Coronavirus/COVID-19, Thread 3 (Omicron & Delta Variants)

[Parliament10]

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That Omicron is a Monster.

[greenroom31]

Let me try to lay this out in simple logical format (if A then B, if B then C, etc.) Please let me know if any of this is wrong, especially the medically trained within our group:

In order for COVID to completely go away we must either (1) quarantine/wait until it dies out or (2) achieve immunity through vaccinating almost everyone.

Global quarantining until COVID dies out would have massive social and economic impact, and is not something we collectively have the governance or willingness to enact.

Therefore, the only way to truly eradicate COVID is through vaccinating almost everyone, or waiting until only the vaccinated and those who develop natural immunity (through getting COVID, surviving, and developing antibodies in the process) remain.

A vaccine exists that is proven to be safe and effective at extremely high rates. It is easily obtained and can be taken by anyone in the US over 5 years old who is willing to take it.

If we can't get almost everyone to take the vaccine, COVID will continue to mutate into new variants, as unvaccinated people pass it to each other and allow for it to continue to survive (resulting in continued deaths -- especially to those most at risk like the elderly and immunocompromised).

Therefore, those who do not take the vaccine are ensuring that COVID will persist until everyone is either (1) vaccinated, (2) naturally immune, or (3) dead.

If you accept all of the above to be true (and essentially inevitable barring government vaccination mandates), then the only rational approach is to get vaccinated and keep getting boosters until those who refuse either die off or develop enough natural immunity through contracting COVID enough times to survive.

In the meantime we have to hope that a new COVID variant doesn't emerge that is so contagious and deadly that it wipes out a huge swath of the population -- vaccinated as well as unvaccinated.

It's sad, but this is what those who refuse to get the vaccine are choosing. They just seem to lack the logic to understand it.

[playa-hater]

This is an amazingly depressing times we live in.. I just hope and pray we can get through this.. Prayers for any and everyone effected by these times..

[ddb]

"Medical links" aka cobbled together bull from antivax idiots including from "planet lockdown" which claimed that the vaccine is gonna microchip us all. What a **** loser.

You obviously didn’t watch it.

[Bad-Thoma]

"Medical links" aka cobbled together bull from antivax idiots including from "planet lockdown" which claimed that the vaccine is gonna microchip us all. What a **** loser.

You obviously didn’t watch it.

[Bucksmaniac]

Let me try to lay this out in simple logical format (if A then B, if B then C, etc.) Please let me know if any of this is wrong, especially the medically trained within our group:

In order for COVID to completely go away we must either (1) quarantine/wait until it dies out or (2) achieve immunity through vaccinating almost everyone.

Global quarantining until COVID dies out would have massive social and economic impact, and is not something we collectively have the governance or willingness to enact.

Therefore, the only way to truly eradicate COVID is through vaccinating almost everyone, or waiting until only the vaccinated and those who develop natural immunity (through getting COVID, surviving, and developing antibodies in the process) remain.

A vaccine exists that is proven to be safe and effective at extremely high rates. It is easily obtained and can be taken by anyone in the US over 5 years old who is willing to take it.

If we can't get almost everyone to take the vaccine, COVID will continue to mutate into new variants, as unvaccinated people pass it to each other and allow for it to continue to survive (resulting in continued deaths -- especially to those most at risk like the elderly and immunocompromised).

Therefore, those who do not take the vaccine are ensuring that COVID will persist until everyone is either (1) vaccinated, (2) naturally immune, or (3) dead.

If you accept all of the above to be true (and essentially inevitable barring government vaccination mandates), then the only rational approach is to get vaccinated and keep getting boosters until those who refuse either die off or develop enough natural immunity through contracting COVID enough times to survive.

In the meantime we have to hope that a new COVID variant doesn't emerge that is so contagious and deadly that it wipes out a huge swath of the population -- vaccinated as well as unvaccinated.

It's sad, but this is what those who refuse to get the vaccine are choosing. They just seem to lack the logic to understand it.

You have people catching COVID now that pretty recently had their booster, so even if everyone was vaccinated it wouldn’t go away completely, it just never will unless naturally burning itself out.

[Bad-Thoma]

Let me try to lay this out in simple logical format (if A then B, if B then C, etc.) Please let me know if any of this is wrong, especially the medically trained within our group:

In order for COVID to completely go away we must either (1) quarantine/wait until it dies out or (2) achieve immunity through vaccinating almost everyone.

