Shaq could drop X and Y in today's league

[SomeBunghole]

We all know the shtick. Shaq has a big mouth and a big ego, but very thin skin, so he gets butt-hurt all the time and makes all sorts of claims. Including that he would dominate today's centres and score however many points he feels at the time against today's weak defenses.

Now, I grew up watching Shaq. I don't mean that I was watching him at ten when he was playing for the Cavs(I did actually watch him when I was 10, but he was a rookie...my uncle got me an Orlando Magic basketball after Shaq's rookie season), I mean I was 21 when he left the Lakers. I was an adult when I watched Shaq in his prime. He was an unstoppable force. As a Jazz fan, I hated his guts, but the rings speak for themselves. Grudging admiration is how I'd describe my feelings at the time.

Memory is a funny thing, though. What I certainly do not remember as well as I should is how different basketball was at the time. Part of it is that I've been watching the NBA for 3 decades now and the change has been gradual. You don't notice things when they happen slowly over several years.

I watched some games(not highlights) from around the turn of the century and what shocked me now is how little movement was required of Shaq. Now, I don't mean that he wasn't quick or explosive. That's a whole other thing. I mean that both on offense and defense, he would largely stand around for 20 seconds(they sure liked to eat up shot clock back then, too), take maybe a step or two in a half-hearted fashion, and that was it. This wasn't just Shaq, this was everyone to some degree, but I'm focusing on Shaq here.

Check out this quick video I made. I purposely selected a random section of the legendary Lakers-Blazers game 7 from 2000. I tried to get a few possessions that weren't interrupted at some point by fouls or timeouts or any other break in play. I wasn't going into it selectively trying to prove my own point. I chose the first instance of 4-5 straight, uninterrupted possessions. Feel free to look at the rest of the game on YT if you feel I selected an unrepresentative sample.

Watch on YouTube

It is shocking watching this in 2022. On the first possession Shaq's on defense. His man never actually goes inside the three point line so Shaq just chills on top of the key. He eventually takes a not-too-convincing step towards Rasheed, but by that point, a teammate had already stolen the ball. Shaq then casually jogs down the floor(you people just stole the ball, why isn't anyone running the break???) and parks himself 7-8 feet from the basket, just outside the paint. The ball is passed around as he just stands there. No screens, no cuts, nothing. Just stands there until a teammate scores. I guess you could say that he was preventing Sabonis from coming over to help, but if you watch enough of this game, you know Sabonis was not going to come over anyway.

Then the Blazers come down and give it to Sheed again, and Shaq stands in a spot on top of the key, and again comes over too late to make an attempt at a double team. This time there's no steal and Sheed passes to an open Sabonis. Sabas is deadly from that range and Shaq is too slow to come back(just as he was too slow to actually make Sheed's pass more difficult) and it's an easy basket.

Then on offense, Shaq parks himself again, takes a few steps as if he's actually doing something, but 20 seconds into the shot clock, receives the ball in the same spot he had originally parked himself in. He makes no attempt to come to the ball or make a cut or set a screen, and Sabonis pokes it away. Shaq then doesn't even cross the other three point line when the Blazers are on offense, and Mighty Mouse misses the layup through sheer luck.

How many steps did Shaq actually take in the minute and a half of action here? Then watch any game today. Watch Jarrett Allen, as an example. Watch how much he works on O and D. Constantly moving, constantly running, constantly helping. Switching on smaller players, setting screens.

Having a prime Shaq playing today is obviously a hypothetical. Transporting him forward in time and giving him a year to get adjusted to modern basketball, to practice, to get himself into better shape, what have you...yeah, he'd be a great player still. But that's not how Shaq talks about this. He talks about it as if he'd just have to step onto the court and he'd dominate. Remember that this is a man who even 20 years ago was knows as lazy with a low motor. I know someone's going to point out that before 2001, illegal defense rules encouraged people to stand around on defense, but feel free to find footage of Shaq doing anything different in 2002. He was lazy. He didn't keep himself in great shape at all, especially compared to current players.

Shaq would either get so abused on defense through switching today that you'd have to pull him off the floor regardless of his contribution on offense, or he'd actually try and get so winded that you'd still have to pull him because he's out of breath. If that sounds familiar, I guess we're both thinking of Boban right now.

Watching basketball from 20 years ago(actually watching, not highlights or reading about in on RealGM) gives you a different perspective on today's game. Of course today nobody plays 45 minutes a game like Iverson or even Finley used to. Of course players need to take games off. Of course you can't just have some lumbering giant stand under the basket and hope to get away with it. Of course you can't just get a big man with finesse and a soft touch around the basket and build your offense around him.

And of course Shaq wouldn't score 50 on today's centres. Unless you're talking G-League.

[cupcakesnake]

A 1 minute and 30-second sample of Shaq and you're saying it should give us a great idea of Shaq because it's "randomly selected"?

If you watch a ton of Shaq, yes he was low motor in a lot of play types, but he also worked aggressively off the ball to establish deep post position. It's also important to note that they changed the rules on zone defense after that year (EDIT: it was 2001), introducing the defensive 3-second rule, meaning the kind of conservative drop coverage was outlawed.

