Bradley Beal - Part III

[nate33]

Wasn't a fan of the Dinwiddie signing when it happened. To me it was obvious that you should run Brad at the 1 next to KCP, Kuz, Rui, Gaff. See how that goes for the first half of the season and if you're desperate for a PG then start making some moves. Now here we go again with a chunk of cap space in the toilet and likely few takers for dudes contract.

I’m not in favor of asking Beal to play PG. It’s alright in an emergency, short-term situation but not for an extended period of time. Beal at PG doesn’t play to his strengths as a shooter and scorer—and it exposes his weaknesses as a ball handler.

On top of that, it’s physically taxing to be both the PG and pretty much the sole scoring threat from the backcourt. I can see it wearing BB down to the point that he’s far less effective in the 4th quarter

I think we should give the Beal-Dinwiddie pairing more time to gel.

Agreed. People are talking about Dinwiddie as if he is a total bust. Dinwiddie has been hot and cold, but he is coming back from an ACL injury and adapting to a role of being a co lead guard rather than a dominant PG. Give him some time to figure things out. The Dinwiddie pre ACL injury was a really good player. It's far too soon to assume that guy no longer exists.

[pcbothwel]

To get more assists, you have to handle the ball more. But, if you handle the ball more, you will turn the ball over more.

If adding 2 assists also adds 1 turnover, you haven't helped your team. The team has more or less broken even. If adding 2 assists also adds more than 1 turnover, the team loses on that change.

Brad has never managed to get to that 2-1 ratio, & he's certainly never exceeded it! This year he's getting 1.94 assists for every turnover. That's the 2d best of his career. It's also an improvement over the average of the previous 3 years, which was 1.72.

PG average = 2.41. For context, however, this year Chris Paul is recording over 4.3 assists for every 1 turnover.

While I agree with you in general, I think that we need to put Beal's AST:TOV ratio into context. His role as the scorer/off ball guard has him attempting a lot of shots and very few passes. This will lead to a worse ratio.
If you put Beal in the Harden seat and gave him more PG duties while reducing shots, I think the AST:TOV ratio would increase.
PG's, in general, are the beneficiaries of easy assist more so than other positions due to the structured nature of their plays/usage.

It may work, it may not, but the only was this team becomes a contender with Beal @ 45M+ is if he plays, and succeeds, as the Harden/Curry archetype and we surround him with versatile wings (Rui, Deni, etc.).

[dlts20]

Spencer didn't even want to be the backup in Brooklyn so no way he is going for that. I also agree with it being too much to ask for Brad to be the PG and primary scorer. His d would definitely go back to being trash.

I also want to wait to see what kind of chemistry Brad and Spencer develop. It's not really fair to judge them yet. People are down on Spencer now and say that him and Brad don't play well together when the fact is that Brad was trash to start the season. Since he's been looking like a all star starter, they really haven't played together. I expect them to mesh and both play well when Spencer returns this time

[dckingsfan]

Spencer didn't even want to be the backup in Brooklyn so no way he is going for that. I also agree with it being too much to ask for Brad to be the PG and primary scorer. His d would definitely go back to being trash.

I also want to wait to see what kind of chemistry Brad and Spencer develop. It's not really fair to judge them yet. People are down on Spencer now and say that him and Brad don't play well together when the fact is that Brad was trash to start the season. Since he's been looking like a all star starter, they really haven't played together. I expect them to mesh and both play well when Spencer returns this time

Personally it isn't that I am down on Dinwiddie. Rather, I am really high on our forwards and I think that is the strength of the team when paired with a shot blocker.

I certainly want to see the minutes that go to Neto and Holiday virtually eliminated to go to our forwards.

I would much rather see 3 of our forwards on the court along with our C than any other lineup(s).

[payitforward]

As other have said, Beal is cool at PG if he's not being pressured but his handle is suspect…and too often acts like he can handle the ball like Curry or Harden, which leads to him turning the ball over. Love all the assists he's been getting though, but prefer to seen BB as a secondary (and not primary) ball handler.

Kuzma has taken on a lot of the responsibility for bringing the ball up in recent games, which gives Beal at least some time to rest while he's on the court.

What was most encouraging about the last game is that Kuz attacked the rim off the dribble and used his size to get easy baskets. Never seen him do that as much as he did against Chicago.

Kuz won't be able to do get to the rim that easily against all defenders but it's great to see him making that a bigger and bigger part of his offensive game.

That is one of the reasons why i would like to see them go big more often with Kuz at the 3 and Deni at the 4. Both guys can use their size to score inside against smaller defenders.

That'll work with Hachimura too.

...as soon as he's able to "attack the rim off the dribble and use his size to get easy baskets." In which case, great. We haven't seen that yet, however -- maybe when he's back playing again? Hope so.

[dlts20]

Spencer didn't even want to be the backup in Brooklyn so no way he is going for that. I also agree with it being too much to ask for Brad to be the PG and primary scorer. His d would definitely go back to being trash.

I also want to wait to see what kind of chemistry Brad and Spencer develop. It's not really fair to judge them yet. People are down on Spencer now and say that him and Brad don't play well together when the fact is that Brad was trash to start the season. Since he's been looking like a all star starter, they really haven't played together. I expect them to mesh and both play well when Spencer returns this time

Personally it isn't that I am down on Dinwiddie. Rather, I am really high on our forwards and I think that is the strength of the team when paired with a shot blocker.

I certainly want to see the minutes that go to Neto and Holiday virtually eliminated to go to our forwards.

I would much rather see 3 of our forwards on the court along with our C than any other lineup(s).

I'm cool with that. I definitely didn't like the benching of Spencer so early in games but if you want to cut out all of the other guards, we could go back to that and let Spencer and Brad play PG full time

[DCZards]

Spencer didn't even want to be the backup in Brooklyn so no way he is going for that. I also agree with it being too much to ask for Brad to be the PG and primary scorer. His d would definitely go back to being trash.

I also want to wait to see what kind of chemistry Brad and Spencer develop. It's not really fair to judge them yet. People are down on Spencer now and say that him and Brad don't play well together when the fact is that Brad was trash to start the season. Since he's been looking like a all star starter, they really haven't played together. I expect them to mesh and both play well when Spencer returns this time

Personally it isn't that I am down on Dinwiddie. Rather, I am really high on our forwards and I think that is the strength of the team when paired with a shot blocker.

I certainly want to see the minutes that go to Neto and Holiday virtually eliminated to go to our forwards.

I would much rather see 3 of our forwards on the court along with our C than any other lineup(s).

The problem with that lineup is that it leaves you with only one decent ball handler—the single guard—and defenses would force the ball out of that player’s hands.

None of the Zards forwards are particularly good ball handlers. Deni and Kuz have shown some ball handling abilities but I don’t think you want to rely on either of them as a ball handler—for other than short spurts.

[dckingsfan]

Spencer didn't even want to be the backup in Brooklyn so no way he is going for that. I also agree with it being too much to ask for Brad to be the PG and primary scorer. His d would definitely go back to being trash.

I also want to wait to see what kind of chemistry Brad and Spencer develop. It's not really fair to judge them yet. People are down on Spencer now and say that him and Brad don't play well together when the fact is that Brad was trash to start the season. Since he's been looking like a all star starter, they really haven't played together. I expect them to mesh and both play well when Spencer returns this time

Personally it isn't that I am down on Dinwiddie. Rather, I am really high on our forwards and I think that is the strength of the team when paired with a shot blocker.

I certainly want to see the minutes that go to Neto and Holiday virtually eliminated to go to our forwards.

I would much rather see 3 of our forwards on the court along with our C than any other lineup(s).

The problem with that lineup is that it leaves you with only one decent ball handler—the single guard—and defenses would force the ball out of that player’s hands.

