The Official Jalen Suggs Thread

[jezzerinho]

Nothing really THAT concerning about Suggs yet, IMO.

Yes, there are some bad plays, yet, there are good plays. It is not all bad plays for him, and you can’t discount the fact that he tries. he puts in a lot of effort, and I dont think you can teach that. His motor alone makes up for it, IMO.

Yes, he isn’t that good right now. But I don’t think he is a bust either.

One thing you can hope for in a rookie is he improves every game, and we see that with Suggs. And I think that is a good sign, because that shows his IQ as well.

Now, if he doesnt improve or lessen the errors he makes on year 2, then that would be concerning.

But for the mean, these are growing pains and we have the luxury to afford it. It is not like this team cant afford to have him commit mistakes because we are trying to win.

This season is all about learning.

We could argue Cole is constantly improving too but yet most are concerned that he won't ever be what we need him to be.

The same standards have to be applied to everyone. Yes Suggs is improving and the are certain things he's already good at, but the concern is equally there for him that he'll stagnate as it is for Cole or Okeke.

I tend to err on the optimistic side with Suggs, just because of the attitude he has. But there's plenty of ground to be made up still.

[basketballRob]

Nothing really THAT concerning about Suggs yet, IMO.

Yes, there are some bad plays, yet, there are good plays. It is not all bad plays for him, and you can’t discount the fact that he tries. he puts in a lot of effort, and I dont think you can teach that. His motor alone makes up for it, IMO.

Yes, he isn’t that good right now. But I don’t think he is a bust either.

One thing you can hope for in a rookie is he improves every game, and we see that with Suggs. And I think that is a good sign, because that shows his IQ as well.

Now, if he doesnt improve or lessen the errors he makes on year 2, then that would be concerning.

But for the mean, these are growing pains and we have the luxury to afford it. It is not like this team cant afford to have him commit mistakes because we are trying to win.

This season is all about learning.

We could argue Cole is constantly improving too but yet most are concerned that he won't ever be what we need him to be.

The same standards have to be applied to everyone. Yes Suggs is improving and the are certain things he's already good at, but the concern is equally there for him that he'll stagnate as it is for Cole or Okeke.

I tend to err on the optimistic side with Suggs, just because of the attitude he has. But there's plenty of ground to be made up still.

Cole has been our best offensive player so far this season slightly ahead of Franz. His defense is so bad tho that he's been the 4th best player overall behind Wendell, Franz, and Suggs.

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[drsd]

Nothing really THAT concerning about Suggs yet, IMO.

At the top-15 of any draft, one can ask, "what is his definable NBA skill"? (which is why Gordon was always a risk).

For Suggs, he is proven to be capable as a defensive guard. He will carve out a multi-year career simply by being a pest. In that for me the absolute floor of Suggs is as a Bruce Bowen-type as a combo-guard. Just be a pest and annoy the opponents down.

As to his ceiling, I guess as a Chauncey Billups-type, if I had to consider the notion.
Interesting that the rookie numbers are not that far off between these two: rookie Player Comparison: Jalen Suggs vs. Chauncey Billups


..

[AaronB]

Yeah it’s pretty clear Suggs sucks almost as much as rookie Trae Young who shot 32% from 3 for his rookie season. And we’ve all seen that Trae is going nowhere and wouldn’t have a chance at sniffing a conference finals on his rookie contract…

Cue “Payton!” and “Kawhi Gordon” comments…

I’m a fan of Suggs but I don’t consider him the franchise cornerstone. I think he’s a good addition for the start of a rebuild. Let’s see if he rises over the next few seasons or someone supplants him. I don’t think we could complain if either eventuates.

How are Suggs & Trae even comparable?
Trae had almost 20 points, +8 assists rookie season on almost 54% TS.
Suggs has 12 points ,4,4 assists, and sits on 46% TS.

In Win share, Trae was 3rd best Atlanta player, even as a rookie, on Orlando, Suggs is the worst.

Trae arived in nba with 2 clear offensive strenghts. Playmaking & ability to draw fouls at ridicilous rate.
Suggs arived in nba with basically zero offensive strenghts and he is only useful as on ball defender.

Payton & Gordon and lesser exstend Hezonja, just like 3 previous years of unhealthy d*** riding of Bamba and blaming everybody but him for his shortcommings are good reminder that player does not have unlimited ceiling just because he joined your favorite team, and after some time, there is clear stagnation in improvment and it's time to accept player for what he is, not what forum wants him to be. We have same situation now with Okeke ( no progress) Cole ( idential player to last version of himself, just bigger usage), RJ Hampton ( guy somehow got even more worthless ). Non of them got better from last year.

Suggs should improve. But even if and when he does, it would require incredible uptick in everything where he will come to be starting level PG on good team.
It is not just shooting. His shooting is just most obvious issue



but it's also ball security, ballhandling, playmaking, and something as simple as pick&roll. On list of nba players, that includes centers, with at least 20 games plays, his percentile in picK&roll is 12... Literally Bam Adebayo and Danilo Galinari are better at pick&rolling as ballhandler than your "point guard".

