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Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3

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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1341 » by AirP. » Tue Mar 8, 2022 7:33 pm

Oladipo doesn't have enough data.
Herro has been going up a bunch although still last in the regular rotation.
Strus has been dropping with from probably his irregular minutes.
5 regular rotation players 10+.

Code: Select all

Player                      ORtg DRtg ORtg-DRtg
------                      ---- ---- ---------
Victor Oladipo\oladivi01    137  115         22
Jimmy Butler\butleji01      123  106         17
Dewayne Dedmon\dedmode01    120  104         16
Caleb Martin\martica02      122  107         15
P.J. Tucker\tuckepj01       123  109         14
Nik Stauskas\stausni01      127  115         12
Bam Adebayo\adebaba01       114  103         11
Chris Silva\silvach01       119  108         11
Omer Yurtseven\yurtsom01    113  103         10
Max Strus\strusma01         116  111          5
Kyle Lowry\lowryky01        114  109          5
KZ Okpala\okpalkz01         113  109          4
Udonis Haslem\hasleud01     110  106          4
Gabe Vincent\vincega01      111  110          1
Duncan Robinson\robindu01   111  111          0
Tyler Herro\herroty01       106  110         -4
Markieff Morris\morrima02   104  112         -8
Haywood Highsmith\highsha01 102  111         -9
Kyle Guy\guyky01            101  110         -9
Marcus Garrett\garrema01    89   108        -19
Javonte Smart\smartja01          117       -117

For some comparisons...
Milwaulkee
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

Player                           ORtg DRtg ORtg-DRtg
------                           ---- ---- ---------
DeAndre' Bembry\bembrde01        151  114         37
Giannis Antetokounmpo\antetgi01  123  105         18
Jevon Carter\carteje01           134  116         18
Pat Connaughton\connapa01        125  111         14
DeMarcus Cousins\couside01       115  104         11
Grayson Allen\allengr01          120  113          7
Bobby Portis\portibo01           115  108          7
Sandro Mamukelashvili\mamuksa01  120  113          7
Jrue Holiday\holidjr01           118  111          7
George Hill\hillge01             119  113          6
Greg Monroe\monrogr01            114  109          5
Khris Middleton\middlkh01        112  111          1
Lindell Wigginton\wiggili01      113  113          0
Serge Ibaka\ibakase01            109  111         -2
Brook Lopez\lopezbr01            104  106         -2
Thanasis Antetokounmpo\antetth01 106  110         -4
Wesley Matthews\matthwe02        108  114         -6
Rodney Hood\hoodro01             107  114         -7
Jordan Nwora\nworajo01           100  111        -11
Donte DiVincenzo\divindo01       94   112        -18
Semi Ojeleye\ojelese01           96   114        -18
Georgios Kalaitzakis\kalaige01   93   113        -20
Justin Robinson\robinju01        87   113        -26
Javonte Smart\smartja01          77   113        -36
Luke Kornet\kornelu01            69   119        -50
Langston Galloway\gallola01      56   113        -57
Javin DeLaurier\delauja01             72         -72
Jeff Dowtin\dowtije01            0    120       -120


Boston
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

Player                        ORtg DRtg ORtg-DRtg
------                        ---- ---- ---------
Joe Johnson\johnsjo02         200  116         84
Robert Williams\williro04     145  102         43
Daniel Theis\theisda01        132  99          33
Grant Williams\willigr01      126  109         17
Al Horford\horfoal01          120  104         16
Enes Freedom\kanteen01        120  105         15
Justin Jackson\jacksju01      125  116          9
Sam Hauser\hausesa01          118  110          8
Jabari Parker\parkeja01       113  105          8
Derrick White\whitede01       112  107          5
Josh Richardson\richajo01     113  108          5
Jayson Tatum\tatumja01        110  106          4
Marcus Smart\smartma01        110  106          4
Bruno Fernando\fernabr01      110  108          2
Payton Pritchard\pritcpa01    111  111          0
Jaylen Brown\brownja02        107  107          0
Romeo Langford\langfro01      107  108         -1
Dennis Schröder\schrode01     108  110         -2
Aaron Nesmith\nesmiaa01       90   108        -18
Brodric Thomas\thomabr01      89   112        -23
Juancho Hernangómez\hernaju01 74   105        -31
Luke Kornet\kornelu01         23   96         -73
Kelan Martin\martike03        0    106       -106
Malik Fitts\fittsma01         0    106       -106
C.J. Miles\milescj01               115       -115

