GT: Nets @ Timberwolves 1/23/22 8:00pm (YES Network)

[MGrand15]

It is not a waste of time, as criticizing someone for who he signed without presenting the acceptable alternatives is just a weak argument. Morris is certainly a name that fits. If you want to knock marks for missing that is not unreasonable. I would point out:

1) He is a 34.1% career shooter from three (Same exact career number as Milsap, who is 34.1% career from three). Morris was coming off a 31.1% season from three, Milsap 34.3% from three. It isnt like Morris was some sniper we missed on.

2) He went to another big market team. Its one thing to lose out to Memphis or Boston. But if we lose out to LA/MIA/NY/CHI it is harder to fault the GM.

You're not signing snipers for cheap obviously. It's not about that. Morris is a guy that defenses respect and think about - regardless of career 3PT percentage. Millsap has never been that. Even Carter - who I was pretty excited about - isn't respected by defenses. I have no idea why they don't respect him but they just don't. Bembry is another guy defenses ignore regardless of percentage. Marks has more stats on that kind of stuff that we can imagine.

You're acting like I'm asking for home runs out of veteran minimum spots. I'm not. You can look at someone like Tyler Johnson last year. His production isn't amazing but he fit like a glove. He took open 3s with no hesitation and made enough so defenses wouldn't leave him.

Look at Edwards this year. He's not amazing but he's literally the only 3+D guy on the roster that can guard 3/4s. It's a small sample size but the offense is MUCH better with him on the floor. So yeah, if you sign one more guy like that - even if it's a worse version - it does make a difference. You completely eliminate the need for lineups with 3 non-shooters. Lineups that are handcuffing us. You make it a lot easier to play 4 shooters at once.

Guys like Niang and Batum signed for like 3 mil. Garrison Matthews signed a two way deal. Etwuan Moore. Bjelica. Kaminsky. Keef and Porter were great options. Jeff Green would've been huge for this team. I think we willingly moved on - looking for stronger defenders. Marks is one of the best GMs out there. If he was focusing on shooters and athleticism, I think he would've got them. I think he wanted toughness and size - which is why I'm critical.

[MGrand15]

MGrand15

What's your take on Kyrie and him refusing help his team ( getting vaccinated ), also how much blame goes to Marks/Tsai.

Kyrie is an incredible player but I've checked out on him. Don't trust his injuries. Don't trust that he'll be there for the team when it matters. Even if its not his fault. He has a long streak of either not finishing the year because of injuries or mentally checking out on the team or both. Expecting anything different seems silly.

Hard to blame Marks/Tsai. He's literally in the perfect basketball situation playing with his buddies in his home town with a coach that lets him do whatever he wants. I would've been more aggressive in the trade market just out of principle but that would've been tough in reality.

[TheNetsFan]

MGrand15

What's your take on Kyrie and him refusing help his team ( getting vaccinated ), also how much blame goes to Marks/Tsai.

Kyrie is an incredible player but I've checked out on him. Don't trust his injuries. Don't trust that he'll be there for the team when it matters. Even if its not his fault. He has a long streak of either not finishing the year because of injuries or mentally checking out on the team or both. Expecting anything different seems silly.

Hard to blame Marks/Tsai. He's literally in the perfect basketball situation playing with his buddies in his home town with a coach that lets him do whatever he wants. I would've been more aggressive in the trade market just out of principle but that would've been tough in reality.

I both trust Kyrie & distrust Kyrie the most.

When I'm looking 3 years out, Kyrie is likely the safest bet in terms of who will still be performing at an elite level. It's not a stretch to envision him as the best of the Big 3 in 3 years. For that reason, despite is injury prone history, you'd want to lock him up long term.

Of course it's the various non-basketball personal reasons that give you pause. It's one thing to pencil in 15 missed games per season for rest & injuries. But if you overlay various the various non-basketball reason absences that will unfortunately always be popping up it starts to give pause.

That being said, if somebody offers a package too good to pass up, you take it. Otherwise, you continue to ride or die with KD & Irving.

[Hello Brooklyn]

You guys are criticizing the roster construction. Were missing two starters!

Harris AND Claxton.

Mills was a great signing. Bembry has been great. All the draft picks have contributed more than expected.

What more was Marks supposed to do? This team fit very well together.

The fundamental flaw has and always will be Nash. Marks made a colossal mistake in hiring him.

