Bradley Beal - Part III

[payitforward]

I like Beal and have no problems with him, other than I don't think he is a supermax player and I'm pretty sure that he is no longer on the upswing of his career. On a team that his clinging to a .500 record, I think we are better off with a younger Simmons making $35M a year, than Beal making $45M a year. But I say so with no animus toward Beal.

Bullseye.

True even though there's every reason to believe that Brad is a far nicer person than Ben.

[WallToWall]

What do people make of pg Beal? I think this is something that we will implement more and more. 17 assists yesterday!

Beal will be fine going against average defenders. Put a good defender on him and we would be having second thoughts about him at PG. I don’t mind having him handle the ball on short stretches of the game, when the matchups favor. Unless we have 3 players on the court who can handle the ball well enough, giving Beal a chance to pass out of a double team, or have someone else handle the ball when he is covered well, I can’t see a system with Beal at PG working. Do we want Beal using so much energy to bring the ball up, and also be the primary scorer?

[Ruzious]

The thing that really gives Beal a chance at playing the point regularly is that NBA teams do so little pressing - in general. Most teams have PG's expert at breaking the press, so actually pressing full court just isn't done much.

[dckingsfan]

The thing that really gives Beal a chance at playing the point regularly is that NBA teams do so little pressing - in general. Most teams have PG's expert at breaking the press, so actually pressing full court just isn't done much.

This. And if you have forwards that can bring the ball up as well - it just isn't an issue.

In a way, we would have been much better off (complete 20/20 hindsight) in not bringing in either Dinwiddie or Holiday and running with Beal as the starting PG. More ridiculous hindsight, we could have then signed Mathews.

PG: Beal/Neto
SG/SF Rotation: KCP/Mathews/Kispert
PF: Kuzma/Avidja
C: Gafford/Harrell

We would still have had Bryant and Hachimura coming back. And still have had Gill/Bertans off the bench for depth.

Edit: I guess given the above, I would put Dinwiddie, Holiday & Bertans out there if someone inquired. Doubtful we would get anything back (IMO).

[nate33]

The thing that really gives Beal a chance at playing the point regularly is that NBA teams do so little pressing - in general. Most teams have PG's expert at breaking the press, so actually pressing full court just isn't done much.

This. And if you have forwards that can bring the ball up as well - it just isn't an issue.

In a way, we would have been much better off (complete 20/20 hindsight) in not bringing in either Dinwiddie or Holiday and running with Beal as the starting PG. More ridiculous hindsight, we could have then signed Mathews.

PG: Beal/Neto
SG/SF Rotation: KCP/Mathews/Kispert
PF: Kuzma/Avidja
C: Gafford/Harrell

We would still have had Bryant and Hachimura coming back. And still have had Gill/Bertans off the bench for depth.

Edit: I guess given the above, I would put Dinwiddie, Holiday & Bertans out there if someone inquired. Doubtful we would get anything back (IMO).

I'm not writing off Dinwiddie as a bad signing yet. He missed an entire season with a blown ACL.

I still don't have a lot of issues with the signings, even with 20/20 hindsight. I thought Gill over Mathews made no sense, but other than that, I'm not complaining about either Neto or Holiday.

[dckingsfan]

The thing that really gives Beal a chance at playing the point regularly is that NBA teams do so little pressing - in general. Most teams have PG's expert at breaking the press, so actually pressing full court just isn't done much.

This. And if you have forwards that can bring the ball up as well - it just isn't an issue.

In a way, we would have been much better off (complete 20/20 hindsight) in not bringing in either Dinwiddie or Holiday and running with Beal as the starting PG. More ridiculous hindsight, we could have then signed Mathews.

PG: Beal/Neto
SG/SF Rotation: KCP/Mathews/Kispert
PF: Kuzma/Avidja
C: Gafford/Harrell

We would still have had Bryant and Hachimura coming back. And still have had Gill/Bertans off the bench for depth.

Edit: I guess given the above, I would put Dinwiddie, Holiday & Bertans out there if someone inquired. Doubtful we would get anything back (IMO).

