2021-22 NBA Rookie Thread (part 4)

tarantism · Post #141 » by **tarantism** » Sun Dec 19, 2021 8:59 pm

Keep an eye on Kuminga. If he starts getting consistent rotation minutes as Draymond's backup he'll show flashes of brilliance and climb the rookie ladder quickly.

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QingJames · Post #142 » by **QingJames** » Sun Dec 19, 2021 9:01 pm

tarantism wrote:Keep an eye on Kuminga. If he starts getting consistent rotation minutes as Draymond's backup he'll show flashes of brilliance and climb the rookie ladder quickly.

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He looked good last night. Incredible explosiveness on his first step. His defense was pretty bad but he has a great mentor in Draymond. Could be a really interesting player as an oversized 2 tbh.

tarantism · Post #143 » by **tarantism** » Sun Dec 19, 2021 9:08 pm

QingJames wrote:
tarantism wrote:Keep an eye on Kuminga. If he starts getting consistent rotation minutes as Draymond's backup he'll show flashes of brilliance and climb the rookie ladder quickly.

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He looked good last night. Incredible explosiveness on his first step. His defense was pretty bad but he has a great mentor in Draymond. Could be a really interesting player as an oversized 2 tbh.

Have you watched much JK? His defense is probably the strongest pillar of his game right now. Great instincts to go along with elite physical tools, and he can legitimately handle 1-5.

He's definitely a forward who is getting spot minutes as the 5 in the Warriors system, since the 4/5 is so fluid for them. The scoring, while sometimes flashy, has a long way to go. But the tools are there, he just needs more game experience.

QingJames · Post #144 » by **QingJames** » Sun Dec 19, 2021 9:09 pm

tarantism wrote:
QingJames wrote:
tarantism wrote:Keep an eye on Kuminga. If he starts getting consistent rotation minutes as Draymond's backup he'll show flashes of brilliance and climb the rookie ladder quickly.

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He looked good last night. Incredible explosiveness on his first step. His defense was pretty bad but he has a great mentor in Draymond. Could be a really interesting player as an oversized 2 tbh.
Have you watched much JK? His defense is probably the strongest pillar of his game right now. Great instincts to go along with elite physical tools, and he can legitimately handle 1-5.

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I haven't. I was just going off of what I saw last night, and he was pretty bad on that end last night, but if he's been good otherwise then that's great.

tarantism · Post #145 » by **tarantism** » Sun Dec 19, 2021 9:14 pm

QingJames wrote:
tarantism wrote:
QingJames wrote:
He looked good last night. Incredible explosiveness on his first step. His defense was pretty bad but he has a great mentor in Draymond. Could be a really interesting player as an oversized 2 tbh.
Have you watched much JK? His defense is probably the strongest pillar of his game right now. Great instincts to go along with elite physical tools, and he can legitimately handle 1-5.

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I haven't. I was just going off of what I saw last night, and he was pretty bad on that end last night, but if he's been good otherwise then that's great.

Yeah if you're interested go back and watch our recent game against Indiana. He played Sabonis very well. They also often put him on the opposing PG, I think as a developmental tool for future switches, and he's been very good to excellent in those situations. Just all around I've been impressed with his ability and versatility on that end.

I switched to a different game at halftime yesterday because it was so lopsided so I can't comment on his defensive game against Toronto until I go back and watch it.

orlando_joe · Post #146 » by **orlando_joe** » Sun Dec 19, 2021 10:42 pm

thelead wrote:
basketballRob wrote:
thelead wrote:1. Cade
2. Mobley (once he gets back)
3. Barnes
4. Franz
5. Giddy

That's how I have them ranked right now with injuries, stats, and affect on winning. They're all good though.
We were ranking them for the month of December.

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I love Franz but not sure how you have him above Barnes even for the month of December. Barnes is average 16.3 PPG, 8.4 RPG, 3.7 APG, 1.6 BPG, 0.9 SPG in 7 games on 52/36/71 splits but more importantly, his team is 5-2 in that stretch. So he's contributing as much as Franz but in more 'meaningful' minutes. The one thing that I give Franz is his efficiency since he is the focus of most teams now that the team is decimated by injuries and covid. He has been good even with defenses keying in on him.

i dont see how record matters unless you think teams they are on have same talent playing? i dont

srhcan · Post #147 » by **srhcan** » Sun Dec 19, 2021 11:17 pm

PrinceAli wrote:
srhcan wrote:Kuminga looks better shooter than Barnes. But Barnes is better whole package. Couple of years from now Kuminga may be consider as among best 5 players of draft.

