Trade Ideas

[Revenged25]

That's been my contention, that there's a potential window for us to get out of the East this year and who knows what superteam will form or arise in the future to get in our way; but it has to be the right move. Otherwise a non-splashy move may suffice to shore up our lack of a secondary ball-handler/scorer/creator. If we're going to re-sign Sexton, then a buyout or expiring player could serve as a stop-gap in that role.

C'mon Koby, go find this team's Flip Murray.

There's a difference between making a move for a player that won't significantly improve the Cavs likely playoff situation and making a move for a player that will. If the trade is for someone like LeVert, CJ, etc then they might as well just stand pat as it won't make a huge difference in the outcome of their season and will probably be more expensive options in the long run than what they would've traded away. Now if the trade is for someone like BI, Brown, etc then that's a different story.

Honestly I'd rather the Cavs hold off this year, get the playoff experience for Garland/Mobley/Okoro etc and then resign Rubio & Sexton to contracts that would still be cheaper/the same combined as someone like CJ. Cavs still get what they lacked this season after injuries but on a cheaper more long term sustainable situation and would still have those assets on better contracts for matching purposes if they so choose to.

I guess I think the gap between CJ and Sexton is much bigger than you do. But the east is close enough that if the Cavs end up with a 3-6 seed, they're probably losing in the first round. We already know we don't want any part of the Bucks, Nets, Heat or Bulls at full strength, and probably not the Sixers either if they add a Simmons trade piece. Not much experience gained there.

For any perceived difference in CJ and Sexton, which I really don't think there is much, it'll be more than made up in the contract they'll be on. For the cost of CJ, not even counting the assets we'll have to trade to get him, they'd likely be able to have both Rubio and Sexton under contract, or close to it. I mean would you really rather have CJ at 30/33/35 to take 18.5 FGA to average 21 PPG and around 4 APG or Collin Sexton at 15-20 AAV to take 16.5 FGA to average 20 PPG and end up getting around 3 APG. I think I'd rather Sexton since then you can use the 13-15 AAV difference to resign Rubio as well, not to mention not giving up the assets.

Also do you really think CJ is going to be enough to get the Cavs over the likes of Bucks, Nets, Heat, or Bulls? I don't. Not to mention CJ is 30 and will likely be declining while Sexton is still reaching his peak. Now once again a trade for someone like BI, Brown, etc I see being able to actually help the Cavs against those previously mentioned teams and are actually still rather young so they'd be able to be part of the teams run for more than a 1 year stop gap because players are hurt.

[toooskies]

There's a difference between making a move for a player that won't significantly improve the Cavs likely playoff situation and making a move for a player that will. If the trade is for someone like LeVert, CJ, etc then they might as well just stand pat as it won't make a huge difference in the outcome of their season and will probably be more expensive options in the long run than what they would've traded away. Now if the trade is for someone like BI, Brown, etc then that's a different story.

Honestly I'd rather the Cavs hold off this year, get the playoff experience for Garland/Mobley/Okoro etc and then resign Rubio & Sexton to contracts that would still be cheaper/the same combined as someone like CJ. Cavs still get what they lacked this season after injuries but on a cheaper more long term sustainable situation and would still have those assets on better contracts for matching purposes if they so choose to.

I guess I think the gap between CJ and Sexton is much bigger than you do. But the east is close enough that if the Cavs end up with a 3-6 seed, they're probably losing in the first round. We already know we don't want any part of the Bucks, Nets, Heat or Bulls at full strength, and probably not the Sixers either if they add a Simmons trade piece. Not much experience gained there.

For any perceived difference in CJ and Sexton, which I really don't think there is much, it'll be more than made up in the contract they'll be on. For the cost of CJ, not even counting the assets we'll have to trade to get him, they'd likely be able to have both Rubio and Sexton under contract, or close to it. I mean would you really rather have CJ at 30/33/35 to take 18.5 FGA to average 21 PPG and around 4 APG or Collin Sexton at 15-20 AAV to take 16.5 FGA to average 20 PPG and end up getting around 3 APG. I think I'd rather Sexton since then you can use the 13-15 AAV difference to resign Rubio as well, not to mention not giving up the assets.

Also do you really think CJ is going to be enough to get the Cavs over the likes of Bucks, Nets, Heat, or Bulls? I don't. Not to mention CJ is 30 and will likely be declining while Sexton is still reaching his peak. Now once again a trade for someone like BI, Brown, etc I see being able to actually help the Cavs against those previously mentioned teams and are actually still rather young so they'd be able to be part of the teams run for more than a 1 year stop gap because players are hurt.

The game is about more than PPG. Every impact stat has a wide gap between the two players. Sexton returning from knee surgery and Rubio returning from his second ACL repair are much bigger risks to return to their previous levels of play, let alone show any improvement next year.

McCollum might not be the ideal fit but he gives us a chance this year and he should require much less capital to acquire than Brown or Ingram types. I think he's a better option that Rubio + Sexton this year and next, and beyond that is difficult to predict. He may be 30 but he is a responsible guy who takes care of himself and hasn't shown signs of drop-off yet.

[KuruptedCav]

That's been my contention, that there's a potential window for us to get out of the East this year and who knows what superteam will form or arise in the future to get in our way; but it has to be the right move. Otherwise a non-splashy move may suffice to shore up our lack of a secondary ball-handler/scorer/creator. If we're going to re-sign Sexton, then a buyout or expiring player could serve as a stop-gap in that role.

C'mon Koby, go find this team's Flip Murray.

There's a difference between making a move for a player that won't significantly improve the Cavs likely playoff situation and making a move for a player that will. If the trade is for someone like LeVert, CJ, etc then they might as well just stand pat as it won't make a huge difference in the outcome of their season and will probably be more expensive options in the long run than what they would've traded away. Now if the trade is for someone like BI, Brown, etc then that's a different story.

