Is 3 point spamming a problem for the game? Are there any solutions?

[DaPessimist]

Remove the corner 3pnt shot, or widen the court and move the corner 3pnt shot back. I think that would significantly reduce the 3pnt spamming, because role players camping in the corner is the primary culprit in my opinion.

77% of three's are taken above the break, the above the break three is still hit at a percentage that is much more efficient than shooting 40% on non rim 2PT shots and is not more volatile in terms of streakiness in any significant way.

I understand, but it would be easier to defend 3pnt shots above the break when you don't have to worry as much about defending the corner 3pnt shot. Most teams will be perfectly fine leaving PJ Tucker to take open, long-distance corner shots worth 2 points.

[Lalouie]

drop the line back 2.5' - 3' problem solved...there's nothing hard about a solution

what we need is the line to drop back until it is percentage wise equivalent to the 2.

the problem of course is wrestling with what to do with the corners. i think widening the court to make the 3 equidistant all around the arc widens the midrange and we will see MORE MIDRANGE game. players will develop better 1on1 offense skills and concomitantly on defense as well. i just think we'll see more dedication to D. because no one defends the 3, it matriculates down to bad d against the 2 as well.

the other option is keeping the floor the same and just eliminating the corners period. that kills spacing but so what. this is all about stupid 3pt shooting

Equal to the 2PT jumpshot? That's tough.

I'll just do every 5 years from 99-00

Year / 3-10 / 10-16 / 16-<3PT
99-00: 37.9 / 36.5 / 42.8
04-05: 39.1 / 38.3 / 40.0
09-10: 42.1 / 40.0 / 40.2
14-15: 38.4 / 40.3 / 39.4
19-20: 39.6 / 41.6 / 40.4
20-21: 42.4 / 42.1 / 40.8

Two point jumpshots, basically anywhere we drop into fall at around 40% which is the equivalent 3PT% of 27% 3PT. This season it is actually higher than it usuaohad been. That's of course why you actually can have an advantage now as a team if you can get all those same rim attempts and three's that everyone else gets but also have players who hit 45%+ from 2PT not at the rim.

The problem teams face and why the 3PT is so prominent is that the mid-range is just about as streaky and volatile for the average team as three's (something many people don't always acknowledge), and then you get 1 less point. It probably will be tough to balance without changing the scoring system. Right now three's are worth 50% more but only like 4-5% lower FG, the difference in volatility between shooting 39-40% from 3 feet to inside the arc vs everything outside the arc is barely different. If many teams took 90 FGA, one set all away from the rim but inside the arc, and another set all three's. All mid-range would give the average team 54 misses and all three's would give the average team 58.5 misses. That's almost nothing to a team to the get 1 more point for every make. The pts would be 72 for mid-range vs 94.5 for all three's, yea, 4.5 misses on average for 22.5 more points is an easy decision.

Teams used to go COLD just like now back when three was utilized less, it would just be more turn around post fade way, long and middle mid-range shots and hook shot bricks instead of more 3PT bricks. So I don't know, could be tough, maybe doable, but who knows, kinda hard. The easier, somewhat easier solution is changing the scoring system.

It could be as wild as 3's and 4's, so they are worth 33% more instead of 50%. It could be 2.5 which makes them worth 25% more. You could get creative with 2.5 and instead make it that every other three point shot is worth 3 points, so you don't have to do decimals, but that might be odd to track, though not really, every odd number made three is worth 3 pts, every even number made three is worth 2 pts.

wow,,,that was an involved read. i got lost somewhere mid-paragraph! lol
whatever the 3pt % is, increase the distance until the % drop to a level equal to the average 2pt. so if say the average 2pt % was 45% or 90pts per 100 attempts, then increase the 3pt distance until it's percenatge drops to 30%

i like it simple

[og15]

Remove the corner 3pnt shot, or widen the court and move the corner 3pnt shot back. I think that would significantly reduce the 3pnt spamming, because role players camping in the corner is the primary culprit in my opinion.

77% of three's are taken above the break, the above the break three is still hit at a percentage that is much more efficient than shooting 40% on non rim 2PT shots and is not more volatile in terms of streakiness in any significant way.

I understand, but it would be easier to defend 3pnt shots above the break when you don't have to worry as much about defending the corner 3pnt shot. Most teams will be perfectly fine leaving PJ Tucker to take open, long-distance corner shots worth 2 points.

For sure, that part is true, would be weird to see how the corners would be utilized

[Lalouie]

Remove the corner 3pnt shot, or widen the court and move the corner 3pnt shot back. I think that would significantly reduce the 3pnt spamming, because role players camping in the corner is the primary culprit in my opinion.