Global quarantining until COVID dies out would have massive social and economic impact, and is not something we collectively have the governance or willingness to enact.

Therefore, the only way to truly eradicate COVID is through vaccinating almost everyone, or waiting until only the vaccinated and those who develop natural immunity (through getting COVID, surviving, and developing antibodies in the process) remain.

A vaccine exists that is proven to be safe and effective at extremely high rates. It is easily obtained and can be taken by anyone in the US over 5 years old who is willing to take it.

If we can't get almost everyone to take the vaccine, COVID will continue to mutate into new variants, as unvaccinated people pass it to each other and allow for it to continue to survive (resulting in continued deaths -- especially to those most at risk like the elderly and immunocompromised).

Therefore, those who do not take the vaccine are ensuring that COVID will persist until everyone is either (1) vaccinated, (2) naturally immune, or (3) dead.

If you accept all of the above to be true (and essentially inevitable barring government vaccination mandates), then the only rational approach is to get vaccinated and keep getting boosters until those who refuse either die off or develop enough natural immunity through contracting COVID enough times to survive.

In the meantime we have to hope that a new COVID variant doesn't emerge that is so contagious and deadly that it wipes out a huge swath of the population -- vaccinated as well as unvaccinated.

It's sad, but this is what those who refuse to get the vaccine are choosing. They just seem to lack the logic to understand it.

You have people catching COVID now that pretty recently had their booster, so even if everyone was vaccinated it wouldn’t go away completely, it just never will unless naturally burning itself out.

If you are vaccinated you don't get as sick which means significantly less viral mass to mutate, pass on etc. You're bodies immune system response is prepped by a vaccine to react faster reducing the chance it has to replicate. It's not hard.

[exculpatory]

https://rumble.com/vr10fp-scientists-and-doctors-with-a-critical-view-on-the-corona-crisis.html

Just a bunch of "outliers" I'm sure.
Perhaps they aren't outliers....they're just being surpressed by big tech.

If ex and whoever else can post their medical links & videos, so can I.

There is always more than 1 side, people.

Compliments to Greenroom & Bad Thom for their excellent posts just above as very smart lay people!

How about a post with no bashing (like I posted numerous times in earlier threads when I tried to patiently & politely explain true Covid medicine - before I reached my saturation/frustration boiling point)?

Here it comes.

There is a VAST VAST difference between the peer reviewed medical links which I post, summarize & explain - which reflect the consensus opinion of the VAST VAST majority of the world’s smartest, most well renowned & most accomplished ID physicians, epidemiologists & virologists, & the outlier links you occasionally post.
There is a VAST VAST difference between my medical insights & explanations as an extremely experienced/knowledgeable academic physician & your less than elementary understanding of clinical trials & true science.
In other words, I know more than you do about this by a factor of about a million.
Furthermore, it is irrational beyond description to believe that there is some kind of international conspiracy involving experts from all over the world, the CDC, the EXPERT & GOVERNMENT-INDEPENDENT ACIP (ADVISORY COMMITTEE ON IMMUNIZATION PRACTICES) which advises the CDC, the FDA, the LIKEWISE EXPERT & GOVERNMENT INDEPENDENT IMMUNIZATION ADVISORY COMMITTEE which advises the FDA, the NIH & big Pharma suppressing certain information. It truly borders on lunacy.

That is the best I can do, DDB.
Good luck.
You will need it if you continue unvaccinated & unmasked as new Omicron cases soon exceed 1/2-1 million per day.

PS This also bears repeating. Given that you have already survived Covid, if you were to receive the booster now, your protection VS reinfection with Omicron would most likely EXCEED the protection VS de novo Omicron infection of those of us who have been recently boosted in the context of 2 prior vaccinations. You would also be MUCH MUCH less likely to spread the disease to the unvaccinated around you (& the vulnerable at risk groups who have been vaccinated +/- boosted). And the less spread, the less likely new variants even worse than Omicron & Delta will evolve. That is the best advice I can give you. Cya.

[Bad-Thoma]

https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/omicron-infections-appear-no-less-severe-than-delta-covid-19-lowers-sperm-count-2021-12-20/

Various interesting bits. Here is why I have faith in Reuters, opening paragraph to the article -

Dec 20 (Reuters) - The following is a summary of some recent studies on COVID-19. They include research that warrants further study to corroborate the findings and that has yet to be certified by peer review.

Transparency right at the front of the summaries.

The aptamer bit seems really interesting, I'm looking forward to seeing what happens with it. If it works to its potential I'm also looking forward to rolling my eyes at all the people that won't take it because they think its 5g will microchip them with windmill cancer.

