Where do you rank Moses Malone among Centers?

[Lalouie]

top10 near the end,

[Winsome Gerbil]

random thought/observation -- it was absolute fate that he would eventually come to Philadelphia to win a title, because he was the Smokin' Joe Frazier of basketball centers. Not the most brilliant, not the most charismatic, but the hardest nosed hardest working and most relentless. You could beat him sometimes, but you were always going to feel it the next morning and know you'd been in a battle. And he'd be right there ready to go the next day too. Willis Reed might have been the poor man's version.

[Sothron]

Wilt, KAJ, Russell, Moses, Hakeem for me.

[jazzfan1971]

Never saw him play. So, hard to say.
But, going to be hard to beat, Wilt, Kareem, Duncan, Hakeem, Shaq, Russel. So, I'm guessing maybe #7. I could see him in front of the Admiral. I could also see the Joker moving into that first group.

[rzzzzz]

Was kinda debating Jokic before I said it...but if Walton is making top 75 lists, I think Jokic at this point is a better player than he was at his best (I'm open to a debate there, it's not some "not close" deal).

It’s not close. I know we can’t compare Jokic to Walton to NCAA performances, since Jokic didn’t have the chance, but Walton’s last UCLA game, for the title, was mind blowing. It wasn’t perfect because he missed the last shot he took. (He had make them all until then.)

Walton was never fully healthy in the Pros, but Calendar year ‘77, he was his best. He had a fair power forward, and the rest of the roster were scrappy, but no one you would ever consider an all star. Walton was the league’s top defender, ran the Portland offense and ran the team in transition as well. He went through a top GOAT candidate to get the finals and beat a historic HOFer, who had a damn talented team, to win the title. And then the first half of the next season, he played even better, leading the Blazers to a .800 record before his foot fell off. Yeah, Walton’s best didn’t last long. He didn’t play at his best near long enough for any serious GOATish consideration (and probably should have looked out for himself a lot more carefully than the team’s medical staff). Though even hobbled, he came back with a great Boston squad and earned another title. When Jokic has two titles, we can talk about how much he did on his own to compare to a player who briefly did everything better than anybody else at the time.

[dhsilv2]

Was kinda debating Jokic before I said it...but if Walton is making top 75 lists, I think Jokic at this point is a better player than he was at his best (I'm open to a debate there, it's not some "not close" deal).

It’s not close. I know we can’t compare Jokic to Walton to NCAA performances, since Jokic didn’t have the chance, but Walton’s last UCLA game, for the title, was mind blowing. It wasn’t perfect because he missed the last shot he took. (He had make them all until then.)

Walton was never fully healthy in the Pros, but Calendar year ‘77, he was his best. He had a fair power forward, and the rest of the roster were scrappy, but no one you would ever consider an all star. Walton was the top league’s top defender, ran the Portland offense and ran the team in transition as well. He went through a top GOAT candidate to get the finals and beat a historic HOFer, who had a damn talented team, to win the title. And then the first half of the next season, he played even better, leading the Blazers to a .800 record before his foot fell off. Yeah, Walton’s best didn’t last long. He didn’t play at his best near long enough for any serious GOATish consideration (and probably should have looked out for himself a lot more carefully than the team’s medical staff). Though even hobbled, he came back with a great Boston squad and earned another title. When Jokic has two titles, we can talk about how much he did on his own to compare to a player who briefly did everything better than anybody else at the time.

I'll never consider a title meaningful at this level to be honest so I can't really engage. Walton was great, but Jokic is on another level as a scorer. He creates space unlike anything Walton could dream of. And 2-3 years ago the defensive gap was so stupid I'd laugh at myself but now Jokic is a good defender and his scoring gap closes that gap. Jokic has always been better and healthies longer. Maybe at Waltons best he was better...but even his in best years he was missing so many games. At this point I'm good with Jokic over Walton and I love Walton's best, it's epic, but it wasn't even a full season and playoffs. That matters. He was stupidly lucky to be on a team good enough for him to get a ring and in a league with no competition that year.

[rzzzzz]

He was stupidly lucky to be on a team good enough for him to get a ring and in a league with no competition that year.

That’s right. The Blazers were lucky to get rid of him, so he didn’t hold them back from becoming that HOF dynasty that dominated the league for so many years to come. In a league so devoid of talent after just merging with the ABA. No fun for anybody!

[LewisnotMiller]

For a boneheaded minute i was thinking of the Mavs center Moses Brown instead of Moses Malone

I've got him ranked a little lower...lol

[wojoaderge]

He was stupidly lucky to be on a team good enough for him to get a ring and in a league with no competition that year.

That’s right. The Blazers were lucky to get rid of him, so he didn’t hold them back from becoming that HOF dynasty that dominated the league for so many years to come. In a league so devoid of talent after just merging with the ABA. No fun for anybody!