Honestly I'd rather the Cavs hold off this year, get the playoff experience for Garland/Mobley/Okoro etc and then resign Rubio & Sexton to contracts that would still be cheaper/the same combined as someone like CJ. Cavs still get what they lacked this season after injuries but on a cheaper more long term sustainable situation and would still have those assets on better contracts for matching purposes if they so choose to.

I guess I think the gap between CJ and Sexton is much bigger than you do. But the east is close enough that if the Cavs end up with a 3-6 seed, they're probably losing in the first round. We already know we don't want any part of the Bucks, Nets, Heat or Bulls at full strength, and probably not the Sixers either if they add a Simmons trade piece. Not much experience gained there.

You learn more from failure than success and test the make of a man/player through adversity. Very few people succeed on their first attempt at anything worthwhile.

The NBA playoffs, more than any sport, is a different ballgame. Primarily, facing the same team serially means that they’ve actually studied and prepared and you adapt or perish. Learning what that looks and feels like let’s you practice and prepare; the taste of getting played off the court and someone ending your season is valuable.

Getting to the playoffs is the goal. Absent lightening in a bottle, the second round is peak for this team, with reinforcements, and that’s matchup dependent.

The Cavs have depth issues not starter holes. There aren’t a lot of available players that I’d start over Okoro at SG right now; and the available options at SF generally look like Cedi. So anyone brought in either needs to either see a reduced role or netted against the player whose time they are displacing. Either way, we’re overpaying, unless sending out the displaced player.


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[KuruptedCav]

I guess I think the gap between CJ and Sexton is much bigger than you do. But the east is close enough that if the Cavs end up with a 3-6 seed, they're probably losing in the first round. We already know we don't want any part of the Bucks, Nets, Heat or Bulls at full strength, and probably not the Sixers either if they add a Simmons trade piece. Not much experience gained there.

For any perceived difference in CJ and Sexton, which I really don't think there is much, it'll be more than made up in the contract they'll be on. For the cost of CJ, not even counting the assets we'll have to trade to get him, they'd likely be able to have both Rubio and Sexton under contract, or close to it. I mean would you really rather have CJ at 30/33/35 to take 18.5 FGA to average 21 PPG and around 4 APG or Collin Sexton at 15-20 AAV to take 16.5 FGA to average 20 PPG and end up getting around 3 APG. I think I'd rather Sexton since then you can use the 13-15 AAV difference to resign Rubio as well, not to mention not giving up the assets.

Also do you really think CJ is going to be enough to get the Cavs over the likes of Bucks, Nets, Heat, or Bulls? I don't. Not to mention CJ is 30 and will likely be declining while Sexton is still reaching his peak. Now once again a trade for someone like BI, Brown, etc I see being able to actually help the Cavs against those previously mentioned teams and are actually still rather young so they'd be able to be part of the teams run for more than a 1 year stop gap because players are hurt.

The game is about more than PPG. Every impact stat has a wide gap between the two players. Sexton returning from knee surgery and Rubio returning from his second ACL repair are much bigger risks to return to their previous levels of play, let alone show any improvement next year.

McCollum might not be the ideal fit but he gives us a chance this year and he should require much less capital to acquire than Brown or Ingram types. I think he's a better option that Rubio + Sexton this year and next, and beyond that is difficult to predict. He may be 30 but he is a responsible guy who takes care of himself and hasn't shown signs of drop-off yet.

The issue with McCollum is who do you send out.

Kevin Love works with salary, but, opens a huge hole at the 4/5 and the shooting nets out. Really prefer to not do that.

Rubio, Sexton, Pangos works but Portland doesn’t want Sexton for the same reason they would be trading McCollum. Anfernee Simmons & Norman Powell. So the Cavs will pay a premium to route Sexton or for Portland to treat him more like an expiring.

And what they’d probably want is Rubio, Okoro, Pangos…

Is the difference between Okoro and CJ McCollum the Eastern Conference Finals?

Now, if the Trailblazers want to make a deal that involves Rubio, some picks and Norman Powell; I’m all ears. A cost controlled SG who can guard 1-3 and shoot the three at an elite level. Yeah, sign me up.


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[toooskies]

For any perceived difference in CJ and Sexton, which I really don't think there is much, it'll be more than made up in the contract they'll be on. For the cost of CJ, not even counting the assets we'll have to trade to get him, they'd likely be able to have both Rubio and Sexton under contract, or close to it. I mean would you really rather have CJ at 30/33/35 to take 18.5 FGA to average 21 PPG and around 4 APG or Collin Sexton at 15-20 AAV to take 16.5 FGA to average 20 PPG and end up getting around 3 APG. I think I'd rather Sexton since then you can use the 13-15 AAV difference to resign Rubio as well, not to mention not giving up the assets.

Also do you really think CJ is going to be enough to get the Cavs over the likes of Bucks, Nets, Heat, or Bulls? I don't. Not to mention CJ is 30 and will likely be declining while Sexton is still reaching his peak. Now once again a trade for someone like BI, Brown, etc I see being able to actually help the Cavs against those previously mentioned teams and are actually still rather young so they'd be able to be part of the teams run for more than a 1 year stop gap because players are hurt.

The game is about more than PPG. Every impact stat has a wide gap between the two players. Sexton returning from knee surgery and Rubio returning from his second ACL repair are much bigger risks to return to their previous levels of play, let alone show any improvement next year.

McCollum might not be the ideal fit but he gives us a chance this year and he should require much less capital to acquire than Brown or Ingram types. I think he's a better option that Rubio + Sexton this year and next, and beyond that is difficult to predict. He may be 30 but he is a responsible guy who takes care of himself and hasn't shown signs of drop-off yet.

The issue with McCollum is who do you send out.

Kevin Love works with salary, but, opens a huge hole at the 4/5 and the shooting nets out. Really prefer to not do that.

Rubio, Sexton, Pangos works but Portland doesn’t want Sexton for the same reason they would be trading McCollum. Anfernee Simmons & Norman Powell. So the Cavs will pay a premium to route Sexton or for Portland to treat him more like an expiring.

