Tank World Order (7.0)

[720]

So we're going to pretend like he wasn't incentivized to take 20 plus shots multiple times vs all these covid protocol/ injury plagued teams the past week and a half to up his counting and efficiency stats? From Mr.BetOnYourSelf, the man who wants to win all the awards? Stop being naïve.

Amazing logic man. I guess going by what you said, Scottie is statpadding too considering he said he wants to win ROY!!

Not even going to entertain this any longer. Literally an awful opinion if you think Fred is stat padding. You have real analysts who know hoops talk about how he changed his shot frequency on different areas of the court which is helping him get better shot attempts. But carry on man, it's usually the ones with the most to say that have the worst opinions anyways.

Right or wrong. FVV will get a max contract next year based on his play, thats gona be 70 million tied up in Siakam/FVV. You also have GTJ who could be due for around 20 million a year. Close to 90 million tied up in those three guys.

He also just happens to take 18-20+ shots vs depleted teams. Man took 27 shots twice in two games this last stretch. **** laughable.

[pingpongrac]

Aren't you the same guy that scoffed at the notion that the team wasn't good last year and said we're making the playoffs? I would heed your own advice bro. lol

LMAO imagine bro. I dont argue about how good the team is. It's a waste of time. If the team looks like they want to compete, I will cheer for wins. If the team looks like they want to tank, I'll just watch for player development and hope for a good pick. I dont pick sides.

Though I'll give you an A+ for trying to change this around on find something to discredit me with. Good effort. Just always remember what you said, "Fred Vanvleet is a statpadder"

I wont be responding back after this but listen to more basketball podcasts, watch more basketball, read basketball articles and you'll have better takes.

There is nothing to discredit, you don't have an opinion. You thought we were good last year and had egg on your face by the end and act like it didn't happen. I couldn't care less about discrediting you just pointing out facts. Take your own advice.

Comments like this are unnecessary (and pretty douchey saying he doesn't deserve an opinion for being wrong) and a bit of revisionist history by leaving out how we got to that end point where we were terrible.

We had an awful record to start last season, but most games could have went either way (we lost 2 on the final possession and 3 others in the last minute because of some bad calls against the Spurs, Sixers and Pelicans) and we definitely played better than our 2-8 record suggested. Despite that 2-8 start, we worked our way back up to 17-17 and we were trending up. We also had an easy upcoming schedule before/after the break (2 games against Detroit and 4 games against teams in the same range as us) then COVID decimated our team. In a stretch where we would have went 3-3 at the absolute worst, we dropped 6 straight then we were absolutely screwed by officiating in the Utah game (41-14 FTA disadvantage in a 3-point loss) to top it off. We were healthy in 2 of the next 3 games (bad loss to Cavs and blowout against the Nuggets) then we traded off most of our backcourt depth and Powell for GTJ and what would eventually become Johnson/Banton.

From the trade deadline on, we never got a good look at what a small-ball Lowry/FVV/GTJ/OG/Siakam lineup might look like either (they literally played together for 30 total minutes spread across 3 of the last 28 games) and we lost 19 of 28 games. The last 1/3 of the season -- and to an even greater extent the last 3 weeks -- was blatantly tanked. We went 1-10 in the last 11 games with most of our top players sitting out almost every game and our lone win was the Lakers game (because it was Lowry's last hurrah plus Siakam was dominating).

The only reason we finished at 27-45 is because we were royally screwed by COVID at the most inopportune time then our front office made the right call to start collecting additional assets and resting our "injured" players for most of the last 25 games. You can keep inflating your own ego and pounding your chest all over this board by pretending as if the team was bad all along, but that doesn't alter the reality. We would have been a ~.500 team in spite of not having anyone at C and playing every game away from home.

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[KL78192020]

I dont understand how after a year and a half of arguments there is a sizeable group of people who don't realize that TWO originated as a meme based on the NWO from a user named Hulk_Hogan. Using tank as a be all and end all term is easier than "Selectively losing to secure a lottery pick in order to add to the Raptors asset base."

Photoshopping random Raptors players on a literal tank is good for a laugh. There is no need to bust out the dictionary and consult each other in a extended statistical analysis on what tank means and if they are successful 100% of the time.

This lack of understanding has led to violent threats and comparisons to fascists. It's unfortunate that this still continues.

