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The Official Jalen Suggs Thread

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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1241 » by RookieStar » Wed Feb 23, 2022 8:52 pm

KillMonger wrote:has better things to do and yet had the time to post that diatribe....well let's put a pin in this and revisit in year 3....i think we can all agree it's a bit too soon one way or the other.....much like many things magic related is a work in progress


THIS!

Seriously, when we draft a player with this high a pick, do you draft him based on what he can produce in his rookie year? Or draft him based on what we think where he will be/how we can develop him down the road?

If his numbers sucks right now, fine. Nothing to be ashamed of. However, doe he show glimpses of improvement, work ethic and the like? If so, then we are blessed.
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1242 » by RookieStar » Wed Feb 23, 2022 9:01 pm

p0peye wrote:
Skybox wrote:
Horcy wrote:
He's such a waste of effort...I can imagine the 90% of us scrolling down when we see those endless posts without paying attention to a single word.
But at the end of the day we need to understand what he is, a hater. And a pretty narcissistic one.


I think it's weird that we (me included) spend so much time analyzing a fellow poster. I can see the work put in and the analysis. I'd truly be interested in something proactive is all I'm saying...it's a lot easier to critique the past than to make suggestions or pick a horse.


It might be a cultural thing for both Pepe and me, as well some other Balkan posters. As we grow up, we are raised to be focused on things we need to improve. If you have a math test and get 9/10 right, teachers and parents in Balkan harp on that one mistake we made, almost as if we failed the test. For example, in Ireland where we moved now kids get praised if they got 6/10. A real positive game changer for my children, though I am worried here they are not studying enough nor striving to be best as they can.

That being said, pepe is not wrong in assessment of where Suggs sits at, there's a long road for him to improve to be either SG or PG.


yeah I get that. I spent some time in strict Asian countries due to work like Singapore,Korea,Japan,etc and I observed that 1 mistake would be "highlighted" so next time you could be better. Also, that 6/10 , instead of getting praised it gets warned that 1 more and you could've flunked.

As I said no one is happy that Suggs shoots at a terrible 3pt percentage. Heck, we are The Magic. We are STARVED for some reliable and constant 3pt threat since the Hedo/Shard days. Also, was the majority of comments like " this summer Suggs needs to work on ___________ " ignored? We acknowledged his deficiencies and what he needs to be done. We also acknowledged the positives and hope that he brings especially his steady improvement on his weaknesses and his defense/BBIQ/instinct that we never expected to be that good.
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1243 » by The Effect » Thu Feb 24, 2022 12:20 am

the only people who think suggs is having a bad rookie year are the people that are only looking at the box scores

Everyone who watches knows that he does so many little things that done show up in the stats

Can he improve? for sure, but am i disappointed in his play this year? nope!
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1244 » by Bensational » Thu Feb 24, 2022 1:09 am

I had hoped Suggs would be a 18/5/5 or greater guy hitting 34% or higher from 3. Ideally cracking the mythical 20ppg mark. And low turnovers as more of a steady hand.

I just checked his per36 (because he averages 28.8mpg at the moment) and was surprised to see he’s at 16.7ppg 4.8rpg and 5.6apg… and 3.9tov lol.

His scoring efficiency and ball safety are definitely underwhelming compared to my hopes/expectations, but I like everything else he brings. We keep the ball in his hands and let him figure it out, along with Franz, because who else would we rather have doing it right now? If a better player or prospect comes along to replace him, so be it. I mean, what are the worst outcomes?

- he never improves his shooting from current averages. He ends up as an MCW like presence on the team and someone replaces him. Conclusion: it doesn’t matter right now, we have no other alternatives to explore.

- he becomes Marcus Smart 2.0. Not a star but not a bad player. Likely outcome, he gets replaced. Conclusion: it doesn’t matter right now.
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1245 » by Magic_Kingdom » Thu Feb 24, 2022 1:50 am

It may not be fair to Suggs, but a lot of fans have lost patience with the Magic missing on picks. I know I have. Weltman has been here five years and hasn't added a star to the team through the draft, free agency or trades. His top picks since arriving are Isaac, Bamba, Okeke, Anthony, and Suggs. (Franz looks like a good pick but wasn't their top pick in this draft). I'm tired of the excuse "well that's where these guys were slotted". Weltman and Hammond get paid a lot of money to get it right, not just go down the Draft Xpress board and take who's next. If Suggs's shooting keeps him from becoming a star -- and right now it's horrendous -- then they missed again.
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1246 » by MasterGMer » Thu Feb 24, 2022 4:11 am

pepe1991 wrote:
tooler wrote:I'm imagining a world where pepe uses his uh, passion, toward something positive and good. I was thinking the other day how pleasant it would be if all this effort was spent talking about how good Franz has been.