[Captain_Caveman]

Let me try to lay this out in simple logical format (if A then B, if B then C, etc.) Please let me know if any of this is wrong, especially the medically trained within our group:

In order for COVID to completely go away we must either (1) quarantine/wait until it dies out or (2) achieve immunity through vaccinating almost everyone.

Global quarantining until COVID dies out would have massive social and economic impact, and is not something we collectively have the governance or willingness to enact.

Therefore, the only way to truly eradicate COVID is through vaccinating almost everyone, or waiting until only the vaccinated and those who develop natural immunity (through getting COVID, surviving, and developing antibodies in the process) remain.

A vaccine exists that is proven to be safe and effective at extremely high rates. It is easily obtained and can be taken by anyone in the US over 5 years old who is willing to take it.

If we can't get almost everyone to take the vaccine, COVID will continue to mutate into new variants, as unvaccinated people pass it to each other and allow for it to continue to survive (resulting in continued deaths -- especially to those most at risk like the elderly and immunocompromised).

Therefore, those who do not take the vaccine are ensuring that COVID will persist until everyone is either (1) vaccinated, (2) naturally immune, or (3) dead.

If you accept all of the above to be true (and essentially inevitable barring government vaccination mandates), then the only rational approach is to get vaccinated and keep getting boosters until those who refuse either die off or develop enough natural immunity through contracting COVID enough times to survive.

In the meantime we have to hope that a new COVID variant doesn't emerge that is so contagious and deadly that it wipes out a huge swath of the population -- vaccinated as well as unvaccinated.

It's sad, but this is what those who refuse to get the vaccine are choosing. They just seem to lack the logic to understand it.

You have people catching COVID now that pretty recently had their booster, so even if everyone was vaccinated it wouldn’t go away completely, it just never will unless naturally burning itself out.

If you are vaccinated you don't get as sick which means significantly less viral mass to mutate, pass on etc. You're bodies immune system response is prepped by a vaccine to react faster reducing the chance it has to replicate. It's not hard.

Dude just copped to doing facebook research on the COVID thread in Current Affairs.

viewtopic.php?p=95538738#p95538738

[Bad-Thoma]

You have people catching COVID now that pretty recently had their booster, so even if everyone was vaccinated it wouldn’t go away completely, it just never will unless naturally burning itself out.

If you are vaccinated you don't get as sick which means significantly less viral mass to mutate, pass on etc. You're bodies immune system response is prepped by a vaccine to react faster reducing the chance it has to replicate. It's not hard.

Dude just copped to doing facebook research on the COVID thread in Current Affairs.

viewtopic.php?p=95538738#p95538738

He'll have no idea why that is problematic.

[exculpatory]

Let me try to lay this out in simple logical format (if A then B, if B then C, etc.) Please let me know if any of this is wrong, especially the medically trained within our group:

In order for COVID to completely go away we must either (1) quarantine/wait until it dies out or (2) achieve immunity through vaccinating almost everyone.

Global quarantining until COVID dies out would have massive social and economic impact, and is not something we collectively have the governance or willingness to enact.

Therefore, the only way to truly eradicate COVID is through vaccinating almost everyone, or waiting until only the vaccinated and those who develop natural immunity (through getting COVID, surviving, and developing antibodies in the process) remain.

A vaccine exists that is proven to be safe and effective at extremely high rates. It is easily obtained and can be taken by anyone in the US over 5 years old who is willing to take it.

If we can't get almost everyone to take the vaccine, COVID will continue to mutate into new variants, as unvaccinated people pass it to each other and allow for it to continue to survive (resulting in continued deaths -- especially to those most at risk like the elderly and immunocompromised).

Therefore, those who do not take the vaccine are ensuring that COVID will persist until everyone is either (1) vaccinated, (2) naturally immune, or (3) dead.

If you accept all of the above to be true (and essentially inevitable barring government vaccination mandates), then the only rational approach is to get vaccinated and keep getting boosters until those who refuse either die off or develop enough natural immunity through contracting COVID enough times to survive.

In the meantime we have to hope that a new COVID variant doesn't emerge that is so contagious and deadly that it wipes out a huge swath of the population -- vaccinated as well as unvaccinated.

It's sad, but this is what those who refuse to get the vaccine are choosing. They just seem to lack the logic to understand it.

Great work.

Read my last post.

