Tobias Harris Trade Thread

[the_process]

You can use assets to turn Tobias in to a couple pieces that fit better. Even if those pieces are individually worse than Tobias, they will fit the team better.

Or maybe a bunch of guys ask out, and one of them wants to come play with Jo and James.

[stormi]

This revision around Tobias Harris every year around the all-star break is so sicking to read. Do y'all not have any shame?

He is not a "decent player". He's been our statistical worst core player in every single playoffs since he's joined this team, and he's had his chance in a multitude of roles. Stop making excuses for this guy. Shake Milton outshone him in the bubble and 6'2 pudgy Seth Curry kicked him off the ball because he has no bag.

The game of basketball is real simple. Either you're a star player, or you're doing everything you can to make the life of your star easier.

Well we've already clearly established that Tobias Harris is extremely far away from a star player considering he gets caved in any time he's tasked to be the best player of his 5-man unit.

So how can Tobias make himself an effective even with his prehistoric skillset? Defending, and shooting. Unfortunately he's the worst wing defender in the league, has negative athleticism and cannot c&s.

I can almost guarantee that he's gone this summer, bar we win a championship.

[stormi]

Two guys I would target that might be somewhat affordable and would fit here like a glove are: Kentavious Caldwell-Pope and Maxi Kleber.

Kleber is a big mobile body at 6'10 that loves to shoot and can protect the rim.

KCP is another player in that Niang/Green role. Good size at 6'5, won a championship spacing the floor for Lebron can shoot the ball and is just a classic consummate 3&D roleplayer.

I think the premier guy that could have been had is Gary Trent Jr, but Toronto scammed him from Portland.

Lonzo/Haliburton/Bane are the unattainable guys that would make magic playing alongside Harden and Embiid.

[the_process]

This revision around Tobias Harris every year around the all-star break is so sicking to read. Do y'all not have any shame?

He is not a "decent player". He's been our statistical worst core player in every single playoffs since he's joined this team, and he's had his chance in a multitude of roles. Stop making excuses for this guy. Shake Milton outshone him in the bubble and 6'2 pudgy Seth Curry kicked him off the ball because he has no bag.

The game of basketball is real simple. Either you're a star player, or you're doing everything you can to make the life of your star easier.

Well we've already clearly established that Tobias Harris is extremely far away from a star player considering he gets caved in any time he's tasked to be the best player of his 5-man unit.

So how can Tobias make himself an effective even with his prehistoric skillset? Defending, and shooting. Unfortunately he's the worst wing defender in the league, has negative athleticism and cannot c&s.

I can almost guarantee that he's gone this summer, bar we win a championship.

Preach.

[LloydFree]

This revision around Tobias Harris every year around the all-star break is so sicking to read. Do y'all not have any shame?

He is not a "decent player". He's been our statistical worst core player in every single playoffs since he's joined this team, and he's had his chance in a multitude of roles. Stop making excuses for this guy. Shake Milton outshone him in the bubble and 6'2 pudgy Seth Curry kicked him off the ball because he has no bag.

Spoiler:

The game of basketball is real simple. Either you're a star player, or you're doing everything you can to make the life of your star easier.

Well we've already clearly established that Tobias Harris is extremely far away from a star player considering he gets caved in any time he's tasked to be the best player of his 5-man unit.

So how can Tobias make himself an effective even with his prehistoric skillset? Defending, and shooting. Unfortunately he's the worst wing defender in the league, has negative athleticism and cannot c&s.

I can almost guarantee that he's gone this summer, bar we win a championship

.

B.S.

There is no statistical measure that you can come up with, to show that Tobias Harris was the worst core player on the 76ers, in last year's Playoffs.

You can state that Tobias Harris has been a disappointment without making stuff up.

[stormi]

This revision around Tobias Harris every year around the all-star break is so sicking to read. Do y'all not have any shame?

He is not a "decent player". He's been our statistical worst core player in every single playoffs since he's joined this team, and he's had his chance in a multitude of roles. Stop making excuses for this guy. Shake Milton outshone him in the bubble and 6'2 pudgy Seth Curry kicked him off the ball because he has no bag.

Spoiler:

The game of basketball is real simple. Either you're a star player, or you're doing everything you can to make the life of your star easier.

Well we've already clearly established that Tobias Harris is extremely far away from a star player considering he gets caved in any time he's tasked to be the best player of his 5-man unit.

