Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST)

[wolves_89]

DO NOT TRADE Pat Beverly.

Whether Smart comes or not (he would be welcome IMHO), keep Bev because no one player has been more instrumental in changing the culture here. Keep him, as an assistant coach if necessary.

I like the Richardson/Langford for Beasley swap. Josh R. fits the current team needs more anyway.

I hope the Bev rumors are more about leveraging a good extension vs really needing to move.

I'd go back to the Beas deal with Boston....but here's my preferred wrinkle where we get some big help as well (see below where we send 2 of our 3 2nds to OKC).....thoughts?

4-way deal where...

OKC gets Satoransky & the 2--2nds

Bos gets Beasley

NOP gets Richardson/Naz/Kenny Hustle

Min gets Nesmith/Hayes/Muscala

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I think I'd avoid Hayes.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/33141181/new-orleans-pelicans-jaxson-hayes-charged-domestic-violence-battery-police-officer-connection-july-arrest

[winforlose]

This series of moves assumes no big deals, kinda rolling them all into one, but they can be done separately, except the NY deal needs to also have the Philly deal to work.

Minnesota out: JO, JMAC, Layman, Beasley, Bolmaro, 2 2nd round picks.
Minnesota in: Kemba Walker, Obi Toppin, Paul Reed, Josh Richardson, Romeo Langford, Payton Pritchard.

Knicks out: Walker and Toppin
Knicks in: JO, Bolmaro, Layman

Sixers out: Paul Reed
Sixers in: 2 2nd round picks

Boston out: Richardson, Langford, Pritchard
Boston in: Beasley, JMAC

Why for 76ers, they don’t use Reed, but he would a nice depth move and I see him as better than Knight. 2nds is a decent return for a guy you stash in the G.

Why for NY: Thibs drafted JO, they get a defensive minded Bolmaro, and they dump Kemba’s contract. Layman is expiring, they re-sign JO, and can grow Bolmaro.

Why for Boston: Pritchard is having a tough year and is falling out of the rotation. JMAC has come alive of late and could really help them push their way up to home court play in. They wanted Beasley for Richardson and two young guys, Langford and Pritchard qualify. Plus JMAC is only one year older than Pritchard so it is kind of a wash.

Why for us: Toppin and Reed give us great depth at the PF and C. Toppin can play alongside V8 and KAT or alongside MCD on the bench unit. If Prince maintains his excellent play he can move back to the 3 and not need to be outsized so often. The two bigs give us options. Richardson is hopefully more consistent than Beasley, and Langford will hopefully grow into the role. Again we add some depth and give ourselves options. Walker and Pritchard are both guys who can make a big impact on the game. Pritchard would be a project who wouldn’t see a ton of minutes unless Bev is unavailable, but his upside is higher than JMAC and his size helps. Kemba adds some desperately needed scoring and play making. If his defense sucks his minutes will be scaled back, but I am hopeful he will do better with us and our scheme.

The only downside to my moves is we create something of a log jam with young guys not getting minutes. When healthy our starting lineup probably stays the same. Our 2nd unit becomes Walker, Nowell, MCD, Prince, and either Reid or Reed. But what we add is extreme depth for the playoffs and the ability to move on from guys like Naz and Nowell and Prince if we need to next year. We also gain some nice trade chips for next offseason.

[Rookie-Mistake]

I think we stand pat
Looks like the team is geling, I do t see them blowing it up.

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[shrink]

I went back and got the quotes tonight from our broadcasters, Jim Peterson and Dave Benz. I wanted to post it here too, to give visitors that don’t read our game threads a bit of perspective outside of us typical fans.

This is my 24th year broadcasting for this team, and this is the best chemistry in my 24 years .. even going back to the Kevin Garnett years of 2003-2004. I’m just saying, the 2003-2004 team was special, no doubt about it, but, this team was kind of put together in a grass roots way, and they’ve kind of come alive together, you know? And Kevin Garnett was MVP that year, he was a superstar -this is kind of a different model. But this group is really tight, and so fun to watch,

And that’s why, you know, I chuckle, I read some of these, you know, Bleacher Report, and they’re talking about some of the possible trades, and all these people who don’t really follow this team, and aren’t connected to it, are like, “Well, you know, um, the Timberwolves are a very nice story.” Could the Timberwolves use some upgrades? Every team could use some upgrades. But, at the end of the day, do you want to disrupt the chemistry that this team has?

[TheProdigy]

To those of you who continue to conjure up trades to improve our starting power forward position - newsflash : Jarred Vanderbilt is turning into an elite role player, on a very team friendly contract. You're embarrasing yourself at this point if you can't see how valuable he is. /rant

[moss_is_1]

I went back and got the quotes tonight from our broadcasters, Jim Peterson and Tom Hanneman. I wanted to post it here too, to give visitors that don’t read our game threads a bit of perspective outside of us typical fans.

This is my 24th year broadcasting for this team, and this is the best chemistry in my 24 years .. even going back to the Kevin Garnett years of 2003-2004. I’m just saying, the 2003-2004 team was special, no doubt about it, but, this team was kind of put together in a grass roots way, and they’ve kind of come alive together, you know? And Kevin Garnett was MVP that year, he was a superstar -this is kind of a different model. But this group is really tight, and so fun to watch,

And that’s why, you know, I chuckle, I read some of these, you know, Bleacher Report, and they’re talking about some of the possible trades, and all these people who don’t really follow this team, and aren’t connected to it, are like, “Well, you know, um, the Timberwolves are a very nice story. Could the Timberwolves use some upgrades? Every team could use some upgrades. But, at the end of the day, do you want to disrupt the chemistry that this team has?

I'm really loving this team. Only thing I can really see is moving Layman, Okogie, Reid, or Bolmaro maybe for a bench big that's better than Naz or picks. Use those 3 2nds we have also.

[life_saver]

I definitely think they will move Okogie..I am thinking Jazz is one of the possible destinations.

[winforlose]

To those of you who continue to conjure up trades to improve our starting power forward position - newsflash : Jarred Vanderbilt is turning into an elite role player, on a very team friendly contract. You're embarrasing yourself at this point if you can't see how valuable he is. /rant

The only thing I disagree with is “turning into.” V8 has turned himself into an elite role player. That said, I also think he could be an elite role player at the SF, and despite plenty of people telling me he cannot, no one has been able to tell me why. He can defend the SF. He can box out and rebound against SFs. He can play the exact style of offense against SFs. There is nothing he can do at the PF that he could not do at the SF. So we could move Bev to the bench, Dlo to the PG, Ant to the SG, V8 to the SF and still upgrade the PF or C.

[winforlose]

I went back and got the quotes tonight from our broadcasters, Jim Peterson and Tom Hanneman. I wanted to post it here too, to give visitors that don’t read our game threads a bit of perspective outside of us typical fans.

This is my 24th year broadcasting for this team, and this is the best chemistry in my 24 years .. even going back to the Kevin Garnett years of 2003-2004. I’m just saying, the 2003-2004 team was special, no doubt about it, but, this team was kind of put together in a grass roots way, and they’ve kind of come alive together, you know? And Kevin Garnett was MVP that year, he was a superstar -this is kind of a different model. But this group is really tight, and so fun to watch,

And that’s why, you know, I chuckle, I read some of these, you know, Bleacher Report, and they’re talking about some of the possible trades, and all these people who don’t really follow this team, and aren’t connected to it, are like, “Well, you know, um, the Timberwolves are a very nice story. Could the Timberwolves use some upgrades? Every team could use some upgrades. But, at the end of the day, do you want to disrupt the chemistry that this team has?

I'm really loving this team. Only thing I can really see is moving Layman, Okogie, Reid, or Bolmaro maybe for a bench big that's better than Naz or picks. Use those 3 2nds we have also.

