months while still collecting a paycheck waiting to go another job.

[Flash4thewin]

No way they accept mental health reports second hand from Rich Paul and make decisions based on that. If Ben Simmons wants to supply documentation about his mental health concerns to justify not being fined, I'm sure that is fine by the 76ers since that is what they were asking for. Ben Simmons and Rich Paul don't get to withhold mental health information and request changes based on Simmons' mental health at the same time. It just doesn't work that way.

How about the mental health specialist that they themselves recommended? Do they accept reports from him? Because Simmons has met with a mental health specialist that the 76ers themselves recommended -> https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/264668/Ben-Simmons-Meets-With-76ers-Recommended-Mental-Health-Specialist

So, yeah, not sure what you're trying to say here.

He met with them and the fact hes getting fined tells you everything you need to know. The 76er though their actions implicate Simmons is a liar and worse now that Simmons has seen the recommended specialist the 76er have documentation ready for the inevitable arbitration.

[Nuntius]

After what his agent said today, ie Simmons is not mentally fit to play in the NBA, I don't see how Simmons is an asset anymore. I don't believe Simmons should concentrate on playing professional basketball at this stage of his life. There is no shame in that. Many young promising players had to call it quits at a young age due to injuries/health. This is nothing different.

Then he shouldn't get paid step away and retire. He's always had that option.

But no, he wants 30+ million to sit on his ass

**** that. He's a lying POS

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It’s comical how some on here defend him like oh maybe he does have a mental illness. Guess what so do a lot of other Americans and they can go sit at home for months while still collecting a paycheck waiting to go another job.

And that's pretty much the reason why I'm "defending" him. Because the reality is that every worker should have the protection of a strong union that protects their rights.

[Nuntius]

No way they accept mental health reports second hand from Rich Paul and make decisions based on that. If Ben Simmons wants to supply documentation about his mental health concerns to justify not being fined, I'm sure that is fine by the 76ers since that is what they were asking for. Ben Simmons and Rich Paul don't get to withhold mental health information and request changes based on Simmons' mental health at the same time. It just doesn't work that way.

How about the mental health specialist that they themselves recommended? Do they accept reports from him? Because Simmons has met with a mental health specialist that the 76ers themselves recommended -> https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/264668/Ben-Simmons-Meets-With-76ers-Recommended-Mental-Health-Specialist

So, yeah, not sure what you're trying to say here.

He met with them and the fact hes getting fined tells you everything you need to know. The 76er though their actions implicate Simmons is a liar and worse now that Simmons has seen the recommended specialist the 76er have documentation ready for the inevitable arbitration.

Afaik, they haven't fined him yet after that meeting. We'll see how it goes. Not that I trust the 76ers after the **** they've pulled in the past, of course.

[azcatz11]

Then he shouldn't get paid step away and retire. He's always had that option.

But no, he wants 30+ million to sit on his ass

**** that. He's a lying POS

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It’s comical how some on here defend him like oh maybe he does have a mental illness. Guess what so do a lot of other Americans and they can go sit at home for months while still collecting a paycheck waiting to go another job.

And that's pretty much the reason why I'm "defending" him. Because the reality is that every worker should have the protection of a strong union that protects their rights.

If everyone did what BS is doing - society wouldn't function. Everyone would just claim mental illness so they wouldn't have to work and get paid. We both know he's full of it

[rickxdel]

No way they accept mental health reports second hand from Rich Paul and make decisions based on that. If Ben Simmons wants to supply documentation about his mental health concerns to justify not being fined, I'm sure that is fine by the 76ers since that is what they were asking for. Ben Simmons and Rich Paul don't get to withhold mental health information and request changes based on Simmons' mental health at the same time. It just doesn't work that way.

How about the mental health specialist that they themselves recommended? Do they accept reports from him? Because Simmons has met with a mental health specialist that the 76ers themselves recommended -> https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/264668/Ben-Simmons-Meets-With-76ers-Recommended-Mental-Health-Specialist

So, yeah, not sure what you're trying to say here.

1. Ben Simmons only met with a 76ers appointed mental health professional one time so far, for one hour this past Monday November 8th.

2. This meeting just happened to occur right after the team started fining him again due to a lack of communication and clarity on his progress over the past two weeks despite the team's attempts to reach out

3. Rich Paul himself said that one meeting with the Philly therapist was not enough to make any sort of recommendation, direct quote: "He’s not there yet. How can a doctor, who has only met with Ben once, say, ‘Ben is mentally ready to play?’ So do we keep digging on him, or help him?” so what is your point about 'How about a mental health specialist they themselves recommended?" In order for Sixers to accept that specialist's opinion #4 must happen

4. Sixers want Ben to continue working with the therapist they provided and provide documentation of progress, not much to ask for someone who isn't performing the duties his job requires yet still wants to receive full pay. We shall see if Ben actually complies this time

Seems to me Ben clearly wants out of Philly, doesn't want to play for them while still getting paid. Wants to have his cake and eat it too.

[Myth]

No way they accept mental health reports second hand from Rich Paul and make decisions based on that. If Ben Simmons wants to supply documentation about his mental health concerns to justify not being fined, I'm sure that is fine by the 76ers since that is what they were asking for. Ben Simmons and Rich Paul don't get to withhold mental health information and request changes based on Simmons' mental health at the same time. It just doesn't work that way.

How about the mental health specialist that they themselves recommended? Do they accept reports from him? Because Simmons has met with a mental health specialist that the 76ers themselves recommended -> https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/264668/Ben-Simmons-Meets-With-76ers-Recommended-Mental-Health-Specialist

So, yeah, not sure what you're trying to say here.

There was other reports that he sought an outside mental health specialist. The link you provided indicates that Ben Simmons is repeatedly not cooperating, so yeah, not sure what you're trying to say here. So whether he has an outside mental health professional and they aren't supplying evidence that he requires time away from the team for mental health reasons or he is simply not cooperating with the provider the team connected him to, either way this further justifies that he is claiming mental health issues but not supplying enough info or meeting criteria to justify his leave. You don't get to claim mental health issues and require accommodations without a professional backing it up.

[chitownsports4ever]

At this point you gotta believe Simmons career is done as we know it . I just dont see a viable way back at this point with all the nonsense going on right now .

Outside of the teams

GS
BKN
HOU
LAC
LAL
MIL
POR
MIA
UTA
NY
WAS

he would immediately be the highest paid player on the team and immediately deemed the franchise player based on his salary alone. The more it goes on and the sillier it gets I just don't see many teams willingly bringing that sorta drama to their door steps at that cost.

The best things for Simmons right now would be to flat out retire and leave his remaining salary on the table . If hes really hurting take back his power and retire and go work on his mental health and his shot. Hes 25 years old so sit out until 2023-24 and get your mind right and your shot right and then choose your next destination based on who you believe is the best fit for you after hanging and talking to various players and meeting with teams and coaches .

He will never come out ahead on his current path regardless of what Rich Paul has told him.