If Jalen Suggs plays for 29 other teams general consensus about his rookie year from this forum would be -he sucks, we dodged a bullet.
But since he joined favorite team of yours, people have incredible need to defend undefendable.

Somebody in nba who shoots 22,8% for 3, who shoots sub 40% mid range, who has -8 net rating, who has historiclly low efficiency ( Mudiay, Exum historic), who makes rookie MCW look like prime Steph Curry in terms of efficiency & scoring maybe, just maybe isn't as good as you hoped he will be when you used 5th pick to draft him?

There are things that are subjective in life, such are: taste of pizza with pineapple on.
There are things that are not subjective in life such is being 10% below league's average in just about every efficiency metric.

Plays defense, pesky defender, good at ball pressure, not exponentionally advanced passer, mediocre ballhandler, very bad shooter. Who did i described? Rookie Michael Carter Williams or Suggs? And if difference is non, why we pretend there is one?

YoU aRE HaTeR. Why? Because i call somebody that looks like poop, smells like a poop, plays like a poop- s**t ?
How did my harping on Bamba aged ? Suprise suprise, 4 years later " HaTeR PePe" was right. I'm yet to recive apologizes for people who called me hater. Guys, feel free to do so whenever you feel. Hell, there is one poster, who knows well who he is, who said Bamba is more talented than Vuc :wink:
How did my harping on Payton aged? Two moderators losing their ***t over him for 3 years.
Last year i had huge fight with one poster about Cole Anthony not being starting level guard in nba. Well...that aged well.
Two years ago how many people attacked me for saying Fultz is broken and won't regain his shot? Any apoligizes for being wrong ? Nah.
My description of Okeke as "bench Ariza" was met with lot of hate. Guess who can't start on worst team in nba?
Any apologizes for being blocked in debates that Gordon isn't next star player Magic are waiting for?
One year of life wasted on endless debates can and should Isaac play SF. (can't, shouldn't , didn't).

This is what this forum normally does. They blow player out of proportion, portray young players in fashion that outside would think they talk about young Jordan, than after they are proven to be wrong, they move to adore and worship new shiny toy and never talk about things they said about previous player in past.
Unlike that modus operandi of forum i will say what i think about player like he is not part of my team. Sometimes i will be wrong, sometimes i will be right. But i don't hide from mistakes. But i also don't think every player that puts jersey on Magic will have He-man transformation from Wes Iwundu to Jimmy Butler ( of f*** it, even that was a thing after we drafted him ) :noway: :crazy:

Why you will never see me or anybody with any basketball knowledge being Franz "hater" ? Because guy is simply good. Being hater meaning having no reason to "hate" on somebody or something yet doing so. Calling very,very,very bad rookie -bad isn't being hater, it's being honest. Something most fans from this forum, when it comes to subject, simply aren't.

Of f*** it , this is my last post about him for calendar year 2022. I'm just tired of this s*** repeating itself over and over again. I really have better things in my life in free time to do than debate how player who shoots 36,7% FG, 22,8 for 3 and has no mid range game , has -5,2 BPM, negative net rating, awful PER, is among worst gaurds in nba by TS% won't have miracle summer where he will return and become elite at everything. Especially because he struggles with basics for guards like pick&roll, passing, floor vision.



This is still his rookie season. I trust my eye test. I think he will end up being a good player in the NBA, just not now
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1247 » by fateis007 » Thu Feb 24, 2022 5:22 am

Magic_Kingdom wrote:It may not be fair to Suggs, but a lot of fans have lost patience with the Magic missing on picks. I know I have. Weltman has been here five years and hasn't added a star to the team through the draft, free agency or trades. His top picks since arriving are Isaac, Bamba, Okeke, Anthony, and Suggs. (Franz looks like a good pick but wasn't their top pick in this draft). I'm tired of the excuse "well that's where these guys were slotted". Weltman and Hammond get paid a lot of money to get it right, not just go down the Draft Xpress board and take who's next. If Suggs's shooting keeps him from becoming a star -- and right now it's horrendous -- then they missed again.