[Jay555]

You guys are criticizing the roster construction. Were missing two starters!

Harris AND Claxton.

Mills was a great signing. Bembry has been great. All the draft picks have contributed more than expected.

What more was Marks supposed to do? This team fit very well together.

The fundamental flaw has and always will be Nash. Marks made a colossal mistake in hiring him.

He should have added more shooting.

But then he did not know Kyrie was going to be a part time player and Harris for as healthy as he's been his whole career is out of action for more than 2 months now.

Having said all that, I still think we can win it all provided

- We are fully healthy come playoff
- Kyrie takes the shot

We will see how that turns out.

[NetsWorld]

You guys are criticizing the roster construction. Were missing two starters!

Harris AND Claxton.

Mills was a great signing. Bembry has been great. All the draft picks have contributed more than expected.

What more was Marks supposed to do? This team fit very well together.

The fundamental flaw has and always will be Nash. Marks made a colossal mistake in hiring him.

He should have added more shooting.

But then he did not know Kyrie was going to be a part time player and Harris for as healthy as he's been his whole career is out of action for more than 2 months now.

Having said all that, I still think we can win it all provided

- We are fully healthy come playoff
- Kyrie takes the shot

We will see how that turns out.

Our starting lineup has been so inconsistent in terms of who plays; it looks like we have been 20 different type of teams because of that. We really need the damn big three to play together.

[Prokorov]

You're not signing snipers for cheap obviously. It's not about that. Morris is a guy that defenses respect and think about - regardless of career 3PT percentage. Millsap has never been that. Even Carter - who I was pretty excited about - isn't respected by defenses. I have no idea why they don't respect him but they just don't. Bembry is another guy defenses ignore regardless of percentage. Marks has more stats on that kind of stuff that we can imagine.

Snipers not being cheap is kind of my point. I'm ok to concede teams may respect Morris more then Milsap/Carter, although I think its minimal respect difference. Is it possible you are confusing the attention teams give Marcus Morris (38% career) vs. Markief (34%)? In either event, im fine with disappointment in not chasing/landing Morris, but personally feel it is very reasonable to lose a minimum player to another contender in a big market/warm weather spot.

You're acting like I'm asking for home runs out of veteran minimum spots. I'm not. You can look at someone like Tyler Johnson last year. His production isn't amazing but he fit like a glove. He took open 3s with no hesitation and made enough so defenses wouldn't leave him.

I think we are on the same page with what would be ideal. I just still dont think those names were out there. I'm not asking you give me a huge list. but like, what realistic option for Marks where there? can you provide even a half dozen names? I struggle too. Tyler Johnson is available. He did 10 days with the spurs and sixers and neither brought him back. id be fine with him taking Carter's spot. But I think availablity/injuries with him is an issue, which is why he was replaced with Carter in the first place

Look at Edwards this year. He's not amazing but he's literally the only 3+D guy on the roster that can guard 3/4s. It's a small sample size but the offense is MUCH better with him on the floor. So yeah, if you sign one more guy like that - even if it's a worse version - it does make a difference. You completely eliminate the need for lineups with 3 non-shooters. Lineups that are handcuffing us. You make it a lot easier to play 4 shooters at once.

I agree. I dont see any Kessler Edwards' types that were available for the minimum

Guys like Niang and Batum signed for like 3 mil. Garrison Matthews signed a two way deal. Etwuan Moore. Bjelica. Kaminsky. Keef and Porter were great options. Jeff Green would've been huge for this team. I think we willingly moved on - looking for stronger defenders. Marks is one of the best GMs out there. If he was focusing on shooters and athleticism, I think he would've got them. I think he wanted toughness and size - which is why I'm critical.

Niang signed for more then the minimum. Batum resigned with an LA team. Etwuan moore is basically Jevon Carter. Kaminsky is the same level as milsap. Green isnt having a good year. his shooting came back to reality. And honestly it was smart to move on from him and tyler johnson. we needed to invest in guys who are more durable given how fragile a roster we already had.

