Nets v. Bucks | 01.07.2022 @ 7:30 PM on ESPN/YES

[MrDollarBills]

The lack of spacing and movement is killing us. If guys can't shoot, then they need to be moving around to create opportunities for passes and scores.

No screens off ball, no back door cuts, nothing. Nash literally has non shooters standing in corners watching Harden and KD attempt to score versus 3 defenders.

Marks needs to wake tf up before his buddy destroys this team. If he already hasn't

So I'm honestly curious, what's your ideal rotation where we would have ample shooting around KD and Harden?

LMA as a stretch 5 maybe, and Mills and Bembry? Nobody really pays attention to LMA at the 3pt line anyway, and Bembry is a non shooter. So that still leaves just KD and Harden and Mills. And how many minutes are we going to run those 3? We have guys like Brown and Duke and Edwards and Griffin and Johnson off the bench too. Literally none of them scare a defense from deep whatsoever.

We don't have shooters. IDK why people keep harping on that point, like Nash has options here.

I pointed out that our guys can't shoot in my first sentence. But that doesn't mean that they should be standing around while Harden drives into a wall of defenders either. Guys need to start moving, setting screens and cutting. We aren't even hitting LMA in his sweet spots for jumpers anymore.

Why are we having guys that shoot 26% from deep standing in corners? That isn't helping.

You have to cater the system to the personnel to effectively produce the best shots. Having Harden drive into a wall of white jerseys or KD taking contested pull ups over 2 people are not the best shots that we can get. Why aren't we setting screens for KD when KD is off ball??

The Nets offense is laughable right now, and way too easy to stop.

[Jay555]

The lack of spacing and movement is killing us. If guys can't shoot, then they need to be moving around to create opportunities for passes and scores.

No screens off ball, no back door cuts, nothing. Nash literally has non shooters standing in corners watching Harden and KD attempt to score versus 3 defenders.

Marks needs to wake tf up before his buddy destroys this team. If he already hasn't

So I'm honestly curious, what's your ideal rotation where we would have ample shooting around KD and Harden?

LMA as a stretch 5 maybe, and Mills and Bembry? Nobody really pays attention to LMA at the 3pt line anyway, and Bembry is a non shooter. So that still leaves just KD and Harden and Mills. And how many minutes are we going to run those 3? We have guys like Brown and Duke and Edwards and Griffin and Johnson off the bench too. Literally none of them scare a defense from deep whatsoever.

We don't have shooters. IDK why people keep harping on that point, like Nash has options here.

I pointed out that our guys can't shoot in my first sentence. But that doesn't mean that they should be standing around while Harden drives into a wall of defenders either. Guys need to start moving, setting screens and cutting. We aren't even hitting LMA in his sweet spots for jumpers anymore.

Why are we having guys that shoot 26% from deep standing in corners? That isn't helping.

You have to cater the system to the personnel to effectively produce the best shots. Having Harden drive into a wall of white jerseys or KD taking contested pull ups over 2 people are not the best shots that we can get. Why aren't we setting screens for KD when KD is off ball??

The Nets offense is laughable right now, and way too easy to stop.

I am afraid Nash is just not able to design any offensive sets other than letting our stars figure it out by themselves.

[Jay555]

Also, I don't think Harden is a great PG, contrary to popular belief. I actually think he kinda sucks at it. Specifically because he's so slow in terms of initiating any offense, his decision-making honestly isn't that great and leads to a lot of bad shots and TOs where he's flailing and hoping for a foul, and he doesn't do ANYTHING off the ball. Like, when Curry gets trapped in the PnR and passes it off for a 4 on 3 opportunity and the defense collapses, he immediately relocates when the defense is off balance and slightly confused, and sets himself up for an open shot or open lane or just any additional opportunity...when Harden passes the ball, he stands there and watches. He does not move.

You gotta look at what he did last season vs this season. He was perfect last season before the injury.

