Thoughts in General, Rumors, etc 5.0

[shangrila]

Here is the thing, over the last month plus, Harris has been excellent. He has returned to his career averages which were enough for the Sixers to sign him in the first place. Yes he is overpaid, but he is far and away not one of the "worst contracts in the league". Russell (at $30,000,000 plus a year), and fillers such as Beasley, Beverly and Prince are not going to motivate Brooklyn or the Sixers to give up Harden or Simmons.

Minnesota, without Edwards, has no place in this transaction.

He's due between 35 and 40mil per season for the next few years, has a trade kicker and was overpaid the moment he put pen to paper, so him returning to his career averages is an entirely moot point.

You want to argue you wouldn't use Simmons to dump his salary? Fine. But you're kidding yourself if you don't think that contract is right behind Wall/Westbrook for the worst in the league.

I mean, the very fact the Sixers are trying to shoehorn him into every Simmons trade should tell you all you need to know about his value.

[zimpy27]

If muscala want out , an SRP is enough , doubt you guys have enough asset to cover the Westbrook portion of the trade though.

If I’m being realistic it probably cost 2 first , if I’m being greedy it’s 2 first and a swap somewhere in future too ( with a non OKC pick)

I don't want Westbrook back to OKC right now and even less for a 2027 FRP but we saw from last years that it wasn't THAT expensive to get rid of a bad contract (Horford/Kemba/Wall etc.). No team would offer 2 FRPs to get rid of one and a half of contract of a terrible contract.

Going by the outgoing and incoming salary I would absolutely want a second first though .

There’s a better chance that there’s another team rather than OKC willing to do this but there’s only so many gm out there secure enough to trade for a 2027 first as the reward for absorbing salary

We sent out Horford who have quite a bit of salary (with a high guarantee that force most team to be unlikely to waive his final season) for kemba . In return we got an immediate 16th pick

For this trade we are sending out favors much lower salary and absorbing Westbrook slightly higher salary (compared to kemba) . Once you consider the pick is quite a bit away … that’s how I get my second first demand.

Now if we absorb a bad contract(or two) of same length to favors around 20-25m and flip that for Westbrook I would be ok with one sole pick.

The talent back from that trade would probably means lakers prefer not doing that trade then though.

Edit : same point still remain though, don’t really want Westbrook usage rate back.

With OKC having so many FRPs you could argue that a later FRP is better since you are spreading them out more. I felt like you didn't get great value for having multiple FRPs around the draft.

I think Horford was neutral value so this feels similar to the Kemba trade. OKC gave their SRP (which is quite close to a late FRP if I recall). I think a team could offer Westbrook a better salary than broken Kemba too.

I don't think it takes 2 FRPs.

[Devilanche]

With OKC having so many FRPs you could argue that a later FRP is better since you are spreading them out more. I felt like you didn't get great value for having multiple FRPs around the draft.

I think Horford was neutral value so this feels similar to the Kemba trade. OKC gave their SRP (which is quite close to a late FRP if I recall). I think a team could offer Westbrook a better salary than broken Kemba too.

I don't think it takes 2 FRPs.

I don’t think OKC going get good value for our multiple first during draft day anymore. I think once Presti is locked into someone he like at the draft he will be willing to overpay in picks if he have to .

Not too hung up on seconds for a trade this big cause I don’t think it matter much since we aren’t actual GM .

Kemba trade I believe Presti done it with the intention to rehab his value before flipping but going off performance today I think we are better off with the buyout ( kemba not performing well enough to outweigh his old salary and OKC probably would have won more with developing less of Giddey/Mann/wiggin)

If at this trade deadline I truly believe it will take 2 first or at least 1 first plus 1 more swap somewhere that’s bound to occur but lakers picks tends to be valued at low 20s so the extra swap of a marginal few spot as added incentive.

Lakers probably better off looking at other team say maybe Detroit and build a trade offer around KO who would help space your lineup.

[toooskies]

OKC should probably be trading for swap rights and not picks outright. (With multiple swap rights equal to a single FRP, of course.)

[Resistance]

Is there going to be a Notice posted for people to doublecheck the integrity of Twitter accounts that have trade reports/confirmations?

I don't know why, but some people enjoy creating Twitter accounts that have names/handles very similar to actual reporters and media. All it takes is for a few people to be fooled by the fake accounts and then there is propagation of false information.

[DoItALL9]

Paul Millsap, Joe Harris, James Harden

For

Ben Simmons, Danny Green, and Tobias Harris
(Maybe a first, a couple of swaps, or a few seconds)

Sent from my LM-G710 using RealGM mobile app

[HartfordWhalers]

So, I've always felt like the Nets would be stupid to trade Harden now. If he really does want Philly; so what? Try and win a ring. Those chances don't come often. Try and convince him to stay. And the S&T (or opt in with the opt in only because of a wink wink trade incoming) will always be there.