None of the Zards forwards are particularly good ball handlers. Deni and Kuz have shown some ball handling abilities but I don’t think you want to rely on either of them as a ball handler—for other than short spurts.

Disagree. Kuz is certainly fine in this regard as well as KCP. Avidja is getting better and Rui was improving as well. Kispert is also going to be fine in that regard.

Add to that - the improved D more than makes up for the slight offset in ball handling (which I don't see degrading the offense - regardless).

[FAH1223]

Read on Twitter

[payitforward]

At this point I would like to see Beal as the starting PG backed up by Dinwiddie.

And then have three of our forwards on the court (in no particular order)

Kentavious Caldwell-Pope
Kyle Kuzma
Deni Avdija

Corey Kispert
Dāvis Bertāns
Anthony Gill
Rui Hachimura (when back)

And a C

Daniel Gafford, Montrezl Harrell, Thomas Bryant

At this point - I don't see Wes being able to transition to this type of lineup.

I don't even mind if Dinwiddie starts, but it's looking like Dinwiddie and Beal together can handle all 48 minutes at PG, allowing us to play bigger with KCP and Kispert getting some SG minutes.

Basically, I'm not seeing a need for Neto in the rotation at all. And Holiday is only needed in matchups where his one-on-one defense against fast guards can come in handy.

And this holds true to an even greater extent once Hachimura and Bryant get back as we will have more good forwards and centers vying for minutes.

Yup - the key going forward is the forwards - so fast forward and see if Wes can be so forward as to change is rotations.

Brad's played 31 games this year; he's playing 36.25 minutes a game. May we assume that his minutes won't go up much? Won't go up at all, I hope, as that's plenty of load for any player!

If some of those minutes -- let's say 18 of them -- are at PG (that's what's needed if he & Spencer are to handle all 48 pg minutes), that means he's only playing 18 minutes at SG.

That leaves 30 minutes available at SG. Who is playing those minutes? & how is that going to make us better?

Edit: maybe the more appropriate word here is not "forward" but "forewarned" instead ?

[prime1time]

Defensively we are better off with bigger players that can switch onto smaller players than having Neto or Holliday on the floor. I'd also point out that a month or two ago, people were basically saying that Beal had lost all his talent and was completely washed up. Other's basically accused him of stealing money and being a bad person. In Beal's last 10 games he's averaging 28.3/7.4/4.4 on 52.2% shooting from the field. In his last 3 games since moving to PG Brad has averaged 11.67 assists. When will people give this man some credit?

[prime1time]

As other have said, Beal is cool at PG if he's not being pressured but his handle is suspect…and too often acts like he can handle the ball like Curry or Harden, which leads to him turning the ball over. Love all the assists he's been getting though, but prefer to seen BB as a secondary (and not primary) ball handler.

Kuzma has taken on a lot of the responsibility for bringing the ball up in recent games, which gives Beal at least some time to rest while he's on the court.

What was most encouraging about the last game is that Kuz attacked the rim off the dribble and used his size to get easy baskets. Never seen him do that as much as he did against Chicago.

Kuz won't be able to do get to the rim that easily against all defenders but it's great to see him making that a bigger and bigger part of his offensive game.

I think the reality is that the PG position has become very overvalued. Putting Beal at PG doesn't mean we'll turn him into Steve Nash or Chris Paul. It just means that the offense starts with the ball in Brad's hands instead of passing the ball to him off of some action. The assists that Brad's getting is less about Beal's greatly improved passing and more about Beal evolving and taking what the defense gives him. By having the ball in Brad's hands to initiate the offense, it provides him more spacing to work with and puts him in a similar situation that he was in 2019-2020.

Getting bogged down in the debate of secondary ballhandler is irrelevant to me. Focusing on Beal's turnovers, unless they rach extreme numbers, also seems irrelevant to me. Saying that Beal is fine unless he's pressured again seems bizarre. Who are these defenders that you are mentioning? Are they going to pick him up full court or at 3-quarter court? If so, then Beal simply doesn't have to be the ball-handler. And we could use that overaggression to our advantage by having him attack backdoor.