I'm not writing off Dinwiddie as a bad signing yet. He missed an entire season with a blown ACL.

I still don't have a lot of issues with the signings, even with 20/20 hindsight. I thought Gill over Mathews made no sense, but other than that, I'm not complaining about either Neto or Holiday.

Gotcha - I just think we would have been in a much better place with the lineup I described, not to mention the cap flexibility.

And it would have allowed Wes not to run with the multiple PG lineups that have once again plagued us. Our strength is in our wings not our multiple PGs (opinion).

[nate33]

This. And if you have forwards that can bring the ball up as well - it just isn't an issue.

In a way, we would have been much better off (complete 20/20 hindsight) in not bringing in either Dinwiddie or Holiday and running with Beal as the starting PG. More ridiculous hindsight, we could have then signed Mathews.

PG: Beal/Neto
SG/SF Rotation: KCP/Mathews/Kispert
PF: Kuzma/Avidja
C: Gafford/Harrell

We would still have had Bryant and Hachimura coming back. And still have had Gill/Bertans off the bench for depth.

Edit: I guess given the above, I would put Dinwiddie, Holiday & Bertans out there if someone inquired. Doubtful we would get anything back (IMO).

I'm not writing off Dinwiddie as a bad signing yet. He missed an entire season with a blown ACL.

I still don't have a lot of issues with the signings, even with 20/20 hindsight. I thought Gill over Mathews made no sense, but other than that, I'm not complaining about either Neto or Holiday.

Gotcha - I just think we would have been in a much better place with the lineup I described, not to mention the cap flexibility.

And it would have allowed Wes not to run with the multiple PG lineups that have once again plagued us. Our strength is in our wings not our multiple PGs (opinion).

I think it's a little premature to label Beal a starting NBA PG. He had a two good games against bad defenses when there was no scouting report against the new look. Let's see him do it for 10 games.

[dckingsfan]

I'm not writing off Dinwiddie as a bad signing yet. He missed an entire season with a blown ACL.

I still don't have a lot of issues with the signings, even with 20/20 hindsight. I thought Gill over Mathews made no sense, but other than that, I'm not complaining about either Neto or Holiday.

Gotcha - I just think we would have been in a much better place with the lineup I described, not to mention the cap flexibility.

And it would have allowed Wes not to run with the multiple PG lineups that have once again plagued us. Our strength is in our wings not our multiple PGs (opinion).

I think it's a little premature to label Beal a starting NBA PG. He had a two good games against bad defenses when there was no scouting report against the new look. Let's see him do it for 10 games.

Ah, small sample size. I might counter that Beal's assist percentage is tops on the team at 30.8. If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck...

[DCZards]

As other have said, Beal is cool at PG if he's not being pressured but his handle is suspect…and too often acts like he can handle the ball like Curry or Harden, which leads to him turning the ball over. Love all the assists he's been getting though, but prefer to seen BB as a secondary (and not primary) ball handler.

Kuzma has taken on a lot of the responsibility for bringing the ball up in recent games, which gives Beal at least some time to rest while he's on the court.

What was most encouraging about the last game is that Kuz attacked the rim off the dribble and used his size to get easy baskets. Never seen him do that as much as he did against Chicago.

Kuz won't be able to do get to the rim that easily against all defenders but it's great to see him making that a bigger and bigger part of his offensive game.

[payitforward]

To get more assists, you have to handle the ball more. But, if you handle the ball more, you will turn the ball over more.

If adding 2 assists also adds 1 turnover, you haven't helped your team. The team has more or less broken even. If adding 2 assists also adds more than 1 turnover, the team loses on that change.

Brad has never managed to get to that 2-1 ratio, & he's certainly never exceeded it! This year he's getting 1.94 assists for every turnover. That's the 2d best of his career. It's also an improvement over the average of the previous 3 years, which was 1.72.

PG average = 2.41. For context, however, this year Chris Paul is recording over 4.3 assists for every 1 turnover.