So how can Tobias make himself an effective even with his prehistoric skillset? Defending, and shooting. Unfortunately he's the worst wing defender in the league, has negative athleticism and cannot c&s.

I can almost guarantee that he's gone this summer, bar we win a championship

.

B.S.

There is no statistical measure that you can come up with, to show that Tobias Harris was the worst core player on the 76ers, in last year's Playoffs.

You can state that Tobias Harris has been a disappointment without making stuff up.

His actual impact advanced metrics were the worst of our core four last season. He was the worst player in the series against Boston. And his on court impact was the worst of any starter by a significant margin against Toronto in 2019.

It makes sense why though. His presence on either side of the ball is non-existent. Joel is a force on both sides of the ball. Seth and Ben are heavily skewed towards being an offense/defensive presence. Tobias is in that ugly purgatory stage where he's getting cooked on defense by Collins/Tatum/Siakam type wings, but then also not providing much in terms of efficient volume scoring or playmaking.

He's gone this summer. No ifs ands or buts about it.

[76ciology]

Tobi is bad because Ben was worse.

Ben is so bad that even Tobi is more playable than him in the playoffs and has a better contract than Ben.

I’m more willing to pay $33-35M per year for an empty 20ppg with efficient %s than a player who is a non defensive anchor and is a complete liability on offense.

Just look at the buyout market, I can find guys who can provide me what Ben can provide on defense closer than guys who can provide what Tobi can. Nobody is letting a near 20ppg with good scoring %s go, while there’s an abundant on one dimensional defensive players in the league such as DeAndre Jordan or Derrick Favors.

When we paid Tobi $35M, that’s when we chose Ben over Jimmy. And we chose Ben over Jimmy because we expect Ben to be a top tier star.

Ben f’d us up and because of that we need Tobi to be Kevin Durant and Seth Curry to be his brother.

[Murray_17]

B.S.

There is no statistical measure that you can come up with, to show that Tobias Harris was the worst core player on the 76ers, in last year's Playoffs.

You can state that Tobias Harris has been a disappointment without making stuff up.

His %TS, net rating and rebounding all falled of a cliff in the Hawks series...

His USG% also went down significantly, which is stupid if you think he was leading all bench units and played more minutes than in the Wizards series.

[Murray_17]

Just look at the buyout market, I can find guys who can provide me what Ben can provide on defense closer than guys who can provide what Tobi can. Nobody is letting a near 20ppg with good scoring %s go, while there’s an abundant on one dimensional defensive players in the league such as DeAndre Jordan or Derrick Favors.

Derrick Favors is not a good defender, nor is DJ. And i'm disgusted wth Ben as much as the next guy but comparing what he provides with those guys is simplistic at best. This is like saying Draymond or Gobert are easy to replace players.

[sixers hoops]

Tobi is bad because Ben was worse.

Ben is so bad that even Tobi is more playable than him in the playoffs and has a better contract than Ben.

I’m more willing to pay $33-35M per year for an empty 20ppg with efficient %s than a player who is a non defensive anchor and is a complete liability on offense.

Just look at the buyout market, I can find guys who can provide me what Ben can provide on defense closer than guys who can provide what Tobi can. Nobody is letting a near 20ppg with good scoring %s go, while there’s an abundant on one dimensional defensive players in the league such as DeAndre Jordan or Derrick Favors.

When we paid Tobi $35M, that’s when we chose Ben over Jimmy. And we chose Ben over Jimmy because we expect Ben to be a top tier star.

Ben f’d us up and because of that we need Tobi to be Kevin Durant and Seth Curry to be his brother.

When a player accepts a $35 million/year contract, they are fair game for criticism for not living up to the expectations that come with accepting such a deal. And, as you said, Ben being a dud just magnified it. However, Tobias is here the rest of this year, and likely next year, so the Sixers need to maximize his talents to the best of their ability.

Doc has stated many times that he wants Tobias to have a quick trigger. Some of the most successful PFs to play with Joel were Ersan, Mike Scott in his short stint as an effective sixer, and Niang. Similarly, PJ Tucker worked great with Harden. I think it’s clear that Embiid and Harden would really benefit from Tobias being an effective floor spacer when he plays with those guys.

When Embiid is out of the game, we may need Tobias to take on a bigger scoring roll, but I’m not really worried about him being a $35 million player at this point. I just want him to play whatever role can help us win a title.