And what they’d probably want is Rubio, Okoro, Pangos…

Is the difference between Okoro and CJ McCollum the Eastern Conference Finals?

Now, if the Trailblazers want to make a deal that involves Rubio, some picks and Norman Powell; I’m all ears. A cost controlled SG who can guard 1-3 and shoot the three at an elite level. Yeah, sign me up.


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I would do Rubio/Cedi/Pangos/picks. I'd consider Rubio/Markkanen. I'd consider Love, and probably throw in other assets for Robert Covington. I'd consider Rubio/Cedi/Sexton, with Sexton probably to a third team.

I would easily start McCollum over Okoro and start either Okoro or Markkanen at the 3 depending on the matchup in the playoffs. Also, Okoro would definitely still lay, so we're looking at McCollum primarily replacing the ~12 Rondo/Goodwin minutes and probably squeezing Cedi's minutes depending on if he's January Cedi or November Cedi. I think Markkanen slides to Love's role for some of his minutes if Love goes out.

So the question "Is the difference between Okoro and CJ the ECF?" a false question. It's more a question of whether CJ is enough of an upgrade over Rondo/Goodwin/Cedi. (And Cedi's shooting is fading hard.)

[JonFromVA]

The game is about more than PPG. Every impact stat has a wide gap between the two players. Sexton returning from knee surgery and Rubio returning from his second ACL repair are much bigger risks to return to their previous levels of play, let alone show any improvement next year.

McCollum might not be the ideal fit but he gives us a chance this year and he should require much less capital to acquire than Brown or Ingram types. I think he's a better option that Rubio + Sexton this year and next, and beyond that is difficult to predict. He may be 30 but he is a responsible guy who takes care of himself and hasn't shown signs of drop-off yet.

The issue with McCollum is who do you send out.

Kevin Love works with salary, but, opens a huge hole at the 4/5 and the shooting nets out. Really prefer to not do that.

Rubio, Sexton, Pangos works but Portland doesn’t want Sexton for the same reason they would be trading McCollum. Anfernee Simmons & Norman Powell. So the Cavs will pay a premium to route Sexton or for Portland to treat him more like an expiring.

And what they’d probably want is Rubio, Okoro, Pangos…

Is the difference between Okoro and CJ McCollum the Eastern Conference Finals?

Now, if the Trailblazers want to make a deal that involves Rubio, some picks and Norman Powell; I’m all ears. A cost controlled SG who can guard 1-3 and shoot the three at an elite level. Yeah, sign me up.


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I would do Rubio/Cedi/Pangos/picks. I'd consider Rubio/Markkanen. I'd consider Love, and probably throw in other assets for Robert Covington. I'd consider Rubio/Cedi/Sexton, with Sexton probably to a third team.

I would easily start McCollum over Okoro and start either Okoro or Markkanen at the 3 depending on the matchup in the playoffs. Also, Okoro would definitely still lay, so we're looking at McCollum primarily replacing the ~12 Rondo/Goodwin minutes and probably squeezing Cedi's minutes depending on if he's January Cedi or November Cedi. I think Markkanen slides to Love's role for some of his minutes if Love goes out.

So the question "Is the difference between Okoro and CJ the ECF?" a false question. It's more a question of whether CJ is enough of an upgrade over Rondo/Goodwin/Cedi. (And Cedi's shooting is fading hard.)

You make some good arguments, but the rub is CJ's salary is escalating to $35M, he's 30 years old, his career TS% is only 55% and down this season, but he takes 18 shots a game. He's 6'3" but his wingspan is just 6'5" and he presumably still expects to start. So he's like an expensive/older/polished version of Sexton --- who as it turns out may become available at some point during the playoffs.

I'm willing to consider anything if the cost to acquire is cheap, but Isaac at SG has been effective, Lauri as part of the triple tower lineup has been effective, Kevin coming off the bench has been actually useful. Even when Cedi's shot is off, he's still 6'8".

So, short of a transformational trade, I'm hoping we can find someone(s) a lot less expensive to replace Rubio as backup PG and secondary scorer/creator/shooter.

[mcfly1204]

Honestly, I do not see McCollum as a viable trade target for Cleveland. I am not interested in giving much, short of cap space\expirings, and I think another team will come along with a better offer. I'd much rather just keep Sexton around, especially if you have any intention of starting CJ beyond this season. Plus, the recent reports are saying Sexton may be good to go for the Playoffs this season...

[toooskies]

The issue with McCollum is who do you send out.

Kevin Love works with salary, but, opens a huge hole at the 4/5 and the shooting nets out. Really prefer to not do that.

Rubio, Sexton, Pangos works but Portland doesn’t want Sexton for the same reason they would be trading McCollum. Anfernee Simmons & Norman Powell. So the Cavs will pay a premium to route Sexton or for Portland to treat him more like an expiring.

And what they’d probably want is Rubio, Okoro, Pangos…

Is the difference between Okoro and CJ McCollum the Eastern Conference Finals?

Now, if the Trailblazers want to make a deal that involves Rubio, some picks and Norman Powell; I’m all ears. A cost controlled SG who can guard 1-3 and shoot the three at an elite level. Yeah, sign me up.


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I would do Rubio/Cedi/Pangos/picks. I'd consider Rubio/Markkanen. I'd consider Love, and probably throw in other assets for Robert Covington. I'd consider Rubio/Cedi/Sexton, with Sexton probably to a third team.

I would easily start McCollum over Okoro and start either Okoro or Markkanen at the 3 depending on the matchup in the playoffs. Also, Okoro would definitely still lay, so we're looking at McCollum primarily replacing the ~12 Rondo/Goodwin minutes and probably squeezing Cedi's minutes depending on if he's January Cedi or November Cedi. I think Markkanen slides to Love's role for some of his minutes if Love goes out.