[exculpatory]

Let me try to lay this out in simple logical format (if A then B, if B then C, etc.) Please let me know if any of this is wrong, especially the medically trained within our group:

In order for COVID to completely go away we must either (1) quarantine/wait until it dies out or (2) achieve immunity through vaccinating almost everyone.

Global quarantining until COVID dies out would have massive social and economic impact, and is not something we collectively have the governance or willingness to enact.

Therefore, the only way to truly eradicate COVID is through vaccinating almost everyone, or waiting until only the vaccinated and those who develop natural immunity (through getting COVID, surviving, and developing antibodies in the process) remain.

A vaccine exists that is proven to be safe and effective at extremely high rates. It is easily obtained and can be taken by anyone in the US over 5 years old who is willing to take it.

If we can't get almost everyone to take the vaccine, COVID will continue to mutate into new variants, as unvaccinated people pass it to each other and allow for it to continue to survive (resulting in continued deaths -- especially to those most at risk like the elderly and immunocompromised).

Therefore, those who do not take the vaccine are ensuring that COVID will persist until everyone is either (1) vaccinated, (2) naturally immune, or (3) dead.

If you accept all of the above to be true (and essentially inevitable barring government vaccination mandates), then the only rational approach is to get vaccinated and keep getting boosters until those who refuse either die off or develop enough natural immunity through contracting COVID enough times to survive.

In the meantime we have to hope that a new COVID variant doesn't emerge that is so contagious and deadly that it wipes out a huge swath of the population -- vaccinated as well as unvaccinated.

It's sad, but this is what those who refuse to get the vaccine are choosing. They just seem to lack the logic to understand it.

You have people catching COVID now that pretty recently had their booster, so even if everyone was vaccinated it wouldn’t go away completely, it just never will unless naturally burning itself out.

If you are vaccinated you don't get as sick which means significantly less viral mass to mutate, pass on etc. YOUR bodies immune system response is prepped by a vaccine to react faster reducing the chance it has to replicate. It's not hard.

Great response.
Proud of you (for a liberal).

PS I corrected your grammar.

[cl2117]

"Medical links" aka cobbled together bull from antivax idiots including from "planet lockdown" which claimed that the vaccine is gonna microchip us all. What a **** loser.

You obviously didn’t watch it.

I did. Did you? Look in the top left/right corners of each clip, it lets you know where they've pulled the interviews from....

I for one love my new micro chip.

Please log-off as you promised.

[Scarletfire81]

51 million covid cases in the US

800k deaths

That’s 1.6 percent chance of dying from covid.

My age group 40-49 is only 3.9 percent of that 800k.

That’s 31200 deaths out of 51 million cases.

That’s strictly the numbers.

Make what you want out of it.

[Andrew McCeltic]

That is simply not true.

The vast vast majority of physicians with true & appropriate expertise in Covid medicine all over the world (not just at the CDC) will tell you that what Makary is saying is untrue. He is an outlier & a frequent guest of Laura Ingraham on Fox.

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/961975
COVID-19 Vaccines Provide 5 Times the Protection of Natural Immunity, CDC Study Says

https://www.medpagetoday.com/infectiousdisease/covid19vaccine/93940
Debate Is Over. COVID Vaccination Doubled Protection For The Previously Infected

https://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/961995
Vaccine After COVID-19 Infection Boosts Immune Response, Study Finds

PS FYI.
1. I draw all of my conclusions about Covid medicine by reading the original source peer reviewed literature with the eyes/brain of an extremely experienced, knowledgeable, brilliant & dedicated physician. I am NOT influenced in the **** slightest by the media.
2. That said, for the record, I am NOT at all a “hair on fire” liberal with regard to many other issues - where I am well to the right of center. The exception for me in a huge way is Covid. I have devoted my life to excellence in the teaching & practice of medicine. Excellence in medicine is literally ingrained in my being. It physically hurts me to see bad or careless medicine & I have an extremely high standard for myself & the younger physicians I train.
3. And the left-leaning news media are handling Covid much more truthfully & vastly more accurately than Fox. An inconvertible fact.

Love the doctor shopping until you find a crank or a quack who'll tell you what you want to hear. The one guy on Fox News says they're all lying to me!

Geez at least get the news channel right. It’s definitely not Fox News. Fox is so 2015

You’re sure you didn’t just forget how to work the cable tv? Lot of steps

[Bucksmaniac]

Let me try to lay this out in simple logical format (if A then B, if B then C, etc.) Please let me know if any of this is wrong, especially the medically trained within our group:

In order for COVID to completely go away we must either (1) quarantine/wait until it dies out or (2) achieve immunity through vaccinating almost everyone.