Philly
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

Player                        ORtg DRtg ORtg-DRtg
------                        ---- ---- ---------
Willie Cauley-Stein\caulewi01 228  108        120
DeAndre Jordan\jordade01      168  99          69
James Harden\hardeja01        145  110         35
Charles Bassey\bassech01      128  102         26
Joel Embiid\embiijo01         120  104         16
Andre Drummond\drumman01      109  99          10
Jaden Springer\sprinja01      102  94           8
Tyrese Maxey\maxeyty01        120  113          7
Paul Reed\reedpa01            108  102          6
Matisse Thybulle\thybuma01    113  107          6
Tobias Harris\harrito02       111  111          0
Seth Curry\curryse01          113  114         -1
Georges Niang\niangge01       112  114         -2
Tyler Johnson\johnsty01       108  111         -3
Paul Millsap\millspa01        105  109         -4
Danny Green\greenda02         104  110         -6
Shake Milton\miltosh01        104  112         -8
Furkan Korkmaz\korkmfu01      103  113        -10
Isaiah Joe\joeis01            103  114        -11
Charlie Brown Jr.\brownch02   91   109        -18
Braxton Key\keybr01           71   95         -24
Myles Powell\powelmy01        74   114        -40
Aaron Henry\henryaa01         29   110        -81
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1342 » by BadMofoPimp » Tue Mar 8, 2022 7:40 pm

AirP. wrote:
Kobewade11 wrote:throwbacktuesday.

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Which also means 25% he doesn't? I get if he said it was 100% going to happen he didn't. 99% of everything that gets talked about doesn't happen but you do find out from that report is that Miami was very much open to moving him, more then likely it was in a package for a high level player.

Myself, I'm very interested in how Herro handles teams that start to gameplan against him which should start in the playoffs because of right now teams really aren't because there just isn't much knowledge about his game nor the time to practice for that gameplan to take away what he likes vs a vet that players already know what he likes or doesn't like. Although Butler was horrific in the playoffs, Herro shot just under 32% from the field himself. If Herro is a good scorer in the playoffs he should have proved himself enough to stay with him long term, if he doesn't score well in the playoffs he'll have a season to work on counters and Miami will have another season and playoffs before they have to decide on what to do with him and to see if he grows as a player with new counters.

With all that being said, Herro's hot shooting of late has gotten him to leap his rookie season's efficiency at .550 TS% to having his most efficient season so far currently at .553 TS%, also he's raised his ORTG-DRTG from -9 earlier in the season to now just -4 which is a dramatic swing inside a season.


That was old news from last summer. Herro aain't going nowhere.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1343 » by somerandomdude » Tue Mar 8, 2022 7:43 pm

3ammy3uck3ts wrote:
somerandomdude wrote:When Markieff Morris returns, whose minutes does he take?

I'm thinking Caleb gets sac'd, which is a crying shame for how well he's played.


Nah no way he gets Caleb’s minutes. He’s not near the level of player Oladipo is. The ship has sailed on him imo, somethings wrong if he comes back and takes Caleb’s minutes

The reason I bring it up is because Caleb's been getting the bulk of his minutes at backup PF.

So the consensus is that Markieff is out of the rotation, then, or situational depending on playoff matchups.

I don't disagree and I think the team has moved on, I just don't know if Spo will see it that way considering Keef's a vet and "obligations" and whatnot.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1344 » by AirP. » Tue Mar 8, 2022 7:44 pm

BadMofoPimp wrote:
AirP. wrote:
Kobewade11 wrote:throwbacktuesday.

