Artis Gilmore in the 90s - Where does he rank among Centers

[migya]

If Artis Gilmore was drafted in place of Shawn Bradley in 1992 at age 22 like in 1971 when he started playing in the ABA, where would he rank among Centers in the 90s and does he perform near the level he did in his career?

Does Gilmore get any awards or accolades?

[70sFan]

That's interesting timeline. Of course he wouldn't get accolades he did in the ABA as a rookie, as he'd have to compete against peak Hakeem, prime Robinson and rookie Shaq. Once he hit his peak, he could make some noise. His 1975 season would happen in 1996. