Shams: Pacers Moving toward Rebuild; Receptive to Trade Talks

[Wizop]

Excellent podcast from C2_Cooper.

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[Larry_Russell]

What do you think of

Robert WIlliams
Juancho Hernangomez (EXP)
ROmeo Langford

for

Turner

[Topofthekey]

What do you think of

Robert WIlliams
Juancho Hernangomez (EXP)
ROmeo Langford

for

Turner

Interesting. But where's the actual trade?

Where are the picks and pick swaps?

Snarkiness aside, this trade doesn't do anything for the Pacers. They downgrade from Turner to Williams, and the payoff is Langford? Don't see the point

[boomershadow]

This is the first time I've been in favor of a full rebuild so far. I really thought the team that hit the fourth seed a few years ago and had Bubble Warren had potential to go further than it did. But it didn't. It's time to move on. If we don't look to the future now, the team will be in the same state in the future as it is now.

There is an over simplification that exists saying you can only build for the future by being bad now or you can get better in the present. I don't think trading almost everyone can make things much worse than they already are. I'm down to trade Turner, Sabonis, and Levert right away for whatever young guys and picks we can get. The front office has been trying so hard to make this core better for so long they have lost sight that moving on from it might make the team better right away.

ESPECIALLY if the Dubs are willing to give up Wiseman for Sabonis.

[Wizop]

What do you think of

Robert WIlliams
Juancho Hernangomez (EXP)
ROmeo Langford

for

Turner

I don't like any trade that doesn't include a facilitator at point coming here.

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[Scoot McGroot]

This is the first time I've been in favor of a full rebuild so far. I really thought the team that hit the fourth seed a few years ago and had Bubble Warren had potential to go further than it did. But it didn't. It's time to move on. If we don't look to the future now, the team will be in the same state in the future as it is now.

There is an over simplification that exists saying you can only build for the future by being bad now or you can get better in the present. I don't think trading almost everyone can make things much worse than they already are. I'm down to trade Turner, Sabonis, and Levert right away for whatever young guys and picks we can get. The front office has been trying so hard to make this core better for so long they have lost sight that moving on from it might make the team better right away.

ESPECIALLY if the Dubs are willing to give up Wiseman for Sabonis.

I really don’t want to get away from the twin towers build, only to be forced into another twin towers rebuild dependent on being able to play two centers together, or dumping Jackson/Goga for essentially nothing in return in order to build around Wiseman.

Give me Kuminga, all day long. There’s a chance you could even play Turner or Goga with Jackson and Kuminga at the same time, too. Here’s no chance you could play any 3 of Jackson, Goga, Turner, and Wiseman together. It’s just blocking your prospects or wasting assets, to me.

[Scoot McGroot]

What do you think of

Robert WIlliams
Juancho Hernangomez (EXP)
ROmeo Langford

for

Turner

There nothing there for Indy. RW3 is a fine player, although clearly a downgrade from Turner. Juancho does essentially nothing for us this year. Romeo should be a fine prospect, but he really isn’t. It’s tough to see him as the value needed in downgrading from Turner to Rob.

[boomershadow]

This is the first time I've been in favor of a full rebuild so far. I really thought the team that hit the fourth seed a few years ago and had Bubble Warren had potential to go further than it did. But it didn't. It's time to move on. If we don't look to the future now, the team will be in the same state in the future as it is now.

There is an over simplification that exists saying you can only build for the future by being bad now or you can get better in the present. I don't think trading almost everyone can make things much worse than they already are. I'm down to trade Turner, Sabonis, and Levert right away for whatever young guys and picks we can get. The front office has been trying so hard to make this core better for so long they have lost sight that moving on from it might make the team better right away.

ESPECIALLY if the Dubs are willing to give up Wiseman for Sabonis.

I really don’t want to get away from the twin towers build, only to be forced into another twin towers rebuild dependent on being able to play two centers together, or dumping Jackson/Goga for essentially nothing in return in order to build around Wiseman.

Give me Kuminga, all day long. There’s a chance you could even play Turner or Goga with Jackson and Kuminga at the same time, too. Here’s no chance you could play any 3 of Jackson, Goga, Turner, and Wiseman together. It’s just blocking your prospects or wasting assets, to me.

I would take Kuminga too.

I would honestly trade both Sabonis and Turner. It just makes the most sense to me at this point. A slight retool around one or the other would have made sense a year or two or even longer ago. Idk if it does now. I want a harder reset. I don't want to tank, but sometimes the deck just needs reshuffled.

I'm higher on Goga than most Pacer fans I've seen and there has been some talk about whether Jackson is better at the 4 or 5. Regardless, I don't see either of them as being players you turn down the opportunity to build around a top 2 pick for. That is if he is on the table even.

[Scoot McGroot]

This is the first time I've been in favor of a full rebuild so far. I really thought the team that hit the fourth seed a few years ago and had Bubble Warren had potential to go further than it did. But it didn't. It's time to move on. If we don't look to the future now, the team will be in the same state in the future as it is now.

There is an over simplification that exists saying you can only build for the future by being bad now or you can get better in the present. I don't think trading almost everyone can make things much worse than they already are. I'm down to trade Turner, Sabonis, and Levert right away for whatever young guys and picks we can get. The front office has been trying so hard to make this core better for so long they have lost sight that moving on from it might make the team better right away.

ESPECIALLY if the Dubs are willing to give up Wiseman for Sabonis.