The biggest difference is spacing. In Houston, when he drove to the basket, there were shooters around him and there was the lob threat in Capela. Same thing here. Last year, all of our role players can shoot threes, Green, Shamet, Joe, Tyler which makes the game easier for him. Now what do we have? Nil shooting if Mills is off. Then Nets become super easy to defend. Pack the paint waiting for Harden, double team KD or Harden when they have the ball, dare our role players to shoot. If our role players can’t punish them from 3, it’s basically over even if KD and Harden drops great numbers. Harden is not Kyrie or KD who can just go and get you bucket regardless of the system. You need to surround him with spacing or lob threat, then he will bring you the goods. Let me put it this way, you give him three shooters who shoot around 36% on 3’s and an athletic center, the 5 home game losses would most likely be reversed.

When Joe comes back, it will be greatly improved. Then you add a full time Kyrie if possible…all these issues will be solved but I think we need another shooter because if one of them went down, it would be ugly again.

He was certainly a lot better last year, but I do think he played differently too. Way more decisive, made quicker decisions, and we got into our sets faster as a result. I think he was more motivated to make it work with Kyrie and Durant and played the way everyone doubted he could. But now I fear he's just regressed into his old bad habits, and he's not nearly as good at that anymore to make it worth it.

Being indecisive is exactly the reason why I said the main issue right now is lack of spacing.

Dude, like how many times does he barely get the ball past half court with 16 seconds left? And for the next 10 seconds, he doesn't do anything with the ball, except try a useless screen where he doesn't put any pressure on the defense, and then ends up taking a step back 3 with less than 5 seconds on the clock? Or he gets trapped, passes the ball, and then stands there without putting any extra pressure on the defense? So then he'll get the ball back in the exact same spot and it's another step back 3?

Watch the tape. He's always like that. Back in the 2017-2018 season, there was one instance CP3 was yelling at him for jogging up the court. That's not the issue. He did plenty of this last season.


He's become so easy to defend, it's infuriating. He's a negative impact player right now, we are honestly better with him on the bench.

The whole team has become easy to defend. Did you see how difficult it is for KD and Harden to score recently? They were constantly double or triple teamed. When Ginnias passed the ball out, their role players made them. When KD or Harden passed the ball, they passed back or bricked them.. Again, our spacing will be way better with Joe back. Before that, it's as far as Mills can take us at home. I would not worry about road games now.

[Hello Brooklyn]

We basically have no spacing right now. Thats one of the main issues.

Mills has been terrible the last few games. But also KD and Harden! Neither have been good shooters this year.

And there are no other shooters on the bench. Maybe Edwards but hes too young and unreliable.

Bembry/Johnson/Brown all non-shooters. Griffin lost his shot.

With Kyrie/Harris we have enough spacing.

Its obvious we need to make some change to our roster. Add one more shooter.

[Jay555]

We basically have no spacing right now. Thats one of the main issues.

Mills has been terrible the last few games. But also KD and Harden! Neither have been good shooters this year.

And there are no other shooters on the bench. Maybe Edwards but hes too young and unreliable.

Bembry/Johnson/Brown all non-shooters. Griffin lost his shot.

With Kyrie/Harris we have enough spacing.

Its obvious we need to make some change to our roster. Add one more shooter.

Yep, this is partly on Marks too. How did our role players go from good or above average shooters to utterly can not shoot at all?

It's weird how Griffin's shot has gone down the toilet. He's recovering a bit tho recently but just did not get playing time at all...I am sure he would have made a difference at least defensively on Ginnais.

[GTR11]

Some hot take boys got dose of reality slapped into their heads . Still can't grasp entire situation due to agenda they created.

Joe and Kyrie definitely can help, they won't fix it. Coaching is what really holding entire thing up. If right situation is created Harden can/will fix absences of Joe and Kyrie without us even thinking about them. Until than we second round exit team. We not better than Bucks, Miami or Bulls. Not even sure we be able to take care of Philly.