So the question "Is the difference between Okoro and CJ the ECF?" a false question. It's more a question of whether CJ is enough of an upgrade over Rondo/Goodwin/Cedi. (And Cedi's shooting is fading hard.)

You make some good arguments, but the rub is CJ's salary is escalating to $35M, he's 30 years old, his career TS% is only 55% and down this season, but he takes 18 shots a game. He's 6'3" but his wingspan is just 6'5" and he presumably still expects to start. So he's like an expensive/older/polished version of Sexton --- who as it turns out may become available at some point during the playoffs.

I'm willing to consider anything if the cost to acquire is cheap, but Isaac at SG has been effective, Lauri as part of the triple tower lineup has been effective, Kevin coming off the bench has been actually useful. Even when Cedi's shot is off, he's still 6'8".

So, short of a transformational trade, I'm hoping we can find someone(s) a lot less expensive to replace Rubio as backup PG and secondary scorer/creator/shooter.

Well, name a guy who's low-cost, shoots better than McCollum, and can both get his own shot and facilitate reasonably well, and is available for expiring salary and a 1st and a few 2nds at most? I don't think that guy is out there. You can cross a few things off that list of requirements and not find that guy.

I'm just saying that going into the playoffs playing a replacement-level PG when Garland sits is not going to go well. Only having one ballhandler above replacement level is not going to go well. We're already playing for next year if we don't address that.

[jbk1234]

Honestly, I do not see McCollum as a viable trade target for Cleveland. I am not interested in giving much, short of cap space\expirings, and I think another team will come along with a better offer. I'd much rather just keep Sexton around, especially if you have any intention of starting CJ beyond this season. Plus, the recent reports are saying Sexton may be good to go for the Playoffs this season...

There's a part of me that would prefer Hield due to age and cap constraints, but CJ can create offense and space the floor, which when combined are really valuable skill sets. I'm not sure Hield is a legitimate secondary ball handler who can create his own offense. The biggest issue with Sexton going forward on this roster is where he likes to take most of his shots. If an issue arises where he and Mobley are trying to occupy the same space on the floor offensively, then there's shouldn't even be a debate as to which one needs to go. I think people are overly the dismissive of the risks of handing Sexton a big extension. If it doesn't work out, it could really not work out, and if he's attached to a big contract, we'll have to attach value just to move him.

[JonFromVA]

I would do Rubio/Cedi/Pangos/picks. I'd consider Rubio/Markkanen. I'd consider Love, and probably throw in other assets for Robert Covington. I'd consider Rubio/Cedi/Sexton, with Sexton probably to a third team.

I would easily start McCollum over Okoro and start either Okoro or Markkanen at the 3 depending on the matchup in the playoffs. Also, Okoro would definitely still lay, so we're looking at McCollum primarily replacing the ~12 Rondo/Goodwin minutes and probably squeezing Cedi's minutes depending on if he's January Cedi or November Cedi. I think Markkanen slides to Love's role for some of his minutes if Love goes out.

So the question "Is the difference between Okoro and CJ the ECF?" a false question. It's more a question of whether CJ is enough of an upgrade over Rondo/Goodwin/Cedi. (And Cedi's shooting is fading hard.)

You make some good arguments, but the rub is CJ's salary is escalating to $35M, he's 30 years old, his career TS% is only 55% and down this season, but he takes 18 shots a game. He's 6'3" but his wingspan is just 6'5" and he presumably still expects to start. So he's like an expensive/older/polished version of Sexton --- who as it turns out may become available at some point during the playoffs.

I'm willing to consider anything if the cost to acquire is cheap, but Isaac at SG has been effective, Lauri as part of the triple tower lineup has been effective, Kevin coming off the bench has been actually useful. Even when Cedi's shot is off, he's still 6'8".

So, short of a transformational trade, I'm hoping we can find someone(s) a lot less expensive to replace Rubio as backup PG and secondary scorer/creator/shooter.

Well, name a guy who's low-cost, shoots better than McCollum, and can both get his own shot and facilitate reasonably well, and is available for expiring salary and a 1st and a few 2nds at most? I don't think that guy is out there. You can cross a few things off that list of requirements and not find that guy.

I'm just saying that going into the playoffs playing a replacement-level PG when Garland sits is not going to go well. Only having one ballhandler above replacement level is not going to go well. We're already playing for next year if we don't address that.

Not a fan, but Boston is only paying Dennis Schroeder $5M this season, he's expiring, and they have some motivation to move him to open up minutes for Pritchard. Dennis is shooting 35.7% on 4.1 3pa/game with a 54.6 TS% and he's used to coming off the bench.

So, lower 3p%, but higher TS% and massive difference in salary.

We don't have to do it all with just one player.... and it doesn't have to be anyone on the lips of the rumor mongers.

The Cavs actually had Cam Payne on a 10-day contract back in 2019 (played pretty well for us too), the Sun's picked him up and he's been a difference maker as CP3's backup since. Sort of thing the Cavs were trying to find with Goodwin who's struggled to shoot the ball, but his A/TO ratio is nearly 5:1 (coaches love backup points who don't turn the ball over).

But hey, if the Cavs would rather go big name hunting than kick tires on 10-day contracts, Eric Gordon is only on the books guaranteed for next season at $19.5M.

The big question is will Houston settle for the best offer and will the Cavs end up being the team that offers it.

[toooskies]

You make some good arguments, but the rub is CJ's salary is escalating to $35M, he's 30 years old, his career TS% is only 55% and down this season, but he takes 18 shots a game. He's 6'3" but his wingspan is just 6'5" and he presumably still expects to start. So he's like an expensive/older/polished version of Sexton --- who as it turns out may become available at some point during the playoffs.

I'm willing to consider anything if the cost to acquire is cheap, but Isaac at SG has been effective, Lauri as part of the triple tower lineup has been effective, Kevin coming off the bench has been actually useful. Even when Cedi's shot is off, he's still 6'8".