Before the season started I was thrilled about getting Bev for Juancho and Culver. I liked the idea of the Rubio for Prince move (though I did expect another move that never came.) I liked the re-signing of JMAC and loved the re-signing of V8 on good contracts. We had a good offseason. But Beasley, Prince, MCD, JMAC, Naz, and Dlo all underperformed for a good chunk of the season. At this point most or all of them have shown flashes of who we thought we had (what they were in prior years or should have been this year.) However, I don’t know how much to trust that this is sustainable. I still think we need to make either one big move or several small moves to shore up or depth, but I will admit having our guys perform is damn fun to watch.

[minimus]

Naz Reid and Josh Okogie for PJ Washington?

Why for CHA? Two reasons, Center and defense. Charlotte is the only team with a winning record currently 20th or lower in defensive rating. They are 26th. Okogie could help this immediately. Naz Reid gives them a longer term center option. Mason Plumlee isn't it, and Washington shouldn't be getting center minutes.

Why for MIN? Get a little more beef behind Vanderbilt, and a guy who might be a more cost-effective option than Reid would be next year. Flexibility for bigger moves stays in place.

I would do it if Washington can play some C minutes

[old school 34]

I went back and got the quotes tonight from our broadcasters, Jim Peterson and Tom Hanneman. I wanted to post it here too, to give visitors that don’t read our game threads a bit of perspective outside of us typical fans.

This is my 24th year broadcasting for this team, and this is the best chemistry in my 24 years .. even going back to the Kevin Garnett years of 2003-2004. I’m just saying, the 2003-2004 team was special, no doubt about it, but, this team was kind of put together in a grass roots way, and they’ve kind of come alive together, you know? And Kevin Garnett was MVP that year, he was a superstar -this is kind of a different model. But this group is really tight, and so fun to watch,

And that’s why, you know, I chuckle, I read some of these, you know, Bleacher Report, and they’re talking about some of the possible trades, and all these people who don’t really follow this team, and aren’t connected to it, are like, “Well, you know, um, the Timberwolves are a very nice story. Could the Timberwolves use some upgrades? Every team could use some upgrades. But, at the end of the day, do you want to disrupt the chemistry that this team has?

I'm really loving this team. Only thing I can really see is moving Layman, Okogie, Reid, or Bolmaro maybe for a bench big that's better than Naz or picks. Use those 3 2nds we have also.

I'm pretty much there with you, but the only other guy I'd move is Beasley...I like the Boston rumored deal (Nesmith for me over Langford)....but I hope we circle back to that one after we're done kicking the tires on the bigger moves & find the other bench big.

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[old school 34]

DO NOT TRADE Pat Beverly.

Whether Smart comes or not (he would be welcome IMHO), keep Bev because no one player has been more instrumental in changing the culture here. Keep him, as an assistant coach if necessary.

I like the Richardson/Langford for Beasley swap. Josh R. fits the current team needs more anyway.

I hope the Bev rumors are more about leveraging a good extension vs really needing to move.

I'd go back to the Beas deal with Boston....but here's my preferred wrinkle where we get some big help as well (see below where we send 2 of our 3 2nds to OKC).....thoughts?

4-way deal where...

OKC gets Satoransky & the 2--2nds

Bos gets Beasley

NOP gets Richardson/Naz/Kenny Hustle

Min gets Nesmith/Hayes/Muscala

Sent from my SM-G973U using RealGM mobile app

I think I'd avoid Hayes.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/33141181/new-orleans-pelicans-jaxson-hayes-charged-domestic-violence-battery-police-officer-connection-july-arrest

That sucks...good find...I hadn't heard that he had that in his past. That puts me probably back to doing just the Boston deal as rumored & then trying to find that longer defensive rebounding big somewhere else?

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[TheProdigy]

To those of you who continue to conjure up trades to improve our starting power forward position - newsflash : Jarred Vanderbilt is turning into an elite role player, on a very team friendly contract. You're embarrasing yourself at this point if you can't see how valuable he is. /rant

The only thing I disagree with is “turning into.” V8 has turned himself into an elite role player. That said, I also think he could be an elite role player at the SF, and despite plenty of people telling me he cannot, no one has been able to tell me why. He can defend the SF. He can box out and rebound against SFs. He can play the exact style of offense against SFs. There is nothing he can do at the PF that he could not do at the SF. So we could move Bev to the bench, Dlo to the PG, Ant to the SG, V8 to the SF and still upgrade the PF or C.