[Jay555]

Some hot take boys got dose of reality slapped into their heads . Still can't grasp entire situation due to agenda they created.

Joe and Kyrie definitely can help, they won't fix it. Coaching is what really holding entire thing up. If right situation is created Harden can/will fix absences of Joe and Kyrie without us even thinking about them. Until than we second round exit team. We not better than Bucks, Miami or Bulls. Not even sure we be able to take care of Philly.

Do we even have a coach that actually coaches? Not sure if the management is ready to pull the trigger after signing him to a 4 year contract worth 8.7 mil per year. 10 home games losses in a row would be a starter to get them talking. He's what? Sec highest paid coach after Pop in the NBA? What a **** joke...Easiest job ever. How cool is it to just rock up to the stadium and clap hands and collect 8.7 mil a year? It is getting a bit stressful now. I will give him that.


https://www.ibtimes.com/highest-paid-nba-coaches-2021-bucks-budenholzer-suns-williams-dont-make-list-3252238

[MrDollarBills]

You gotta look at what he did last season vs this season. He was perfect last season before the injury.

The biggest difference is spacing. In Houston, when he drove to the basket, there were shooters around him and there was the lob threat in Capela. Same thing here. Last year, all of our role players can shoot threes, Green, Shamet, Joe, Tyler which makes the game easier for him. Now what do we have? Nil shooting if Mills is off. Then Nets become super easy to defend. Pack the paint waiting for Harden, double team KD or Harden when they have the ball, dare our role players to shoot. If our role players can’t punish them from 3, it’s basically over even if KD and Harden drops great numbers. Harden is not Kyrie or KD who can just go and get you bucket regardless of the system. You need to surround him with spacing or lob threat, then he will bring you the goods. Let me put it this way, you give him three shooters who shoot around 36% on 3’s and an athletic center, the 5 home game losses would most likely be reversed.

When Joe comes back, it will be greatly improved. Then you add a full time Kyrie if possible…all these issues will be solved but I think we need another shooter because if one of them went down, it would be ugly again.

He was certainly a lot better last year, but I do think he played differently too. Way more decisive, made quicker decisions, and we got into our sets faster as a result. I think he was more motivated to make it work with Kyrie and Durant and played the way everyone doubted he could. But now I fear he's just regressed into his old bad habits, and he's not nearly as good at that anymore to make it worth it.

Being indecisive is exactly the reason why I said the main issue right now is lack of spacing.

Dude, like how many times does he barely get the ball past half court with 16 seconds left? And for the next 10 seconds, he doesn't do anything with the ball, except try a useless screen where he doesn't put any pressure on the defense, and then ends up taking a step back 3 with less than 5 seconds on the clock? Or he gets trapped, passes the ball, and then stands there without putting any extra pressure on the defense? So then he'll get the ball back in the exact same spot and it's another step back 3?

Watch the tape. He's always like that. Back in the 2017-2018 season, there was one instance CP3 was yelling at him for jogging up the court. That's not the issue. He did plenty of this last season.


He's become so easy to defend, it's infuriating. He's a negative impact player right now, we are honestly better with him on the bench.

The whole team has become easy to defend. Did you see how difficult it is for KD and Harden to score recently? They were constantly double or triple teamed. When Ginnias passed the ball out, their role players made them. When KD or Harden passed the ball, they passed back or bricked them.. Again, our spacing will be way better with Joe back. Before that, it's as far as Mills can take us at home. I would not worry about road games now.

Harden openly complained about spacing a week or so back as well.

Marks needs to get off of his ass and get to work.

[Hello Brooklyn]

We basically have no spacing right now. Thats one of the main issues.

Mills has been terrible the last few games. But also KD and Harden! Neither have been good shooters this year.

And there are no other shooters on the bench. Maybe Edwards but hes too young and unreliable.