Global quarantining until COVID dies out would have massive social and economic impact, and is not something we collectively have the governance or willingness to enact.

Therefore, the only way to truly eradicate COVID is through vaccinating almost everyone, or waiting until only the vaccinated and those who develop natural immunity (through getting COVID, surviving, and developing antibodies in the process) remain.

A vaccine exists that is proven to be safe and effective at extremely high rates. It is easily obtained and can be taken by anyone in the US over 5 years old who is willing to take it.

If we can't get almost everyone to take the vaccine, COVID will continue to mutate into new variants, as unvaccinated people pass it to each other and allow for it to continue to survive (resulting in continued deaths -- especially to those most at risk like the elderly and immunocompromised).

Therefore, those who do not take the vaccine are ensuring that COVID will persist until everyone is either (1) vaccinated, (2) naturally immune, or (3) dead.

If you accept all of the above to be true (and essentially inevitable barring government vaccination mandates), then the only rational approach is to get vaccinated and keep getting boosters until those who refuse either die off or develop enough natural immunity through contracting COVID enough times to survive.

In the meantime we have to hope that a new COVID variant doesn't emerge that is so contagious and deadly that it wipes out a huge swath of the population -- vaccinated as well as unvaccinated.

It's sad, but this is what those who refuse to get the vaccine are choosing. They just seem to lack the logic to understand it.

You have people catching COVID now that pretty recently had their booster, so even if everyone was vaccinated it wouldn’t go away completely, it just never will unless naturally burning itself out.

If you are vaccinated you don't get as sick which means significantly less viral mass to mutate, pass on etc. You're bodies immune system response is prepped by a vaccine to react faster reducing the chance it has to replicate. It's not hard.

Since liberals tend to ask for the same when the shoe is on the other foot do you have a peer-reviewed article showing lower viral load in the vaccinated?

[Bad-Thoma]

You have people catching COVID now that pretty recently had their booster, so even if everyone was vaccinated it wouldn’t go away completely, it just never will unless naturally burning itself out.

If you are vaccinated you don't get as sick which means significantly less viral mass to mutate, pass on etc. YOUR bodies immune system response is prepped by a vaccine to react faster reducing the chance it has to replicate. It's not hard.

Great response.
Proud of you (for a liberal).

PS I corrected your grammar.

OK, can't believe I missed a your - you're. You got me there.

[Bad-Thoma]

You have people catching COVID now that pretty recently had their booster, so even if everyone was vaccinated it wouldn’t go away completely, it just never will unless naturally burning itself out.

If you are vaccinated you don't get as sick which means significantly less viral mass to mutate, pass on etc. You're bodies immune system response is prepped by a vaccine to react faster reducing the chance it has to replicate. It's not hard.

Since liberals tend to ask for the same when the shoe is on the other foot do you have a peer-reviewed article showing lower viral load in the vaccinated?

Why would I need a peer reviewed article to prove something you should have learned in 8th grade science? A vaccine isn't a **** full body condom that you put on that protects you from the virus even entering your lungs man, what exactly do you think is going on here? Even people that don't get sick get exposed to it, it's the strength and speed of the body's immune reaction that keeps it from replicating as much and sometimes spreading to more vulnerable systems. Naturally the longer it takes to react and the weaker the reaction the more chance the virus has to increase viral load and the more you exhale with your breath, with your saliva, etc. Then when you get sick enough that you start coughing you expel the **** in great clouds of viral fun for any surrounding bystanders to share in, spreading the joy for all humanity.

[Bad-Thoma]

51 million covid cases in the US

800k deaths

That’s 1.6 percent chance of dying from covid.

My age group 40-49 is only 3.9 percent of that 800k.

That’s 31200 deaths out of 51 million cases.

That’s strictly the numbers.

Make what you want out of it.

What in the ever loving **** is that supposed to be? I'm in the same age group and without checking those numbers I believe them, but it's not just me me me **** me. If I get sick I can pass it someone who is more at risk or someone who then passes it to someone who is more at risk. I could get really sick and end up hospitalized which is a higher percentage than death. Me taking up valuable hospital resources during a pandemic could cost someone else dearly. I could be part of the unvaccinated who are providing fertile ground for mutation and survive and not be a part of that myopic statistic you put up there. I could do it all while thinking, "I'll most likely be fine so who cares."