Former Miami Dolphins HC Brian Flores SUES the NFL FOR RACIAL DISCRIMINATION;owner offered HC $100k per loss 4 draft

[AbeVigodaLive]

Yes, I think if the Giants were an equal opportunity employer instead of conducting token interviews for minorities he would not have sued

The Giants had 6 coaches lined up for interviews

3 white coaches
3 black coaches

Leslie Fraizer (Black) and Brain Daboll (White) were the two that got multiple interviews.

So ya they didn’t need to interview Flores for him to be a token minority to pass the Rooney Rule.

Maybe just maybe they really liked Daboll from his interview (with he had prior to their scheduled one with Flores).

Like mentioned above, Rooney Rule is for two external minority candidates. They did use Flores to check the box.

Relevant or not... I did find it amusing.

From Wikipedia:
"... To fulfill the requirements of this rule, many teams interview non-white coaches that have been around the league for years and have had previously unsuccessful stints as head coaches, such as Marvin Lewis."

-----------------

Leslie Frazier had the worst W/L record (by far) of any of the Minnesota Vikings past 8 coaches... dating back to 1984. But he has been around for awhile... coaching for 7 different teams.

He certainly fits the mold.

[Pharmcat]

The Texans are the worst run team in the NFL where a pastor has the ear of the owner. They’re not a professional organization and the way they’re run doesn’t reflect how the other teams are run. They’re like King Tommen who has the High Sparrow in charge.

The Bears haven’t been the best when it comes to football operations, but the Bears just hired a black GM who hired a white coach. Did racism play a favor in hiring the white coach?

It’s difficult to say, and the best coach the Bears have had in my lifetime is Lovie, and I disagreed with firing him but I don’t think bringing him back now is the right now.

When was the last time we had a black gm and black coach pairing? I’d have to look that up. But it seems like black people in authority position don’t help other blacks out in the nfl. Look at tomlin and how little diversity he had on his coordinators. I wonder if they feel like they will get blowback so they don’t do it, but is something else to consider.

The Dolphins did. Brian Flores was hired by Chris Grier.

Ironically, Flores was fired most likely over a power struggle with Grier. Flowers wanted more power. The owner kept the GM and fired Flores.

Ah thanks didn’t remember that one. I stand corrected on that one but tomlin one still is true I believe

[Pharmcat]

I'm still not understanding this. So if he would have gotten the Giants job - he wouldn't have filed the lawsuit and exposed Ross? Or if he didn't get any of the other 3 jobs he interviewed for?

And now all of a sudden he's playing the victim? Come on...

Yes, I think if the Giants were an equal opportunity employer instead of conducting token interviews for minorities he would not have sued

The Giants had 6 coaches lined up for interviews

3 white coaches
3 black coaches

Leslie Fraizer (Black) and Brain Daboll (White) were the two that got multiple interviews.

So ya they didn’t need to interview Flores for him to be a token minority to pass the Rooney Rule.

Maybe just maybe they really liked Daboll from his interview (with he had prior to their scheduled one with Flores).

Isn’t it 2 external minority coaches for Rooney rule?

[Johnny Bball]

Jesus that's a hell of a reach

Not at all, you have people itt being willfully obtuse about just hiring the "best candidate" when it's statistically impossible for 30 out of 32 head coaches to be white in a sport that's played 70% by minorities.

70% of NFL players may be minorities, but minorities, by definition, make up less of the population. The American population is only 13.4% black, and there are lots of white coaches who never played in the NFL. There are way more white football coaches than black football coaches in America because there’s way more white people in America than black people. 75% of the American population is white, including Hispanic white. 60% of the population is non Hispanic white.

I have no doubt there are some racists in the NFL, but
I’m not sure if this lawsuit will prove that. The Bears just hired a black GM who hired a white coach. Did racism play a role in the Bears deciding to hire a white coach?

He doesn't have to prove they're racists. As a matter of fact, he's probably already changed the league in a very large way forever, just by filing it.

[bisme37]

I think there's probably something for me to moderate here but I really don't follow football and I have no idea what you guys are even talking about lol.

[Jkam31]

Can someone please pinpoint where/when the discrimination took place?

I’m not saying it didn’t. I just haven’t seen it.

Because the Giants chose a candidate before interviewing Flores?