[dckingsfan]

To get more assists, you have to handle the ball more. But, if you handle the ball more, you will turn the ball over more.

If adding 2 assists also adds 1 turnover, you haven't helped your team. The team has more or less broken even. If adding 2 assists also adds more than 1 turnover, the team loses on that change.

Brad has never managed to get to that 2-1 ratio, & he's certainly never exceeded it! This year he's getting 1.94 assists for every turnover. That's the 2d best of his career. It's also an improvement over the average of the previous 3 years, which was 1.72.

PG average = 2.41. For context, however, this year Chris Paul is recording over 4.3 assists for every 1 turnover.

Fair point and Dinwiddie is at 3-1.

My point gets to the original post that PGs are generally not pressured and I would love to see us run BB with three forwards. I think that is ultimately where the strength of this team will lie (especially if/when Rui comes back and Bertans starts to hit).

I guess the converse could also be true. Dinwiddie with three forwards. Either way, I think this rotation with BB and Dinwiddie is broken.

[tontoz]

As other have said, Beal is cool at PG if he's not being pressured but his handle is suspect…and too often acts like he can handle the ball like Curry or Harden, which leads to him turning the ball over. Love all the assists he's been getting though, but prefer to seen BB as a secondary (and not primary) ball handler.

Kuzma has taken on a lot of the responsibility for bringing the ball up in recent games, which gives Beal at least some time to rest while he's on the court.

What was most encouraging about the last game is that Kuz attacked the rim off the dribble and used his size to get easy baskets. Never seen him do that as much as he did against Chicago.

Kuz won't be able to do get to the rim that easily against all defenders but it's great to see him making that a bigger and bigger part of his offensive game.

That is one of the reasons why i would like to see them go big more often with Kuz at the 3 and Deni at the 4. Both guys can use their size to score inside against smaller defenders.

[Ruzious]

As other have said, Beal is cool at PG if he's not being pressured but his handle is suspect…and too often acts like he can handle the ball like Curry or Harden, which leads to him turning the ball over. Love all the assists he's been getting though, but prefer to seen BB as a secondary (and not primary) ball handler.

Kuzma has taken on a lot of the responsibility for bringing the ball up in recent games, which gives Beal at least some time to rest while he's on the court.

What was most encouraging about the last game is that Kuz attacked the rim off the dribble and used his size to get easy baskets. Never seen him do that as much as he did against Chicago.

Kuz won't be able to do get to the rim that easily against all defenders but it's great to see him making that a bigger and bigger part of his offensive game.

That is one of the reasons why i would like to see them go big more often with Kuz at the 3 and Deni at the 4. Both guys can use their size to score inside against smaller defenders.

And we can use our 4 best non-centers together at crunch time - if we use KCP at the 2 and Beal at the point - at least until Dinwiddie gets his ability to penetrate back. At the end of the Bulls game, we should have Deni covering DeRozan with KCP helping out. Instead, we had Kispert covering him with Beal helping out.

[nate33]

As other have said, Beal is cool at PG if he's not being pressured but his handle is suspect…and too often acts like he can handle the ball like Curry or Harden, which leads to him turning the ball over. Love all the assists he's been getting though, but prefer to seen BB as a secondary (and not primary) ball handler.

Kuzma has taken on a lot of the responsibility for bringing the ball up in recent games, which gives Beal at least some time to rest while he's on the court.

What was most encouraging about the last game is that Kuz attacked the rim off the dribble and used his size to get easy baskets. Never seen him do that as much as he did against Chicago.

Kuz won't be able to do get to the rim that easily against all defenders but it's great to see him making that a bigger and bigger part of his offensive game.

That is one of the reasons why i would like to see them go big more often with Kuz at the 3 and Deni at the 4. Both guys can use their size to score inside against smaller defenders.

That'll work with Hachimura too.

[dckingsfan]

At this point I would like to see Beal as the starting PG backed up by Dinwiddie.