I really don’t want to get away from the twin towers build, only to be forced into another twin towers rebuild dependent on being able to play two centers together, or dumping Jackson/Goga for essentially nothing in return in order to build around Wiseman.

Give me Kuminga, all day long. There’s a chance you could even play Turner or Goga with Jackson and Kuminga at the same time, too. Here’s no chance you could play any 3 of Jackson, Goga, Turner, and Wiseman together. It’s just blocking your prospects or wasting assets, to me.

I would take Kuminga too.

I would honestly trade both Sabonis and Turner. It just makes the most sense to me at this point. A slight retool around one or the other would have made sense a year or two or even longer ago. Idk if it does now. I want a harder reset. I don't want to tank, but sometimes the deck just needs reshuffled.

I'm higher on Goga than most Pacer fans I've seen and there has been some talk about whether Jackson is better at the 4 or 5. Regardless, I don't see either of them as being players you turn down the opportunity to build around a top 2 pick for. That is if he is on the table even.

Oh, I think both are likely much better players than their trade value would be. It’s essentially be giving up on the two of them to focus on Wiseman, or wasting Wiseman by focusing on developing the other two. Either way, you’d be wasting a ton of young talent you’ve invested heavily in.

Or….

You’d just be setting yourself up to play twin towers again with some combo of these guys going forward, which seems like something we shouldn’t be doing.

[Topofthekey]

Someone on the Pacers subreddit suggested tripling down on the twin tower approach and starting Goga with Turbonis

I mean, it's obviously a meme

Or is it?

Turbonis has been nett positive. Starting Goga at SF sounds like a terrible idea defensively, but defensively how much worse off than Lauri Markkanen is Goga?

The team has a hole at SF anyway, right?

We can call it Turboze too

[8305]

Someone on the Pacers subreddit suggested tripling down on the twin tower approach and starting Goga with Turbonis

I mean, it's obviously a meme

Or is it?

Turbonis has been nett positive. Starting Goga at SF sounds like a terrible idea defensively, but defensively how much worse off than Lauri Markkanen is Goga?

The team has a hole at SF anyway, right?

We can call it Turboze too

Like the title, hate the concept.

[boomershadow]

I watched.a Cavs game the other day and remembered how bad I wanted Ricky Rubio.

[Hoop Hunter]

What do you think of

Robert WIlliams
Juancho Hernangomez (EXP)
ROmeo Langford

for

Turner

Why would the Pacers do that? huge downgrade. We will not be having a fire sale. If Jalen Brown is not in the trade for Turner or Sabonis there will not be one. Seems fair Tatum and Brown don't fit, Turner ad Sabonis don't fit.

Sabonis and LeVert for Brown and Smart.

[Larry_Russell]

What do you think of

Robert WIlliams
Juancho Hernangomez (EXP)
ROmeo Langford

for

Turner

Why would the Pacers do that? huge downgrade. We will not be having a fire sale. If Jalen Brown is not in the trade for Turner or Sabonis there will not be one. Seems fair Tatum and Brown don't fit, Turner ad Sabonis don't fit.

Sabonis and LeVert for Brown and Smart.

Lol. Nope

[Topofthekey]

What do you think of

Robert WIlliams
Juancho Hernangomez (EXP)
ROmeo Langford

for

Turner

Why would the Pacers do that? huge downgrade. We will not be having a fire sale. If Jalen Brown is not in the trade for Turner or Sabonis there will not be one. Seems fair Tatum and Brown don't fit, Turner ad Sabonis don't fit.

Sabonis and LeVert for Brown and Smart.

Lol. Nope

I understand the allure behind Brown. I really do. He's a young, 20+ PPG scorer playing a sexy position

That said, he's a negative on defense. Unlike Sabonis, who is a plus on both sides. Add to that Sabonis' playmaking skills, I rate Sabonis as the better player of the two. There are many Pacer fans who would trade Sabonis for Brown, but I am not one of them

[Larry_Russell]

Why would the Pacers do that? huge downgrade. We will not be having a fire sale. If Jalen Brown is not in the trade for Turner or Sabonis there will not be one. Seems fair Tatum and Brown don't fit, Turner ad Sabonis don't fit.

Sabonis and LeVert for Brown and Smart.

Lol. Nope

I understand the allure behind Brown. I really do. He's a young, 20+ PPG scorer playing a sexy position

That said, he's a negative on defense. Unlike Sabonis, who is a plus on both sides. Add to that Sabonis' playmaking skills, I rate Sabonis as the better player of the two. There are many Pacer fans who would trade Sabonis for Brown, but I am not one of them

Wrong.

Celtics are plus 18 defensively when brown is on the court.

Sabonis is a pylon defensively.

[Topofthekey]

Lol. Nope

I understand the allure behind Brown. I really do. He's a young, 20+ PPG scorer playing a sexy position

That said, he's a negative on defense. Unlike Sabonis, who is a plus on both sides. Add to that Sabonis' playmaking skills, I rate Sabonis as the better player of the two. There are many Pacer fans who would trade Sabonis for Brown, but I am not one of them

Wrong.

Celtics are plus 18 defensively when brown is on the court.

Sabonis is a pylon defensively.

Check his DBPM stats

He's been a negative throughout his career

[Andrew McCeltic]

If Sabonis were a net positive on defense there's no way Indiana would ever trade him..

[Tom White]

If Sabonis were a net positive on defense there's no way Indiana would ever trade him..

And guess what? They still haven't traded him. Don't put too much stock in rumors.

[Wizop]

Got a notice that we waived Wanamaker.