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Which also means 25% he doesn't? I get if he said it was 100% going to happen he didn't. 99% of everything that gets talked about doesn't happen but you do find out from that report is that Miami was very much open to moving him, more then likely it was in a package for a high level player.

Myself, I'm very interested in how Herro handles teams that start to gameplan against him which should start in the playoffs because of right now teams really aren't because there just isn't much knowledge about his game nor the time to practice for that gameplan to take away what he likes vs a vet that players already know what he likes or doesn't like. Although Butler was horrific in the playoffs, Herro shot just under 32% from the field himself. If Herro is a good scorer in the playoffs he should have proved himself enough to stay with him long term, if he doesn't score well in the playoffs he'll have a season to work on counters and Miami will have another season and playoffs before they have to decide on what to do with him and to see if he grows as a player with new counters.

With all that being said, Herro's hot shooting of late has gotten him to leap his rookie season's efficiency at .550 TS% to having his most efficient season so far currently at .553 TS%, also he's raised his ORTG-DRTG from -9 earlier in the season to now just -4 which is a dramatic swing inside a season.


That was old news from last summer. Herro aain't going nowhere.

Yeah... hence him putting throwbacktuesday on the post and me commenting on the % said last year.

I wouldn't say he's going nowhere, he's a highly valuable player on a very small contract on a roster trying to win a championship, so if Miami were to go after a whale he very well could be included with Robinson and others. Say a Donovan Michell? There probably won't be many players available Miami would trade Herro for.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1345 » by AirP. » Tue Mar 8, 2022 7:54 pm

somerandomdude wrote:
3ammy3uck3ts wrote:
somerandomdude wrote:When Markieff Morris returns, whose minutes does he take?

I'm thinking Caleb gets sac'd, which is a crying shame for how well he's played.


Nah no way he gets Caleb’s minutes. He’s not near the level of player Oladipo is. The ship has sailed on him imo, somethings wrong if he comes back and takes Caleb’s minutes

The reason I bring it up is because Caleb's been getting the bulk of his minutes at backup PF.

So the consensus is that Markieff is out of the rotation, then, or situational depending on playoff matchups.

I don't disagree and I think the team has moved on, I just don't know if Spo will see it that way considering Keef's a vet and "obligations" and whatnot.

Miami/Spoelstra could have brought Morris back since the 2nd week of December but haven't. Weeks ago they said he was healthy but ramping up his activity although he looks it pretty good shape. Miami just uses injuries as a way to keep players from being eligible to play making it easier for Spoelstra to not use an available player. I just don't know if it's the FO manipulating Spoelstra or if it's done in tandem by the FO and Spoelstra to make things easier to sort out.

I just think the initial push by Morris was seen as a dirty shot and the organization decided to move on from him and that type of play using the injury and injury history as a way to extend his time not eligible for the lineup. They've done this too many times in recent history not to see a trend of it, A.Bradley last year and J.Johnson and Waiters the year before.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1346 » by somerandomdude » Tue Mar 8, 2022 7:55 pm

So the next question I have is, do you guys see Herro and Dipo being too redundant and taking shots away from each other?

Herro played his best last night with Dipo off the floor and slowed down when Dipo was in.

Not to hate on Duncan, but I think this would all work out better if Dipo were in the SL and Duncan came off the bench.

Or the Heat are going to have put Herro and Dipo in spot up 3 situations to space the floor for each other.

Either way, it looks like a tough challenge in terms of maximizing both players when they're on the court. Best case is Curry/Klay type role.

And fwiw, I'm not talking out of my ass here; both Herro and Dipo were asked this question and hinted at knowing there's a challenge to both of them playing together.

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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1347 » by somerandomdude » Tue Mar 8, 2022 7:59 pm

AirP. wrote:
somerandomdude wrote:
3ammy3uck3ts wrote:
Nah no way he gets Caleb’s minutes. He’s not near the level of player Oladipo is. The ship has sailed on him imo, somethings wrong if he comes back and takes Caleb’s minutes

The reason I bring it up is because Caleb's been getting the bulk of his minutes at backup PF.