I guess he could be toxic enough to the place and demand out, but barring a I really don't want to be here and might even be injured sort of stance from Harden, I have been a proponent from the Nets perspective of figure it out next offseason.

I will say, the one thing that would totally mess that up is a different Simmons trade depending upon what it is. If I'm the Nets I'm really watching the Minnesota Sacramento whoever offers for Simmons and hoping Morey stays steadfast in what he has been doing.

[HartfordWhalers]

Is there going to be a Notice posted for people to doublecheck the integrity of Twitter accounts that have trade reports/confirmations?

I don't know why, but some people enjoy creating Twitter accounts that have names/handles very similar to actual reporters and media. All it takes is for a few people to be fooled by the fake accounts and then there is propagation of false information.

Whenever you see the first person get fooled, feel free to post one. Or just pm one of us to, but I think its better as a tregular thread than a sticky as people (especially on phones) miss the stickies.

And thanks for all your good work!

[VCfor3]

So, I've always felt like the Nets would be stupid to trade Harden now. If he really does want Philly; so what? Try and win a ring. Those chances don't come often. Try and convince him to stay. And the S&T (or opt in with the opt in only because of a wink wink trade incoming) will always be there.

I guess he could be toxic enough to the place and demand out, but barring a I really don't want to be here and might even be injured sort of stance from Harden, I have been a proponent from the Nets perspective of figure it out next offseason.

I will say, the one thing that would totally mess that up is a different Simmons trade depending upon what it is. If I'm the Nets I'm really watching the Minnesota Sacramento whoever offers for Simmons and hoping Morey stays steadfast in what he has been doing.

I think Beal shaking free is the main threat moreso than Minnesota or Sacramento. But the other issue with waiting is Maxey. He has been playing very well this year. If he blows up in the playoffs, you may not be able to get him. I think right now you can get Simmons+Maxey. If Maxey goes super nova, you likely only get one of the two in a S&T even though Brooklyn holds a ton of leverage. Sure Philly will add different value in place of Maxey (Picks/Thybulle/whatever), but if you are convinced Maxey is a future star PG then you may need to make the trade happen at the deadline.

Otherwise I agree keeping Harden for a potential run this offseason and then moving him in a S&T would be super appealing unless Harden starts dogging it.

[HartfordWhalers]

So, I've always felt like the Nets would be stupid to trade Harden now. If he really does want Philly; so what? Try and win a ring. Those chances don't come often. Try and convince him to stay. And the S&T (or opt in with the opt in only because of a wink wink trade incoming) will always be there.

I guess he could be toxic enough to the place and demand out, but barring a I really don't want to be here and might even be injured sort of stance from Harden, I have been a proponent from the Nets perspective of figure it out next offseason.

I will say, the one thing that would totally mess that up is a different Simmons trade depending upon what it is. If I'm the Nets I'm really watching the Minnesota Sacramento whoever offers for Simmons and hoping Morey stays steadfast in what he has been doing.

I think Beal shaking free is the main threat moreso than Minnesota or Sacramento. But the other issue with waiting is Maxey. He has been playing very well this year. If he blows up in the playoffs, you may not be able to get him. I think right now you can get Simmons+Maxey. If Maxey goes super nova, you likely only get one of the two in a S&T even though Brooklyn holds a ton of leverage. Sure Philly will add different value in place of Maxey (Picks/Thybulle/whatever), but if you are convinced Maxey is a future star PG then you may need to make the trade happen at the deadline.

Otherwise I agree keeping Harden for a potential run this offseason and then moving him in a S&T would be super appealing unless Harden starts dogging it.

I have not posted once in the Harden/Simmons thread on purpose, but I don't think Maxey is available now.

[VCfor3]

So, I've always felt like the Nets would be stupid to trade Harden now. If he really does want Philly; so what? Try and win a ring. Those chances don't come often. Try and convince him to stay. And the S&T (or opt in with the opt in only because of a wink wink trade incoming) will always be there.

I guess he could be toxic enough to the place and demand out, but barring a I really don't want to be here and might even be injured sort of stance from Harden, I have been a proponent from the Nets perspective of figure it out next offseason.

I will say, the one thing that would totally mess that up is a different Simmons trade depending upon what it is. If I'm the Nets I'm really watching the Minnesota Sacramento whoever offers for Simmons and hoping Morey stays steadfast in what he has been doing.

I think Beal shaking free is the main threat moreso than Minnesota or Sacramento. But the other issue with waiting is Maxey. He has been playing very well this year. If he blows up in the playoffs, you may not be able to get him. I think right now you can get Simmons+Maxey. If Maxey goes super nova, you likely only get one of the two in a S&T even though Brooklyn holds a ton of leverage. Sure Philly will add different value in place of Maxey (Picks/Thybulle/whatever), but if you are convinced Maxey is a future star PG then you may need to make the trade happen at the deadline.

Otherwise I agree keeping Harden for a potential run this offseason and then moving him in a S&T would be super appealing unless Harden starts dogging it.