And then have three of our forwards on the court (in no particular order)

Kentavious Caldwell-Pope
Kyle Kuzma
Deni Avdija

Corey Kispert
Dāvis Bertāns
Anthony Gill
Rui Hachimura (when back)

And a C

Daniel Gafford, Montrezl Harrell, Thomas Bryant

At this point - I don't see Wes being able to transition to this type of lineup.

[nate33]

At this point I would like to see Beal as the starting PG backed up by Dinwiddie.

And then have three of our forwards on the court (in no particular order)

Kentavious Caldwell-Pope
Kyle Kuzma
Deni Avdija

Corey Kispert
Dāvis Bertāns
Anthony Gill
Rui Hachimura (when back)

And a C

Daniel Gafford, Montrezl Harrell, Thomas Bryant

At this point - I don't see Wes being able to transition to this type of lineup.

I don't even mind if Dinwiddie starts, but it's looking like Dinwiddie and Beal together can handle all 48 minutes at PG, allowing us to play bigger with KCP and Kispert getting some SG minutes.

Basically, I'm not seeing a need for Neto in the rotation at all. And Holiday is only needed in matchups where his one-on-one defense against fast guards can come in handy.

And this holds true to an even greater extent once Hachimura and Bryant get back as we will have more good forwards and centers vying for minutes.

[dckingsfan]

At this point I would like to see Beal as the starting PG backed up by Dinwiddie.

And then have three of our forwards on the court (in no particular order)

Kentavious Caldwell-Pope
Kyle Kuzma
Deni Avdija

Corey Kispert
Dāvis Bertāns
Anthony Gill
Rui Hachimura (when back)

And a C

Daniel Gafford, Montrezl Harrell, Thomas Bryant

At this point - I don't see Wes being able to transition to this type of lineup.

I don't even mind if Dinwiddie starts, but it's looking like Dinwiddie and Beal together can handle all 48 minutes at PG, allowing us to play bigger with KCP and Kispert getting some SG minutes.

Basically, I'm not seeing a need for Neto in the rotation at all. And Holiday is only needed in matchups where his one-on-one defense against fast guards can come in handy.

And this holds true to an even greater extent once Hachimura and Bryant get back as we will have more good forwards and centers vying for minutes.

Yup - the key going forward is the forwards - so fast forward and see if Wes can be so forward as to change is rotations.

[Dark Faze]

Wasn't a fan of the Dinwiddie signing when it happened. To me it was obvious that you should run Brad at the 1 next to KCP, Kuz, Rui, Gaff. See how that goes for the first half of the season and if you're desperate for a PG then start making some moves. Now here we go again with a chunk of cap space in the toilet and likely few takers for dudes contract.

[dckingsfan]

Wasn't a fan of the Dinwiddie signing when it happened. To me it was obvious that you should run Brad at the 1 next to KCP, Kuz, Rui, Gaff. See how that goes for the first half of the season and if you're desperate for a PG then start making some moves. Now here we go again with a chunk of cap space in the toilet and likely few takers for dudes contract.

Having said that and noting that we are where we are... would you have a problem with Dinwiddie as Beal's backup at PG?

I see two pluses in that. Dinwiddie is going to be better than most of the backup PGs he goes against. The other is that you could then keep Beal's minutes in the low 30s.

[DCZards]

Wasn't a fan of the Dinwiddie signing when it happened. To me it was obvious that you should run Brad at the 1 next to KCP, Kuz, Rui, Gaff. See how that goes for the first half of the season and if you're desperate for a PG then start making some moves. Now here we go again with a chunk of cap space in the toilet and likely few takers for dudes contract.

I’m not in favor of asking Beal to play PG. It’s alright in an emergency, short-term situation but not for an extended period of time. Beal at PG doesn’t play to his strengths as a shooter and scorer—and it exposes his weaknesses as a ball handler.

On top of that, it’s physically taxing to be both the PG and pretty much the sole scoring threat from the backcourt. I can see it wearing BB down to the point that he’s far less effective in the 4th quarter

I think we should give the Beal-Dinwiddie pairing more time to gel.