Who would you prefer on your team ? Coby or Ayo?

[Bulliever2020]

There's a reason why this guy is on the foe list for the majority of the Bulls board.

[HotelVitale]

In games he has started, 11.4p 6.8a 3.8r 1.2s 1.6to 54.7%fg 41.8%3p
For a starting NBA PG, that's pretty mediocre. Nice efficiency, relatively low volume.

Certainly comparable to Lonzo Ball’s career numbers, and this year. For a rookie I wouldn’t want to call the numbers mediocre though. Rookie and all.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I think Ayo is fantastic. Let's not forget that one of his starts was when he played an entire game with a concussion and went 1-7. In the long term, I think Ayo is the better option to start over Ball. I'm just trying to be "objective" and lay out the actual stats with no spin. Even with no asterisks (rookie, 2nd round pick, injuries), the numbers are . . . fine.

Fine is all I can muster for the stats too. I actually think Ayo's non-statistical things are where he shines and what people should be basing a case for him on, esp since there are several things that make those numbers much less sweet than his boosters are letting on here:
--in games he's starting, he's playing 38 minutes per night, which would be 2nd in the whole league if he kept it up; in case it's not obvious 11/7/4 is extremely small production for 38 minutes per game--for example 11pts per 36 puts Ayo in the bottom 10% of rotation players this year, alongside only defensive specialists and guys having dreadful years
--buyer beware on the 3pt stats, even in those huge-minutes starts he's putting up about 3 3pt shots per game and he's never been a high volume shooter; a cold-shooting week or two could push the 41% down into the mid-30s, which is where he was in college
None of that is bad per se or a condemnation of him as a prospect or player, it's just that a stat-based argument for him isn't particularly strong or anything more than 'looks okay for a rook, let's wait and see where he goes from here.'

[FriedRise]

I think this is what they call a landslide.

[bwgood77]

For contract reasons, Ayo. In a year and a few months, Coby gets paid.

Otherwise a toss up.

[bwgood77]

Better question is in 2 years who do you prefer to have with Ayo? Coby or Ball? I think they keep one and get rid of the other...paying Coby and Ball along with LaVine, DeRozan and Vucevic if they keep all 3 (along with maybe Patrick Williams) will be the problem.

[Roger Murdock]

The poll results are misleading because I voted for Coby by mistake and meant to click Ayo.

Ayo by a mile. I've been impressed everytime Ive watched him. Hes essentially a vet already.

Coby just stinks and hasnt developed.

[Lunartic]

I accidentally voted Coby 12 times using my burner accounts so results might be a bit shoddy

viewtopic.php?p=96904218#p96904218

I told ya OP, Ayo is a multidimensional player and is still a rookie, Coby is one dimensional. Ayo is considered untouchable by AKME unless the trade is for a star-level player. Dumb teams like the Kings traded away their future star in Haliburton for win-now pieces.

[JujitsuFlip]

I think this is what they call a landslide.

[Lunartic]

I didn't realize this was a debate on the Bulls board and I'm a frequent poster there.

because it's not a debate

[mj234eva]

OP why don't you tell the general board about coby's 1k points over a season?

fun times.

[mj234eva]

viewtopic.php?p=96194115#p96194115

to me this is interesting info and a reason why we struggle offensively with lonzo though he can stuff the stat sheet. opens my eyes to matt thomas , mckinnie as guys who can have expanded roles.

This gem came from the OP.

I don't take their basketball opinions seriously. He has become something like a caricature of himself.

[BeatDaCavs420]

@ The poll results...DeBaTe On BuLlS BoArd

OP is the only one debating it over there with his trolling

[fleet]

I accidentally voted Coby 12 times using my burner accounts so results might be a bit shoddy

You crazy kids and your computers

[old skool]

Dosunmu is doing great for a rookie, because so many rookies are youngsters with relatively little experience versus high level competition. Bulls fans have every right to be excited over him, because he has been an unexpected contributor on an overacheiving team. Great return on a 2nd round pick.