You're right that he can play SF, but I do think he loses some of the utility he brings by moving him down to the 3. The skills that make him so valuable in my opinion is being able to switch defensively onto perimeter players with ease, while also being a very good rebounder. If you move him down to the 3, then who are you bringing on to play the 4/5? Chances are it will be a slower player who struggles defending in space. Let's be honest, the number of bigs in this league who can shoot 3s (can't have 2 non shooters on the floor together), rebound well, and defend the perimeter is very low. So if you do want to acquire someone like that, you're going to have to give up significant assets because unicorn bigs are so rare.

[winforlose]

To those of you who continue to conjure up trades to improve our starting power forward position - newsflash : Jarred Vanderbilt is turning into an elite role player, on a very team friendly contract. You're embarrasing yourself at this point if you can't see how valuable he is. /rant

The only thing I disagree with is “turning into.” V8 has turned himself into an elite role player. That said, I also think he could be an elite role player at the SF, and despite plenty of people telling me he cannot, no one has been able to tell me why. He can defend the SF. He can box out and rebound against SFs. He can play the exact style of offense against SFs. There is nothing he can do at the PF that he could not do at the SF. So we could move Bev to the bench, Dlo to the PG, Ant to the SG, V8 to the SF and still upgrade the PF or C.

You're right that he can play SF, but I do think he loses some of the utility he brings by moving him down to the 3. The skills that make him so valuable in my opinion is being able to switch defensively onto perimeter players with ease, while also being a very good rebounder. If you move him down to the 3, then who are you bringing on to play the 4/5? Chances are it will be a slower player who struggles defending in space. Let's be honest, the number of bigs in this league who can shoot 3s (can't have 2 non shooters on the floor together), rebound well, and defend the perimeter is very low. So if you do want to acquire someone like that, you're going to have to give up significant assets because unicorn bigs are so rare.

1. The weakness in the high wall concept we run is that when our C is guarding the perimeter, their C rolls to the basket. When their big rolls we have 3 choices. Choice A is collapse multiple players to stop the big. When we use Choice A they swing to open corner 3 point shooter who either shoots or swings again and they get an open 3. Choice B is we do nothing and they get lob dunks and easy layups. Choice C is we try and have our PF match their C alone and in the rare instances we have seen this it often ends badly for V8. His lack of physical size and strength makes defending or boxing out against much heavier players very challenging. The best way to fix the high wall is to put a big body in the paint and let them handle the roller. Julius Randle for example has the weight and wingspan to play this role.

2. KAT is one of if not the best 3 point shooting bigs of all time. We don’t need another 40% guy to make the spacing work. Anyone who shoots around 33% can demand to be guarded. Or in the alternative anyone who can shoot 35-36% when left wide open will still be efficient enough to help us. Randle shoots 30.3% this year down from last years 41.1%. Randle is also able to attack off the dribble and is used to being the focus of the defense. Randle demands a defender and a SF will not be able to contain him. This means that either they put a SF on KAT and he shoots over him, or that the PF and C must guard our bigs and V8 is guarded by the SF. This opens the lane for Dlo and Ant, makes it easier for V8 to run in and grab boards, putbacks, and cutting/rolling dunks.

3. Randle is averaging 8.1 defensive rebounds and 9.9 boards this season. Last season he averaged 9 defensive boards and 10.2 total boards. Randle could easily be 15/10 guy.

4. Randle makes 23 next year, then 25, then 27. While this is by no means cheap, it is much cheaper than Simmons, and is in line with what Grant wants to make on his next deal. Turner makes 17.5 next year and then will want a raise as well. We can afford Randle.