So the consensus is that Markieff is out of the rotation, then, or situational depending on playoff matchups.

I don't disagree and I think the team has moved on, I just don't know if Spo will see it that way considering Keef's a vet and "obligations" and whatnot.

Miami/Spoelstra could have brought Morris back since the 2nd week of December but haven't.
You don't know that. Stop listening to 4seasons.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1348 » by AirP. » Tue Mar 8, 2022 8:02 pm

somerandomdude wrote:
AirP. wrote:
somerandomdude wrote:The reason I bring it up is because Caleb's been getting the bulk of his minutes at backup PF.

So the consensus is that Markieff is out of the rotation, then, or situational depending on playoff matchups.

I don't disagree and I think the team has moved on, I just don't know if Spo will see it that way considering Keef's a vet and "obligations" and whatnot.

Miami/Spoelstra could have brought Morris back since the 2nd week of December but haven't.
You don't know that. Stop listening to 4seasons.

Really, what about Morris tweeting about being back soon... like 2 months ago?

On the rumors, that's what they are... rumors not absolutes so unless they say 100% or it's going down, don't think whatever you hear is automatically happening, just understand it's probably being talked about.

Last year A.Bradley couldn't get off injured reserve in Miami, last played Feb 3rd, once traded for Oladipo on March 25th he played for Houston a couple days later on the 29th and played in 14 straight games.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1349 » by AirP. » Tue Mar 8, 2022 8:15 pm

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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1350 » by RexBoyWonder » Tue Mar 8, 2022 8:26 pm

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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1351 » by AirP. » Tue Mar 8, 2022 8:34 pm

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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1352 » by 3ammy3uck3ts » Tue Mar 8, 2022 8:34 pm

AirP. wrote:Oladipo doesn't have enough data.
Herro has been going up a bunch although still last in the regular rotation.
Strus has been dropping with from probably his irregular minutes.
5 regular rotation players 10+.

Code: Select all

Player                      ORtg DRtg ORtg-DRtg
------                      ---- ---- ---------
Victor Oladipo\oladivi01    137  115         22
Jimmy Butler\butleji01      123  106         17
Dewayne Dedmon\dedmode01    120  104         16
Caleb Martin\martica02      122  107         15
P.J. Tucker\tuckepj01       123  109         14
Nik Stauskas\stausni01      127  115         12
Bam Adebayo\adebaba01       114  103         11
Chris Silva\silvach01       119  108         11
Omer Yurtseven\yurtsom01    113  103         10
Max Strus\strusma01         116  111          5
Kyle Lowry\lowryky01        114  109          5
KZ Okpala\okpalkz01         113  109          4
Udonis Haslem\hasleud01     110  106          4
Gabe Vincent\vincega01      111  110          1
Duncan Robinson\robindu01   111  111          0
Tyler Herro\herroty01       106  110         -4
Markieff Morris\morrima02   104  112         -8
Haywood Highsmith\highsha01 102  111         -9
Kyle Guy\guyky01            101  110         -9
Marcus Garrett\garrema01    89   108        -19
Javonte Smart\smartja01          117       -117

For some comparisons...
Milwaulkee
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

Player                           ORtg DRtg ORtg-DRtg
------                           ---- ---- ---------
DeAndre' Bembry\bembrde01        151  114         37
Giannis Antetokounmpo\antetgi01  123  105         18
Jevon Carter\carteje01           134  116         18
Pat Connaughton\connapa01        125  111         14
DeMarcus Cousins\couside01       115  104         11
Grayson Allen\allengr01          120  113          7
Bobby Portis\portibo01           115  108          7
Sandro Mamukelashvili\mamuksa01  120  113          7
Jrue Holiday\holidjr01           118  111          7
George Hill\hillge01             119  113          6
Greg Monroe\monrogr01            114  109          5
Khris Middleton\middlkh01        112  111          1
Lindell Wigginton\wiggili01      113  113          0
Serge Ibaka\ibakase01            109  111         -2
Brook Lopez\lopezbr01            104  106         -2
Thanasis Antetokounmpo\antetth01 106  110         -4
Wesley Matthews\matthwe02        108  114         -6
Rodney Hood\hoodro01             107  114         -7
Jordan Nwora\nworajo01           100  111        -11
Donte DiVincenzo\divindo01       94   112        -18
Semi Ojeleye\ojelese01           96   114        -18
Georgios Kalaitzakis\kalaige01   93   113        -20
Justin Robinson\robinju01        87   113        -26
Javonte Smart\smartja01          77   113        -36
Luke Kornet\kornelu01            69   119        -50
Langston Galloway\gallola01      56   113        -57
Javin DeLaurier\delauja01             72         -72
Jeff Dowtin\dowtije01            0    120       -120