So, short of a transformational trade, I'm hoping we can find someone(s) a lot less expensive to replace Rubio as backup PG and secondary scorer/creator/shooter.

Well, name a guy who's low-cost, shoots better than McCollum, and can both get his own shot and facilitate reasonably well, and is available for expiring salary and a 1st and a few 2nds at most? I don't think that guy is out there. You can cross a few things off that list of requirements and not find that guy.

I'm just saying that going into the playoffs playing a replacement-level PG when Garland sits is not going to go well. Only having one ballhandler above replacement level is not going to go well. We're already playing for next year if we don't address that.

Not a fan, but Boston is only paying Dennis Schroeder $5M this season, he's expiring, and they have some motivation to move him to open up minutes for Pritchard. Dennis is shooting 35.7% on 4.1 3pa/game with a 54.6 TS% and he's used to coming off the bench.

So, lower 3p%, but higher TS% and massive difference in salary.

We don't have to do it all with just one player.... and it doesn't have to be anyone on the lips of the rumor mongers.

The Cavs actually had Cam Payne on a 10-day contract back in 2019 (played pretty well for us too), the Sun's picked him up and he's been a difference maker as CP3's backup since. Sort of thing the Cavs were trying to find with Goodwin who's struggled to shoot the ball, but his A/TO ratio is nearly 5:1 (coaches love backup points who don't turn the ball over).

But hey, if the Cavs would rather go big name hunting than kick tires on 10-day contracts, Eric Gordon is only on the books guaranteed for next season at $19.5M.

The big question is will Houston settle for the best offer and will the Cavs end up being the team that offers it.

Schroder for the rest of the season would be a great move but requires some dancing on the Cavs' side to take him while getting under the tax. I'm not sure the Celtics just give him up given he's playing 30 minutes a game for them. (If they wanted to give Pritchard more run, they'd just cut Schroder's minutes.) Cory Joseph might be a more reasonable pick-up?

I like Goodwin, but he's a replacement-level guy. So is Rondo. Either of them could show something, but they're clearly the weakest player in a hypothetical 8-man playoff rotation for the Cavs. (I think the Cavs need to promote Goodwin to a real roster spot to play him in the playoffs.) The Suns/Payne comparison is a great optimistic take, but he also surprised the Suns by how well he played. He probably surprised himself. You definitely can't count on Goodwin making that leap or seeing "playoff Rondo" come back.

Gordon isn't a passer, he's pretty much taking minutes from Cedi in the playoffs. (Which I'm fine with but doesn't take Rondo/Goodwin off the court.)

[jbk1234]

Well, name a guy who's low-cost, shoots better than McCollum, and can both get his own shot and facilitate reasonably well, and is available for expiring salary and a 1st and a few 2nds at most? I don't think that guy is out there. You can cross a few things off that list of requirements and not find that guy.

I'm just saying that going into the playoffs playing a replacement-level PG when Garland sits is not going to go well. Only having one ballhandler above replacement level is not going to go well. We're already playing for next year if we don't address that.

Not a fan, but Boston is only paying Dennis Schroeder $5M this season, he's expiring, and they have some motivation to move him to open up minutes for Pritchard. Dennis is shooting 35.7% on 4.1 3pa/game with a 54.6 TS% and he's used to coming off the bench.

So, lower 3p%, but higher TS% and massive difference in salary.

We don't have to do it all with just one player.... and it doesn't have to be anyone on the lips of the rumor mongers.

The Cavs actually had Cam Payne on a 10-day contract back in 2019 (played pretty well for us too), the Sun's picked him up and he's been a difference maker as CP3's backup since. Sort of thing the Cavs were trying to find with Goodwin who's struggled to shoot the ball, but his A/TO ratio is nearly 5:1 (coaches love backup points who don't turn the ball over).

But hey, if the Cavs would rather go big name hunting than kick tires on 10-day contracts, Eric Gordon is only on the books guaranteed for next season at $19.5M.

The big question is will Houston settle for the best offer and will the Cavs end up being the team that offers it.

Schroder for the rest of the season would be a great move but requires some dancing on the Cavs' side to take him while getting under the tax. I'm not sure the Celtics just give him up given he's playing 30 minutes a game for them. (If they wanted to give Pritchard more run, they'd just cut Schroder's minutes.) Cory Joseph might be a more reasonable pick-up?

I like Goodwin, but he's a replacement-level guy. So is Rondo. Either of them could show something, but they're clearly the weakest player in a hypothetical 8-man playoff rotation for the Cavs. (I think the Cavs need to promote Goodwin to a real roster spot to play him in the playoffs.) The Suns/Payne comparison is a great optimistic take, but he also surprised the Suns by how well he played. He probably surprised himself. You definitely can't count on Goodwin making that leap or seeing "playoff Rondo" come back.

Gordon isn't a passer, he's pretty much taking minutes from Cedi in the playoffs. (Which I'm fine with but doesn't take Rondo/Goodwin off the court.)

Schroder sucks. LeVert sucks. I'm team no trade if those are the guys are coming back. I don't want poor defenders, inefficient, ball-dominant type players coming back. Neither of those guys shoot the three all that well either. If we're going to hand the keys in the second unit to someone who's going to hijack the offense, let's just hope Sexton comes back before the postseason. At least he can do so somewhat efficiently.

[JonFromVA]

Well, name a guy who's low-cost, shoots better than McCollum, and can both get his own shot and facilitate reasonably well, and is available for expiring salary and a 1st and a few 2nds at most? I don't think that guy is out there. You can cross a few things off that list of requirements and not find that guy.

I'm just saying that going into the playoffs playing a replacement-level PG when Garland sits is not going to go well. Only having one ballhandler above replacement level is not going to go well. We're already playing for next year if we don't address that.

Not a fan, but Boston is only paying Dennis Schroeder $5M this season, he's expiring, and they have some motivation to move him to open up minutes for Pritchard. Dennis is shooting 35.7% on 4.1 3pa/game with a 54.6 TS% and he's used to coming off the bench.