Bembry/Johnson/Brown all non-shooters. Griffin lost his shot.

With Kyrie/Harris we have enough spacing.

Its obvious we need to make some change to our roster. Add one more shooter.

Yep, this is partly on Marks too. How did our role players go from good or above average shooters to utterly can not shoot at all?

It's weird how Griffin's shot has gone down the toilet. He's recovering a bit tho recently but just did not get playing time at all...I am sure he would have made a difference at least defensively on Ginnais.

I was screaming before the season about the Shamet trade.

It never made sense to me. Because we gave up an asset for nothing!

Instead we have 4 rookies on the roster.

I get that we expected to have Harris. But having 2 shooters is not enough.

[GTR11]

Some hot take boys got dose of reality slapped into their heads . Still can't grasp entire situation due to agenda they created.

Joe and Kyrie definitely can help, they won't fix it. Coaching is what really holding entire thing up. If right situation is created Harden can/will fix absences of Joe and Kyrie without us even thinking about them. Until than we second round exit team. We not better than Bucks, Miami or Bulls. Not even sure we be able to take care of Philly.

Do we even have a coach that actually coaches? Not sure if the management is ready to pull the trigger after signing him to a 4 year contract worth 8.7 mil per year. 10 home games losses in a row would be a starter to get them talking. He's what? Sec highest paid coach after Pop in the NBA? What a **** joke...Easiest job ever. How cool is it to just rock up to the stadium and clap hands and collect 8.7 mil a year? It is getting a bit stressful now. I will give him that.


https://www.ibtimes.com/highest-paid-nba-coaches-2021-bucks-budenholzer-suns-williams-dont-make-list-3252238

We don't, this team is iso heavy that think it'll freestyle its way to chip. Even if we get Kyrie and Joe back it won't solve schemes that being played vs us. During last year PO Bucks figured it out, that's with healthy Kyrie that game. We got azz whipped and it translated into game four, Kyrie getting hurt was nail in a coffin.

D'Antoni can't run team with Kyrie being iso scorer. For his system to work, you need good/great playmakers like Nash/Harden or CP, if type of player ain't available it'll be exposed. That exactly what happened last year.

Our main issue is that Harden not being able to run offense, I mean we have no system in plays. I mean he needs PnR partner, spacing and cutters to be effective, pretty much designed plays aka system. We have none to speak of. Top of the key iso ain't working anymore, even great scorer like KD struggles right now from his sweet spot on iso plays simply because entire defense collapsing on them, it's bad, we in deep trouble right now.

We have losing record vs 500+ teams, lately we can't even beat up on sub 500 teams or barely beating 10 day contract team.

Harden is a key to our chip hopes. If he struggles, we will be bounced quick. In order to get him going he needs motion offense. Kenny and D'Antoni specialize on that and we had both. Well since flat earth clown thinks we don't need coach we got exactly that in Nash. In addition to it his azz decides he don't need to get vaccinated and now collecting checks at home.

I'm starting to give up on this year now. I don't see how this team will improve.

[Jay555]

Some hot take boys got dose of reality slapped into their heads . Still can't grasp entire situation due to agenda they created.

Joe and Kyrie definitely can help, they won't fix it. Coaching is what really holding entire thing up. If right situation is created Harden can/will fix absences of Joe and Kyrie without us even thinking about them. Until than we second round exit team. We not better than Bucks, Miami or Bulls. Not even sure we be able to take care of Philly.

Do we even have a coach that actually coaches? Not sure if the management is ready to pull the trigger after signing him to a 4 year contract worth 8.7 mil per year. 10 home games losses in a row would be a starter to get them talking. He's what? Sec highest paid coach after Pop in the NBA? What a **** joke...Easiest job ever. How cool is it to just rock up to the stadium and clap hands and collect 8.7 mil a year? It is getting a bit stressful now. I will give him that.


https://www.ibtimes.com/highest-paid-nba-coaches-2021-bucks-budenholzer-suns-williams-dont-make-list-3252238

We don't, this team is iso heavy that think it'll freestyle its way to chip. Even if we get Kyrie and Joe back it won't solve schemes that being played vs us. During last year PO Bucks figured it out, that's with healthy Kyrie that game. We got azz whipped and it translated into game four, Kyrie getting hurt was nail in a coffin.