Coby White has been a frustrating disappointment, with multiple highs and lows sprinkled throughout his rookie contract tenure. A less than hoped for return on a 1st round pick.

Different players, but probably viewed as having comparable overall NBA value.





Sent from my SM-N960U using RealGM mobile app

[PaKii94]

OP why don't you tell the general board about coby's 1k points over a season?

sure cobe scored more in his 2nd season than lauri markaneen ever has in his career in a single season.

1k plus points . Lauri make 16m a year.
Will ayo ever score 1k in a season? is he capable of it?

My dude you brought up Lauri in this thread (who is still a better player than Coby) and again, literally no one gives any sh*ts about Coby scoring 1k on dreadful efficiency. I'd rather bank on ayo developing his scoring (he already has everything else) vs Coby developing how to play ball.

[PaKii94]

Certainly comparable to Lonzo Ball’s career numbers, and this year. For a rookie I wouldn’t want to call the numbers mediocre though. Rookie and all.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I think Ayo is fantastic. Let's not forget that one of his starts was when he played an entire game with a concussion and went 1-7. In the long term, I think Ayo is the better option to start over Ball. I'm just trying to be "objective" and lay out the actual stats with no spin. Even with no asterisks (rookie, 2nd round pick, injuries), the numbers are . . . fine.

Fine is all I can muster for the stats too. I actually think Ayo's non-statistical things are where he shines and what people should be basing a case for him on, esp since there are several things that make those numbers much less sweet than his boosters are letting on here:
--in games he's starting, he's playing 38 minutes per night, which would be 2nd in the whole league if he kept it up; in case it's not obvious 11/7/4 is extremely small production for 38 minutes per game--for example 11pts per 36 puts Ayo in the bottom 10% of rotation players this year, alongside only defensive specialists and guys having dreadful years
--buyer beware on the 3pt stats, even in those huge-minutes starts he's putting up about 3 3pt shots per game and he's never been a high volume shooter; a cold-shooting week or two could push the 41% down into the mid-30s, which is where he was in college
None of that is bad per se or a condemnation of him as a prospect or player, it's just that a stat-based argument for him isn't particularly strong or anything more than 'looks okay for a rook, let's wait and see where he goes from here.'

All you said is true. However I think ayo's scoring game has been oppressed with playing next to Lavine/DeRozan/vuc. He's been busy with his playmaking/defense role. When those guys were out he did step up his scoring.

Watch on YouTube

[bearadonisdna]

OP why don't you tell the general board about coby's 1k points over a season?

sure cobe scored more in his 2nd season than lauri markaneen ever has in his career in a single season.

1k plus points . Lauri make 16m a year.
Will ayo ever score 1k in a season? is he capable of it?

My dude you brought up Lauri in this thread (who is still a better player than Coby) and again, literally no one gives any sh*ts about Coby scoring 1k on dreadful efficiency. I'd rather bank on ayo developing his scoring (he already has everything else) vs Coby developing how to play ball.

Look at this crap defending an 11 PER player.
Talk about dreadful efficiency , my dude.
This is what really agitates me about this group .
It’s so much glass house syndrome .
As we speak Cobe has outscored ANO playing 300 less minutes . So the scoring on volume and just being a more efficient player using PER which is an efficiency rating .

Also I’ve used per 36 to show cobe is more productive . The fact is the vitriol that comes from the ANO apologist and their cobe hate is so polarizing you would think the bulls hadn’t squandered the 1st seed recently . This isn’t all about cobe, it’s their last bastion to deflect he has been a tank commander vs .500 while PROVIDING NOTHING OF VALUE AND COULD BE REPLACED BY PRACTICALLY anybody on the roster . Cobe happens to be collateral damage .

This is the same type of reaction you would get if I slandered somebody like Caruso . It’s the media circus kids that warrant this type of gung ho swarm of apologist . Also revisionist history , an absolute lack of accountability regarding the point in question which is trash starts vs .500 teams.
Btw I don’t care he went to Illinois or whatever weird fan accommodations .
He is an 11 PER player you can get that anywhere so I think these apologist need to get their mind right .
If I wanted to trash Vuc or Zach or even derozan I would probably have an army behind me. Not for Ayo or Caruso though . They are untouchable . It’s sad.