Yea some of these guys are confused. Its ok, I'm just here for the laughs at this point. I've been posting more since covid and WFH, this is a form of entertainment. If it wasn't for covid I'd be travelling a lot more and doing lots of other activities not wasting time online.

The silent majority are still in favor. 51% in favour of the tank, only 29% opposed, and 20% TDB.

[pingpongrac]

Amazing logic man. I guess going by what you said, Scottie is statpadding too considering he said he wants to win ROY!!

Not even going to entertain this any longer. Literally an awful opinion if you think Fred is stat padding. You have real analysts who know hoops talk about how he changed his shot frequency on different areas of the court which is helping him get better shot attempts. But carry on man, it's usually the ones with the most to say that have the worst opinions anyways.

Right or wrong. FVV will get a max contract next year based on his play, thats gona be 70 million tied up in Siakam/FVV. You also have GTJ who could be due for around 20 million a year. Close to 90 million tied up in those three guys.

He also just happens to take 18-20+ shots vs depleted teams. Man took 27 shots twice in two games this last stretch. **** laughable.

More lies. FVV took 18+ shots quite a few times before this recent stretch. He was usually uber efficient in those games too (26/10/6 on 72 TS% against Indiana, 33/3/6 on 69 TS% against Washington, 32/6/7 on 67 TS% against Philadelphia, etc.) with the exception of the opener (where everyone but Banton was garbage) and the Warriors game (where he chased Steph around all game and held him to 12 points on 2/10 shooting).

A player taking more shots when they're in the midst of a nearly historic hot streak...who could have possibly guessed that would happen?

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[720]

LMAO imagine bro. I dont argue about how good the team is. It's a waste of time. If the team looks like they want to compete, I will cheer for wins. If the team looks like they want to tank, I'll just watch for player development and hope for a good pick. I dont pick sides.

Though I'll give you an A+ for trying to change this around on find something to discredit me with. Good effort. Just always remember what you said, "Fred Vanvleet is a statpadder"

I wont be responding back after this but listen to more basketball podcasts, watch more basketball, read basketball articles and you'll have better takes.

There is nothing to discredit, you don't have an opinion. You thought we were good last year and had egg on your face by the end and act like it didn't happen. I couldn't care less about discrediting you just pointing out facts. Take your own advice.

Comments like this are unnecessary (and pretty douchey saying he doesn't deserve an opinion for being wrong) and a bit of revisionist history by leaving out how we got to that end point where we were terrible.

We had an awful record to start last season, but most games could have went either way (we lost 2 on the final possession and 3 others in the last minute because of some bad calls against the Spurs, Sixers and Pelicans) and we definitely played better than our 2-8 record suggested. Despite that 2-8 start, we worked our way back up to 17-17 and we were trending up. We also had an easy upcoming schedule before/after the break (2 games against Detroit and 4 games against teams in the same range as us) then COVID decimated our team. In a stretch where we would have went 3-3 at the absolute worst, we dropped 6 straight then we were absolutely screwed by officiating in the Utah game (41-14 FTA disadvantage in a 3-point loss) to top it off. We were healthy in 2 of the next 3 games (bad loss to Cavs and blowout against the Nuggets) then we traded off most of our backcourt depth and Powell for GTJ and what would eventually become Johnson/Banton.

From the trade deadline on, we never got a good look at what a small-ball Lowry/FVV/GTJ/OG/Siakam lineup might look like either (they literally played together for 30 total minutes spread across 3 of the last 28 games) and we lost 19 of 28 games. The last 1/3 of the season -- and to an even greater extent the last 3 weeks -- was blatantly tanked. We went 1-10 in the last 11 games with most of our top players sitting out almost every game and our lone win was the Lakers game (because it was Lowry's last hurrah plus Siakam was dominating).

The only reason we finished at 27-45 is because we were royally screwed by COVID at the most inopportune time then our front office made the right call to start collecting additional assets and resting our "injured" players for most of the last 25 games. You can keep inflating your own ego and pounding your chest all over this board by pretending as if the team was bad all along, but that doesn't alter the reality. We would have been a ~.500 team in spite of not having anyone at C and playing every game away from home.

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Just gonna ignore all the excuses you made for that 2-8 start because if we're gonna start being proud of closes losses then this discussion goes nowhere. I'm just gonna go straight into that huge losing streak most people like to talk about.