Boston
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

Player                        ORtg DRtg ORtg-DRtg
------                        ---- ---- ---------
Joe Johnson\johnsjo02         200  116         84
Robert Williams\williro04     145  102         43
Daniel Theis\theisda01        132  99          33
Grant Williams\willigr01      126  109         17
Al Horford\horfoal01          120  104         16
Enes Freedom\kanteen01        120  105         15
Justin Jackson\jacksju01      125  116          9
Sam Hauser\hausesa01          118  110          8
Jabari Parker\parkeja01       113  105          8
Derrick White\whitede01       112  107          5
Josh Richardson\richajo01     113  108          5
Jayson Tatum\tatumja01        110  106          4
Marcus Smart\smartma01        110  106          4
Bruno Fernando\fernabr01      110  108          2
Payton Pritchard\pritcpa01    111  111          0
Jaylen Brown\brownja02        107  107          0
Romeo Langford\langfro01      107  108         -1
Dennis Schröder\schrode01     108  110         -2
Aaron Nesmith\nesmiaa01       90   108        -18
Brodric Thomas\thomabr01      89   112        -23
Juancho Hernangómez\hernaju01 74   105        -31
Luke Kornet\kornelu01         23   96         -73
Kelan Martin\martike03        0    106       -106
Malik Fitts\fittsma01         0    106       -106
C.J. Miles\milescj01               115       -115

Philly
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

Player                        ORtg DRtg ORtg-DRtg
------                        ---- ---- ---------
Willie Cauley-Stein\caulewi01 228  108        120
DeAndre Jordan\jordade01      168  99          69
James Harden\hardeja01        145  110         35
Charles Bassey\bassech01      128  102         26
Joel Embiid\embiijo01         120  104         16
Andre Drummond\drumman01      109  99          10
Jaden Springer\sprinja01      102  94           8
Tyrese Maxey\maxeyty01        120  113          7
Paul Reed\reedpa01            108  102          6
Matisse Thybulle\thybuma01    113  107          6
Tobias Harris\harrito02       111  111          0
Seth Curry\curryse01          113  114         -1
Georges Niang\niangge01       112  114         -2
Tyler Johnson\johnsty01       108  111         -3
Paul Millsap\millspa01        105  109         -4
Danny Green\greenda02         104  110         -6
Shake Milton\miltosh01        104  112         -8
Furkan Korkmaz\korkmfu01      103  113        -10
Isaiah Joe\joeis01            103  114        -11
Charlie Brown Jr.\brownch02   91   109        -18
Braxton Key\keybr01           71   95         -24
Myles Powell\powelmy01        74   114        -40
Aaron Henry\henryaa01         29   110        -81


1. Oladipo is our best player
2. This is a good sign for Herro, please continue to play winning basketball.
3. Bucks: Jrue and Middleton are surprising
4. Celtics: Tatum and Brown surprising, holy **** Robert Williams
5. Sixers: as expected tbh.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1353 » by IceColdCubano » Tue Mar 8, 2022 8:34 pm

AirP. wrote:
Kobewade11 wrote:throwbacktuesday.

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Which also means 25% he doesn't? I get if he said it was 100% going to happen he didn't. 99% of everything that gets talked about doesn't happen but you do find out from that report is that Miami was very much open to moving him, more then likely it was in a package for a high level player.