D'Antoni can't run team with Kyrie being iso scorer. For his system to work, you need good/great playmakers like Nash/Harden or CP, if type of player ain't available it'll be exposed. That exactly what happened last year.

Our main issue is that Harden not being able to run offense, I mean we have no system in plays. I mean he needs PnR partner, spacing and cutters to be effective, pretty much designed plays aka system. We have none to speak of. Top of the key iso ain't working anymore, even great scorer like KD struggles right now from his sweet spot on iso plays simply because entire defense collapsing on them, it's bad, we in deep trouble right now.

We have losing record vs 500+ teams, lately we can't even beat up on sub 500 teams or barely beating 10 day contract team.

Harden is a key to our chip hopes. If he struggles, we will be bounced quick. In order to get him going he needs motion offense. Kenny and D'Antoni specialize on that and we had both. Well since flat earth clown thinks we don't need coach we got exactly that in Nash. In addition to it his azz decides he don't need to get vaccinated and now collecting checks at home.

I'm starting to give up on this year now. I don't see how this team will improve.

Hopefully Kyrie somehow gets the vax...and basketball god sides with us this time. No more injuries etc.

[Pablo Escobar]

Harden/Mills and Kyrie/Harris/Kd/Claxton would most likely be your starters. You have two decent defenders in there and 3 that aren't known for it. With Harris being the worst of the bunch and a target come playoff time. So you add the Johnsons/Bembrys of the world which help but they're limited offensively and can be left open to make things harder for the stars especially Harden. Mills is a great shooter but can't play defense and once his shot is off he doesn't really add much. Griffin doesn't even get minutes anymore but he also can be exposed defensively, especially on switches. He's good at taking charges though and also is a good passer, if he can get his shot back he should be in the rotation.

Just a collection of one way guys in both directions minus Kd and Claxton so a move should be made for your team. And this part time nonsense needs to end as well, either get the vax or ship his ass out for more useful pieces. More 3nd guys and decent big men will help your team tremendously, also Harden needs to stop playing like he doesn't give a fk. Yes the roster isn't ideal and the coaching sucks but you were a former mvp. Not sure a hamstring should take this long, you guys traded for him to be contenders. Not looking like a borderline allstar player.

Kd can't continue playing at this pace coming off a major injury. He should be crusing around 32-33 mpg and saving him come post season. He has had to do a bunch of heavy lifting and it isn't fair to him. Harden needs to step up a ton and Kyrie needs to lay off conspiracy reddit/youtube and join his "brothers"

[Hello Brooklyn]

If I had to choose between a new coach or getting Harden back to normal it would EASILY be Harden.

Harden is one of the greatest offensive players of ALL TIME. He should basically be playing at the level of KD.

If KD and Harden were both buzzing none of this **** would matter. We would be able to produce enough offense. And the other guys would get their looks.

Defenses don't even respect Harden half the time. They usually leave him in single coverages. Or other times wide open.

Kyrie played for one game and he was ALREADY playing at an elite level. Way better than Harden has for most of the season.

[Jay555]

If I had to choose between a new coach or getting Harden back to normal it would EASILY be Harden.

Harden is one of the greatest offensive players of ALL TIME. He should basically be playing at the level of KD.

If KD and Harden were both buzzing none of this **** would matter. We would be able to produce enough offense. And the other guys would get their looks.

Defenses don't even respect Harden half the time. They usually leave him in single coverages. Or other times wide open.