[mjkvol]

This revision around Tobias Harris every year around the all-star break is so sicking to read. Do y'all not have any shame?

He is not a "decent player". He's been our statistical worst core player in every single playoffs since he's joined this team, and he's had his chance in a multitude of roles. Stop making excuses for this guy. Shake Milton outshone him in the bubble and 6'2 pudgy Seth Curry kicked him off the ball because he has no bag.

The game of basketball is real simple. Either you're a star player, or you're doing everything you can to make the life of your star easier.

Well we've already clearly established that Tobias Harris is extremely far away from a star player considering he gets caved in any time he's tasked to be the best player of his 5-man unit.

So how can Tobias make himself an effective even with his prehistoric skillset? Defending, and shooting. Unfortunately he's the worst wing defender in the league, has negative athleticism and cannot c&s.

I can almost guarantee that he's gone this summer, bar we win a championship.

Thank you.

One problem with Tobias is that he sees himself as a star, thus the tantrum when he heard some boos. He may be in for a rude awakening after this season.

[Zumramania]

When a player accepts a $35 million/year contract, they are fair game for criticism for not living up to the expectations that come with accepting such a deal. And, as you said, Ben being a dud just magnified it. However, Tobias is here the rest of this year, and likely next year, so the Sixers need to maximize his talents to the best of their ability.

Doc has stated many times that he wants Tobias to have a quick trigger. Some of the most successful PFs to play with Joel were Ersan, Mike Scott in his short stint as an effective sixer, and Niang. Similarly, PJ Tucker worked great with Harden. I think it’s clear that Embiid and Harden would really benefit from Tobias being an effective floor spacer when he plays with those guys.

When Embiid is out of the game, we may need Tobias to take on a bigger scoring roll, but I’m not really worried about him being a $35 million player at this point. I just want him to play whatever role can help us win a title.

He is shooting 3.4 threes per game this season and only 34.5% get in, so it seems he even regressed as a shooter? He will get more open looks with Harden, but I think there is little hope of him providing us what we need from deep. He could maybe have a quicker trigger on those twos and get more mismatches. Also yeah, judging by the way he reacted to those crowd boos and how he talked in some interviews, it seems that he shares some "character weaknesses" with Ben Simmons. Maybe he is less childish and willing to make more compromises, but he might have a similarly fragile ego that snaps under pressure.

[LloydFree]

B.S.

There is no statistical measure that you can come up with, to show that Tobias Harris was the worst core player on the 76ers, in last year's Playoffs.

You can state that Tobias Harris has been a disappointment without making stuff up.

His %TS, net rating and rebounding all falled of a cliff in the Hawks series...

His USG% also went down significantly, which is stupid if you think he was leading all bench units and played more minutes than in the Wizards series.

Regardless of whether his TS% and Rebounding went down, he still wasn't the worst core player by any measure, during LAST years' playoffs. The guy made a patently false statement about the player in order to make his point.

[stormi]

My thing with Harris is that, in a late game situation he provides you zero value offensively or defensively.

In your ideal championship contending world where you have a Joel Embiid and James Harden, why would you ever want him on the court clogging the lane with them. You would obviously opt out for Niang's and Green's and even Seth's that have gravity to open up the floor and to be ready shooters if the ball came their way.

But also defensively, if you're curating a five man unit, who is Harris guarding? You're throwing him on a skilled guard or forward? He has no athleticism and stubby arms. If he gets caught in open space that offensive player is licking their lips, and he's not protecting the rim either.

Ben at his very worst is a defensive chess piece that racks up steals, blocks and deflections. You trust Seth out there late game if you need a bucket because at his very worst, a defense cannot leave him unaccounted for. His presence is opening up the floor.

I don't want Harris out there offensively or defensively in a close game. He doesn't play a winning brand of basketball.

Just my thoughts.

[FireMorey]

Thinking about Harris' flaws and that contract makes me think back to that day where the Sixers traded Butler, signed Harris to a max and signed Horford all in a day. That's like the real life equivalent of you losing your job, your wife leaving you, and finding out you have a serious illness all in the same day.

I remember saying at the time it was one of the darkest days as a Sixers fan of my lifetime and my friends called me a drama queen and everyone who knew it was terrible, but were living in denial and trying to convince themselves of how it would all work out. Now, it's basically accepted universally as such, and it's a miracle that after screwing things up so monumentally, the Sixers were still able to land James Harden and salvage this thing.