Myself, I'm very interested in how Herro handles teams that start to gameplan against him which should start in the playoffs because of right now teams really aren't because there just isn't much knowledge about his game nor the time to practice for that gameplan to take away what he likes vs a vet that players already know what he likes or doesn't like. Although Butler was horrific in the playoffs, Herro shot just under 32% from the field himself. If Herro is a good scorer in the playoffs he should have proved himself enough to stay with him long term, if he doesn't score well in the playoffs he'll have a season to work on counters and Miami will have another season and playoffs before they have to decide on what to do with him and to see if he grows as a player with new counters.

With all that being said, Herro's hot shooting of late has gotten him to leap his rookie season's efficiency at .550 TS% to having his most efficient season so far currently at .553 TS%, also he's raised his ORTG-DRTG from -9 earlier in the season to now just -4 which is a dramatic swing inside a season.


A couple of things from what you mentioned above I want to point out.

1. I am in agreement that during the time this was posted, the whole NBA was talking about Hero being the trade asset and a foregone conclusion he was traded in the off season. It didn't happen, the team went a different direction. Nobody really ever has all the cards in play like our GM does the moment those calls get made. I am sure if Pat, walked us through all the options we would of seen through his lens that the obvious choice was to keep Tyler. I am sure that if the opportunity benefited us he would have been sent bye bye in trade with flowers in hand.

2. Teams are already game planning for Hero. I love to hear all the post game talks from the other coaches as they have a lot of good tid bits in there. I have heard multiple times, "we knew Hero was going to come in a make and be a difference maker", "we made some adjustments before the game and some at half time that we thought could slow him down", "we will keep tinkering with our bench and we staggered some starters to slow him down". those are some, most recently Doc Rivers said "we threw the zone at Miami, its on us that Jimmy was able to do some of those things as he is not a zone buster, but we knew Hero was that guy who would be able to break it".

3. Hero's increase in efficiency on offense is a two part change that occurred after the all star break.
- The team has been involving him in sets, via pick and roll, hand offs, cutting back doors during his staggered minutes with the starters. Hero was usually just standing around the three point line, and watching and waiting for a kick out. So the coaching staff has made some really good modifications on that end. Its making him harder to guard.
- Hero himself has also changed his game plan, he is taking less and by less I mean almost 1/8 of the shots he took before from midrange. He is focusing on driving to the basket more, which shows form his increase in free throws. This has given him far greater open 3pts because the defender is now stepping back and playing for the drive when he starts his dribble. He is also taking more 3pts from the top of the key, which is his most efficient spot for him, and less from the angles which were his worst. He is involving the big man in half of the plays, either to pass on the roll for easy dunk/layup or for him to score on the other end. He is making smarter decisions. He is using the floater a lot more on his drives, which means less chance of being blocked, I mean I see them at least 2-3 per game now, this a guards bread and butter on a dribble drive. I think the time off during the all star break was very important they were able to get together and watch film, review and find some adjustments to the team as a whole, but my guess is the biggest ones that affected the team were to Hero's overall game.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1354 » by twix2500 » Tue Mar 8, 2022 8:39 pm

somerandomdude wrote:So the next question I have is, do you guys see Herro and Dipo being too redundant and taking shots away from each other?

Herro played his best last night with Dipo off the floor and slowed down when Dipo was in.

Not to hate on Duncan, but I think this would all work out better if Dipo were in the SL and Duncan came off the bench.

Or the Heat are going to have put Herro and Dipo in spot up 3 situations to space the floor for each other.

Either way, it looks like a tough challenge in terms of maximizing both players when they're on the court. Best case is Curry/Klay type role.

And fwiw, I'm not talking out of my ass here; both Herro and Dipo were asked this question and hinted at knowing there's a challenge to both of them playing together.

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You taking too much from last night to look at stats as indication how the chemistry will work. Last night the players just wanted to insure Dipo some touches to get him comfortable again.

