Raps will make the playoffs, and 2nd round, if healthy

[Bruin]

This must be sarcasm but GTJ has been a negative defender his entire career.

"Entire career" aka ~100 legit games with the Blazers -- who were 27th in DRTG in 19/20 and 29th in DRTG in 20/21 -- and 17 games with a Raptors team that was tanking post-trade deadline last season. It must be hard to have any kind of decent defensive numbers when no one on your team plays defence.

GTJ is T-1st in steals and 3rd in deflections in the entire league. He creates at least 3-4 turnovers almost every game. At the very least, he has been a good defender this season.

Sent from my Pixel 4 using RealGM mobile app

To the first paragraph, sounds a lot like excuses.

To the second paragraph, gambling on defense does not equal a good defender. Has he improved on defense this season, sure, I'm not sure anyone outside of Raptor fans would call GTJ a good defender though.

That’s funny considering the NBA has him in the top 10 of the DPOY ladder

https://www.nba.com/news/defensive-player-ladder-dec-2021-edition?amp=1

[FreeThrowLine]

Which of the top 5 ranked teams could you see them beating in a 7 game series if both teams are healthy? I don't see them beating any of the current top 5 ranked teams

Aren't Chicago and Cleveland in the top 5? They'd annihilate Cleveland and give Chicago a really good series if not beat them. All Chicago has are question marks in Lavine, Demar, Ball and Vucevic who have either never played in the playoffs or performed poorly while there.

Cavs aren’t in the top 5 and the Raptors aren’t “annihilating” anyone. They’re not beating the Bulls if both teams are healthy

[JujitsuFlip]

And advanced stats are just somebodies idea of what captures impact, and its just amateurs deciding which one to use and how much weight they will put on each one. Largely Just as pointless.

At least one is quantifiable

So what? Metrics aren't inherently useful. How Does it add value? How do you weigh different stats?

If you cant tell me where FVV ranks based on the stats then what are you using them for?

They are much more useful than your eye test, I can 100% guarantee that.

Why is it my job to interpret statistics for you? If you do not understand them, that's fine. I've come to find a vast majority of this forum relies solely on their amateur eye test...

[JujitsuFlip]

"Entire career" aka ~100 legit games with the Blazers -- who were 27th in DRTG in 19/20 and 29th in DRTG in 20/21 -- and 17 games with a Raptors team that was tanking post-trade deadline last season. It must be hard to have any kind of decent defensive numbers when no one on your team plays defence.

GTJ is T-1st in steals and 3rd in deflections in the entire league. He creates at least 3-4 turnovers almost every game. At the very least, he has been a good defender this season.

Sent from my Pixel 4 using RealGM mobile app

To the first paragraph, sounds a lot like excuses.

To the second paragraph, gambling on defense does not equal a good defender. Has he improved on defense this season, sure, I'm not sure anyone outside of Raptor fans would call GTJ a good defender though.

That’s funny considering the NBA has him in the top 10 of the DPOY ladder

https://www.nba.com/news/defensive-player-ladder-dec-2021-edition?amp=1

Not sure I would call Steve Aschburner the NBA but I stand corrected, there is 1 person outside of Raptors fans who beleives GTJ is a good defender, despite all the evidence that proves otherwise lol

[nikster]

At least one is quantifiable

So what? Metrics aren't inherently useful. How Does it add value? How do you weigh different stats?

If you cant tell me where FVV ranks based on the stats then what are you using them for?

They are much more useful than your eye test, I can 100% guarantee that.

Why is it my job to interpret statistics for you? If you do not understand them, that's fine. I've come to find a vast majority of this forum relies solely on their amateur eye test...

I'm saying not even you understand them enough to make all your decisions based solely on numbers. Otherwise you would be able to give a ranking for FVv.

these stats can be used appropriately with the eye test. But theyre far from an end all be all in evaluating players

[Los_29]

Which of the top 5 ranked teams could you see them beating in a 7 game series if both teams are healthy? I don't see them beating any of the current top 5 ranked teams

Aren't Chicago and Cleveland in the top 5? They'd annihilate Cleveland and give Chicago a really good series if not beat them. All Chicago has are question marks in Lavine, Demar, Ball and Vucevic who have either never played in the playoffs or performed poorly while there.

Cavs aren’t in the top 5 and the Raptors aren’t “annihilating” anyone. They’re not beating the Bulls if both teams are healthy

What have the Bulls core accomplished in the playoffs?

[JujitsuFlip]

So what? Metrics aren't inherently useful. How Does it add value? How do you weigh different stats?

If you cant tell me where FVV ranks based on the stats then what are you using them for?

They are much more useful than your eye test, I can 100% guarantee that.

Why is it my job to interpret statistics for you? If you do not understand them, that's fine. I've come to find a vast majority of this forum relies solely on their amateur eye test...

