2021-22 NBA Season Discussion

[falcolombardi]

For this season sure...but Kyrie Irving is injury prone and that has been his problem for the two prior seasons.

I know you love your narratives and even more so you love to hate on people, but the biggest problem for the Nets by far is their health concerns not their "narcissistic' personalities. Their personalities had nothing to do with why they lost last year, much less the year before that.

Going on a "sabbatical" in the middle of the season for vague "personal issues" had nothing to do with injuries. That whole saga last year wasn't much different than him thinking it's okay to be a part-time player this year, even as it's visibly wearing on his teammates. Kyrie is a narcissist who only cares about himself, who never factors in what's best for his team, and thinks he's above honoring his contract. And the Nets have enabled him every step of the way.

It's not hating, it's simple facts. Everyone knew that the Nets were taking a huge risk by uniting the three biggest divas in the league. This isn't some "narrative" I'm spinning out of nothing, this was a widely acknowledged caveat with their team's construction.

Can't say that I disagree with a lot of the sentiments here.

To expand on this, it's incredibly ironic when you think about how all 3 of them ended up where they are now. To take a look at each:

KD: wanted to prove that he can lead a team to a championship after feeling like he didn't get enough credit on the Warriors. Irony is that he could've done that in OKC and seemed to be the only person in the world who didn't know how him joining a 73-win team that beat him in the year prior would be perceived. Disturbed by how others viewed him drove him to find new glory where he would be the undisputed #1. In return, he exchanged a great system and the best and most selfless teammate he ever had for two of the only players that rival him in diva-ness and an unproven organization.

Harden: wanted to join a contending team after declaring his old team as "just not good enough" and came into the season deliberately fat. Irony is that Houston wasn't good enough largely because he himself hamstrung them by forcing them to trade away his best teammate (who got him closest to winning a championship as the lead dog) after said teammate demanded that he play more within a team context at the expense of Harden's gaudy individual stats. Compounding this, Houston was forced to trade for Westbrook who had sky-high usage like him, couldn't shoot and was also on one of the worst contracts in the league. Westbrook soon tired of playing with Harden and the Rockets were once again forced to trade for an even worse contract in John Wall.

Now the team he demanded to be traded to is losing and he's unhappy about a myriad of things and wants to move again when at first all he supposedly wanted was to win a championship.

Kyrie: like KD, wanted to prove he could win without Bron and forced his way out. Went to the Celtics and torpedoed their season with his drama and joined forces with KD to create a contender by themselves. Three seasons have passed and he's torpedoing the very team that he himself played a big part in creating.

to make matters worse, al horford supposedly was joining okc if dursnt stayed

horford/durant/roberson/oladipo/westbrook in 2017 + Steven Adams

that team would have been the favorite over spurs, warriors and cavs for the next 3 years

[parsnips33]

Celtics have the best net rating in the East according to bball reference but are only the 7th seed. Could they make some noise in the playoffs?

[Colbinii]

Celtics have the best net rating in the East according to bball reference but are only the 7th seed. Could they make some noise in the playoffs?

Yes. They have a walking 50-point scorer in Tatum and terrific role players [Smart, Brown, Williams, Horford].

I would actually like to see them make a consolidate trade.

[feyki]

Ahahaha what about Hassan Whiteside??

[feyki]

T-Mac in the first 4 games of the 2003 Playoffs:

36,5 PPG, 4,5 APG, +12,5 rTS, +17 rORTG.

[MartinToVaught]

Celtics have the best net rating in the East according to bball reference but are only the 7th seed. Could they make some noise in the playoffs?

I can't see them making any serious playoff run with the way they blow leads.

T-Mac in the first 4 games of the 2003 Playoffs:

36,5 PPG, 4,5 APG, +12,5 rTS, +17 rORTG.

And Doc still managed to choke that series away with T-Mac playing like that.

[Colbinii]

Celtics have the best net rating in the East according to bball reference but are only the 7th seed. Could they make some noise in the playoffs?

I can't see them making any serious playoff run with the way they blow leads.

T-Mac in the first 4 games of the 2003 Playoffs:

36,5 PPG, 4,5 APG, +12,5 rTS, +17 rORTG.

And Doc still managed to choke that series away with T-Mac playing like that.

What did Doc do in order to choke the series?

[Outside]

T-Mac in the first 4 games of the 2003 Playoffs:

36,5 PPG, 4,5 APG, +12,5 rTS, +17 rORTG.

1. Why list the first four games only when he shot great and the team did well but skip the last three games which were terrible?

2. (Looking at the thread title.) What does this have to do with the 2021-22 season?

[falcolombardi]

Celtics have the best net rating in the East according to bball reference but are only the 7th seed. Could they make some noise in the playoffs?

I can't see them making any serious playoff run with the way they blow leads.

T-Mac in the first 4 games of the 2003 Playoffs:

36,5 PPG, 4,5 APG, +12,5 rTS, +17 rORTG.

And Doc still managed to choke that series away with T-Mac playing like that.

What did Doc do in order to choke the series?

just looking st rosters detroit seems the much better team so it could be argued doc overachieved by getting that 3-1 lead in the first place

a bit different that the clippers 3-1 loss to rockets in 2015 or to nuggets in 2020 where they had the better team

[70sFan]

T-Mac in the first 4 games of the 2003 Playoffs:

36,5 PPG, 4,5 APG, +12,5 rTS, +17 rORTG.

