Your 2022 NBA Draft Prospect

reanimator · Post #281 » by **reanimator** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:24 pm

To me, its not just that Paolo has defensive concerns as a potential tweener but he was billed as a plus passer which would make him more dynamic but it just hasn't been there yet. Takes him from a healthy Pistons era Blake Griffin/Julius Randle archetype to a Tobias Harris/healthy Jabari Parker one which isn't the worst but meh.

NYPiston · Post #282 » by **NYPiston** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:52 pm

Manocad wrote:
I don't see Ivey as a need simply because he does things no other Pistons do. I consider "need" as "what translates to wins." And as I said, it appears he needs pretty wide offensive spacing created to be most effective which is not only what the Pistons don't do well, but he's not going to get that kind of spacing in the NBA. Just like with Jalen Green, who was my #2 choice if Cade wasn't available, I'm not going to be heartbroken if Ivey turns out to be a consensus pick at the position the Pistons are drafting in. But if it were me I'd consider trading down if an opportunity were available and someone other team really wanted Ivey, e.g. hypothetically trading down from #2 to #7 and a late first/couple of seconds. Now obviously that scenario may not be a possibility so you take Ivey. I don't see scoring as being the Pistons' Achilles heel given Cade, Bey, Grant/his potential replacement, Diallo and Frank. I think their problems scoring have been due to slumps and Casey's puzzling offensive schemes (or lack thereof). Add a guy like Ivey and you're just getting points in a different way/from a different player; I don't think that directly translates to a much better team/more wins.

As far as the 2003 draft, the Pistons won a championship and did pretty well with Tayshaun. Could they have done better with Wade or Carmelo? Perhaps. But last I checked Carmelo doesn't have a championship and Wade needed Shaq then Lebron and Bosh to get his. And that's not a knock on either of those guys; I'm simply saying you can't play the "This is what WOULD have happened" game with any certainty.

The thing is, you're looking too deeply into this.
Drafting is a long term projection so what the needs are today might not be the same needs 2-3 years down the line. You draft the best talent especially at this point in a rebuild with a roster that's a major work in progress. You draft the best talent (who you think projects to be the best player down the line) then work out the needs with other assets. Having more talent does translate to wins down the line, especially highly athletic talent in this case not only because of the talent but it also makes the roster more valuable in an asset sense so they can trade from a position of strength to fill a position of weakness.
Also, I think an uber athletic shot maker who can also facilitate next to Cade would certainly fill a need and create matchup nightmares for the defense.

I only brought up the Wade/Carmelo example because it was an example of a team not drafting a player because they had a starter that played the same position on the current roster. If Dumars had played the long game and just took BPA, they could have extended their competitive window far longer and he probably would have kept his job for far longer.

With that said, I'm not saying they HAVE TO take Ivey. I'm just saying that he should be in consideration just as much as the big guys despite not filling the biggest need. I felt the same about Suggs last season if the Pistons had dropped a bit in the draft order even though it would have created a crowded backcourt.
In any event, I don't think we're that far off in agreement since you also agree that they should consider Ivey if they see him as BPA.

FloridaMan78 · Post #283 » by **FloridaMan78** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 3:57 pm

I think I’m a bit spoiled by last years draft lol. It’s probably going to end up being one of the best ever.

I think we’ll come back to earth this year and it will be your average draft. Any of the top 4 last year would have went #1 this year.

Oddly I don’t really like the consensus picks this year. Not really a fan of their games.

Banchero’s talent is undeniable, but I really don’t like his heavy ISO game. He has a ton of potential, I just haven’t liked what I’ve seen.

I love Chet’s game, but the dudes a tooth pick. Such a risk.

I like Jabari. His shot is really smooth and a nice high release. Reminds me of Aldridge with 3 point range. Not weak inside, just not dominant. Has a great drive game because he’s such a 3point theat. Would fit the offense seamlessly.

Ivey’s the safe pick to me. His offense and defense is so impactful. That speed, strength and athleticism is Westbrook, Morant, Wade level. Green is more of a jump shooter where Ivey is attacking the rim. IMO that is a major need for our offense. We have no one attacking the rim, except for Cade who picks his spots when he drives.

Kendall Brown is this years Scottie Barnes who was the previous years Patrick Williams. He has a decent set 3 point shot that he doesn’t really take. It’d be cool if they put the ball more in his hands to see what he can do.

1. Jaden Ivey
2. Jabari Smith
3. Banchero
4. Chet
5. Kendall Brown

reanimator · Post #284 » by **reanimator** » Mon Dec 20, 2021 6:34 pm

Chet : I still just see a connector player on offense. C+S, attacking close outs, ball mover. On defense, I see a good defender with potential flaws as a post and ballscreen/perimeter defender. But man oh man, if he is able to make things happen off a live dribble or switch onto smalls then watch out. Overall, I don't see a bust because the shooting, rim protection, passing will ensure rotational minutes but he is the least likely to reach his ceiling in the top 5 imo.

Kendall Brown: I definitely need to put more eyes on him but from what I've seen, the closest Piston analogue would be a bigger Hamidou Diallo with actual vision/playmaking ability. A finisher for Cade to hit on cuts/lobs and a transition nightmare. I feel more confident he reaches his ceiling than Chet and it would not be a letdown if Detroit takes him @ 5.

Keegan Murray, JD Davison, Johnny Davis, Nikola Jovic, and Beneddict Mathurin the other guys I expect to push for top 5 status given what we've seen so far.

reanimator · Post #285 » by **reanimator** » Tue Dec 21, 2021 1:27 pm

Chet vs Texas Tech, Alabama, Duke, UCLA, UCLA, Texas : 9.6 ppg on 51/21/64 splits + 1 apg 8 rpg 3 bpg

Zags dont play anymore HM comp until the tourney

mattao313 · Post #286 » by **mattao313** » Wed Dec 22, 2021 4:33 pm

I think we'd benefit from Ivey's downhill play and athleticism but I still think we need a real PG. Ivey and Cade seem more combo guard SG imo.