77% of three's are taken above the break, the above the break three is still hit at a percentage that is much more efficient than shooting 40% on non rim 2PT shots and is not more volatile in terms of streakiness in any significant way.

do you mean 3s taken on the break? i'm not sure

[JonFromVA]

Let defenses adjust and evolve. Its hard for me to believe dropping your big on a P&R is "state of the art" again. The goal should be no weak points and contest everything.

[og15]

drop the line back 2.5' - 3' problem solved...there's nothing hard about a solution

what we need is the line to drop back until it is percentage wise equivalent to the 2.

the problem of course is wrestling with what to do with the corners. i think widening the court to make the 3 equidistant all around the arc widens the midrange and we will see MORE MIDRANGE game. players will develop better 1on1 offense skills and concomitantly on defense as well. i just think we'll see more dedication to D. because no one defends the 3, it matriculates down to bad d against the 2 as well.

the other option is keeping the floor the same and just eliminating the corners period. that kills spacing but so what. this is all about stupid 3pt shooting

Equal to the 2PT jumpshot? That's tough.

I'll just do every 5 years from 99-00

Year / 3-10 / 10-16 / 16-<3PT
99-00: 37.9 / 36.5 / 42.8
04-05: 39.1 / 38.3 / 40.0
09-10: 42.1 / 40.0 / 40.2
14-15: 38.4 / 40.3 / 39.4
19-20: 39.6 / 41.6 / 40.4
20-21: 42.4 / 42.1 / 40.8

Two point jumpshots, basically anywhere we drop into fall at around 40% which is the equivalent 3PT% of 27% 3PT. This season it is actually higher than it usuaohad been. That's of course why you actually can have an advantage now as a team if you can get all those same rim attempts and three's that everyone else gets but also have players who hit 45%+ from 2PT not at the rim.

The problem teams face and why the 3PT is so prominent is that the mid-range is just about as streaky and volatile for the average team as three's (something many people don't always acknowledge), and then you get 1 less point. It probably will be tough to balance without changing the scoring system. Right now three's are worth 50% more but only like 4-5% lower FG, the difference in volatility between shooting 39-40% from 3 feet to inside the arc vs everything outside the arc is barely different. If many teams took 90 FGA, one set all away from the rim but inside the arc, and another set all three's. All mid-range would give the average team 54 misses and all three's would give the average team 58.5 misses. That's almost nothing to a team to the get 1 more point for every make. The pts would be 72 for mid-range vs 94.5 for all three's, yea, 4.5 misses on average for 22.5 more points is an easy decision.

Teams used to go COLD just like now back when three was utilized less, it would just be more turn around post fade way, long and middle mid-range shots and hook shot bricks instead of more 3PT bricks. So I don't know, could be tough, maybe doable, but who knows, kinda hard. The easier, somewhat easier solution is changing the scoring system.

It could be as wild as 3's and 4's, so they are worth 33% more instead of 50%. It could be 2.5 which makes them worth 25% more. You could get creative with 2.5 and instead make it that every other three point shot is worth 3 points, so you don't have to do decimals, but that might be odd to track, though not really, every odd number made three is worth 3 pts, every even number made three is worth 2 pts.

wow,,,that was an involved read. i got lost somewhere mid-paragraph! lol
whatever the 3pt % is, increase the distance until the % drop to a level equal to the average 2pt. so if say the average 2pt % was 45% or 90pts per 100 attempts, then increase the 3pt distance until it's percenatge drops to 30%

i like it simple

I think maybe two things could be factors, the NBA might not want a 3PT line that teams hit at only around 27%, but second could be maybe you fear that players just get better at the new range and you get a similar problem again? Obviously there's a limit to how much players can keep improving, but who knows. Point system would be a more permanent solution.

Remove the corner 3pnt shot, or widen the court and move the corner 3pnt shot back. I think that would significantly reduce the 3pnt spamming, because role players camping in the corner is the primary culprit in my opinion.

77% of three's are taken above the break, the above the break three is still hit at a percentage that is much more efficient than shooting 40% on non rim 2PT shots and is not more volatile in terms of streakiness in any significant way.

do you mean 3s taken on the break? i'm not sure

Above the break just means anything not from the corner

[SelfishPlayer]

The solution is to move the 3 point line closer to the basket as to make it a shot more people can shoot well while disincentivizing doing it well from distance. People will shoot the 3 from where they do it best. Move it back to where it was during the Rockets CHIP era.

[picko]

If you wanted to solve the 'problem' then the most effective solution would be to turn 2s into 3s and 3s into 4s. All you need to do is reduce the premium awarded to perimeter shooting.

Consider the maths:

Current: 50% on 2s = 33% on 3s
Adjusted: 50% on 3s = 37.5% on 4s

As inside shooting becomes relatively more efficient, teams would shift away from 'spamming' outside shots. Problem solved.