5. Julius Randle might not like getting less touches and shots, but he will also get less double teams, less pressure to dominate games, and a fresh start with a fan base that doesn’t boo him. He is only 27 which means he is around the same age as our older guys (KAT is 26, Dlo is 25, ect..) Moreover, if KAT goes out now we have another volume scorer and rebounder who can fill some of the void that missing KAT leaves behind.

6. Price. I think 2 top 8 protected firsts, Beasley, Okogie, and Bolmaro might get this done. Even if we don’t give that package to NY, we could give it to Indiana and they could give Turner to NY and send Randle here.

[Celts17Pride]

FYI

[Wolfson] “Minnesota definitely trying to trade for Marcus Smart. But, unless they include a first-round pick or Jaden McDaniels in addition to Malik Beasley, [a deal] most likely doesn’t get done.” - @DWolfsonKSTP on @SKORNorth

Read on Twitter

Like I mentioned before I think it's very unlikely the Celtics trade Marcus Smart. Marcus Smart is extremely valuable to the Celtics and contributes greatly towards winning.

[moss_is_1]

I really like Smart for our team, but definitely not going to give up Jaden, and I personally have no interest in giving up our best shooter along with a pick for a very mediocre shooter.

[Dosadi]

It is a firing offense to include Jaden or a First round pick along with Beasley for Smart. And I like Marcus Smart.

[slick21]

I went back and got the quotes tonight from our broadcasters, Jim Peterson and Tom Hanneman. I wanted to post it here too, to give visitors that don’t read our game threads a bit of perspective outside of us typical fans.

This is my 24th year broadcasting for this team, and this is the best chemistry in my 24 years .. even going back to the Kevin Garnett years of 2003-2004. I’m just saying, the 2003-2004 team was special, no doubt about it, but, this team was kind of put together in a grass roots way, and they’ve kind of come alive together, you know? And Kevin Garnett was MVP that year, he was a superstar -this is kind of a different model. But this group is really tight, and so fun to watch,

And that’s why, you know, I chuckle, I read some of these, you know, Bleacher Report, and they’re talking about some of the possible trades, and all these people who don’t really follow this team, and aren’t connected to it, are like, “Well, you know, um, the Timberwolves are a very nice story.” Could the Timberwolves use some upgrades? Every team could use some upgrades. But, at the end of the day, do you want to disrupt the chemistry that this team has?

Thanks for sharing that, but just one small correction. I think you are referring to Petersen and TV play-by-play guy Dave Benz. Sadly, Hanneman passed away in late 2020.

[old school 34]

I really like Smart for our team, but definitely not going to give up Jaden, and I personally have no interest in giving up our best shooter along with a pick for a very mediocre shooter.

I like Smart a lot as well, but your right there needs to be limits.

What if the tweak is more...

Smart/Nesmith for Beasley/Okogie....now I might even throw my FRP in there (prefer 2--2nds)...but that feels better for both rosters from a balance perspective?

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[shrink]

I went back and got the quotes tonight from our broadcasters, Jim Peterson and Tom Hanneman. I wanted to post it here too, to give visitors that don’t read our game threads a bit of perspective outside of us typical fans.

This is my 24th year broadcasting for this team, and this is the best chemistry in my 24 years .. even going back to the Kevin Garnett years of 2003-2004. I’m just saying, the 2003-2004 team was special, no doubt about it, but, this team was kind of put together in a grass roots way, and they’ve kind of come alive together, you know? And Kevin Garnett was MVP that year, he was a superstar -this is kind of a different model. But this group is really tight, and so fun to watch,

And that’s why, you know, I chuckle, I read some of these, you know, Bleacher Report, and they’re talking about some of the possible trades, and all these people who don’t really follow this team, and aren’t connected to it, are like, “Well, you know, um, the Timberwolves are a very nice story.” Could the Timberwolves use some upgrades? Every team could use some upgrades. But, at the end of the day, do you want to disrupt the chemistry that this team has?

Thanks for sharing that, but just one small correction. I think you are referring to Petersen and TV play-by-play guy Dave Benz. Sadly, Hanneman passed away in late 2020.

Thank you. I’ll go edit it.