Kyrie played for one game and he was ALREADY playing at an elite level. Way better than Harden has for most of the season.

At home vs 76ers and then Clips after the LA trip, Harden had 30+ triple double for both games and Durant had 33 and 28 respectively.

We still lost both.

No, it would not be enough offense. Assuming Harden and Durant gets you 60-65 per night, where do we get the rest of the points from? Mills has been filling the void but you can not expect him to get 15 pts per night consistently. He's been driven to the ground with the heavy mins he's on hence the current slump. Notice he's only averaged 20 mins per game when he was with the Spurs. We might be able to beat up on bad teams with the current set up but against good teams it would require both Harden and KD to go super human to have a chance. Our losing record vs top teams is woeful. (We almost always get blown out, Harden & KD are not enough).

The fact that we are missing 35 pts per night from Kyrie(25 pts) and Joe (11 pts) is HUGE. That's over 50 mil payroll in the books lol..Take 50 mil off any top teams and see how they go..They would be lucky to make top 8 in their respective conference.

Your point about Kyrie playing at an elite level is valid. However, can we get that every night tho? One night we have it. The other night it is not there. Being available seems easy yet so hard.. Anyways.

The result of the current set up is KD and Harden will be driven to the ground with the heavy mins they are on. Giannis is laughing all the way to the bank and says " See you in the playoffs, " because dude only averages 32 mins per game.

[Hello Brooklyn]

If I had to choose between a new coach or getting Harden back to normal it would EASILY be Harden.

Harden is one of the greatest offensive players of ALL TIME. He should basically be playing at the level of KD.

If KD and Harden were both buzzing none of this **** would matter. We would be able to produce enough offense. And the other guys would get their looks.

Defenses don't even respect Harden half the time. They usually leave him in single coverages. Or other times wide open.

Kyrie played for one game and he was ALREADY playing at an elite level. Way better than Harden has for most of the season.

At home vs 76ers and then Clips after the LA trip, Harden had 30+ triple double for both games and Durant had 33 and 28 respectively.

We still lost both.

No, it would not be enough offense. Assuming Harden and Durant gets you 60-65 per night, where do we get the rest of the points from? Mills has been filling the void but you can not expect him to get 15 pts per night consistently. He's been driven to the ground with the heavy mins he's on hence the current slump. Notice he's only averaged 20 mins per game when he was with the Spurs. We might be able to beat up on bad teams with the current set up but against good teams it would require both Harden and KD to go super human to have a chance. Our losing record vs top teams is woeful. (We almost always get blown out, Harden & KD are not enough).

The fact that we are missing 35 pts per night from Kyrie(25 pts) and Joe (11 pts) is HUGE. That's over 50 mil payroll in the books lol..Take 50 mil off any top teams and see how they go..They would be lucky to make top 8 in their respective conference.

Your point about Kyrie playing at an elite level is valid. However, can we get that every night tho? One night we have it. The other night it is not there. Being available seems easy yet so hard.. Anyways.

The result of the current set up is KD and Harden will be driven to the ground with the heavy mins they are on. Giannis is laughing all the way to the bank and says " See you in the playoffs, " because dude only averages 32 mins per game.

Sixers game just came to a few shots at the end of the game. Maxey made a ton of 3s. Mills couldn't hit his. I don't think we even played bad.

Clippers game was just being idiots and collapsing.

We obviously need more offense. But I have faith other can create enough offense on most night. If those two are playing well.

The Grizzlies, Pacers, Bucks were all embarrassing performances. And Harden was bad in all of them.

So what if he has to play heavy minutes? Do does KD. So does LeBron. So did he when he was in Houston. Thats what you have to do.

I think Kyrie would be more consistently good. Look at Harden's averages. They are the worst of his career since OKC. And its not close.

Obviously coaching is bad. And we could be doing more offensively. But the bigger concern is Harden playing like **** half the time. Its killing us.

With Harris/Kyrie out we need him to do more.