[Lalouie]

Equal to the 2PT jumpshot? That's tough.

I'll just do every 5 years from 99-00

Year / 3-10 / 10-16 / 16-<3PT
99-00: 37.9 / 36.5 / 42.8
04-05: 39.1 / 38.3 / 40.0
09-10: 42.1 / 40.0 / 40.2
14-15: 38.4 / 40.3 / 39.4
19-20: 39.6 / 41.6 / 40.4
20-21: 42.4 / 42.1 / 40.8

Two point jumpshots, basically anywhere we drop into fall at around 40% which is the equivalent 3PT% of 27% 3PT. This season it is actually higher than it usuaohad been. That's of course why you actually can have an advantage now as a team if you can get all those same rim attempts and three's that everyone else gets but also have players who hit 45%+ from 2PT not at the rim.

The problem teams face and why the 3PT is so prominent is that the mid-range is just about as streaky and volatile for the average team as three's (something many people don't always acknowledge), and then you get 1 less point. It probably will be tough to balance without changing the scoring system. Right now three's are worth 50% more but only like 4-5% lower FG, the difference in volatility between shooting 39-40% from 3 feet to inside the arc vs everything outside the arc is barely different. If many teams took 90 FGA, one set all away from the rim but inside the arc, and another set all three's. All mid-range would give the average team 54 misses and all three's would give the average team 58.5 misses. That's almost nothing to a team to the get 1 more point for every make. The pts would be 72 for mid-range vs 94.5 for all three's, yea, 4.5 misses on average for 22.5 more points is an easy decision.

Teams used to go COLD just like now back when three was utilized less, it would just be more turn around post fade way, long and middle mid-range shots and hook shot bricks instead of more 3PT bricks. So I don't know, could be tough, maybe doable, but who knows, kinda hard. The easier, somewhat easier solution is changing the scoring system.

It could be as wild as 3's and 4's, so they are worth 33% more instead of 50%. It could be 2.5 which makes them worth 25% more. You could get creative with 2.5 and instead make it that every other three point shot is worth 3 points, so you don't have to do decimals, but that might be odd to track, though not really, every odd number made three is worth 3 pts, every even number made three is worth 2 pts.

wow,,,that was an involved read. i got lost somewhere mid-paragraph! lol
whatever the 3pt % is, increase the distance until the % drop to a level equal to the average 2pt. so if say the average 2pt % was 45% or 90pts per 100 attempts, then increase the 3pt distance until it's percenatge drops to 30%

i like it simple

I think maybe two things could be factors, the NBA might not want a 3PT line that teams hit at only around 27%, but second could be maybe you fear that players just get better at the new range and you get a similar problem again? Obviously there's a limit to how much players can keep improving, but who knows. Point system would be a more permanent solution.

but here's the question. are/will the players just taking shots from further away or are their shooting precentages actually going up from further away

if the 3 remains equal to the 2 analytically, the 2 will always be the advisable shot because it's a higher % shot. the most egregious spamming is done when players take the 3 when the 3 IS NOT NEEDED. like fer instance when they only need 1 or 2points.

what adds to the motivation is i believe players prefer the unguarded 3 over the guarded 2. in other words while being analytically advisable it has also bred softness and laziness. it's simply human nature to follow the path that's the easiest. analytics has made the 3 mentally and physically the easier/better shot

[ellobo]

As someone who has been watching NBA basketball since the mid 1970s, IMO three point shooting has unlocked a much more pleasing and team-oriented style of play. I grew up playing and watching basketball without a three point line on the court, and then watched the evolution of the game toward recognizing and exploiting the value of the three. Believe me, it took a long time for me to accept and appreciate that evolution, but I've come around to realizing it is for the better.

Three point shooting opens up the court for other kinds of shots. Without the threat of the three, spacing is much worse and every other shot becomes harder. That's why there were illegal defense rules back in the day, which forced defenders to hug non-shooters on the perimeter to allow for stagnant iso-ball. The three point shot (and players' skill at making it) solves the spacing problem organically.

Once you have the court spaced out, it opens up lots of offensive possibilities. Now you have driving lanes to score at the rim or drive and kick. You give your post players space to work to score or draw help. You create open space in the midrange. You get more offensive variety, not less, and you give offenses more ways to generate open shots instead of contested ones. Back in the day, there was a big emphasis on iso scoring and being able to make tough contested shots in the post or facing up. There was an excitement to that kind of confrontational shot-making, and it's still very valuable, but more often it was just ugly and inefficient.

Defense is actually a lot more interesting when you have to guard multiple positions and actually cover the whole floor. Is anyone really pining for the big white stiff to make a comeback?