1. Why list the first four games only when he shot great and the team did well but skip the last three games which were terrible?

He did the same thing with 2014 LMA and he said that Aldridge was top 5 player in the playoffs.

[Colbinii]

Morey did it

[Colbinii]

Re: 76ers preferring to wait to the off-season to trade Simmons - hoping for Harden:

I just find myself shaking my head at Morey this year. While it's within the realm of possibility that Morey being super-patient on the Simmons trades works out just as he's hoping, he can't know it's going to work out, and if he makes no trade before the deadline, then this will mean he's wasted 2 years of Embiid's prime when he was brought into make the hard decisions that Elton Brand could not.

I consider Morey's Houston work to be among the best GMing performances of the 21st century, but his Philly work may end up being among the most disappointing.

I guess I sort of agree with you and it’s definitely frustrating. But my I guess my question is this?

Do we think that any of the pieces that were available thus far make them into contenders this year?

It seems like people are in agreement that last the Sixers WITH Ben Simmons are solidly not contenders.

If Morey makes a move for say McCollum do we really think that’s a contending team? Because if the answer is No, then doesn’t making that trade effectively end Embiid’s window?

I guess I can see the rationale (although I waiver on agreeing with it) that Morey’s better off trying to hit a home run at this stage, even if the odds are relatively slim.

Also, while I think the Laker’s are proof of why you don’t let your franchise player be your GM, I have to think that Embiid must have signed off on this approach. There’s no chance that he’s not being consulted every step of the way right?

None of this is to say that the Sixers shouldn’t have tried to keep Butler and move Simmons, but I think that was before Morey’s time?

The time to trade Simmons was before last year's playoff trauma. Simple as that. His stock has fallen drastically, as has other franchise's perception of the 76ers' leverage. This may seem like a "Well sure, given everything we know now.", but many of us said that one of the two stars needed to be traded after the 2020 playoffs, and speaking for myself, I had assumed that they brought Morey in to make the hard decision that no one earlier had had the balls to make.

So to me, by far the biggest decision Morey made was not taking seriously the idea that he was sitting on something of a ticking timebomb.

The fact that after the timebomb went off Morey's continued to drag his heels in the name of not trading Simmons until someone else gets desperate enough to offer something fitting for Simmons' prior trade value is the more fascinating spectacle, but it's largely just a gamble being made because Philly doesn't like any of the options realistically available to them at this point. Well and good to try this for a while, but the longer you try it, the more the reality of the consequences will sink in.

Your franchise player is the most injury-prone franchise player since Bill Walton, and if you don't trade Simmons until the off-season, then you've literally wasted what could easily become the healthiest year of his career (if Embiid actually managed to avoid another injury until next season) under the premise that Ben Simmons is so highly valued by other NBA teams that the 76ers will successfully him for assets that you see as more valuable than Simmons.

Maybe it pays off, but if it doesn't, Morey's going to look like a fool.

Re: if trading for McCollum closes the 76ers championship window, why do it? I'd suggest that to the degree McCollum not being good enough could be said to close an open championship window, we should also acknowledge that said championship window has already closed, and what Morey is praying is that the right trade will come along for Simmons that will pry it back open

That prayer can in theory last forever, but let it suffice to say that while Morey claims he can wait Simmons out for 4 years, he cannot. He'll get fired before then, and look like an idiot who strung along the 76ers franchise for years because he really had no plan for how to get the team where he was hired to get them.

Not a fool after all.

[parsnips33]

I'm really glad this didn't carry over into the offseason lol. Harden and Embiid might break the record for free throws in a game

[mikejames23]

I really thought he would waste an entire year of Simmons. Good job Morey.

[cpower]

its hard to say if philly actually improves this season. i can see slight drop in Embiid's numbers which could impact his MVP chances

[parsnips33]

I honestly don't know if I'm more excited for East or West playoffs this year. So many good teams

[TheGOATRises007]

If Harden can get back to what he was pre-hamstring injury, I like the Sixers in the East.

But I really think he may have just declined in general.

It's amazing how the Nets big 3 failed all because of Kyrie in the end. Hilarious.

[MartinToVaught]

Read on Twitter

Kudos to Embiid for being a good teammate during all these rumors.

[Outside]

What a strange saga.

For this season, giving up Seth Curry hurts, but if Harden stays healthy, meshes with the team, particularly Embiid, and approaches a reasonably productive version of himself (none of that a given), then this makes Philly better than having Ben Simmons doing literally zero. Longer term, giving up two first round picks hurts. Mid-term, knowing that Harden can walk after this season is a big risk, but realistically, I don't know how many places Harden could go at this point. But Harden will demand the max, even if he's not worth it anymore, so that's another problem.

We'll see how this works for the Nets. Adding Simmons to dysfunction central is rolling the dice. Maybe Simmons will get along great with KD and Kyrie, or maybe they'll be like matter and anti-matter. The risk seems pretty high. Until I see otherwise, they still seem like a hot mess. Nash may not be the greatest coach, but I don't know what he did in a previous life to deserve this.

[clearlynotjesse]

Thoughts on the Embiid/Harden fit? Obviously championship level talent but curious to see how the 15th best coach in NBA history will use them.