Dipo and Herro are not redundant. Dipo is a better ball handler out of Herro and Vincent. Dipo can handle press defense and get the offense set. He will draw the press defender away from Herro. Herro can focus using his ball handling coming off screens or in the open court. Dipo also a better drive and kick player than Herro. Dipo will put rim pressure on opponents and he is good at corner 3s. Herro can focus on shooting mid range and from three on the wings.

We are gonna see a lot of Herro at the small forward position. In all it should make Herro a more efficient player. Herro score 31 pts on 18 shots instead of 22 plus shots and getting 26 pts

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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1355 » by 3ammy3uck3ts » Tue Mar 8, 2022 8:43 pm

somerandomdude wrote:So the next question I have is, do you guys see Herro and Dipo being too redundant and taking shots away from each other?

Herro played his best last night with Dipo off the floor and slowed down when Dipo was in.

Not to hate on Duncan, but I think this would all work out better if Dipo were in the SL and Duncan came off the bench.

Or the Heat are going to have put Herro and Dipo in spot up 3 situations to space the floor for each other.

Either way, it looks like a tough challenge in terms of maximizing both players when they're on the court. Best case is Curry/Klay type role.

And fwiw, I'm not talking out of my ass here; both Herro and Dipo were asked this question and hinted at knowing there's a challenge to both of them playing together.

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I think Duncan should be out of the rotation all together personally. Gabe and Strus are more complete players.

I think Dipo and Herro can make it work but if not I would love to see Dipo starting over Duncan and 70% of DHOs eliminated from the damn offense and let out monster of a mismatch in Bam go to work like the Brooklyn game.

Lowry/Gabe
Dipo/Herro
Jimmy/Duncan or Strus
Tucker/Martin
Bam/Dedmon

I’d love to see that. I think in the playoffs If Spo we’re to shorten the rotation we could see Duncan or Strus taken out since they’re the closest to being “1 dimensional” guys. Can’t see Duncan being cut out of the rotation though if were going to trade him this summer
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1356 » by AirP. » Tue Mar 8, 2022 8:48 pm

3ammy3uck3ts wrote:
1. Oladipo is our best player
2. This is a good sign for Herro, please continue to play winning basketball.
3. Bucks: Jrue and Middleton are surprising
4. Celtics: Tatum and Brown surprising, holy **** Robert Williams
5. Sixers: as expected tbh.


Role players can have very high ORTG-DRTG since they only shoot open shots, I mentally separate role-players from more utilized players offensively.

Tatum and Brown's ORTGs were below league average until January which is around when the Celtics turned it around after being bad the first half of the season.

Middleton's DRTG has been really bad in Feb and so far in March too.
Holiday's DRTG has been really bad since January but wow, he's had 2 normal months and 2 short months(Nov and March currently) of ORTGs of 125+.

Looking at Milwaukee, going back to Dec 28th the Bucks have scored 120+ points in 15 games and 8 of those game were 130 or more points so they've had to be going at a quicker pace but also being more efficient during those games.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1357 » by 3ammy3uck3ts » Tue Mar 8, 2022 9:01 pm

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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1358 » by DayofMourning » Tue Mar 8, 2022 9:12 pm

3ammy3uck3ts wrote:
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Bam is consistently undervalued as a defender. The space he covers and the energy he exerts on that end is 2nd to none.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1359 » by AirP. » Tue Mar 8, 2022 9:24 pm

IceColdCubano wrote:2. Teams are already game planning for Hero. I love to hear all the post game talks from the other coaches as they have a lot of good tid bits in there. I have heard multiple times, "we knew Hero was going to come in a make and be a difference maker", "we made some adjustments before the game and some at half time that we thought could slow him down", "we will keep tinkering with our bench and we staggered some starters to slow him down". those are some, most recently Doc Rivers said "we threw the zone at Miami, its on us that Jimmy was able to do some of those things as he is not a zone buster, but we knew Hero was that guy who would be able to break it".