All this would probably mean much less if Orlando does not already have two guards who are all slotted in same "PG" role despite non of them is good. Cole is chucker who only cares about his box score, Fultz & Suggs can't coexist because they are like Bledsoe & MCW sharing floor.

"You complain about rookie" . Yes , because Frazn, Barnes, Mobley are blueprint that rookies can actually be good or even great.
There was plenty of rookies in past that struggled and got better later. But this is not rookies having some issues, this is rookie being extreamly bad even by rookie standards.

Dude, everyone gets his shooting so far has been terrible. No need to keep repeating it.

This is how the argument goes:

You: "Suggs shooting $ucks so he is terrible"

Everyone else: "Yes it does, but he is clearly an average NBA player by most advanced metrics as his defense is a very high level"

You: "No, Suggs is terrible, his shooting $ucks"

On and on Ad nausium.

Anyone who is paying attention sees that the shot is off (although quite good form). Just remove the eyepatch and watch the whole game some time.

The handle appears to be improving significantly by the eyeball test. He wasn't even his college team's main ball handler.

I would take Suggs over Cole 7 days a week and twice on Sunday.

[Skin]

Nothing really THAT concerning about Suggs yet, IMO.

At the top-15 of any draft, one can ask, "what is his definable NBA skill"? (which is why Gordon was always a risk).

For Suggs, he is proven to be capable as a defensive guard. He will carve out a multi-year career simply by being a pest. In that for me the absolute floor of Suggs is as a Bruce Bowen-type as a combo-guard. Just be a pest and annoy the opponents down.

As to his ceiling, I guess as a Chauncey Billups-type, if I had to consider the notion.
Interesting that the rookie numbers are not that far off between these two: rookie Player Comparison: Jalen Suggs vs. Chauncey Billups


..

I remember when we traded for Chauncey Billups, but he never played because he was hurt and then we let him go because we thought he was a draft bust.

[yoyojw17]

Nothing really THAT concerning about Suggs yet, IMO.

At the top-15 of any draft, one can ask, "what is his definable NBA skill"? (which is why Gordon was always a risk).

For Suggs, he is proven to be capable as a defensive guard. He will carve out a multi-year career simply by being a pest. In that for me the absolute floor of Suggs is as a Bruce Bowen-type as a combo-guard. Just be a pest and annoy the opponents down.

As to his ceiling, I guess as a Chauncey Billups-type, if I had to consider the notion.
Interesting that the rookie numbers are not that far off between these two: rookie Player Comparison: Jalen Suggs vs. Chauncey Billups


..

I remember when we traded for Chauncey Billups, but he never played because he was hurt and then we let him go because we thought he was a draft bust.

Wait.... so you're saying that players can get better?!? And possibly at different and unexpected times? and at different rateS?!?

OMG.... this is ....

[basketballRob]

At the top-15 of any draft, one can ask, "what is his definable NBA skill"? (which is why Gordon was always a risk).

For Suggs, he is proven to be capable as a defensive guard. He will carve out a multi-year career simply by being a pest. In that for me the absolute floor of Suggs is as a Bruce Bowen-type as a combo-guard. Just be a pest and annoy the opponents down.

As to his ceiling, I guess as a Chauncey Billups-type, if I had to consider the notion.
Interesting that the rookie numbers are not that far off between these two: rookie Player Comparison: Jalen Suggs vs. Chauncey Billups


..

I remember when we traded for Chauncey Billups, but he never played because he was hurt and then we let him go because we thought he was a draft bust.

Wait.... so you're saying that players can get better?!? And possibly at different and unexpected times? and at different rateS?!?

OMG.... this is ....

Earlier this year when Chuma came back from his hip injury it was obvious he wasn't right and he struggled. Since all the Chuma is a bum posts, in like the last 20 games, Chuma has shot 400 from 3 and had nearly 2 SPG in around 23 MPG.

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[MasterGMer]

Looking at some of the posts just makes me laugh. Cry out loud that this is ONLY FIRST YEAR of Suggs in the NBA.

I still remembered some of yall were so high on Ben Mclemory or Emmanuel Mudiay. Look at their career now in the NBA.

Fans can judge their talents all you want. But this is only the first year of Suggs in the NBA. Give him some time.

I firmly believe Suggs will be a star one day. He has a real high ceiling.

His biggest problem is his finishing and shooting. But that doesn't worry me long term. He will be fine!

[ibraheim718]

It's hard to bite my lip but I try.

First... the best player on a championship team isn't always the leader. Take Leonard when he won in Toronto (Kyle Lowry was the leader).. all of Tim Duncan's championships (Avery Johnson for the early one and Ginobilli for the later ones were the obvious leaders of those teams).. Jason Kidd was the leader when Dirk won.. You can even say Draymond was the guy who led the Warriors during their championship runs.. I can go on and on with examples of players who "led" their teams to championships but were not the "best" players.