In that losing streak. We were fortunate to have had the all star weekend overlap with the outbreak for our team, so we were lucky in that regard.

Then in the actual 9 game losing streak itself Fred and Siakam were back by the pistons game. So they played and lost against the Pistons, Jazz (again, excuses about free-throw discrepancies like it's valid is laughable considering this is a common occurrence for many teams and it goes both ways) and then two embarrassing losses to the Cavs and horrible Rockets team. These games are all featured Lowry, Fred and Siakam. Not only that but the 4 game losing streak right after where we lost to the Pistons again and a tanking Thunder afterword also featured Fred and Siakam (Lowry was out for the Pistons game but our two pillars in Fred and Siakam played).

Of that stretch where we lost 13 of 14 games, Fred and Siakam were out for....5 games. That's it. So lets stop acting like we got screwed. That 14 game stretch made the decision for the front office and they started to doe half measure tanking moves like resting guys and putting players in and out of the lineups (I thought they could have done more but hey, we got 7th and moved up to 4th so can't complain).

Many of us knew this team had major flaws, especially with that slow start. They were valid concerns and they ended up coming to fruition.

[720]

Right or wrong. FVV will get a max contract next year based on his play, thats gona be 70 million tied up in Siakam/FVV. You also have GTJ who could be due for around 20 million a year. Close to 90 million tied up in those three guys.

He also just happens to take 18-20+ shots vs depleted teams. Man took 27 shots twice in two games this last stretch. **** laughable.

More lies. FVV took 18+ shots quite a few times before this recent stretch. He was usually uber efficient in those games too (26/10/6 on 72 TS% against Indiana, 33/3/6 on 69 TS% against Washington, 32/6/7 on 67 TS% against Philadelphia, etc.) with the exception of the opener (where everyone but Banton was garbage) and the Warriors game (where he chased Steph around all game and held him to 12 points on 2/10 shooting).

A player taking more shots when they're in the midst of a nearly historic hot streak...who could have possibly guessed that would happen?

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I mean, you better be efficient when playing against g leaguers one would think, "historical" give any decent player that low level of competition and it would also be historical. Also, did he not take 27 shots vs the Clippers and pelicans? like what are we talking about? I stated a fact, that's not a lie. He always chucks up shots (still would sprinkle lower fga's in between), that doesn't disprove that he clearly took more shots vs bummy teams to up his numbers for the allstar game.

Highlighted games are when he wasn't chucking. Now look at the last 2 weeks where we played g leaguers and bench players. LOL Man is shooting for that allstar weekend.

[GreatWhiteStiff]

There MIGHT be less conflict if you stayed out of the thread...

If I stay out of the thread then where else will I get my daily fix of horrible takes and insults?

Los you thrive on the conflict within this thread, and I thrive off your posts. You are very much needed. I think the tWo even know that, deep down.

[Los_29]

720 ACTUALLY believes that FVV was stat padding. He’s actually serious. This is incredible.

He just refuses to admit he’s been wrong on FVV (and basically everything else for that matter).

[Madhouse]

This is what a proper tank looks like

Read on Twitter

?s=20

[pingpongrac]

He also just happens to take 18-20+ shots vs depleted teams. Man took 27 shots twice in two games this last stretch. **** laughable.

More lies. FVV took 18+ shots quite a few times before this recent stretch. He was usually uber efficient in those games too (26/10/6 on 72 TS% against Indiana, 33/3/6 on 69 TS% against Washington, 32/6/7 on 67 TS% against Philadelphia, etc.) with the exception of the opener (where everyone but Banton was garbage) and the Warriors game (where he chased Steph around all game and held him to 12 points on 2/10 shooting).

A player taking more shots when they're in the midst of a nearly historic hot streak...who could have possibly guessed that would happen?

Sent from my Pixel 4 using RealGM mobile app

I mean, you better be efficient when playing against g leaguers one would think, "historical" give any decent player that low level of competition and it would also be historical. Also, did he not take 27 shots vs the Clippers and pelicans? like what are we talking about? I stated a fact, that's not a lie. He always chucks up shots (still would sprinkle lower fga's in between), that doesn't disprove that he clearly took more shots vs bummy teams to up his numbers for the allstar game.