Basically, you are upset with Marks because:
-A couple guys chose other contenders in big markets, some resigning to stay in place (Batum, Morris, Bjelica)
-Moved on from guys with availability risk (Green, Johnson)
-Didnt sign guys instead of the same level guys he did bring in (Moore/Kaminsky vs. Carter/Milsap)

I don't mean to nitpick you, especially since I think we are on the same page. It would be awesome to just have Batum or Morris here or even if one of Carter/Milsap actually panned out. But I don't think the available players were there to be had and those names we didnt get, were likey never realistic options. Batum is living in LA playing with the clips and PG/Kawhi (neither had been ruled out when he signed). Bjelicia choose GSW and likely a bigger role there then he had for us coming in. As is, Milsap wants out because of a lack of minutes.

I dont think anyone would bat an eye or be surprised if it was carter shooting well this year and moore struggling. That is more luck and maybe some of Nash misuse then it is a poor marks choice.

I also feel people are overreacting to the "Lack of shooting coming into the year"

Not many teams had as much shooting as us coming into training camp. as is mentioned above (Career % coming in):

KD - 38%
Harden 37%
Kyrie - 39 %
Harris - 44%
Mills - 39%
Carter - 37%
Milsap - 34%
Blake - 33%

That is alot of shooting. It isnt any less then we had post-Harden trade last year

KD - 38%
Harden 37%
Kyrie - 39 %
Harris - 44%
Shamet - 39%
Tyler Johnson - 36%
Chiozza - 35%
Green - 34%
Blake - 33%

The difference is basically a low level bench guy like Chiozza. And we can probably get that off the street right now (Isiaah Thomas, Tyler Johnson)

The big difference is really Carter/Milsap/Blake are shooting well below their norms (even assuming some decline) while last year Johnson/Green/Blake all shot at/above their norms.

Now, if you want to criticize marks for not fixing the problem since we know milsap/carter have stunk and blake has been a mess, thats a different story and im with you. We should have 100% been in on forbes for instance

but i dont think there is a reasonable case to criticize the shooting for the roster coming into the year

[Prokorov]

You guys are criticizing the roster construction. Were missing two starters!

Harris AND Claxton.

Mills was a great signing. Bembry has been great. All the draft picks have contributed more than expected.

What more was Marks supposed to do? This team fit very well together.

The fundamental flaw has and always will be Nash. Marks made a colossal mistake in hiring him.

I'd argue we are missing 3.5 starters

Road: KD/Harris/Claxton
Home: Kyrie/KD/Harris/Claxton

There is no criticism to be had for Marks offseason other than not replacing D'antoni on the bench next to Nash. There is room to criticise Marks for not fixing in season issue (still time for that). The Forbes things irritated me for sure. But still time and maybe he has a better move in his pocket.

Nash is a major major issue ive been harping on since 1 or 2 weeks into last year. No one love everything their coach does, especially with rotations... but the lack of game planning, the lack of attacking/exploiting opponents weaknesses, the lack of leveraging your players gravity to get easy layups/open shots, the lack of adjustments is just unacceptable at any paid coaching level. He has been gifted unreal once in a lifetime talent and getting minimum from it by putting it in situations most likely to fail.

If he had to go through what other teams do, he would have a lotto team. He has 3 stars and depth with guys like Patty and LMA and glue guys. Most teams are G-league level when 1 star goes down let alone 2. Marks still has a megastar and playoff talent even when 2 stars are out

[Jay555]

Sheesh..understandable tho.
Too much load for Harden.

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

[Jay555]

I have been saying this all the time - 76ers can sign Harden outright if it comes down to that but it’s probably still going to be S & T.

Read on Twitter

[TheNetsFan]

If Philly dumps Harris, then we really need to worry. Simmons will be easy to move.

Tone is interesting in ND land. Windrem went from saying his trustworthy source stated it is just spin to stating that one report can be dismissed, but 5 can't. He also stated that more will be dropping soon.

2 days ago, ND had an article about how many people in the organization are from "down under," with a by the way Ben Simmons is Australian born too line at the end.

If Morey were to offer what was supposedly on the table for Houston (Simmons+Thybulle+Maxey+2 1sts (don't know which)), would you take it?

[Jay555]

If Philly dumps Harris, then we really need to worry. Simmons will be easy to move.

Tone is interesting in ND land. Windrem went from saying his trustworthy source stated it is just spin to stating that one report can be dismissed, but 5 can't. He also stated that more will be dropping soon.

2 days ago, ND had an article about how many people in the organization are from "down under," with a by the way Ben Simmons is Australian born too line at the end.

