Trade Deadline Discussion & Rumours - Raptors and NBA

[WuTang_CMB]

But we arent going to trade a first and second for Jak/Turner. I agree we need another solid 6 and 7 rotation guys, we dont have those yet. The price of two picks at this stage of timeline and this year is shortsighted to me. If the team falls in the first round which is a major possibility, and has zero picks this year (we already dont have our 2nd), that's an underwhelming start to the off-season when this management team uses the draft to continue to grow and create assets.

1) Second round picks are just face-savers for GMs who fail to negotiate 1sts. There's not much value there. The Raptors have had more undrafted hits (Fred/TD) than second round hits (Norm). We now have guys that prefer to sign here when undrafted. Trade all the seconds, forever.

2) If it's the right player, then they shouldn't hesitate. We're not one player away, but we're also not one late round pick blowing up away. We have the most exciting rookie in the league, starting. This is all free money.

Trading away 2 picks at the deadline is the wrong move at this stage. We are going to trade a draft capital package when we can easily slip to play in or just stay and lose in first round. Jak/Turner arent moving the needle. Dont think you are taking into consideration the risk/reward here. Just have a hard time seeing Masai make that move this season.

Not to mention we are doing this for a guy who likely wont finish games. Doesnt really make sense for the price we are paying. We likely find a better value deal out there so we can have our cake and eat it too.

[aligator]

No, you are right. Raps have no interest in Turner or any C (besides an end of bench energency guy) for that matter.

[VanWest82]

Jakob I'm not a fan of.

Bamba is kind of bad defensively, but he'll protect the Rim and hit 3s

Turner would probably be a game changer even if he's 6th man, will he buy into being 6th man tho?

We need a guard more than anything.

If we trade for Turner then he's starting. Barnes will move to the bench.

Not necessarily, GTj could be the guy depending on the matchups. Nurse has that record (see Marc vs Serge(vs Jonas) until he settled on Marc
One of the pros of getting Turner is to fit between Barnes and Siakam

Scottie has been playing the 5 in our small line up and our biggest team weakness is shooting. It's possible Nurse juggles depending on match up but I have to think Trent stays most of the time.

[OakleyDokely]

If we trade for Turner then he's starting. Barnes will move to the bench.

Another reason not to trade for Turner

Why? Raps might win more and Barnes might develop faster getting to play on ball more.

I'd rather him get accustomed to starting and have him develop chemistry with the starters as soon as possible.

And frankly, he's going to be more impactful than Turner by next year.

This is after all, using Masai's words, a rebuilding year.

[alienchild]

I bet Raptors and Pacers are playing chicken over a Turner deal. Raptors offered Dragic + FRP. Pacers want more. The clock is ticking.

Masai doesn't play chicken. If he doesn't like a deal, he walks away.

[VanWest82]

Another reason not to trade for Turner

Why? Raps might win more and Barnes might develop faster getting to play on ball more.

I'd rather him get accustomed to starting and have him develop chemistry with the starters as soon as possible.

And frankly, he's going to be more impactful than Turner by next year.

This is after all, using Masai's words, a rebuilding year.

It was that but it's probably not anymore if we're talking about trading FRPs and playoff seeding.

[dukes_wild]

A guard to do what? play 10 minutes as a backup to FVV? that's all the room we could have left for that guard (disregarding the impact on Banton's 10 minutes)

There is room for 20-25 minutes a night. He doesn't just have to handle the point.

We want to be big
Siakam-OG-Barnes-Precious-Boucher |Barnes-GTj-OG-Boucher-Birch|etc.....there are no 20-25 minutes available.

We desperately need guard help off the bench. We don't have enough players on this team who can actually provide value with the ball in their hands at a consistent level.

A player like Bogdan who can act as a pseudo-backup point guard who can slide into the 2/3 spots as well with our starters to provide more spacing would elevate the ceiling of our team way more than another 6'10 player who can't create off the dribble or make plays for others

[OakleyDokely]

Why? Raps might win more and Barnes might develop faster getting to play on ball more.

I'd rather him get accustomed to starting and have him develop chemistry with the starters as soon as possible.

And frankly, he's going to be more impactful than Turner by next year.