That may violate the Rooney Rule but I don’t see how it is discrimination. Maybe they just actually really really liked the other coach.

Is there more I haven’t seen?

The guy that was hired worked for the new GM that was hired a month ago plus giants interview 2 other black coaches before Flores this is a non story but we are in the I was offended or it’s racism era so carry on

[Duke4life831]

Yes, I think if the Giants were an equal opportunity employer instead of conducting token interviews for minorities he would not have sued

The Giants had 6 coaches lined up for interviews

3 white coaches
3 black coaches

Leslie Fraizer (Black) and Brain Daboll (White) were the two that got multiple interviews.

So ya they didn’t need to interview Flores for him to be a token minority to pass the Rooney Rule.

Maybe just maybe they really liked Daboll from his interview (with he had prior to their scheduled one with Flores).

Isn’t it 2 external minority coaches for Rooney rule?

It is, I forgot Graham was an assistant for the Giants.

I still don’t think there is any proof that the Giants practiced any kind of discrimination with this hire though.

[AbeVigodaLive]

I think there's probably something for me to moderate here but I really don't follow football and I have no idea what you guys are even talking about lol.

Nothing to see here...

Just some silly rule that you can't date one Rooney sister without first asking the other one.

[bisme37]

I think there's probably something for me to moderate here but I really don't follow football and I have no idea what you guys are even talking about lol.

Nothing to see here...

Just some silly rule that you can't date one Rooney sister without first asking the other one.

Kate plz.

[azcatz11]

The Giants had 6 coaches lined up for interviews

3 white coaches
3 black coaches

Leslie Fraizer (Black) and Brain Daboll (White) were the two that got multiple interviews.

So ya they didn’t need to interview Flores for him to be a token minority to pass the Rooney Rule.

Maybe just maybe they really liked Daboll from his interview (with he had prior to their scheduled one with Flores).

Isn’t it 2 external minority coaches for Rooney rule?

It is, I forgot Graham was an assistant for the Giants.

I still don’t think there is any proof that the Giants practiced any kind of discrimination with this hire though.

They're saying the smoking gun is the text messages from Belichick...they're conspiracy theories floating around that he intentionally sent the message to Flores telling him he's the 'Giants Guy' like that Curb your Enthusiasm episode...I heard that on the Chris Long Podcast this morning.

Who knows.

[Jkam31]

Also on the owner wanting to tank how many of us want out losing teams to tank and say oh ownership wouldn’t allow it. Now an owner is accused of it and we have fake outrage the hypocrisy is real in this country, the owner wanted to tank for Burrow who took his team to the SB this year instead they got a scrub 4 picks later. I know us kings fans would beg Vivek to tank

[Wallace_Wallace]

Im just going to say this. I think the whole 70% of the players are black so the lack of head coaches being black is a problem, has one major flaw in it. The majority of coaches nowadays weren't NFL players, I believe 25 out of the 32 coaches last year never played in the NFL. And like 3 of the 7 that did, never played a game and got cut in training camp.

Im not even weighing in on some of the bigger topics going on in this thread. Just strictly speaking on seeing people (not just on here) continue to talk about the racial makeup of the players as it has some kind of connection to what the racial makeup of the coaches should be.

They're two completely different professions. Especially nowadays it seems like the focus is getting guys that have been coaches straight out of college. Sean McVay got his first job in the NFL at 22 years old. Mike Tomlin got his first coaching gig at 23 years old. Hell Brian Flores got his first job in the NFL at 23 years old.

That's a good point. Someone decides to forego a playing career and pursue coaching career. Similar to Erik Spoelstra who worked his way up from a video coordinator to one of the best best head coaches in the NBA, and I'm pretty sure he get to where he is because he's Asian-American.

[Pharmcat]

Also on the owner wanting to tank how many of us want out losing teams to tank and say oh ownership wouldn’t allow it. Now an owner is accused of it and we have fake outrage the hypocrisy is real in this country, the owner wanted to tank for Burrow who took his team to the SB this year instead they got a scrub 4 picks later. I know us kings fans would beg Vivek to tank

Paying a coach to tank is a serious swipe at the integrity of the game. It’s like playing off a player to play bad , player betting on own team , etc

[Duke4life831]

Isn’t it 2 external minority coaches for Rooney rule?