[bearadonisdna]

There's a reason why this guy is on the foe list for the majority of the Bulls board.

And there’s a reason why that boards narrative is mostly driven by lower ranked posters,
Which to me is not acceptable .

[PaKii94]

sure cobe scored more in his 2nd season than lauri markaneen ever has in his career in a single season.

1k plus points . Lauri make 16m a year.
Will ayo ever score 1k in a season? is he capable of it?

My dude you brought up Lauri in this thread (who is still a better player than Coby) and again, literally no one gives any sh*ts about Coby scoring 1k on dreadful efficiency. I'd rather bank on ayo developing his scoring (he already has everything else) vs Coby developing how to play ball.

Look at this crap defending an 11 PER player.
Talk about dreadful efficiency , my dude.
This is what really agitates me about this group .
It’s so much glass house syndrome .
As we speak Cobe has outscored ANO playing 300 less minutes . So the scoring on volume and just being a more efficient player using PER which is an efficiency rating .

Also I’ve used per 36 to show cobe is more productive . The fact is the vitriol that comes from the ANO apologist and their cobe hate is so polarizing you would think the bulls hadn’t squandered the 1st seed recently . This isn’t all about cobe, it’s their last bastion to deflect he has been a tank commander vs .500 while PROVIDING NOTHING OF VALUE AND COULD BE REPLACED BY PRACTICALLY anybody on the roster . Cobe happens to be collateral damage .

This is the same type of reaction you would get if I slandered somebody like Caruso . It’s the media circus kids that warrant this type of gung ho swarm of apologist . Also revisionist history , an absolute lack of accountability regarding the point in question which is trash starts vs .500 teams.
Btw I don’t care he went to Illinois or whatever weird fan accommodations .
He is an 11 PER player you can get that anywhere so I think these apologist need to get their mind right .
If I wanted to trash Vuc or Zach or even derozan I would probably have an army behind me. Not for Ayo or Caruso though . They are untouchable . It’s sad.

Sure. I can't take anything you say seriously until you get COBY'S name right.... And even if you did, most of it is nonsense anyway.

[bearadonisdna]

My dude you brought up Lauri in this thread (who is still a better player than Coby) and again, literally no one gives any sh*ts about Coby scoring 1k on dreadful efficiency. I'd rather bank on ayo developing his scoring (he already has everything else) vs Coby developing how to play ball.

Look at this crap defending an 11 PER player.
Talk about dreadful efficiency , my dude.
This is what really agitates me about this group .
It’s so much glass house syndrome .
As we speak Cobe has outscored ANO playing 300 less minutes . So the scoring on volume and just being a more efficient player using PER which is an efficiency rating .

Also I’ve used per 36 to show cobe is more productive . The fact is the vitriol that comes from the ANO apologist and their cobe hate is so polarizing you would think the bulls hadn’t squandered the 1st seed recently . This isn’t all about cobe, it’s their last bastion to deflect he has been a tank commander vs .500 while PROVIDING NOTHING OF VALUE AND COULD BE REPLACED BY PRACTICALLY anybody on the roster . Cobe happens to be collateral damage .

This is the same type of reaction you would get if I slandered somebody like Caruso . It’s the media circus kids that warrant this type of gung ho swarm of apologist . Also revisionist history , an absolute lack of accountability regarding the point in question which is trash starts vs .500 teams.
Btw I don’t care he went to Illinois or whatever weird fan accommodations .
He is an 11 PER player you can get that anywhere so I think these apologist need to get their mind right .
If I wanted to trash Vuc or Zach or even derozan I would probably have an army behind me. Not for Ayo or Caruso though . They are untouchable . It’s sad.

Sure. I can't take anything you say seriously until you get COBY'S name right.... And even if you did, most of it is nonsense anyway.

Coby is a nickname and I chose to spell it the way I like . Youre not his mom so get over it.