You are so full of hatred towards FVV it is **** hilarious. Basically every player in the entire league inflates their numbers against bad teams lol. When someone is in a ridiculous hot streak like FVV was/is, you'll see them take tons of shots especially when their team's offence is labouring too (like it was for long stretches in those Clippers and Pelicans games). We saw it last night when Siakam, FVV and OG all took 10+ shots in the 2nd half because the rest of our team could only score on put backs.

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[Los_29]

This is what a proper tank looks like

Read on Twitter

?s=20

Did you post the wrong tweet? The tweet you posted said Lillard is having surgery.

[720]

More lies. FVV took 18+ shots quite a few times before this recent stretch. He was usually uber efficient in those games too (26/10/6 on 72 TS% against Indiana, 33/3/6 on 69 TS% against Washington, 32/6/7 on 67 TS% against Philadelphia, etc.) with the exception of the opener (where everyone but Banton was garbage) and the Warriors game (where he chased Steph around all game and held him to 12 points on 2/10 shooting).

A player taking more shots when they're in the midst of a nearly historic hot streak...who could have possibly guessed that would happen?

Sent from my Pixel 4 using RealGM mobile app

I mean, you better be efficient when playing against g leaguers one would think, "historical" give any decent player that low level of competition and it would also be historical. Also, did he not take 27 shots vs the Clippers and pelicans? like what are we talking about? I stated a fact, that's not a lie. He always chucks up shots (still would sprinkle lower fga's in between), that doesn't disprove that he clearly took more shots vs bummy teams to up his numbers for the allstar game.

You are so full of hatred towards FVV it is **** hilarious. Basically every player in the entire league inflates their numbers against bad teams lol. When someone is in a ridiculous hot streak like FVV was/is, you'll see them take tons of shots especially when their team's offence is labouring (like it was for long stretches in those Clippers and Pelicans games). We saw it last night when Siakam, FVV and OG all took 10+ shots in the 2nd half because the rest of our team could only score on put backs.

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I don't hate Fred, I love Fred, he's a great off ball player and I loved his contribution stretching back to the bench mob days to the championship. Forever part of that legendary 2019 team and we don't win that championship without Fred's hot shooting in the conference finals and finals.


But you can't look at this image and tell me he ISN'T stat padding. Now it wouldn't be annoying if we were a garbage team with no one to develop. But we have plenty of young guys with potential and it bothers me we're just letting him chuck up shots for meaningless accolades (and upping his leverage during next offseason's contract negotiations)

[Madhouse]

This is what a proper tank looks like

Read on Twitter

?s=20

Did you post the wrong tweet? The tweet you posted said Lillard is having surgery.

No, I don't think Lillard returns for Portland after that and they are trying to get a top 5 pick

[GreatWhiteStiff]

I want some reporter to ask nurse if FVV is statpadding. Maybe Doug Smith. I'm sure they'd have a good chuckle.

[TorontoRapsFan]

I dont understand how after a year and a half of arguments there is a sizeable group of people who don't realize that TWO originated as a meme based on the NWO from a user named Hulk_Hogan. Using tank as a be all and end all term is easier than "Selectively losing to secure a lottery pick in order to add to the Raptors asset base."

Photoshopping random Raptors players on a literal tank is good for a laugh. There is no need to bust out the dictionary and consult each other in a extended statistical analysis on what tank means and if they are successful 100% of the time.

This lack of understanding has led to violent threats and comparisons to fascists. It's unfortunate that this still continues.

Yea some of these guys are confused. Its ok, I'm just here for the laughs at this point. I've been posting more since covid and WFH, this is a form of entertainment. If it wasn't for covid I'd be travelling a lot more and doing lots of other activities not wasting time online.

The silent majority are still in favor. 51% in favour of the tank, only 29% opposed, and 20% TDB.

LMAO you think there is only 60 people on this forum?

Chances are most of the posters who didn't bother voting in your poll don't care about the whole idea of tank, by whatever definition you all want to use today.

[Los_29]

This is what a proper tank looks like

Read on Twitter

?s=20

Did you post the wrong tweet? The tweet you posted said Lillard is having surgery.

No, I don't think Lillard returns for Portland after that and they are trying to get a top 5 pick

It’s not a proper tank though because he got injured. If he was healthy he would be out there. Our tank was actually worse because we sat out guys who were actually healthy lol.