You had me until you tried to throw in not giving them Franz credit, now you're off the deep end. You can say they haven't done well , that is your opinion, but Franz has been an absolute home run for us and im pretty sure 95% of the board did not have him in their 8th spot with Bouknight on board. If they start running the offense through Franz again, and he gets some confidence in a pull up mid range, he is a lock for a 20/5/5 player (on a winning team, not Cole Anthony low efficiency, free reign stats) and the best prospect we have had in years since Oladipo/Dwight

The guy is a legit 7 footer now that can handle the ball, make plays and score. If you watched the rising stars game, is has def kept growing. He was as tall or taller then Sengun and Mobley. They drafted the kid, and hit a home run.

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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1248 » by Magic_Kingdom » Thu Feb 24, 2022 12:42 pm

fateis007 wrote:
Magic_Kingdom wrote:It may not be fair to Suggs, but a lot of fans have lost patience with the Magic missing on picks. I know I have. Weltman has been here five years and hasn't added a star to the team through the draft, free agency or trades. His top picks since arriving are Isaac, Bamba, Okeke, Anthony, and Suggs. (Franz looks like a good pick but wasn't their top pick in this draft). I'm tired of the excuse "well that's where these guys were slotted". Weltman and Hammond get paid a lot of money to get it right, not just go down the Draft Xpress board and take who's next. If Suggs's shooting keeps him from becoming a star -- and right now it's horrendous -- then they missed again.


You had me until you tried to throw in not giving them Franz credit, now you're off the deep end. You can say they haven't done well , that is your opinion, but Franz has been an absolute home run for us and im pretty sure 95% of the board did not have him in their 8th spot with Bouknight on board. If they start running the offense through Franz again, and he gets some confidence in a pull up mid range, he is a lock for a 20/5/5 player (on a winning team, not Cole Anthony low efficiency, free reign stats) and the best prospect we have had in years since Oladipo/Dwight

The guy is a legit 7 footer now that can handle the ball, make plays and score. If you watched the rising stars game, is has def kept growing. He was as tall or taller then Sengun and Mobley. They drafted the kid, and hit a home run.

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That’s fair. They do deserve credit for Franz. Especially since it was somewhat of a surprise pick.
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1249 » by ibraheim718 » Thu Feb 24, 2022 8:11 pm

Of all of the young guards currently on the Magic’s roster, Suggs is the one with the greatest chance of shifting the side’s fortunes in the years to come. His evaluation and success has to be a priority. Noticeably, Suggs actually hasn’t spent all that much time so far in configurations that peg him as the lead playmaker, let alone in line-ups that best accentuate his natural talents and play style preferences. However, there are some numbers that indicate what is perhaps possible should the team find a way to facilitate this.

Specifically of interest is the five-man unit that places him alongside Gary Harris, F. Wagner, Okeke and Carter Jr, a configuration currently sporting a team-best 18.2 net rating in just 30 minutes of total court time (minimum 30 minutes). A closer look reveals that this grouping is one of just three five-man Magic line-ups with a positive net rating all season (again, a minimum of 30 minutes), and it has been far and away the most successful of these despite the limited run.

It makes sense, right? Suggs loves to play hard-nosed defense and run when the opportunity presents itself, and these are the other players on the roster who best fit that profile. It’s a unit replete with disruptive limbs, stout match-ups, active cutters, willing shooters, secondary ball handlers, and even an effective pick-and-roll dance partner. The collective defense is solid (107.6 defensive rating). The offense is Orlando’s best (125.8 offensive rating). The pace ranks comfortably among the team’s quickest outfits (106.9). Down the stretch can we see more of this five-man group? And can we see it in some of the team’s more high intensity moments?

(Of note, switching Okeke out for Mo Bamba also produces a quintet with a positive net rating, this time of 2.1. It really appears that there’s some value to be found in deploying Suggs in a featured role alongside the team’s other versatile defenders and youthful legs.)

Jalen Suggs is not yet a finished basketball product. However, his post-injury performance suggests a ceiling that, while still out of reach at this moment, could eventually elevate the Magic in a meaningful way. But for that to happen, we have to start figuring out what a team in his image really looks like.

It’s time for this season’s closing stretch to be turned over to Suggs.


https://www.orlandopinstripedpost.com/2022/2/22/22945174/orlando-magic-jalen-suggs
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1250 » by thelead » Thu Feb 24, 2022 8:21 pm

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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1251 » by PrimeThyme » Sun Feb 27, 2022 8:09 pm

I was a little bothered by the off the backboard dunk he had the other night, if I’m being honest.