I'm saying not even you understand them enough to make all your decisions based solely on numbers. Otherwise you would be able to give a ranking for FVv.

these stats can be used appropriately with the eye test. But theyre far from an end all be all in evaluating players

Again, if you do not understand them, say that. I don't need you to attempt to speak to my understanding, lol

[FreeThrowLine]

Aren't Chicago and Cleveland in the top 5? They'd annihilate Cleveland and give Chicago a really good series if not beat them. All Chicago has are question marks in Lavine, Demar, Ball and Vucevic who have either never played in the playoffs or performed poorly while there.

Cavs aren’t in the top 5 and the Raptors aren’t “annihilating” anyone. They’re not beating the Bulls if both teams are healthy

What have the Bulls core accomplished in the playoffs?

What difference does it make what individual players accomplished on other teams? It has nothing to do with their current situation. The Bulls are on an 8 game winning streak, lead the East and look like a solid team.

The Raptors are one loss away from dropping to 8th and with a full roster they're currently down by 14 points in the 3rd quarter to a Jazz team missing Gobert, Mitchell, Conley, Bogdanovic, Ingles and Gay

No Leonard or Lowry, this isn't the same Raptors team that went to the finals and they're not scaring anyone. They've also lost both games to the Cavs this year, getting annihilated 144-99 in the most recent one, although to be fair both teams were missing a lot of players

[Los_29]

Cavs aren’t in the top 5 and the Raptors aren’t “annihilating” anyone. They’re not beating the Bulls if both teams are healthy

What have the Bulls core accomplished in the playoffs?

What difference does it make what individual players accomplished on other teams? It has nothing to do with their current situation. The Bulls are on an 8 game winning streak, lead the East and look like a solid team.

The Raptors are one loss away from dropping to 8th and with a full roster they're currently down by 14 points in the 3rd quarter to a Jazz team missing Gobert, Mitchell, Conley, Bogdanovic, Ingles and Gay

No Leonard or Lowry, this isn't the same Raptors team that went to the finals and they're not scaring anyone. They've also lost both games to the Cavs this year, getting annihilated 144-99 in the most recent one, although to be fair both teams were missing a lot of players

8 game winning streak in the REGULAR season. Big difference.

And who cares, the Nets lost to a depleted Clippers team. How long have you been watching the NBA? And man, I'm sorry but no one is going to take you seriously when you bring up that Cleveland game. Are you being serious?

[RRyder823]

At least one is quantifiable

So what? Metrics aren't inherently useful. How Does it add value? How do you weigh different stats?

If you cant tell me where FVV ranks based on the stats then what are you using them for?

They are much more useful than your eye test, I can 100% guarantee that.

Why is it my job to interpret statistics for you? If you do not understand them, that's fine. I've come to find a vast majority of this forum relies solely on their amateur eye test...

Much like an amateurs interpretation of advance statistics..........

Sent from my SM-G975U using RealGM mobile app

[FreeThrowLine]

What have the Bulls core accomplished in the playoffs?

What difference does it make what individual players accomplished on other teams? It has nothing to do with their current situation. The Bulls are on an 8 game winning streak, lead the East and look like a solid team.

The Raptors are one loss away from dropping to 8th and with a full roster they're currently down by 14 points in the 3rd quarter to a Jazz team missing Gobert, Mitchell, Conley, Bogdanovic, Ingles and Gay

No Leonard or Lowry, this isn't the same Raptors team that went to the finals and they're not scaring anyone. They've also lost both games to the Cavs this year, getting annihilated 144-99 in the most recent one, although to be fair both teams were missing a lot of players

8 game winning streak in the REGULAR season. Big difference.

And who cares, the Nets lost to a depleted Clippers team. How long have you been watching the NBA? And man, I'm sorry but no one is going to take you seriously when you bring up that Cleveland game. Are you being serious?

Only been watching the NBA for 35 years, so probably twice as long as you've been alive

The regular season is still indicative of which team can be viewed as a favourite heading into the playoffs and your idea that the Raptors are favourites against the Bulls or would annihilate the Cavs shows how little you know.

Am I being serious? I'm using the 144-99 beating to put you back in your place since you want to talk about the Raptors annihilating the Cavs.

Just sit back and enjoy, at best they make the playoffs and are out the first round, barring any major injuries to an opponent. They're not beating the Bulls, Nets, Bucks, Heat or Sixers in the playoffs

[Los_29]

What difference does it make what individual players accomplished on other teams? It has nothing to do with their current situation. The Bulls are on an 8 game winning streak, lead the East and look like a solid team.

The Raptors are one loss away from dropping to 8th and with a full roster they're currently down by 14 points in the 3rd quarter to a Jazz team missing Gobert, Mitchell, Conley, Bogdanovic, Ingles and Gay

No Leonard or Lowry, this isn't the same Raptors team that went to the finals and they're not scaring anyone. They've also lost both games to the Cavs this year, getting annihilated 144-99 in the most recent one, although to be fair both teams were missing a lot of players

8 game winning streak in the REGULAR season. Big difference.