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FloridaMan78 · Post #287 » by **FloridaMan78** » Thu Dec 23, 2021 12:47 pm

Yea Mathurin is a beast too. He’s right there competing for top 5. Nice shot, athletic, NBA ready body.

Watch on YouTube

Moses ShamMoses · Post #288 » by **Moses ShamMoses** » Thu Dec 23, 2021 2:37 pm

Can anybody give a quick comparison between Jaden Ivey and Hamidou Diallo? Haven't watching much college basketball and was just wondering what Jaden might bring that we don't already have in Diallo being an uber-athletic slasher, high energy type.

vic · Post #289 » by **vic** » Thu Dec 23, 2021 3:02 pm

No relation.

Ivey is a combo guard, mix of D Wade and Ja Morant. He's bigger, but he studies and trains with Morant.

Hami is more like a Josh Jackson/ Andre Iguodala swingman type

FloridaMan78 · Post #290 » by **FloridaMan78** » Thu Dec 23, 2021 3:35 pm

Moses ShamMoses wrote:Can anybody give a quick comparison between Jaden Ivey and Hamidou Diallo? Haven't watching much college basketball and was just wondering what Jaden might bring that we don't already have in Diallo being an uber-athletic slasher, high energy type.

Ivey has a decent 3 point shot. That’s the biggest missing piece with Hami. Defenders sag against him. Defenders have to respect Ivey’s three and when they do he blows by them and he’s always looking to pass if it’s available. I would bet he’s a lot quicker and faster too.

bstein14 · Post #291 » by **bstein14** » Fri Dec 24, 2021 2:36 am

If Diallo could hit 38--40% from deep he'd be a great bonafide starter in this league. Hopefully he works on it more this summer.

MotownMadness · Post #292 » by **MotownMadness** » Wed Dec 29, 2021 6:30 pm

Ivey plays at 5 on the BTN network
Jabari Smith at 7 on ESPN

jakebernat · Post #293 » by **jakebernat** » Wed Dec 29, 2021 7:21 pm

the more I watch, the more I’m sold on Ivey. him and cade would be an incredible backcourt.

MotownMadness · Post #294 » by **MotownMadness** » Thu Dec 30, 2021 6:05 am

Both Ivey and Jabari Smith showed some good things today.

Watch on YouTube

Moses ShamMoses · Post #295 » by **Moses ShamMoses** » Thu Dec 30, 2021 2:58 pm

I'm thinking this is our best chance to add a top guy before we start trying to make the playoffs again. However, we'll likely still need one or more of our recent draft picks to pan out to more than a role player for us to really have a shot at anything. I have highest hopes for Diallo and Bey at the moment.

Drwho17 · Post #296 » by **Drwho17** » Thu Dec 30, 2021 3:25 pm

vic wrote:No relation.

Ivey is a combo guard, mix of D Wade and Ja Morant. He's bigger, but he studies and trains with Morant.

Hami is more like a Josh Jackson/ Andre Iguodala swingman type

What? Hamidou Diallo is about a clone of Wade, just worse at everything, hyper-athletic 2 guards that have trouble shooting.

zeebneeb · Post #297 » by **zeebneeb** » Thu Dec 30, 2021 3:48 pm

If the Pistons land a top 2 pick, I find it highly unlikely Weaver doesn't select Chet, or Paolo. Now that could change if Grant is moved for a young big prospect (Williams, Wiseman, e.t.c.)but even then, passing on one of those two seems super risky.

I wouldn't mind it as I loathe picking bigmen with top picks unless they are known generational talents, but I can't see either of those two being passed up.

Moses ShamMoses · Post #298 » by **Moses ShamMoses** » Thu Dec 30, 2021 4:02 pm

I'm going on record of not being sold on Holmgren in the top 5. Aside from the obvious physical concerns, his highlights aren't that impressive.

I remember having similar feelings about Stanley Johnson when he came out going straight at guys, overpowering them at the college-level. Chet isn't doing anything special other than using his length to shoot over college players.

NYPiston · Post #299 » by **NYPiston** » Thu Dec 30, 2021 4:40 pm

Jabari has such a smooth, well rounded game. He's kind of like the Cade of power forwards where he's not explosive but has a wide array of offensive moves, a nice touch from longe range, defensive potential and most importantly, a very high Basketball IQ. He's not dynamic like Paolo but I think he's a smarter, more well rounded player. I'd be ecstatic with either, any of the top 4 really (Ivey and Chet (even though I have concerns with him), but I have Smith slightly ahead of the pack currently.

NYPiston · Post #300 » by **NYPiston** » Thu Dec 30, 2021 4:47 pm

Moses ShamMoses wrote:I'm going on record of not being sold on Holmgren in the top 5. Aside from the obvious physical concerns, his highlights aren't that impressive.

I remember having similar feelings about Stanley Johnson when he came out going straight at guys, overpowering them at the college-level. Chet isn't doing anything special other than using his length to shoot over college players.

It's hard to evaluate Chet because he's on a stacked team with a bunch of upperclassmen who are go to guys so he's a role player on that team. In the NBA, he'll be more featured especially on a rebuilding team so I wouldn't pay much attention to his college stats. His evaluation will be almost entirely based on projection but with that said, I share your concerns in regards to his physicality in particular. Still, I think he has a lot to offer as a stretch big that can provide a lot of length in the lane.