I was just absolutely gutted as I knew the Sixers window slammed shut on that day. All the tanking, all the losing, was all for nothing.

And somehow, Morey pried it back open. He deserves a lot of credit.

[stormi]

Tobi is bad because Ben was worse.

I think it's the opposite my man. Fans were so enchanted with Ben Simmons and his bipolarity in play, that Tobias Harris has been able to weasel his way through for a few years now while throwing up some disgusting playoff horror shows.

But I think the consensus on him is catching up. Morey has been canvassing the league on exit strategies on that contract, and the fans have started to turn on him and his underwhelming brand of basketball.

He's the last toxic piece remaining from that cancerous summer of 2019, but it'll all be over soon.

[shlo]

Thinking about Harris' flaws and that contract makes me think back to that day where the Sixers traded Butler, signed Harris to a max and signed Horford all in a day. That's like the real life equivalent of you losing your job, your wife leaving you, and finding out you have a serious illness all in the same day.

I remember saying at the time it was one of the darkest days as a Sixers fan of my lifetime and my friends called me a drama queen and everyone who knew it was terrible, but were living in denial and trying to convince themselves of how it would all work out. Now, it's basically accepted universally as such, and it's a miracle that after screwing things up so monumentally, the Sixers were still able to land James Harden and salvage this thing.

I was just absolutely gutted as I knew the Sixers window slammed shut on that day. All the tanking, all the losing, was all for nothing.

And somehow, Morey pried it back open. He deserves a lot of credit.

I'll never forget how stupid it all was... and how many people were LOVING it.

[mjkvol]

Tobi is bad because Ben was worse.

Ben is so bad that even Tobi is more playable than him in the playoffs and has a better contract than Ben.

I’m more willing to pay $33-35M per year for an empty 20ppg with efficient %s than a player who is a non defensive anchor and is a complete liability on offense.

Just look at the buyout market, I can find guys who can provide me what Ben can provide on defense closer than guys who can provide what Tobi can. Nobody is letting a near 20ppg with good scoring %s go, while there’s an abundant on one dimensional defensive players in the league such as DeAndre Jordan or Derrick Favors.

When we paid Tobi $35M, that’s when we chose Ben over Jimmy. And we chose Ben over Jimmy because we expect Ben to be a top tier star.

Ben f’d us up and because of that we need Tobi to be Kevin Durant and Seth Curry to be his brother.

Stormi beat me to it - what Ben did was provide a shield of sorts for Tobias in being the focus of criticism from fans and media, while Tobias essentially skated even though he was an inconsequential playoff performer. With no Ben, Tobias' lack of impact is drawing more attention, thus the added criticism.

I also disagree on who I'd rather pay max money to (if I was forced to pick one) - Ben was a high impact player defensively and in transition, while Tobias has zero impact on either end of the floor. His 20 ppg can be easily spread around and made up for, and he is a sieve defensively.

Finding a buyout player to replace Tobias would be infinitely easier. There's no one who will provide the kind of defense Ben played, while Tobias would in many ways be addition by subtraction.

And choosing Ben over Jimmy had nothing to do with Tobias. Once Brand made that awful choice, he gave Tobias the ridiculous contract in desperation to save face, as he would have been seen as squandering all those assets for nothing. We would have been better off had he just cut his losses.

[mjkvol]

Thinking about Harris' flaws and that contract makes me think back to that day where the Sixers traded Butler, signed Harris to a max and signed Horford all in a day. That's like the real life equivalent of you losing your job, your wife leaving you, and finding out you have a serious illness all in the same day.

I've heard it described a lot of ways, but this just nails it. Good work.

[76ciology]

Just look at the buyout market, I can find guys who can provide me what Ben can provide on defense closer than guys who can provide what Tobi can. Nobody is letting a near 20ppg with good scoring %s go, while there’s an abundant on one dimensional defensive players in the league such as DeAndre Jordan or Derrick Favors.

Derrick Favors is not a good defender, nor is DJ. And i'm disgusted wth Ben as much as the next guy but comparing what he provides with those guys is simplistic at best. This is like saying Draymond or Gobert are easy to replace players.

Draymond and Gobert can anchor a defense, Ben Simmons, DAJ and Favors can’t.