So, lower 3p%, but higher TS% and massive difference in salary.

We don't have to do it all with just one player.... and it doesn't have to be anyone on the lips of the rumor mongers.

The Cavs actually had Cam Payne on a 10-day contract back in 2019 (played pretty well for us too), the Sun's picked him up and he's been a difference maker as CP3's backup since. Sort of thing the Cavs were trying to find with Goodwin who's struggled to shoot the ball, but his A/TO ratio is nearly 5:1 (coaches love backup points who don't turn the ball over).

But hey, if the Cavs would rather go big name hunting than kick tires on 10-day contracts, Eric Gordon is only on the books guaranteed for next season at $19.5M.

The big question is will Houston settle for the best offer and will the Cavs end up being the team that offers it.

Schroder for the rest of the season would be a great move but requires some dancing on the Cavs' side to take him while getting under the tax. I'm not sure the Celtics just give him up given he's playing 30 minutes a game for them. (If they wanted to give Pritchard more run, they'd just cut Schroder's minutes.) Cory Joseph might be a more reasonable pick-up?

I like Goodwin, but he's a replacement-level guy. So is Rondo. Either of them could show something, but they're clearly the weakest player in a hypothetical 8-man playoff rotation for the Cavs. (I think the Cavs need to promote Goodwin to a real roster spot to play him in the playoffs.) The Suns/Payne comparison is a great optimistic take, but he also surprised the Suns by how well he played. He probably surprised himself. You definitely can't count on Goodwin making that leap or seeing "playoff Rondo" come back.

Gordon isn't a passer, he's pretty much taking minutes from Cedi in the playoffs. (Which I'm fine with but doesn't take Rondo/Goodwin off the court.)

Gordon has always been a combo-guard and I would hope he could be a secondary playmaker for Garland or a backup point. If that's not something he does anymore? Scratch him off the list, but if he can ... we'd need someone to eat up the 8 to 16 minutes that DG isn't on the floor.

Anyway, there's a reason Altman is getting paid the big bucks. Hopefully he has a creative solution and at the very least gives JBB some options. As always, it sure would be nice if we didn't have to trade offense for defense.

[LivingLegend]

For any perceived difference in CJ and Sexton, which I really don't think there is much, it'll be more than made up in the contract they'll be on. For the cost of CJ, not even counting the assets we'll have to trade to get him, they'd likely be able to have both Rubio and Sexton under contract, or close to it. I mean would you really rather have CJ at 30/33/35 to take 18.5 FGA to average 21 PPG and around 4 APG or Collin Sexton at 15-20 AAV to take 16.5 FGA to average 20 PPG and end up getting around 3 APG. I think I'd rather Sexton since then you can use the 13-15 AAV difference to resign Rubio as well, not to mention not giving up the assets.

Also do you really think CJ is going to be enough to get the Cavs over the likes of Bucks, Nets, Heat, or Bulls? I don't. Not to mention CJ is 30 and will likely be declining while Sexton is still reaching his peak. Now once again a trade for someone like BI, Brown, etc I see being able to actually help the Cavs against those previously mentioned teams and are actually still rather young so they'd be able to be part of the teams run for more than a 1 year stop gap because players are hurt.

The game is about more than PPG. Every impact stat has a wide gap between the two players. Sexton returning from knee surgery and Rubio returning from his second ACL repair are much bigger risks to return to their previous levels of play, let alone show any improvement next year.

McCollum might not be the ideal fit but he gives us a chance this year and he should require much less capital to acquire than Brown or Ingram types. I think he's a better option that Rubio + Sexton this year and next, and beyond that is difficult to predict. He may be 30 but he is a responsible guy who takes care of himself and hasn't shown signs of drop-off yet.

The issue with McCollum is who do you send out.

Kevin Love works with salary, but, opens a huge hole at the 4/5 and the shooting nets out. Really prefer to not do that.

Rubio, Sexton, Pangos works but Portland doesn’t want Sexton for the same reason they would be trading McCollum. Anfernee Simmons & Norman Powell. So the Cavs will pay a premium to route Sexton or for Portland to treat him more like an expiring.

And what they’d probably want is Rubio, Okoro, Pangos…

Is the difference between Okoro and CJ McCollum the Eastern Conference Finals?

Now, if the Trailblazers want to make a deal that involves Rubio, some picks and Norman Powell; I’m all ears. A cost controlled SG who can guard 1-3 and shoot the three at an elite level. Yeah, sign me up.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

Well much like the Allen trade, a 3rd team would probably need to be involved for CJ without having to send out Love (which is not ideal anyways)

With CJ, you basically get a Collin Sexton who is fully mentally developed with BBIQ. If we are looking for a guy who can compliment Garland as the secondary ball handler/scorer who can create his own shot--CJ is it.

If you get CJ on this team, you basically build the team the Blazers have always wanted to become, but never did because of Mobley/Allen/Love/Lauri being the frontcourt players.

If the Blazers are looking to rebuild, you might be able to snag him cheaper than expected and you have assets that a rebuilding team would want. A young talented player to build with (Sexton), cap relief (Rubio) and draft assets (2022 FRP). I wonder if those 3 assets along with a 3rd team being involved to facilitate could net the Cavs both RoCo and McCollum. I would also say if you get CJ then you are setup for the right now and for the future as good as any team in the EC.

However, if you want to go the cheaper route then target Gordon and retain some assets. The Rockets owe us a little favor anyways by giving them KPJ for free.

[toooskies]

Not a fan, but Boston is only paying Dennis Schroeder $5M this season, he's expiring, and they have some motivation to move him to open up minutes for Pritchard. Dennis is shooting 35.7% on 4.1 3pa/game with a 54.6 TS% and he's used to coming off the bench.

So, lower 3p%, but higher TS% and massive difference in salary.

We don't have to do it all with just one player.... and it doesn't have to be anyone on the lips of the rumor mongers.