He’s not a better shooter than Scottie. He was 2/17 from 3 before tonight. He had a great game for sure, but he definitely is still a project. Especially with his shot. Great flashes tonight tho

LoveMyRaps wrote:
srhcan wrote:Kuminga looks better shooter than Barnes. But Barnes is better whole package. Couple of years from now Kuminga may be consider as among best 5 players of draft.

In what world???

QingJames wrote:Giddey on triple double alert.

srhcan wrote:Kuminga looks better shooter than Barnes. But Barnes is better whole package. Couple of years from now Kuminga may be consider as among best 5 players of draft.

wtf are you talking about lmao.

Eye Test suggest Kuminga will end up better offensive player than Barnes. May be it is just 1 game as I have not watched him before. IMO Barnes is overachieving on offense currently, I hope he can sustain it.
The real value of Barnes is combination of offense, passing and defense and that make him having higher ceiling than any other rookie in this class (along with Cade and Kuminga).

nikster · Post #148 » by **nikster** » Sun Dec 19, 2021 11:26 pm

srhcan wrote:
PrinceAli wrote:
srhcan wrote:Kuminga looks better shooter than Barnes. But Barnes is better whole package. Couple of years from now Kuminga may be consider as among best 5 players of draft.

He’s not a better shooter than Scottie. He was 2/17 from 3 before tonight. He had a great game for sure, but he definitely is still a project. Especially with his shot. Great flashes tonight tho

LoveMyRaps wrote:
srhcan wrote:Kuminga looks better shooter than Barnes. But Barnes is better whole package. Couple of years from now Kuminga may be consider as among best 5 players of draft.

In what world???

QingJames wrote:Giddey on triple double alert.

srhcan wrote:Kuminga looks better shooter than Barnes. But Barnes is better whole package. Couple of years from now Kuminga may be consider as among best 5 players of draft.

wtf are you talking about lmao.

Eye Test suggest Kuminga will end up better offensive player than Barnes. May be it is just 1 game as I have not watched him before. IMO Barnes is overachieving on offense currently, I hope he can sustain it.
The real value of Barnes is combination of offense, passing and defense and that make him having higher ceiling than any other rookie in this class (along with Cade and Kuminga).

So Barnes is over achieving over a quarter of athe season but your basing Kumingas potential on a single game...

srhcan · Post #149 » by **srhcan** » Sun Dec 19, 2021 11:26 pm

QingJames wrote:I think this next stretch of Cavs games with Mobley out will determine just how impactful he has been on the defensive end vis-a-vis the other guys on that roster. Either the team will be much worse defensively, cementing Mobley as a real potential DPOY candidate this year, or the team will remain about the same defensively and it will be clear that Mobley is benefitting immensely from his teammates on that end of the floor.

Currently, Cavs players are posting absolutely bonkers defensive ratings:
Mobley: 98.2
Love: 98.4
Rubio: 99.3 (!)
Garland: 101.1 (!!)
Okoro: 101.6
Allen: 101.8
Markkanen: 104 (!!)

How Cleveland performs with Mobley out should help us evaluate better where he stands in the ROY race. If Cleveland struggles defensively then I think that cements him as the frontrunner. If Cleveland remains an elite defensive team then it is clear Mobley’s eye-popping defensive numbers are being boosted by his teammates (not to say he isn’t an excellent defender) and he falls behind Barnes and probably Cade as well in the race IMO.

It is already proven beyond doubt that Mobley has not contributed to Cavs success more than Jaret Allen and Darius Garland. And lets not forget the bench mob. Cavs teammates have given more support to Mobley than what Mobley has given to them.

Bruin · Post #150 » by **Bruin** » Sun Dec 19, 2021 11:28 pm

nikster wrote:
srhcan wrote:
PrinceAli wrote:He’s not a better shooter than Scottie. He was 2/17 from 3 before tonight. He had a great game for sure, but he definitely is still a project. Especially with his shot. Great flashes tonight tho

LoveMyRaps wrote:
In what world???

QingJames wrote:Giddey on triple double alert.

wtf are you talking about lmao.

Eye Test suggest Kuminga will end up better offensive player than Barnes. May be it is just 1 game as I have not watched him before. IMO Barnes is overachieving on offense currently, I hope he can sustain it.
The real value of Barnes is combination of offense, passing and defense and that make him having higher ceiling than any other rookie in this class (along with Cade and Kuminga).

So Barnes is over achieving over a quarter of athe season but your basing Kumingas potential on a single game...