It is, I forgot Graham was an assistant for the Giants.

I still don’t think there is any proof that the Giants practiced any kind of discrimination with this hire though.

They're saying the smoking gun is the text messages from Belichick...they're conspiracy theories floating around that he intentionally sent the message to Flores telling him he's the 'Giants Guy' like that Curb your Enthusiasm episode...I heard that on the Chris Long Podcast this morning.

Who knows.

Ya and all those texts show is they wanted to move forward with Daboll before finishing up all of their interviews.

Which to me isn’t any kind of smoking gun. I’ve been part of the hiring process multiple times. This has happened every single time. You interview someone and they knock out out of the park and by the end of that interview everyone in the room knows that person is going to get the job. You still have a few more interviews scheduled and you go through with them mainly for due diligence.

That’s what looked like what happened here. Either Daboll was their favorite coming in (for clear obvious reasons I’ve stated before) or he knocked it out of the park in the interview. Seemed like Giants knew he was their man after the interview.

Like I’ve said before I totally get why Flores would be upset about this. But I’m lacking to see any evidence at all that this was a discriminatory action by the Giants.

[Jkam31]

People are really missing the significance of this. By coming public with clear evidence of just what a mockery teams are making of hte Rooney Rule(something we've know forever but now he's forcing things), its showing the whole rule is worthless and that white owners are going to keep hiring white coaches they feel comfortable with which is denying opportunities to potentially qualifed candidates.

And the irony of the Rooney Rule coming from the Steelers owners who interviewed a black man seen as underqualified at the time but who blew them away and has now been their head coach forever and his next losing season will be his first one....

But you can see it itt, lots of white people simply don't believe the most qualified candidate can be a black man or that they deserve an actual opportunity to be considered instead of just a token check box.

Flores is going to lose, becaue too many people make too much money off the NFL and when you challenge the shield you lose. But he, like Kap is a good man for sacrificing his career for something bigger than just him. This will have an impact, especially if as this is a class action he can get others to join. Guys like Caldwell or Lewis or Dungy whose coaching careers are probably over anyway certainly have their own stories about being the token interview. As do countless assistants of course but many of them will be loathe to because it will derail their career.

This is real, and its a problem. It's not just oh we love this one coach. Access matters.

Anybody who thinks Kaepernick sacrificed anything should never be taking seriously, ever!

[Duke4life831]

Also on the owner wanting to tank how many of us want out losing teams to tank and say oh ownership wouldn’t allow it. Now an owner is accused of it and we have fake outrage the hypocrisy is real in this country, the owner wanted to tank for Burrow who took his team to the SB this year instead they got a scrub 4 picks later. I know us kings fans would beg Vivek to tank

Paying a coach to tank is a serious swipe at the integrity of the game. It’s like playing off a player to play bad , player betting on own team , etc

Ya and it’s against the law to do so as well. It’s one thing for fans to root for a draft pick. Hell it’s one thing for an owner/GM to go out of their way to put a bad roster out on the field/court (Hinkie 6ers). But paying a coach to purposely throw a game is a whole different level.

[Jkam31]

I'm not going to read though this thread because I am sure there are a lot of idiotic takes and I just don't have the patience to deal with that. The majority of this board just isn't knowledgeable and experienced enough to deal with anything race related.

I love the NFL, but it is about as corrupt and "good ole boys club" as it gets. We have seen it time and time and time again. (Bruce Allen, Jon Gruden, etc etc etc)

There is ONE current black head coach in the NFL right now.

Brian Flores and David Culley both got fired, even though they did very well considering the teams they coached/circumstances surrounding them.

Bills OC and Packers OC just got head coaching jobs. White dudes.
Chiefs OC and Buccaneers OC met in the Super Bowl last year. Both led amazing offenses. Neither one is a head coach right now. Black dudes.

Texans have interviewed Josh McCown for the past couple of years, and he's an ASSISTANT HIGH SCHOOL FOOTBALL COACH.

Eric Beinemy can hardly get an interview, even though he's led one of the best offenses in quite a while for years.

I know the NBA and the MLB has it's problems, but none are nearly in poor of shape as the NFL. It's a huge problem, and it's only getting worse.