If Morey were to offer what was supposedly on the table for Houston (Simmons+Thybulle+Maxey+2 1sts (don't know which)), would you take it?

Thybulle is not for sale.

[ecuhus1981]

If Philly dumps Harris, then we really need to worry. Simmons will be easy to move.

Tone is interesting in ND land. Windrem went from saying his trustworthy source stated it is just spin to stating that one report can be dismissed, but 5 can't. He also stated that more will be dropping soon.

2 days ago, ND had an article about how many people in the organization are from "down under," with a by the way Ben Simmons is Australian born too line at the end.

If Morey were to offer what was supposedly on the table for Houston (Simmons+Thybulle+Maxey+2 1sts (don't know which)), would you take it?

Your question presupposes that it is summer 2022, and Harden has informed the Nets that he will not re-sign with Brooklyn. In that scenario, IF Marks knows that Philadelphia has a way to clear Simmons + Harris while returning zero salary, thereby opening max capspace without us, then he could leave for nothing. In that plausible case, perhaps it would be cheaper for them to deal with us than to drop salary outright. And it would certainly behoove us in that scenario to take the deal.

[TheNetsFan]

If Philly dumps Harris, then we really need to worry. Simmons will be easy to move.

Tone is interesting in ND land. Windrem went from saying his trustworthy source stated it is just spin to stating that one report can be dismissed, but 5 can't. He also stated that more will be dropping soon.

2 days ago, ND had an article about how many people in the organization are from "down under," with a by the way Ben Simmons is Australian born too line at the end.

If Morey were to offer what was supposedly on the table for Houston (Simmons+Thybulle+Maxey+2 1sts (don't know which)), would you take it?

Your question presupposes that it is summer 2022, and Harden has informed the Nets that he will not re-sign with Brooklyn. In that scenario, IF Marks knows that Philadelphia has a way to clear Simmons + Harris while returning zero salary, thereby opening max capspace without us, then he could leave for nothing. In that plausible case, perhaps it would be cheaper for them to deal with us than to drop salary outright. And it would certainly behoove us in that scenario to take the deal.

Why does the above presuppose summer? If Morey finds a way to dump Harris before the deadline, then we're in a lot of danger. If Harden informs Marks now that he'd prefer to be elsewhere, and please trade me now so I can get the full Bird max with the other team, then the best deal for all parties may be to move him now.

[zimpy27]

If Philly dumps Harris, then we really need to worry. Simmons will be easy to move.

Tone is interesting in ND land. Windrem went from saying his trustworthy source stated it is just spin to stating that one report can be dismissed, but 5 can't. He also stated that more will be dropping soon.

2 days ago, ND had an article about how many people in the organization are from "down under," with a by the way Ben Simmons is Australian born too line at the end.

If Morey were to offer what was supposedly on the table for Houston (Simmons+Thybulle+Maxey+2 1sts (don't know which)), would you take it?

Your question presupposes that it is summer 2022, and Harden has informed the Nets that he will not re-sign with Brooklyn. In that scenario, IF Marks knows that Philadelphia has a way to clear Simmons + Harris while returning zero salary, thereby opening max capspace without us, then he could leave for nothing. In that plausible case, perhaps it would be cheaper for them to deal with us than to drop salary outright. And it would certainly behoove us in that scenario to take the deal.

Why does the above presuppose summer? If Morey finds a way to dump Harris before the deadline, then we're in a lot of danger. If Harden informs Marks now that he'd prefer to be elsewhere, and please trade me now so I can get the full Bird max with the other team, then the best deal for all parties may be to move him now.

The real danger move is if Philly trade Harris+Simmons for Barnes+Hali(or Davion)+Bagley+TT+picks..
That trade allows Philly to open enough cap to sign Harden outright by simply finding someone to take Barnes into capsapce. It forces Nets into an SnT for Barnes+Green so they at least get something back that can help them. In that scenario the 76ers can keep Hali(or Davion) and Bagley while getting Harden and they could still use an MLE. It's the most dangerous option.

I think Nets do better by trading Harden early for Simmons+more.

[Jay555]

If Philly dumps Harris, then we really need to worry. Simmons will be easy to move.

Tone is interesting in ND land. Windrem went from saying his trustworthy source stated it is just spin to stating that one report can be dismissed, but 5 can't. He also stated that more will be dropping soon.