This video goes into his off-ball motor in detail.

Watch on YouTube

[cool007]

He would be unstoppable. Getting 40/15 easily and get half the team in foul trouble. Plus in today's NBA, there are no hard fouls anymore or you get flagrants so Shaq would dominate so badly - not even funny.

[Pharmcat]

2000 to 2003 shaq is the most dominant player history in the nba

[theforumblue]

so you ding him for not doubling off a lethal shooter, then ding him again for doubling and letting the lethal shooter make the shot?

running the break after a steal? didnt you see the blazers surrounding the dude that stole the ball?

no cuts screens etc..because shaq isnt out in the perimeter setting a screen himself you think nothing is going on?

well whatever. i guess that's why there aren't any 7 footers over 280lb playing in today's game.

[HornetJail]

I think prime Shaq dropped into 2022 is putting up 35/15, potentially more. I firmly believe he'd be the GOAT going up against today's centers, most of whom would've been PFs when Shaq played.

Certain teams could do ok against him, but the teams physically unequipped to handle him are letting him drop effortless 50 bombs on the regular

[RoundMoundOfRebound]

[MikeM]

Rookie Shaq was like a 7 foot Zion. So if he molded his game from then on to fit the modern NBA, then he'd probably be something like that. 30 a game in his sleep.

[KuruptedCav]

Rhymes and promos.


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[SF_Warriors]

Can't see him being worse than zion, who is basically shaq minus 6 inches. If zion can get 27ppg on 61% FG%, best believe shaq would do similar or better. Shaq with shooters would be unfathomable how deadly he would be. In his laker days, shaq really didnt have great shooting supporting casts. It was usually just fisher who was the only high percentage three point shooter in the rotation, although we have seen what horry can do in the playoffs.

[NZB2323]

97-2004 was the hardest period in NBA history to score and they changed the rules to make it easier to score after that.

Prime Shaq would lead the league in scoring and rebounding.

[SelfishPlayer]

80%FG...

[draftnightsuit]

I think prime Shaq dropped into 2022 is putting up 35/15, potentially more. I firmly believe he'd be the GOAT going up against today's centers, most of whom would've been PFs when Shaq played.

Certain teams could do ok against him, but the teams physically unequipped to handle him are letting him drop effortless 50 bombs on the regular

Todays center competition is way better than the trash Shaq played against. Shaq only dominated when he played against stiffs like Todd MacCollough and Austin Croshere.

[D.Brasco]

He would be unstoppable. Getting 40/15 easily and get half the team in foul trouble. Plus in today's NBA, there are no hard fouls anymore or you get flagrants so Shaq would dominate so badly - not even funny.

I loved Shaq as a player but his poor FT shooting never let him even hit 30 ppg in the regular season at a time when offenses were built around traditional big men.

He'd average good numbers today maybe what he did in his actual playing career or slightly higher but 40 easy, with no 3 point shot and subpar free throws? hell no.

This is like when people say MJ would average 50 ppg in today's league just nonsense.

[Nate505]

Easily 50 and 30. No coach would ever figure out any adjustments for him, and any team he was on would obviously go 82-0. G-14 Classification!

[Big J]

There aren't any bigs anymore, so he'd easily drop 35 & 20.

[HMFFL]

He would be unstoppable. Getting 40/15 easily and get half the team in foul trouble. Plus in today's NBA, there are no hard fouls anymore or you get flagrants so Shaq would dominate so badly - not even funny.

How today's game is played I believe averaging over 15rebs is more than likely. Many people don't taken into account that Shaq was doubled often and took a beating in the post.

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[CLosP]

Does RealGM believe ANY player that played before 2010 can play now? Every great player is greatly diminished because threes. Yeah we get it but if Looney & Steven Adams find consistent minutes something tells me Shaq will do just fine.

[theforumblue]

"8 offensive fouls and give up 40pt to Embiid the far superior center in every way."

[Lockdown504090]

He would be unstoppable. Getting 40/15 easily and get half the team in foul trouble. Plus in today's NBA, there are no hard fouls anymore or you get flagrants so Shaq would dominate so badly - not even funny.

I loved Shaq as a player but his poor FT shooting never let him even hit 30 ppg in the regular season at a time when offenses were built around traditional big men.

He'd average good numbers today maybe what he did in his actual playing career or slightly higher but 40 easy, with no 3 point shot and subpar free throws? hell no.

This is like when people say MJ would average 50 ppg in today's league just nonsense.

shaq could get 7 points per gam pinning people under the hoop in transition or off set plays, 4 points off putbacks( i think he could get more, just being conservative), 6 points off pnr(jakob poetl is at 4.6 and shoots even worse from the ft line), 11 points off the post up( embiid is at 13 from post ups +isolation) 4 points off dumpoff passes(lots of players are around that range). if the opposition runs hack a shaq 4 times and he hits 2, thats 34 points per game. Those are all very realistic numbers given the current landscape of the nba based on nba.com playtype numbers.