This is after all, using Masai's words, a rebuilding year.

It was that but it's probably not anymore if we're talking about trading FRPs and playoff seeding.

Trading 1st rnd picks is really just media speculation at this point.

I'm sure there are deals where Masai would give them up, but I don't believe for a second that the Raps are going to trade Dragic+1st for the best player they can get.

[redeye514]

Send a message to the players that you want to win and believe in them. You trust them to develop and dont need any picks. Bring in Jak.

We are not giving away 2 picks for Jak/Turner.

Play it smart and stay patient. We can easily slip to play in spot and lose in first round or stay where we are and still lose in 1st round.

Remember what happened last season when the Bulls gave up Wendell Carter Jr. and 2 first round picks at the deadline when they were fighting to make the play-in?

They missed the playoffs and Orlando got a top 10 pick that got them Franz Wagner. I can't believe the Bulls didn't put even lottery protection on that pick.

We are in 6th...but could easily be 10th in a month or so.

I’m not advocating for trading a pick or not.. But this bulls- magic analogy is really just perspective. I mean, the bulls were making a play for Vucevic as a long term piece, which they got. They prob trade Wagner for vucevic regardless.. the Bulls wanted an all star / fringe all star C, and paid an appropriate price for one.. and it’s worked out fairly well for them, flirting with first place all season. hard to point to that as an example of a team that inappropriately traded a draft pick..

[TheRaptor!]

Send a message to the players that you want to win and believe in them. You trust them to develop and dont need any picks. Bring in Jak.

We are not giving away 2 picks for Jak/Turner.

Play it smart and stay patient. We can easily slip to play in spot and lose in first round or stay where we are and still lose in 1st round.

Remember what happened last season when the Bulls gave up Wendell Carter Jr. and 2 first round picks at the deadline when they were fighting to make the play-in?

They missed the playoffs and Orlando got a top 10 pick that got them Franz Wagner. I can't believe the Bulls didn't put even lottery protection on that pick.

We are in 6th...but could easily be 10th in a month or so.

All I see are the Bulls on top of the conference

[MikeM]

There's a 25 year old wing averaging 12-10-4-1.5-.15 per 36. He can guard multiple positions and handle the ball. He used to be able to shoot too.

Winslow.

[VanWest82]

I'd rather him get accustomed to starting and have him develop chemistry with the starters as soon as possible.

And frankly, he's going to be more impactful than Turner by next year.

This is after all, using Masai's words, a rebuilding year.

It was that but it's probably not anymore if we're talking about trading FRPs and playoff seeding.

Trading 1st rnd picks is really just media speculation at this point.

I'm sure there are deals where Masai would give them up, but I don't believe for a second that the Raps are going to trade Dragic+1st for the best player they can get.

I don't either, but even if they don't this year has turned into something more than just a development year.

[Clutch0z24]

Jakob I'm not a fan of.

Bamba is kind of bad defensively, but he'll protect the Rim and hit 3s

Turner would probably be a game changer even if he's 6th man, will he buy into being 6th man tho?

We need a guard more than anything.

If we trade for Turner then he's starting. Barnes will move to the bench.

Why Can't OG play SG? I think if we grabbed Turner the Lineup would be

FVV
OG
Barnes
Siakam
Turner

6th Man Trent Jr

Thats how i would run it anyways...OG is a good enough 3 point shooter and a defender to play the SG position

[dukes_wild]

There's a 25 year old wing averaging 12-10-4-1.5-.15 per 36. He can guard multiple positions and handle the ball. He used to be able to shoot too.

Winslow.

Winslow has never been able to shoot

Also per36 numbers are a horrible way to evaluate like 90% of players in the NBA. Low MPG guys who pad in garbage time or exert a ton of energy in very limited minutes will always have good per36 numbers. Like prime Ed Davis

[mtcan]

We are not giving away 2 picks for Jak/Turner.

Play it smart and stay patient. We can easily slip to play in spot and lose in first round or stay where we are and still lose in 1st round.

Remember what happened last season when the Bulls gave up Wendell Carter Jr. and 2 first round picks at the deadline when they were fighting to make the play-in?