2 days ago, ND had an article about how many people in the organization are from "down under," with a by the way Ben Simmons is Australian born too line at the end.

If Morey were to offer what was supposedly on the table for Houston (Simmons+Thybulle+Maxey+2 1sts (don't know which)), would you take it?

Your question presupposes that it is summer 2022, and Harden has informed the Nets that he will not re-sign with Brooklyn. In that scenario, IF Marks knows that Philadelphia has a way to clear Simmons + Harris while returning zero salary, thereby opening max capspace without us, then he could leave for nothing. In that plausible case, perhaps it would be cheaper for them to deal with us than to drop salary outright. And it would certainly behoove us in that scenario to take the deal.

Why does the above presuppose summer? If Morey finds a way to dump Harris before the deadline, then we're in a lot of danger. If Harden informs Marks now that he'd prefer to be elsewhere, and please trade me now so I can get the full Bird max with the other team, then the best deal for all parties may be to move him now.

I do not see Harden leaving this season. But the frustration is mounting for sure, imagine no KD, Harris & Kyrie when playing at home. He's a professional so I expect him to play hard, but he might get disinterested at times which is totally understandable.

[MrDollarBills]

If Philly dumps Harris, then we really need to worry. Simmons will be easy to move.

Tone is interesting in ND land. Windrem went from saying his trustworthy source stated it is just spin to stating that one report can be dismissed, but 5 can't. He also stated that more will be dropping soon.

2 days ago, ND had an article about how many people in the organization are from "down under," with a by the way Ben Simmons is Australian born too line at the end.

If Morey were to offer what was supposedly on the table for Houston (Simmons+Thybulle+Maxey+2 1sts (don't know which)), would you take it?

The way it became clear that the Sixers seem to be sure that Harden is coming means that his agent told them so.


Give me Simmons/Curry + 2 1sts. We need another shooter.

Marks needs to get off of his ass and do this trade at the deadline. Do not wait. If Harden doesn't want to be here, and I DON'T blame him one bit, we need to retool quickly.

[MrDollarBills]

Your question presupposes that it is summer 2022, and Harden has informed the Nets that he will not re-sign with Brooklyn. In that scenario, IF Marks knows that Philadelphia has a way to clear Simmons + Harris while returning zero salary, thereby opening max capspace without us, then he could leave for nothing. In that plausible case, perhaps it would be cheaper for them to deal with us than to drop salary outright. And it would certainly behoove us in that scenario to take the deal.

Why does the above presuppose summer? If Morey finds a way to dump Harris before the deadline, then we're in a lot of danger. If Harden informs Marks now that he'd prefer to be elsewhere, and please trade me now so I can get the full Bird max with the other team, then the best deal for all parties may be to move him now.

The real danger move is if Philly trade Harris+Simmons for Barnes+Hali(or Davion)+Bagley+TT+picks..
That trade allows Philly to open enough cap to sign Harden outright by simply finding someone to take Barnes into capsapce. It forces Nets into an SnT for Barnes+Green so they at least get something back that can help them. In that scenario the 76ers can keep Hali(or Davion) and Bagley while getting Harden and they could still use an MLE. It's the most dangerous option.

I think Nets do better by trading Harden early for Simmons+more.

Harden needs to be gone before the deadline. If Marks drags his feet, he should be fired.

[TheNetsFan]

If Philly dumps Harris, then we really need to worry. Simmons will be easy to move.

Tone is interesting in ND land. Windrem went from saying his trustworthy source stated it is just spin to stating that one report can be dismissed, but 5 can't. He also stated that more will be dropping soon.

2 days ago, ND had an article about how many people in the organization are from "down under," with a by the way Ben Simmons is Australian born too line at the end.

If Morey were to offer what was supposedly on the table for Houston (Simmons+Thybulle+Maxey+2 1sts (don't know which)), would you take it?

The way it became clear that the Sixers seem to be sure that Harden is coming means that his agent told them so.


Give me Simmons/Curry + 2 1sts. We need another shooter.

Marks needs to get off of his ass and do this trade at the deadline. Do not wait. If Harden doesn't want to be here, and I DON'T blame him one bit, we need to retool quickly.

I'd want Maxey back too.

[Suwanee]

Alternatively, Kyrie for Simmons + picks. Will that change Harden’s mind?