First of all Leftwich was offered the Jaguars job and won’t take it unless they fire there GM and he’ll fail as a coach anyways like the rest of the OC that Brady made looo good. Did you expect Culley to stay as coach dude was an interim head coach with a new GM hired let’s use reasoning here as to why he wasn’t brought back

[azcatz11]

It is, I forgot Graham was an assistant for the Giants.

I still don’t think there is any proof that the Giants practiced any kind of discrimination with this hire though.

They're saying the smoking gun is the text messages from Belichick...they're conspiracy theories floating around that he intentionally sent the message to Flores telling him he's the 'Giants Guy' like that Curb your Enthusiasm episode...I heard that on the Chris Long Podcast this morning.

Who knows.

Ya and all those texts show is they wanted to move forward with Daboll before finishing up all of their interviews.

Which to me isn’t any kind of smoking gun. I’ve been part of the hiring process multiple times. This has happened every single time. You interview someone and they knock out out of the park and by the end of that interview everyone in the room knows that person is going to get the job. You still have a few more interviews scheduled and you go through with them mainly for due diligence.

That’s what looked like what happened here. Either Daboll was their favorite coming in (for clear obvious reasons I’ve stated before) or he knocked it out of the park in the interview. Seemed like Giants knew he was their man after the interview.

Like I’ve said before I totally get why Flores would be upset about this. But I’m lacking to see any evidence at all that this was a discriminatory action by the Giants.

I'm in agreement. It's pretty obvious Flores has a prickly personality and doesn't get along with people. That was literally reported through out the entire season. And just because he didn't get a job this offseason doesn't mean he wouldn't next season.

I personally think he's overrated. The Dolphins were lucky to go on that streak this season. All of those wins were against teams that had horrible / backup QB's. It's not like teams are passing on the next Bill Walsh

[Pharmcat]

I'm not going to read though this thread because I am sure there are a lot of idiotic takes and I just don't have the patience to deal with that. The majority of this board just isn't knowledgeable and experienced enough to deal with anything race related.

I love the NFL, but it is about as corrupt and "good ole boys club" as it gets. We have seen it time and time and time again. (Bruce Allen, Jon Gruden, etc etc etc)

There is ONE current black head coach in the NFL right now.

Brian Flores and David Culley both got fired, even though they did very well considering the teams they coached/circumstances surrounding them.

Bills OC and Packers OC just got head coaching jobs. White dudes.
Chiefs OC and Buccaneers OC met in the Super Bowl last year. Both led amazing offenses. Neither one is a head coach right now. Black dudes.

Texans have interviewed Josh McCown for the past couple of years, and he's an ASSISTANT HIGH SCHOOL FOOTBALL COACH.

Eric Beinemy can hardly get an interview, even though he's led one of the best offenses in quite a while for years.

I know the NBA and the MLB has it's problems, but none are nearly in poor of shape as the NFL. It's a huge problem, and it's only getting worse.

First of all Leftwich was offered the Jaguars job and won’t take it unless they fire there GM and he’ll fail as a coach anyways like the rest of the OC that Brady made looo good. Did you expect Culley to stay as coach dude was an interim head coach with a new GM hired let’s use reasoning here as to why he wasn’t brought back

it seems to me black coaches get the "janitor" job via interim title, they get a role at a team that has rocky currents to ride it out, and then when the water smooths, they fire the coach and bring in someone else.

[FNQ]

It’s relatively simple. The Rooney Rule was put in place to give black coaching candidates a chance, since the league is majority black, ownership is entirely non-black, and executive / HCs are vastly white.

The Rooney Rule is there to create equity. Circumventing it - like making it known around the league that you’re hiring a coach before satisfying the rule isn’t inherently racist, however if the league knows of such actions and does little or nothing about it, then it can be seen as such. And then you can get into average coaching tenure / record by race, and see that it’s non linear as well

In 2002 the league was sued on this. And likely would have lost, but bartered to create the Rooney Rule, which was the chief concession. If they don’t honor said rule, and they have statistical evidence already that minorities don’t have the same opportunities as white people (Google 2019 NFL minority coaching study).. then between that and Flores’ experiences, with evidence, there’s a case that the NFL has to address. Flores may not win and may not coach ever again in the NFL, but he could accelerate necessary change