+1 exactly

[Perishable517]

Obvious guys ahead of him
Duncan
Wilt
Russell
Shaq
Kareem
Hakeem

Then similar level

Robinson
Jokic (yep moving him on up)

That's about what I was thinking, though I didn't think of TD I guess since most consider him a PF though I know he's really more of a C. I also thought of Jokic who will end up somewhere in there but kind of decided I shouldn't really rank guys until their career is either over or on the downside.

Was kinda debating Jokic before I said it...but if Walton is making top 75 lists, I think Jokic at this point is a better player than he was at his best (I'm open to a debate there, it's not some "not close" deal). I think we have so many insanely good years for Jokic at this point and after last year, I can't see this year as just some "in the moment" thing either.

I should add I wanted to add Embiid but I have more questions on him but I think his play warrants being in this discussion.

The one guy I left off was Mikan, which I'm now thinking should be there, but god he's era is weird. And I think Ewing maybe should be on that tier with Moses but I think Moses was better.

For me, Moses is clearly better than Ewing. Moses was the heart of thos great Philly teams in the early 80s.

Sent from my HTC U11 using RealGM mobile app

[bwgood77]

That's about what I was thinking, though I didn't think of TD I guess since most consider him a PF though I know he's really more of a C. I also thought of Jokic who will end up somewhere in there but kind of decided I shouldn't really rank guys until their career is either over or on the downside.

Was kinda debating Jokic before I said it...but if Walton is making top 75 lists, I think Jokic at this point is a better player than he was at his best (I'm open to a debate there, it's not some "not close" deal). I think we have so many insanely good years for Jokic at this point and after last year, I can't see this year as just some "in the moment" thing either.

I should add I wanted to add Embiid but I have more questions on him but I think his play warrants being in this discussion.

The one guy I left off was Mikan, which I'm now thinking should be there, but god he's era is weird. And I think Ewing maybe should be on that tier with Moses but I think Moses was better.

For me, Moses is clearly better than Ewing. Moses was the heart of thos great Philly teams in the early 80s.

Sent from my HTC U11 using RealGM mobile app

Yeah, I didn't even consider him. Like he popped into my head but he seems well below everyone else mentioned.

[Golden Knight]

For a boneheaded minute i was thinking of the Mavs center Moses Brown instead of Moses Malone

He's ahead of Cauley-Stein.

[dhsilv2]

That's about what I was thinking, though I didn't think of TD I guess since most consider him a PF though I know he's really more of a C. I also thought of Jokic who will end up somewhere in there but kind of decided I shouldn't really rank guys until their career is either over or on the downside.

Was kinda debating Jokic before I said it...but if Walton is making top 75 lists, I think Jokic at this point is a better player than he was at his best (I'm open to a debate there, it's not some "not close" deal). I think we have so many insanely good years for Jokic at this point and after last year, I can't see this year as just some "in the moment" thing either.

I should add I wanted to add Embiid but I have more questions on him but I think his play warrants being in this discussion.

The one guy I left off was Mikan, which I'm now thinking should be there, but god he's era is weird. And I think Ewing maybe should be on that tier with Moses but I think Moses was better.

For me, Moses is clearly better than Ewing. Moses was the heart of thos great Philly teams in the early 80s.

Sent from my HTC U11 using RealGM mobile app

Had 90 ewing had the talent moses had, I'm pretty sure he could have gotten a ring too though. That's not a knock on Moses but peak Ewing was on another level defensively than moses. My issues with Ewing is more that his peak wasn't that long, his knees went and he became that mid 90's jump shooting guy most of us think about first. And the poor guy was just stuck without any real other stars on those knicks teams.

[HeartBreakKid]

That's about what I was thinking, though I didn't think of TD I guess since most consider him a PF though I know he's really more of a C. I also thought of Jokic who will end up somewhere in there but kind of decided I shouldn't really rank guys until their career is either over or on the downside.

Was kinda debating Jokic before I said it...but if Walton is making top 75 lists, I think Jokic at this point is a better player than he was at his best (I'm open to a debate there, it's not some "not close" deal). I think we have so many insanely good years for Jokic at this point and after last year, I can't see this year as just some "in the moment" thing either.

I should add I wanted to add Embiid but I have more questions on him but I think his play warrants being in this discussion.

The one guy I left off was Mikan, which I'm now thinking should be there, but god he's era is weird. And I think Ewing maybe should be on that tier with Moses but I think Moses was better.

For me, Moses is clearly better than Ewing. Moses was the heart of thos great Philly teams in the early 80s.

Sent from my HTC U11 using RealGM mobile app

What do you mean? His first year with them was 83, they had already gone to the finals multiple times before they got him.

[hauntedcomputer]

I definitely put Mikan in the top tier. Five rings, 23 ppg. I don't know why he doesn't get any credit. It's like Otto Graham in football--he's Tom Brady without the losses.