Just try getting rid of the three point line without illegal defense rules and see how you like the game then. Dudes will be coming out of the woodwork to call for some way of creating space on the floor -- like maybe a line around the perimeter where shots are worth more. Then you could put a team of good shooters out there and offenses will flow more freely...genius!

[xdrta+]

put a cap on the amount of 3pm a team gets per game. let them be used as a strategical tool to build a lead or save for a comeback/ clutch time. easy peazy

Let's put a cap on dunks, too. Dunks are boring. Heck, mid-range also. In fact, let's put caps on every range so that it can be a balanced basketball game with equal points from every area of the court.

i'm not sure exactly what point you thought you made with this. major whiff

Well, for the slow reading group, it shows what a major whiff the idea of "put a cap on the amount of 3pm a team gets per game" is.

[draftnightsuit]

I’m so glad we have a fresh new topic in between Laker and Lebron vs. Jordan threads. This board never runs out of things to talk about.

[KembaWalker]

Let's put a cap on dunks, too. Dunks are boring. Heck, mid-range also. In fact, let's put caps on every range so that it can be a balanced basketball game with equal points from every area of the court.

i'm not sure exactly what point you thought you made with this. major whiff

Well, for the slow reading group, it shows what a major whiff the idea of "put a cap on the amount of 3pm a team gets per game" is.

Except you didn't at all, you just made some incoherent rambling post about nothing. Limiting 3pm has the same logic as limiting the amount of fouls a player can commit in a game before they are ineligible. To discourage fouls. 3pt spam needs to be discouraged and this is a far more elegant solution that adds actual depth to the strategy of the game compared to unrealistic changes like modifying the court size or taking away corners.

Go babble somewhere else

[og15]

i'm not sure exactly what point you thought you made with this. major whiff

Well, for the slow reading group, it shows what a major whiff the idea of "put a cap on the amount of 3pm a team gets per game" is.

Except you didn't at all, you just made some incoherent rambling post about nothing. Limiting 3pm has the same logic as limiting the amount of fouls a player can commit in a game before they are ineligible. To discourage fouls. 3pt spam needs to be discouraged and this is a far more elegant solution that adds actual depth to the strategy of the game compared to unrealistic changes like modifying the court size or taking away corners.

Go babble somewhere else

Well, theoretically, depends on whether the league and majority of fans in general think it is a problem or if specific individual fans just don't like it.

[KembaWalker]

Well, for the slow reading group, it shows what a major whiff the idea of "put a cap on the amount of 3pm a team gets per game" is.

Except you didn't at all, you just made some incoherent rambling post about nothing. Limiting 3pm has the same logic as limiting the amount of fouls a player can commit in a game before they are ineligible. To discourage fouls. 3pt spam needs to be discouraged and this is a far more elegant solution that adds actual depth to the strategy of the game compared to unrealistic changes like modifying the court size or taking away corners.

Go babble somewhere else

Well, theoretically, depends on whether the league and majority of fans in general think it is a problem or if specific individual fans just don't like it.

That's true, I'm only offering my solution as if the higher powers had already come to the determination that 3pt spam was something that was 100% going to be addressed. Which I think it will but probably still many years from now. It's an imbalance in the game that can't be solved tactically with Xs and Os so I don't see why it wouldn't just keep growing

[thamadkant]

i think just make mid range shots 2.5 points and fouls on made layups or dunks an extra 2 shots to incentivise Inside plays and draw fouls while getting a good shot or dunk.

leave 3pters the way they are but make inside plays more attractive.

[Beethoven]

One of the most common complaints about the NBA today is that it is a three-point shooting chuck-fest. Players are too good at shooting 3's now. Does this need to be changed, and is there a solution?

I think making the 3 point line a universal distance from the hoop, i.e. ending the line before it gets to the corner (essentially eliminating the corner 3) is a solution to it. I'm not sure what else can be fairly done to combat it. What do you think about the state of 3 point shooting in the NBA?

lol what's the need of starting a new thread on a discussion already discussed before in multiple multiple threads. Lot of solutions offered in those just go read them. What makes you the 'definitive' subject starter and official 'solution' thread for this, oh man.

[Rodwilliams]

A team with a decent big winning the title will help slow it down.

[Braggins]

Has anyone ever referred to it as "2pt spamming" when teams used to shoot like 90% of their shots from inside the arc and complained that the game wasn't balanced enough because teams were taking all their shots at the rim or midrange?

[KembaWalker]

Has anyone ever referred to it as "2pt spamming" when teams used to shoot like 90% of their shots from inside the arc and complained that the game wasn't balanced enough because teams were taking all their shots at the rim or midrange?

It wasn't added to the game to be a balanced scoring option, it was added to be an excitement/gimmick play to add hype. It's having the complete opposite effect at this point (at least for many people) so it's fair to call it out and look at changes.