[Madhouse]

Did you post the wrong tweet? The tweet you posted said Lillard is having surgery.

No, I don't think Lillard returns for Portland after that and they are trying to get a top 5 pick

It’s not a proper tank though because he got injured. If he was healthy he would be out there. Our tank was actually worse because we sat out guys who were actually healthy lol.

They will probably have the same tactic. Might as well clean house after that though. Not going anywhere with Lillard and he is aging.

[TorontoRapsFan]

I mean, you better be efficient when playing against g leaguers one would think, "historical" give any decent player that low level of competition and it would also be historical. Also, did he not take 27 shots vs the Clippers and pelicans? like what are we talking about? I stated a fact, that's not a lie. He always chucks up shots (still would sprinkle lower fga's in between), that doesn't disprove that he clearly took more shots vs bummy teams to up his numbers for the allstar game.

You are so full of hatred towards FVV it is **** hilarious. Basically every player in the entire league inflates their numbers against bad teams lol. When someone is in a ridiculous hot streak like FVV was/is, you'll see them take tons of shots especially when their team's offence is labouring (like it was for long stretches in those Clippers and Pelicans games). We saw it last night when Siakam, FVV and OG all took 10+ shots in the 2nd half because the rest of our team could only score on put backs.

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I don't hate Fred, I love Fred, he's a great off ball player and I loved his contribution stretching back to the bench mob days to the championship. Forever part of that legendary 2019 team and we don't win that championship without Fred's hot shooting in the conference finals and finals.


But you can't look at this image and tell me he ISN'T stat padding. Now it wouldn't be annoying if we were a garbage team with no one to develop. But we have plenty of young guys with potential and it bothers me we're just letting him chuck up shots for meaningless accolades (and upping his leverage during next offseason's contract negotiations)

What about the assists, and the rebounds, and the steals? Hell there is even the pretty good fg%. Why don't they count in your stat padding idea? Oh and the fact that most of these games are Ws. Team stat pad?

Players just shouldn't do well against other teams when they can. They should just maintain their minimums.

[Los_29]

No, I don't think Lillard returns for Portland after that and they are trying to get a top 5 pick

It’s not a proper tank though because he got injured. If he was healthy he would be out there. Our tank was actually worse because we sat out guys who were actually healthy lol.

They will probably have the same tactic. Might as well clean house after that though. Not going anywhere with Lillard and he is aging.

Yeah they are one of the few teams in the league that are actually a treadmill team. CJ and Lillard are in their 30’s and haven’t really had any playoff success aside from three years ago.

Perfect year to stealth tank.

[720]

You are so full of hatred towards FVV it is **** hilarious. Basically every player in the entire league inflates their numbers against bad teams lol. When someone is in a ridiculous hot streak like FVV was/is, you'll see them take tons of shots especially when their team's offence is labouring (like it was for long stretches in those Clippers and Pelicans games). We saw it last night when Siakam, FVV and OG all took 10+ shots in the 2nd half because the rest of our team could only score on put backs.

Sent from my Pixel 4 using RealGM mobile app

I don't hate Fred, I love Fred, he's a great off ball player and I loved his contribution stretching back to the bench mob days to the championship. Forever part of that legendary 2019 team and we don't win that championship without Fred's hot shooting in the conference finals and finals.


But you can't look at this image and tell me he ISN'T stat padding. Now it wouldn't be annoying if we were a garbage team with no one to develop. But we have plenty of young guys with potential and it bothers me we're just letting him chuck up shots for meaningless accolades (and upping his leverage during next offseason's contract negotiations)

What about the assists, and the rebounds, and the steals? Hell there is even the pretty good fg%. Why don't they count in your stat padding idea? Oh and the fact that most of these games are Ws. Team stat pad?

Players just shouldn't do well against other teams when they can. They should just maintain their minimums.

Most of these are W's because we've been playing depleted teams for the most part. He's looking at the soft schedule and is using it to up his numbers. Man said players have to sacrifice for the team but has upped his FGA's since saying that. I guess others have to sacrifice but not him.

Assists don't mean someone is playing unselfish or isn't statpadding. Like what? lol Players hunt for assists, you think Westbrook didn't stat pad/ play selfish? He had good rebounding and assist numbers too.