I just think if you’re going to do that and then make the gesture he did after, you have to follow it up with more than a 3 point performance in a game you foul out in. It’s been a somewhat up and down rookie season. I’m hoping he can finish these last 20 games on a high.
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1252 » by thelead » Sun Feb 27, 2022 10:39 pm

PrimeThyme wrote:I was a little bothered by the off the backboard dunk he had the other night, if I’m being honest.

I just think if you’re going to do that and then make the gesture he did after, you have to follow it up with more than a 3 point performance in a game you foul out in. It’s been a somewhat up and down rookie season. I’m hoping he can finish these last 20 games on a high.

What do you expect with Cole as a role model?

Suggs definitely looked like he was still in 'all-star party' mode and did not come in focused.
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1253 » by Xatticus » Sun Feb 27, 2022 11:04 pm

PrimeThyme wrote:I was a little bothered by the off the backboard dunk he had the other night, if I’m being honest.

I just think if you’re going to do that and then make the gesture he did after, you have to follow it up with more than a 3 point performance in a game you foul out in. It’s been a somewhat up and down rookie season. I’m hoping he can finish these last 20 games on a high.


Yeah. I didn't like it. I don't want to get into a debate about that sort of stuff though.
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1254 » by JTG_92940618 » Mon Feb 28, 2022 1:44 am

thelead wrote:
PrimeThyme wrote:I was a little bothered by the off the backboard dunk he had the other night, if I’m being honest.

I just think if you’re going to do that and then make the gesture he did after, you have to follow it up with more than a 3 point performance in a game you foul out in. It’s been a somewhat up and down rookie season. I’m hoping he can finish these last 20 games on a high.

What do you expect with Cole as a role model?

Suggs definitely looked like he was still in 'all-star party' mode and did not come in focused.


That's tough. Cole is just 11 months older than Jalen; we shouldn't be relying on a 21-year-old to be a role model for anyone.
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1255 » by thelead » Mon Feb 28, 2022 1:57 am

JTG_92940618 wrote:
thelead wrote:
PrimeThyme wrote:I was a little bothered by the off the backboard dunk he had the other night, if I’m being honest.

I just think if you’re going to do that and then make the gesture he did after, you have to follow it up with more than a 3 point performance in a game you foul out in. It’s been a somewhat up and down rookie season. I’m hoping he can finish these last 20 games on a high.

What do you expect with Cole as a role model?

Suggs definitely looked like he was still in 'all-star party' mode and did not come in focused.


That's tough. Cole is just 11 months older than Jalen; we shouldn't be relying on a 21-year-old to be a role model for anyone.

Cole is a good dude and has that natural leader mentality... he just lacks the maturity. And I don't want to hear about him being 21. I don't see Cole's peers (at least not the good one) acting 'crunk' or 'turnt up' all the damn time. The summer time videos of him and RJ were off-putting to me. Anyway, my comment was more tongue in cheek than being all serious.
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1256 » by KillMonger » Wed Mar 2, 2022 6:58 am



good game he can build on
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1257 » by Def Swami » Wed Mar 2, 2022 2:23 pm

Some of you guys are are some old curmudgeons :lol:

They're 20 to 23 year old kids. Let them have some fun.
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1258 » by LDNMagic90 » Wed Mar 2, 2022 4:27 pm

If there were to be a role model figure on the magic would that not be either Fultz, Isaac or Harris/Ro-Lo or a combination of all of them?
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1259 » by swarlesbarkley » Wed Mar 2, 2022 5:29 pm

LDNMagic90 wrote:If there were to be a role model figure on the magic would that not be either Fultz, Isaac or Harris/Ro-Lo or a combination of all of them?


Hopefully now that Fultz is back 100%, he'll take over the internal leadership role. Cole will most likely still be the vocal/visual leader because that's just his personality. Harris and Ro-Co are probably too new to the org to be role models. Hard for Isaac since he's rarely with the team for practices and in game time, plus his jesus stuff might rub people the wrong way and he doesn't seem to live basketball like the rest of the guys.

The Suggs dunk did give off touchdown celebration down 35 points vibes but Suggs is always giving 100% so I won't fault him too much. It's really annoying when a player does something like that when they're losing, during a losing season, and they aren't a player who gives 100% effort all the time.
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Re: The Official Jalen Suggs Thread 

Post#1260 » by tiderulz » Wed Mar 2, 2022 5:39 pm

LDNMagic90 wrote:If there were to be a role model figure on the magic would that not be either Fultz, Isaac or Harris/Ro-Lo or a combination of all of them?

honest question, what is Isaac a role model for?

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