Not really, generally sure but not specific to Herro. For instance, not many are getting up on him pressuring him where his poor dribbling skills are a problem where he'll lose the ball or make a mistake passing, when I see a defender playing off Herro I expect to see a solid shot coming from Herro, either just shoot over him or just probing with a dribble and utilizing their momentum against them, Herro feasts off not only bad defenders but defenders who just don't know to get up on him, basically low effort defensive defenders.

On zones, you bust them with passing and manipulating the zone for easy scores or good shooting when open or a quick move to use a defender's momentum against them when they're recovering and Herro happens to be able to exploit both of those with his offense and that's not going to change so a zone will have to change to better handle a player like Herro like possibly a box and one with someone cheating towards Herro and that's where everyone's favorite word gravity may come into play allowing his teammates to have more space and with that, possibly his overall ORTG going up.
3. Hero's increase in efficiency on offense is a two part change that occurred after the all star break.
- The team has been involving him in sets, via pick and roll, hand offs, cutting back doors during his staggered minutes with the starters. Hero was usually just standing around the three point line, and watching and waiting for a kick out. So the coaching staff has made some really good modifications on that end. Its making him harder to guard.
- Hero himself has also changed his game plan, he is taking less and by less I mean almost 1/8 of the shots he took before from midrange. He is focusing on driving to the basket more, which shows form his increase in free throws. This has given him far greater open 3pts because the defender is now stepping back and playing for the drive when he starts his dribble. He is also taking more 3pts from the top of the key, which is his most efficient spot for him, and less from the angles which were his worst. He is involving the big man in half of the plays, either to pass on the roll for easy dunk/layup or for him to score on the other end. He is making smarter decisions. He is using the floater a lot more on his drives, which means less chance of being blocked, I mean I see them at least 2-3 per game now, this a guards bread and butter on a dribble drive. I think the time off during the all star break was very important they were able to get together and watch film, review and find some adjustments to the team as a whole, but my guess is the biggest ones that affected the team were to Hero's overall game.


Yes, Herro is taking the better shots, 3s and drives and leaving midranges alone and it's really helping out his ORTG which means he's helping out the team more.

Spoelstra has been stressing the shot selection with Herro for a while, the announcers were openly talking about it during the game at Portland and somewhat recently Spoelstra mentioned it to the press, it would be nice if his shot selection will stay this good or is this just something he's doing currently. Just a guess, Spoelstra may know Herro has a itchy trigger finger so to satisfy that itch Spoelstra is calling more plays for Herro vs letting Herro just "create" and also put up some bad shots.

The one think I've noticed just watching the games seems to be like you said... more pick and rolls, more 3s and less midrange shots.

ORTG by month for Herro this year (average is 111 this year)
Oct 111 6 games
Nov 104 12 games
Dec 100 12 games
Jan 100 12 games
Feb 115 7 games <- 63% TS% which is very good/great for a high volume scorer.
Mar 123 4 games <- nearly 67% TS% those 6 games which is insane.

His TS% has went up the last 2 months, Feb his TS% in 7 games was .630 and March so far in 4 games is a crazy .676 which if you look around in the NBA, only high FG% bigs are doing that type of efficiency so to me that's an outlier hot streak.

So is this just a hot streak which he's had before or a new normal? Looking at last year it was somewhat the same thing except worse, instead of 100 ORTG months he had 97s.
Last year
Dec 105 4 games
Jan 97 8 games
Feb 102 7 games
Mar 97 4 games
Apr 110 11 games
May 122 6 games

Herro's shot selection lately like you said has been very encouraging and it's showing up in his stats and is really helping the Heat out.
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Re: Miami Heat Regular Season Thread 21-22 Vol. 3 

Post#1360 » by carnageta » Tue Mar 8, 2022 9:27 pm

Bam is a better all-arounder defender than Gobert. Rudy is greater at locking down the paint, and that's about it.

In the modern NBA it's simply more beneficiary to have versatile defensive bigs (Adebayo, Antetokounmpo, Draymond, etc. etc.) due to the offensive schemes that are ran nowadays. Gobert literally got played off of the court in that Lakers game because he was too much of a liability on the perimeter. Bam would never.

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