The Cavs actually had Cam Payne on a 10-day contract back in 2019 (played pretty well for us too), the Sun's picked him up and he's been a difference maker as CP3's backup since. Sort of thing the Cavs were trying to find with Goodwin who's struggled to shoot the ball, but his A/TO ratio is nearly 5:1 (coaches love backup points who don't turn the ball over).

But hey, if the Cavs would rather go big name hunting than kick tires on 10-day contracts, Eric Gordon is only on the books guaranteed for next season at $19.5M.

The big question is will Houston settle for the best offer and will the Cavs end up being the team that offers it.

Schroder for the rest of the season would be a great move but requires some dancing on the Cavs' side to take him while getting under the tax. I'm not sure the Celtics just give him up given he's playing 30 minutes a game for them. (If they wanted to give Pritchard more run, they'd just cut Schroder's minutes.) Cory Joseph might be a more reasonable pick-up?

I like Goodwin, but he's a replacement-level guy. So is Rondo. Either of them could show something, but they're clearly the weakest player in a hypothetical 8-man playoff rotation for the Cavs. (I think the Cavs need to promote Goodwin to a real roster spot to play him in the playoffs.) The Suns/Payne comparison is a great optimistic take, but he also surprised the Suns by how well he played. He probably surprised himself. You definitely can't count on Goodwin making that leap or seeing "playoff Rondo" come back.

Gordon isn't a passer, he's pretty much taking minutes from Cedi in the playoffs. (Which I'm fine with but doesn't take Rondo/Goodwin off the court.)

Gordon has always been a combo-guard and I would hope he could be a secondary playmaker for Garland or a backup point. If that's not something he does anymore? Scratch him off the list, but if he can ... we'd need someone to eat up the 8 to 16 minutes that DG isn't on the floor.

Anyway, there's a reason Altman is getting paid the big bucks. Hopefully he has a creative solution and at the very least gives JBB some options. As always, it sure would be nice if we didn't have to trade offense for defense.

Gordon has never had a 2:1 A/TO ratio in his career. You can call him a secondary playmaker, but he's not a PG.

[jbk1234]

The game is about more than PPG. Every impact stat has a wide gap between the two players. Sexton returning from knee surgery and Rubio returning from his second ACL repair are much bigger risks to return to their previous levels of play, let alone show any improvement next year.

McCollum might not be the ideal fit but he gives us a chance this year and he should require much less capital to acquire than Brown or Ingram types. I think he's a better option that Rubio + Sexton this year and next, and beyond that is difficult to predict. He may be 30 but he is a responsible guy who takes care of himself and hasn't shown signs of drop-off yet.

The issue with McCollum is who do you send out.

Kevin Love works with salary, but, opens a huge hole at the 4/5 and the shooting nets out. Really prefer to not do that.

Rubio, Sexton, Pangos works but Portland doesn’t want Sexton for the same reason they would be trading McCollum. Anfernee Simmons & Norman Powell. So the Cavs will pay a premium to route Sexton or for Portland to treat him more like an expiring.

And what they’d probably want is Rubio, Okoro, Pangos…

Is the difference between Okoro and CJ McCollum the Eastern Conference Finals?

Now, if the Trailblazers want to make a deal that involves Rubio, some picks and Norman Powell; I’m all ears. A cost controlled SG who can guard 1-3 and shoot the three at an elite level. Yeah, sign me up.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

Well much like the Allen trade, a 3rd team would probably need to be involved for CJ without having to send out Love (which is not ideal anyways)

With CJ, you basically get a Collin Sexton who is fully mentally developed with BBIQ. If we are looking for a guy who can compliment Garland as the secondary ball handler/scorer who can create his own shot--CJ is it.

If you get CJ on this team, you basically build the team the Blazers have always wanted to become, but never did because of Mobley/Allen/Love/Lauri being the frontcourt players.

If the Blazers are looking to rebuild, you might be able to snag him cheaper than expected and you have assets that a rebuilding team would want. A young talented player to build with (Sexton), cap relief (Rubio) and draft assets (2022 FRP). I wonder if those 3 assets along with a 3rd team being involved to facilitate could net the Cavs both RoCo and McCollum. I would also say if you get CJ then you are setup for the right now and for the future as good as any team in the EC.

However, if you want to go the cheaper route then target Gordon and retain some assets. The Rockets owe us a little favor anyways by giving them KPJ for free.

I think if you trade for CJ, you trade for CJ and RoCo and Love absolutely has to go out attached to either Rubio or Cedi. Lauri and Okoro get moved to the second unit. RoCo and CJ start. But I don't see CJ starting next to either Lauri or Okoro.

[LivingLegend]

The issue with McCollum is who do you send out.

Kevin Love works with salary, but, opens a huge hole at the 4/5 and the shooting nets out. Really prefer to not do that.

Rubio, Sexton, Pangos works but Portland doesn’t want Sexton for the same reason they would be trading McCollum. Anfernee Simmons & Norman Powell. So the Cavs will pay a premium to route Sexton or for Portland to treat him more like an expiring.

And what they’d probably want is Rubio, Okoro, Pangos…

Is the difference between Okoro and CJ McCollum the Eastern Conference Finals?

Now, if the Trailblazers want to make a deal that involves Rubio, some picks and Norman Powell; I’m all ears. A cost controlled SG who can guard 1-3 and shoot the three at an elite level. Yeah, sign me up.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

Well much like the Allen trade, a 3rd team would probably need to be involved for CJ without having to send out Love (which is not ideal anyways)

With CJ, you basically get a Collin Sexton who is fully mentally developed with BBIQ. If we are looking for a guy who can compliment Garland as the secondary ball handler/scorer who can create his own shot--CJ is it.

If you get CJ on this team, you basically build the team the Blazers have always wanted to become, but never did because of Mobley/Allen/Love/Lauri being the frontcourt players.