The real truth is that with Brad as the main guard on the floor, we get more use out of our forwards. Deni and Kuzma now have the liberty of grabbing the rebound and initiating the offense. Brad being pg doesn't mean we become inflexible and force the ball into his hands. It means that we understand that there are times and situations where we can be successful with Beal in his hands and there are times when we should do something else.

Ultimately, Beal at pg is just another tool in the toolkit.

[tontoz]

Defensively we are better off with bigger players that can switch onto smaller players than having Neto or Holliday on the floor.

I would like to see a 3 guard rotation of Beal/Spencer/KCP. Starting all 3 means someone is playing out of position at the 3. It also means more minutes for Neto/Holiday in mini me lineups.

I think Spencer should be coming off the bench. He is coming off a major injury and he been pretty lame starting next to Beal.

[dckingsfan]

Defensively we are better off with bigger players that can switch onto smaller players than having Neto or Holliday on the floor.

I would like to see a 3 guard rotation of Beal/Spencer/KCP. Starting all 3 means someone is playing out of position at the 3. It also means more minutes for Neto/Holiday in mini me lineups.

I think Spencer should be coming off the bench. He is coming off a major injury and he been pretty lame starting next to Beal.

I hadn't considered that option - But I would be good with that as well. Moving KCP to start as a SG means we get essentially the same thing.

[dckingsfan]

I don't even mind if Dinwiddie starts, but it's looking like Dinwiddie and Beal together can handle all 48 minutes at PG, allowing us to play bigger with KCP and Kispert getting some SG minutes.

Basically, I'm not seeing a need for Neto in the rotation at all. And Holiday is only needed in matchups where his one-on-one defense against fast guards can come in handy.

And this holds true to an even greater extent once Hachimura and Bryant get back as we will have more good forwards and centers vying for minutes.

Yup - the key going forward is the forwards - so fast forward and see if Wes can be so forward as to change is rotations.

Brad's played 31 games this year; he's playing 36.25 minutes a game. May we assume that his minutes won't go up much? Won't go up at all, I hope, as that's plenty of load for any player!

If some of those minutes -- let's say 18 of them -- are at PG (that's what's needed if he & Spencer are to handle all 48 pg minutes), that means he's only playing 18 minutes at SG.

That leaves 30 minutes available at SG. Who is playing those minutes? & how is that going to make us better?

Edit: maybe the more appropriate word here is not "forward" but "forewarned" instead ?

Yep, moving to a 3 forward rotation is half the victory - oh boy, botched that one...

And I would be good if Dinwiddie only plays 20 min/game right now and Beal gets down in the low 30s.

And your correct questions is - where do the rest of those minutes go. My answer - to our deep forward rotation.

[DCZards]

Some of you are underestimating the importance of having two quality guards and playmakers (Beal & Dinwiddie) on the floor together as much as possible…and overrating the ball handling abilities of KCP, Kuzma, Deni and Rui.

[payitforward]

Some of you are underestimating the importance of having two quality guards and playmakers (Beal & Dinwiddie) on the floor together as much as possible…and overrating the ball handling abilities of KCP, Kuzma, Deni and Rui.

I'll say!

In all, this is a just plain silly idea.

[Zonkerbl]

Maybe this is bad economics but I just think, if your team has not broken 50 wins in the last decade, no one on that team should earn the maximum.

[Ruzious]

Some of you are underestimating the importance of having two quality guards and playmakers (Beal & Dinwiddie) on the floor together as much as possible…and overrating the ball handling abilities of KCP, Kuzma, Deni and Rui.

I'll say!

In all, this is a just plain silly idea.

What is? Using Beal as our point guard? It seems to be working ok.

[tontoz]

I've seen Spencer and Beal on the court together. Spencer does very little creating/ball handling when Beal is playing. He is mostly a spot up shooter.

Spencer without Beal has been good. Beal without Spencer has been good. Together they have been like oil and water.