Over a third of the season*

reanimator · Post #151 » by **reanimator** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 1:53 am

Cade's last 5 games: 35 assist to 18 turnovers which is essentially a 2:1 ratio. Am I doing the "take an incredibly small sample to confirm bias on a narrative" thing right?

7r5ur · Post #152 » by **7r5ur** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 1:59 am

reanimator wrote:Cade's last 5 games: 35 assist to 18 turnovers which is essentially a 2:1 ratio. Am I doing the "take an incredibly small sample to confirm bias on a narrative" thing right?

Especially with Grant out. 21 assists in the last 2. Tonight Miami doubled him out at the 3-point line whenever he got the ball and sent a 3rd defender if he got in the lane. Only took 4 shots but just looked to make the right pass and not worry about getting his (And got the W). Crazy maturity for a guy his age.

DroseReturnChi · Post #153 » by **DroseReturnChi** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 5:25 am

reanimator wrote:Cade's last 5 games: 35 assist to 18 turnovers which is essentially a 2:1 ratio. Am I doing the "take an incredibly small sample to confirm bias on a narrative" thing right?

damn is he a cp3 type? dishing out 10 assists oh my he is a star. i told bust cade only way to improve his stock is assists and 3pt and hes listening wonderfully.

whitehops · Post #154 » by **whitehops** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 5:26 am

BDM22 wrote:Especially with Grant out. 21 assists in the last 2. Tonight Miami doubled him out at the 3-point line whenever he got the ball and sent a 3rd defender if he got in the lane. Only took 4 shots but just looked to make the right pass and not worry about getting his (And got the W). Crazy maturity for a guy his age.

crazy part is he won't get any recognition for teams literally game planning to stop him, he'll just get knocked for scoring four points. meanwhile other rookies are getting praised for playing well while being like the 3rd/4th option on their teams.

Post #155 » by **Reeko** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 5:40 am

If we're going purely by stats/raw numbers, Barnes is the clear ROTY at this point. He's not running away with it, but he's definitely leading the pack right now.

God Squad · Post #156 » by **God Squad** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 5:42 am

DroseReturnChi wrote:
reanimator wrote:Cade's last 5 games: 35 assist to 18 turnovers which is essentially a 2:1 ratio. Am I doing the "take an incredibly small sample to confirm bias on a narrative" thing right?

damn is he a cp3 type? dishing out 10 assists oh my he is a star. i told bust cade only way to improve his stock is assists and 3pt and hes listening wonderfully.

grade school poster.

God Squad · Post #157 » by **God Squad** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 5:44 am

Any reason why Cade only took 4 shots today?

LoveMyRaps · Post #158 » by **LoveMyRaps** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 5:53 am

Reeko wrote:If we're going purely by stats/raw numbers, Barnes is the clear ROTY at this point. He's not running away with it, but he's definitely leading the pack right now.

Yeah Scottie has definitely taken the lead on my board.
Him and Mobley are still pretty close. Cade & Wagner have been balling as well.
These 4 guys have separated themselves from the rest of the pack IMO.

Post #159 » by **Reeko** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 6:04 am

LoveMyRaps wrote:
Reeko wrote:If we're going purely by stats/raw numbers, Barnes is the clear ROTY at this point. He's not running away with it, but he's definitely leading the pack right now.

Yeah Scottie has definitely taken the lead on my board.
Him and Mobley are still pretty close. Cade & Wagner have been balling as well.
These 4 guys have separated themselves from the rest of the pack IMO.

For me right now it's:
1. Scottie
2. Mobley
3. Wagner
4. Cade
5. Giddey (Although, a lot of the chatter about him has really tapered off recently)

Green and Suggs have been pretty dismal from an efficiency stand point. Sometimes I wonder how our fan base would've handled drafting Suggs over Barnes, knowing what we know now. Truly franchise altering.

bkseven · Post #160 » by **bkseven** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 6:35 am

DroseReturnChi wrote:
reanimator wrote:Cade's last 5 games: 35 assist to 18 turnovers which is essentially a 2:1 ratio. Am I doing the "take an incredibly small sample to confirm bias on a narrative" thing right?

damn is he a cp3 type? dishing out 10 assists oh my he is a star. i told bust cade only way to improve his stock is assists and 3pt and hes listening wonderfully.

Oh oh there you are. What a surprise. Oh I see a Cade post. Let me respond. Man what a guilty pleasure u get from talking bout Cade so much

Which three rookies impress you the most? (vote for up to 3)