If the Blazers are looking to rebuild, you might be able to snag him cheaper than expected and you have assets that a rebuilding team would want. A young talented player to build with (Sexton), cap relief (Rubio) and draft assets (2022 FRP). I wonder if those 3 assets along with a 3rd team being involved to facilitate could net the Cavs both RoCo and McCollum. I would also say if you get CJ then you are setup for the right now and for the future as good as any team in the EC.

However, if you want to go the cheaper route then target Gordon and retain some assets. The Rockets owe us a little favor anyways by giving them KPJ for free.

I think if you trade for CJ, you trade for CJ and RoCo and Love absolutely has to go out attached to either Rubio or Cedi. Lauri and Okoro get moved to the second unit. RoCo and CJ start. But I don't see CJ starting next to either Lauri or Okoro.

I dont see why Love has to be involved. The Blazers wouldnt want him anyways if the whole purpose of trading CJ is to start a rebuild--they dont need a cap space hog veteran on their roster like Love into next year since they would also likely be trading away Lillard in this scenario. Rubio, yes because of his expiring but not Love.

This is where a 3rd team would be attached to help match salaries to make up that salary gap between Rubio/Sexton and McCollum. Somebody like the Knicks with Fournier to open up space for Reddish.

[JonFromVA]

Schroder for the rest of the season would be a great move but requires some dancing on the Cavs' side to take him while getting under the tax. I'm not sure the Celtics just give him up given he's playing 30 minutes a game for them. (If they wanted to give Pritchard more run, they'd just cut Schroder's minutes.) Cory Joseph might be a more reasonable pick-up?

I like Goodwin, but he's a replacement-level guy. So is Rondo. Either of them could show something, but they're clearly the weakest player in a hypothetical 8-man playoff rotation for the Cavs. (I think the Cavs need to promote Goodwin to a real roster spot to play him in the playoffs.) The Suns/Payne comparison is a great optimistic take, but he also surprised the Suns by how well he played. He probably surprised himself. You definitely can't count on Goodwin making that leap or seeing "playoff Rondo" come back.

Gordon isn't a passer, he's pretty much taking minutes from Cedi in the playoffs. (Which I'm fine with but doesn't take Rondo/Goodwin off the court.)

Gordon has always been a combo-guard and I would hope he could be a secondary playmaker for Garland or a backup point. If that's not something he does anymore? Scratch him off the list, but if he can ... we'd need someone to eat up the 8 to 16 minutes that DG isn't on the floor.

Anyway, there's a reason Altman is getting paid the big bucks. Hopefully he has a creative solution and at the very least gives JBB some options. As always, it sure would be nice if we didn't have to trade offense for defense.

Gordon has never had a 2:1 A/TO ratio in his career. You can call him a secondary playmaker, but he's not a PG.

The way I worded that was confusing, but yes, my only expectations if we got Gordon was that he be able to fill the role of secondary playmaker as well as shooter/scorer. His defense is still a question mark (same as for CJ) unless he finds some new motivation to try, but it's easier to cope with that if he comes off the bench.

In the end it comes down to what these teams are willing to settle for.

[toooskies]

Honestly if we don't make a big move the best idea might be to wait and see if Gary Harris and Goran Dragic get bought out.

[jbk1234]

Well much like the Allen trade, a 3rd team would probably need to be involved for CJ without having to send out Love (which is not ideal anyways)

With CJ, you basically get a Collin Sexton who is fully mentally developed with BBIQ. If we are looking for a guy who can compliment Garland as the secondary ball handler/scorer who can create his own shot--CJ is it.

If you get CJ on this team, you basically build the team the Blazers have always wanted to become, but never did because of Mobley/Allen/Love/Lauri being the frontcourt players.

If the Blazers are looking to rebuild, you might be able to snag him cheaper than expected and you have assets that a rebuilding team would want. A young talented player to build with (Sexton), cap relief (Rubio) and draft assets (2022 FRP). I wonder if those 3 assets along with a 3rd team being involved to facilitate could net the Cavs both RoCo and McCollum. I would also say if you get CJ then you are setup for the right now and for the future as good as any team in the EC.

However, if you want to go the cheaper route then target Gordon and retain some assets. The Rockets owe us a little favor anyways by giving them KPJ for free.

I think if you trade for CJ, you trade for CJ and RoCo and Love absolutely has to go out attached to either Rubio or Cedi. Lauri and Okoro get moved to the second unit. RoCo and CJ start. But I don't see CJ starting next to either Lauri or Okoro.

I dont see why Love has to be involved. The Blazers wouldnt want him anyways if the whole purpose of trading CJ is to start a rebuild--they dont need a cap space hog veteran on their roster like Love into next year since they would also likely be trading away Lillard in this scenario. Rubio, yes because of his expiring but not Love.

This is where a 3rd team would be attached to help match salaries to make up that salary gap between Rubio/Sexton and McCollum. Somebody like the Knicks with Fournier to open up space for Reddish.

Okay, regardless of how many teams you involve, the Cavs have to send out as much salary as they take back for the trade to be legal (technically they can take back 125% of what they send out but that would put them into the tax which would be dumb IMO). CJ alone makes $30.8M. If you include RoCo's expiring, and you should if CJ is going to start here, you're looking at just under $44M in salary you have to send out.

Rubio makes $17.8M. So if you don't send Love, you have to send out Cedi and Sexton just to trade for CJ and stay under the tax, maybe Cedi and Rubio is technically legal, but you really do need another move so you stay out of the tax. Now you could send Sexton to OKC, who could send an asset back to Portland and everyone stays out of the tax, but that's the only other real alternative. But in this scenario you're not getting RoCo, and if you're not getting RoCo as well, I really do question CJ's fit alongside Garland and our current options at the 3.

Unless they're idiots, the Blazers would clearly prefer Love, who plays a position of need for them and has one remaining on his deal, to the three additional years Fournier, who plays their deepest position. No one wants Fournier on that contract right now. The Blazers essentially break even this season, save $4M next year, and save $35M in CJ"s final year by swapping Love for CJ.