Second... I assume the casual who found advanced stats and never let them go thinks Cade who has a lower raptor than Jalen is going to be a bust and at best a regular rotation player even though early in his career Detroit is 1-18 when he doesn't play.

Third.. you have to be a real moron to judge rookies using advanced stats. You judge them by watching them.. checking to see if they improve and projecting what kind of player those improvements can lead to. You want to see if they're still making the same mistakes as they were making early in the year. When you assess that you also want to assess the support a player is getting from the coach and from the vets.. it makes adjustments easier for younger players. In Jalen's case he doesn't even have a quality veteran point guard to learn from and his coach runs an offense that leaves a lot to be desired.

Fourth.. am I the only one sick and tired of watching them run those hideous triple-weave ball screen sets?

[Blue_and_Whte]

I remember when we traded for Chauncey Billups, but he never played because he was hurt and then we let him go because we thought he was a draft bust.

Wait.... so you're saying that players can get better?!? And possibly at different and unexpected times? and at different rateS?!?

OMG.... this is ....

Earlier this year when Chuma came back from his hip injury it was obvious he wasn't right and he struggled. Since all the Chuma is a bum posts, in like the last 20 games, Chuma has shot 400 from 3 and had nearly 2 SPG in around 23 MPG.

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The only bum on this team is Mo Bumba.. everyone else at least plays with some time of energy and effort.or doing other things to impact the game. Our “29/10 center of the future” isn’t that how it went?

Suggs will improve I’m not concerned with him. He actually has a work ethic.

[basketballRob]

We're 3-18 when Suggs doesn't play and 10-27 when he does.

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[fendilim]

Wait.... so you're saying that players can get better?!? And possibly at different and unexpected times? and at different rateS?!?

OMG.... this is ....

Earlier this year when Chuma came back from his hip injury it was obvious he wasn't right and he struggled. Since all the Chuma is a bum posts, in like the last 20 games, Chuma has shot 400 from 3 and had nearly 2 SPG in around 23 MPG.

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The only bum on this team is Mo Bumba.. everyone else at least plays with some time of energy and effort.or doing other things to impact the game. Our “29/10 center of the future” isn’t that how it went?

Suggs will improve I’m not concerned with him. He actually has a work ethic.

Bumba…

[Knightro]

Suggs is finding ways to positively impact games without any ability to make a jumpshot right now. It's wild.

[tiderulz]

Suggs is finding ways to positively impact games without any ability to make a jumpshot right now. It's wild.

he needs to stop taking 3 ptrs until his shot improves

[zaymon]

Suggs is finding ways to positively impact games without any ability to make a jumpshot right now. It's wild.

he needs to stop taking 3 ptrs until his shot improves

Well thats debatable. Willingness to shoot is a positive indicator of future improvement. We dont want Ben Simmons with mental block. I dont care about wins this year, do you ?

[rusoopE]

Looking at some of the posts just makes me laugh. Cry out loud that this is ONLY FIRST YEAR of Suggs in the NBA.

I still remembered some of yall were so high on Ben Mclemory or Emmanuel Mudiay. Look at their career now in the NBA.

Fans can judge their talents all you want. But this is only the first year of Suggs in the NBA. Give him some time.

I firmly believe Suggs will be a star one day. He has a real high ceiling.

His biggest problem is his finishing and shooting. But that doesn't worry me long term. He will be fine!

Leave britney alone

[tiderulz]

Suggs is finding ways to positively impact games without any ability to make a jumpshot right now. It's wild.

he needs to stop taking 3 ptrs until his shot improves

Well thats debatable. Willingness to shoot is a positive indicator of future improvement. We dont want Ben Simmons with mental block. I dont care about wins this year, do you ?

he's shown he is willing. but he is shooting 23% and gone 11-56 for the last 2 months. No, i dont care about wins right now, but he needs to work on that shot.

[Knightro]

he's shown he is willing. but he is shooting 23% and gone 11-56 for the last 2 months. No, i dont care about wins right now, but he needs to work on that shot.

I mean you nailed it, right? He needs to work on his shot.

But it’s not like he’s gonna have time right now to relentlessly do drills with a shooting coach. That sort of work won’t come until the offseason.

Because the outcome of these games doesn’t matter, that’s all the more reason for him to keep shooting now in the hopes of figuring it out. If going 0-4 from 3 a few times in his rookie year breaks him mentally and confident wise, then he’s probably not the guy we thought he was anyway long-term.

[basketballRob]

Suggs has only been playing PG part-time but we miss a lot of his potential assists.

Read on Twitter

?t=b-NM4tXwPS7yeguDwY8lOw&s=19

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[swarlesbarkley]

Suggs has only been playing PG part-time but we miss a lot of his potential assists.

Read on Twitter

?t=b-NM4tXwPS7yeguDwY8lOw&s=19

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That's interesting.

Also - if we only had 1 pick in the top 10 (outside of top 3), I'd love to have Giddey. But with 2 picks I like Franz+Suggs more.