They missed the playoffs and Orlando got a top 10 pick that got them Franz Wagner. I can't believe the Bulls didn't put even lottery protection on that pick.

We are in 6th...but could easily be 10th in a month or so.

All I see are the Bulls on top of the conference

Thanks to Demar Derozan, Lonzo Ball and Alex Caruso.

Vuc in Chicago was a failure up until then...

[dukes_wild]

Jakob I'm not a fan of.

Bamba is kind of bad defensively, but he'll protect the Rim and hit 3s

Turner would probably be a game changer even if he's 6th man, will he buy into being 6th man tho?

We need a guard more than anything.

If we trade for Turner then he's starting. Barnes will move to the bench.

Why Can't OG play SG? I think if we grabbed Turner the Lineup would be

FVV
OG
Barnes
Siakam
Turner

6th Man Trent Jr

Thats how i would run it anyways...OG is a good enough 3 point shooter and a defender to play the SG position

Taking Trent out of the starting 5 is a terrible idea.

Trent spaces the floor way more than OG. OG's 3pt% is solid but he's by no means a shooter that defenses fear and will scramble heavily to close out at the 3pt line.

He's also too slow laterally to defend the 2 spot effectively. He'd get picked apart by the top tier SGs in the league both on and off the ball

If we added a legit 5 and put him into the starting lineup, the only option is benching Barnes to create that space.

[MikeM]

There's a 25 year old wing averaging 12-10-4-1.5-.15 per 36. He can guard multiple positions and handle the ball. He used to be able to shoot too.

Winslow.

Winslow has never been able to shoot

Also per36 numbers are a horrible way to evaluate like 90% of players in the NBA. Low MPG guys who pad in garbage time or exert a ton of energy in very limited minutes will always have good per36 numbers. Like prime Ed Davis

Good thing he won't play 36 minutes for us.

Also he shot 38% over 2 years and 400 threes for Miami. So at one point he could shoot, yes.

[redeye514]

Remember what happened last season when the Bulls gave up Wendell Carter Jr. and 2 first round picks at the deadline when they were fighting to make the play-in?

They missed the playoffs and Orlando got a top 10 pick that got them Franz Wagner. I can't believe the Bulls didn't put even lottery protection on that pick.

We are in 6th...but could easily be 10th in a month or so.

All I see are the Bulls on top of the conference

Thanks to Demar Derozan, Lonzo Ball and Alex Caruso.

Vuc in Chicago was a failure up until then...

When Vuc got to chicago, Lavine went down for an extended period. Regardless, I agree that vuc is just one of many pieces that Chicago put in place to get to where they are, but you are using it is as an example of a team foolishly trading their pick, when in fact it’s the exact opposite. Chicago traded a pick for a piece, and are now a top team in part because of that move…

[dukes_wild]

There's a 25 year old wing averaging 12-10-4-1.5-.15 per 36. He can guard multiple positions and handle the ball. He used to be able to shoot too.

Winslow.

Winslow has never been able to shoot

Also per36 numbers are a horrible way to evaluate like 90% of players in the NBA. Low MPG guys who pad in garbage time or exert a ton of energy in very limited minutes will always have good per36 numbers. Like prime Ed Davis

Good thing he won't play 36 minutes for us.

Also he shot 38% over 2 years and 400 threes for Miami. So at one point he could shoot, yes.

He shot 38% on extremely low volume, and considering his inability to shoot 3s before and after, it's very obvious that the 2018-2019 season where he shot 38% on 4 attempts per game was an outlier

[Jadoogar]

We are not giving away 2 picks for Jak/Turner.

Play it smart and stay patient. We can easily slip to play in spot and lose in first round or stay where we are and still lose in 1st round.

Remember what happened last season when the Bulls gave up Wendell Carter Jr. and 2 first round picks at the deadline when they were fighting to make the play-in?

They missed the playoffs and Orlando got a top 10 pick that got them Franz Wagner. I can't believe the Bulls didn't put even lottery protection on that pick.

We are in 6th...but could easily be 10th in a month or so.

All I see are the Bulls on top of the conference

Do the Bulls get Demar/Lonzo/Caruso is they don't already have Vuc?
Yes they didn't improve immediately but they don't have this year's success without the Vuc trade.