Moses was the best player in the world in '83. DRob was never that, even in his MVP year. Walton was arguably the best player in the world in '77. Jokic has never been the best player in the world and his career scoring average is sub-19. If he puts together four or five seasons and gets a title, I'd move him up, but I don't get the argument for moving him up now based on recency bias alone. If he suffers Walton-type injuries, he'll likely be remembered as a good player who had a great peak.

My rankings:
KAJ
Russell
Wilt
Mikan
Shaq
Hakeem
Moses
DRob

Hoopshype list seems pretty reasonable. I can't help but downgrade Shaq a little because he's one of the biggest underachievers in history for his size and talent. And I have an unreasonable fondness for Unseld, Thurmond, and Gilmore (whose ppg is on Jokic's level over 17 seasons). I still have Jokic in the Cowens/Sikma tier until he steps up over multiple seasons.

https://hoopshype.com/lists/20-greatest-centers-ever-the-hoopshype-list/

[Calvin Klein]

KAJ
Duncan
Shaq
Russell
Wilt
Hakeem
---------
Moses
---------
Robinson

[flranger]

He got Chuck to stop eating Chicken Wings all the time, has to move him up one spot at least

[dshearn]

I loved Moses. In his era, he was a top center. He wouldn’t be a fit in the modern game, I admit.

Eh,

Best all time offensive rebounder picking up the trash in a 3 point shooting league?

He likely could space as well, he had some rang and in todays NBA would have developed from deep i am sure.


He is one of my all time favorite players…. I think he was awesome enough to transcend generations.

[HeartBreakKid]

I definitely put Mikan in the top tier. Five rings, 23 ppg. I don't know why he doesn't get any credit. It's like Otto Graham in football--he's Tom Brady without the losses.

Moses was the best player in the world in '83. DRob was never that, even in his MVP year. Walton was arguably the best player in the world in '77. Jokic has never been the best player in the world and his career scoring average is sub-19. If he puts together four or five seasons and gets a title, I'd move him up, but I don't get the argument for moving him up now based on recency bias alone. If he suffers Walton-type injuries, he'll likely be remembered as a good player who had a great peak.

My rankings:
KAJ
Russell
Wilt
Mikan
Shaq
Hakeem
Moses
DRob

Hoopshype list seems pretty reasonable. I can't help but downgrade Shaq a little because he's one of the biggest underachievers in history for his size and talent. And I have an unreasonable fondness for Unseld, Thurmond, and Gilmore (whose ppg is on Jokic's level over 17 seasons). I still have Jokic in the Cowens/Sikma tier until he steps up over multiple seasons.

https://hoopshype.com/lists/20-greatest-centers-ever-the-hoopshype-list/

Huh, you could def argue that Jokic was the best player in the world, and what does his career average have to do with anything?

The argument that Robinson is worse than Malone because Robinson was never the best player in the world but Moses was makes no sense. Okay then, if Robinson wasn't the best player in the world - who was? The players you're thinking of, are they better than Moses? If so (and even according to the list you made that seems to be true) isn't that an incredibly flawed argument?

Also, Moses Malone was never the UNDISPUTED best player in the world. It's not like he was heads and shoulders above everyone, and even if he ever was, it was for one season. For whatever reason you mentioned Bill Walton who only had like 2 half way healthy seasons, but he was very clearly better than Moses Malone and they even played at the same time.

[bwgood77]

I definitely put Mikan in the top tier. Five rings, 23 ppg. I don't know why he doesn't get any credit. It's like Otto Graham in football--he's Tom Brady without the losses.

Moses was the best player in the world in '83. DRob was never that, even in his MVP year. Walton was arguably the best player in the world in '77. Jokic has never been the best player in the world and his career scoring average is sub-19. If he puts together four or five seasons and gets a title, I'd move him up, but I don't get the argument for moving him up now based on recency bias alone. If he suffers Walton-type injuries, he'll likely be remembered as a good player who had a great peak.

My rankings:
KAJ
Russell
Wilt
Mikan
Shaq
Hakeem
Moses
DRob

Hoopshype list seems pretty reasonable. I can't help but downgrade Shaq a little because he's one of the biggest underachievers in history for his size and talent. And I have an unreasonable fondness for Unseld, Thurmond, and Gilmore (whose ppg is on Jokic's level over 17 seasons). I still have Jokic in the Cowens/Sikma tier until he steps up over multiple seasons.

https://hoopshype.com/lists/20-greatest-centers-ever-the-hoopshype-list/

This isn't really an argument for DRob, but saying DRob was never the best in the world, if you're saying Jordan was, which is my guess, then Moses wouldn't have been either in that case. Reminds me of an argument seen on the Suns board, about whether peak KJ (short peak due to injuries) was better than peak Nash, and the MVPs are used as argument, yet Nash would never win MVPs if he played in the era of Jordan, Bird, Magic, etc.