I have not posted once in the Harden/Simmons thread on purpose, but I don't think Maxey is available now.

Fair and personally I wouldn't include him. Maxey has been a ton of fun the few times I've gotten to watch him. Loved him going toe to toe with Ja for the win a few games ago.

[Texas Chuck]

I'm very alone on this I understand but if I'm the Wizards I look at that Harden/Simmons rumor and think damn I don't want to miss out on Simmons instead of:

signing Beal to a new max

or

trading Beal for a pile of lessor assets

or

trying to salvage a S&T

I think I'd say getting Simmons is the BCS for our Beal situation and I don't want to miss this window. I'd be calling Morey and saying straight up, let's do it right now. And I think unless Morey knows something we don't he might well take the Beal in the hand over the maybe of Harden.

And because Beal too can opt in it doesn't even totally remove Harden from options as Brooklyn would likely entertain a swap of Harden for Beal this off=season if Harden says I'm leaving regardless.

[K_chile22]

I'm very alone on this I understand but if I'm the Wizards I look at that Harden/Simmons rumor and think damn I don't want to miss out on Simmons instead of:

signing Beal to a new max

or

trading Beal for a pile of lessor assets

or

trying to salvage a S&T

I think I'd say getting Simmons is the BCS for our Beal situation and I don't want to miss this window. I'd be calling Morey and saying straight up, let's do it right now. And I think unless Morey knows something we don't he might well take the Beal in the hand over the maybe of Harden.

And because Beal too can opt in it doesn't even totally remove Harden from options as Brooklyn would likely entertain a swap of Harden for Beal this off=season if Harden says I'm leaving regardless.

I think the wizards are just loyal to Beal to a fault and vice versa

[NYG]

Randle to Portland
Brunson to NYK
McCollum to Dallas

With tons of filler going on salary and value wise.

[NYG]

Randle to Portland
Brunson to NYK
McCollum to Dallas

With tons of filler going on salary and value wise.

Chuck/JRoy... what makes that work?

[daoneandonly]

[url][/url]

Randle to Portland
Brunson to NYK
McCollum to Dallas

With tons of filler going on salary and value wise.

Chuck/JRoy... what makes that work?

Nothing. Brunson won't command anywhere near what CJ makes, so no reason for Dallas to do this

[Texas Chuck]

Randle to Portland
Brunson to NYK
McCollum to Dallas

With tons of filler going on salary and value wise.

I don't have Dallas having $25M worth of salary they would want to give away unless its THJ and I don't know that the Knicks take him back. And while CJ is better than Brunson this year how much longer is that going to be the case? I don't think the upgrade for Dallas is worth the detonation of depth. Even if Brunson gets a huge payday this off-season its likely to be $10M cheaper than CJ. But more than that, its the players Dallas has to dump now just to match salary.

Who were you thinking Dallas would include--Powell and THJ I'm guessing? I know Powell is bad money but if you look at Dallas' centers you'd have to replace him cheap. Boban played for the first time in 20 games last night for like 2 minutes. Moses Brown is equally nailed to the bench and they both aren't ready to take minutes. KP is always hurt and if Kleber becomes the 2nd center now Dallas is playing Bullock as their full time back up PF.

I think that money gap renders this very very difficult. Because Dallas needs the players they give up to match and the teams taking them would go oh yuck THJ/Powell give me major incentive that Dallas isn't going to want to give.

[NYG]

[url][/url]

Randle to Portland
Brunson to NYK
McCollum to Dallas

With tons of filler going on salary and value wise.

Chuck/JRoy... what makes that work?

Nothing. Brunson won't command anywhere near what CJ makes, so no reason for Dallas to do this

What if the filler was THJ and Powell

[NYG]

Randle to Portland
Brunson to NYK
McCollum to Dallas

With tons of filler going on salary and value wise.

I don't have Dallas having $25M worth of salary they would want to give away unless its THJ and I don't know that the Knicks take him back. And while CJ is better than Brunson this year how much longer is that going to be the case? I don't think the upgrade for Dallas is worth the detonation of depth. Even if Brunson gets a huge payday this off-season its likely to be $10M cheaper than CJ. But more than that, its the players Dallas has to dump now just to match salary.

Who were you thinking Dallas would include--Powell and THJ I'm guessing? I know Powell is bad money but if you look at Dallas' centers you'd have to replace him cheap. Boban played for the first time in 20 games last night for like 2 minutes. Moses Brown is equally nailed to the bench and they both aren't ready to take minutes. KP is always hurt and if Kleber becomes the 2nd center now Dallas is playing Bullock as their full time back up PF.

I think that money gap renders this very very difficult. Because Dallas needs the players they give up to match and the teams taking them would go oh yuck THJ/Powell give me major incentive that Dallas isn't going to want to give.

I was thinking THJ to NYK and Powell to Portland

[NYG]

I would shop THJ for a similarly valued PF though from a 4th team just in terms of depth.