And who cares, the Nets lost to a depleted Clippers team. How long have you been watching the NBA? And man, I'm sorry but no one is going to take you seriously when you bring up that Cleveland game. Are you being serious?

Only been watching the NBA for 35 years, so probably twice as long as you've been alive

The regular season is still indicative of which team can be viewed as a favourite heading into the playoffs and your idea that the Raptors are favourites against the Bulls or would annihilate the Cavs shows how little you know.

Am I being serious? I'm using the 144-99 beating to put you back in your place since you want to talk about the Raptors annihilating the Cavs.

Just sit back and enjoy, at best they make the playoffs and are out the first round, barring any major injuries to an opponent. They're not beating the Bulls, Nets, Bucks, Heat or Sixers in the playoffs

No it's not indicative especially during these covid times. It's all about personnel and we know that the Bulls don't have the players that would be considered playoff performers. Lavine has never been in the playoffs and only plays on one side of the court. Likewise with Demar. Vucevic has never performed well in the playoffs and has never been out of the first round. Ball has also never been in the playoffs. They are doomed to fail in the playoffs but at the beginning of the year I thought they were going to be a great regular season team. But just not in the playoffs.

[FreeThrowLine]

No it's not indicative especially during these covid times. It's all about personnel and we know that the Bulls don't have the players that would be considered playoff performers. Lavine has never been in the playoffs and only plays on one side of the court. Likewise with Demar. Vucevic has never performed well in the playoffs and has never been out of the first round. Ball has also never been in the playoffs. They are doomed to fail in the playoffs but at the beginning of the year I thought they were going to be a great regular season team. But just not in the playoffs.

That's a cool story, but it doesn't change the fact that they'd be favourites over the Raptors, as would all the current top 5 ranked teams. I'd be more than happy to place a bet should the matchup take place, so feel free to hit me up in a few months if the Raptors make the playoffs

[Los_29]

No it's not indicative especially during these covid times. It's all about personnel and we know that the Bulls don't have the players that would be considered playoff performers. Lavine has never been in the playoffs and only plays on one side of the court. Likewise with Demar. Vucevic has never performed well in the playoffs and has never been out of the first round. Ball has also never been in the playoffs. They are doomed to fail in the playoffs but at the beginning of the year I thought they were going to be a great regular season team. But just not in the playoffs.

That's a cool story, but it doesn't change the fact that they'd be favourites over the Raptors, as would all the current top 5 ranked teams. I'd be more than happy to place a bet should the matchup take place, so feel free to hit me up in a few months if the Raptors make the playoffs

Not saying they wouldn't be the favourites. I'm saying that they are very beatable and are the team in the east most likely to be upset in the first round.

[FreeThrowLine]

Not saying they wouldn't be the favourites. I'm saying that they are very beatable and are the team in the east most likely to be upset in the first round.

Not by the Raptors they're not

[Los_29]

Not saying they wouldn't be the favourites. I'm saying that they are very beatable and are the team in the east most likely to be upset in the first round.

Not by the Raptors they're not

I'm a Raptors fan so I've watched Demar in the playoffs. It ain't pretty.

[FreeThrowLine]

I'm a Raptors fan so I've watched Demar in the playoffs. It ain't pretty.

You keep saying that like it matters what happened on a completely different roster, coaching staff and system. Then you argue that regular season doesn't matter. You can't say what happened in the past doesn't matter in one area and then change your mind to suit your argument in another

[everdiso]

They’re not beating the Bulls if both teams are healthy

Why not?

[Los_29]

I'm a Raptors fan so I've watched Demar in the playoffs. It ain't pretty.

You keep saying that like it matters what happened on a completely different roster, coaching staff and system. Then you argue that regular season doesn't matter. You can't say what happened in the past doesn't matter in one area and then change your mind to suit your argument in another

Not sure what your point is. Regular season is very different to the playoffs. Demar was so bad in the playoffs that he got benched in the 4th quarter of an elimination game. Also, I am a fan of Demar and I'm super happy to see him have success this year in Chicago. But I know his limitations. He's gotten better in some areas as a player but his biggest weaknesses still remain his biggest weaknesses.

Vucevic has been a poor playoff performer and isn't much of a defender. Lavine isn't a defensive player. Who else do they have?

Sure Chicago will be the favourites. But I'm telling you right now, they wouldn't want to face the Raptors in the 1st round if they had a choice. Three players in the starting lineup have championship rings.

[FreeThrowLine]

Three players in the starting lineup have championship rings.

Again, the 2 biggest contributors for said championship are gone.

My offer stands, if the Raps make the playoffs and face the Bulls, Nets, Bucks, Heat or Sixers (healthy) I’m willing to put my money where my mouth is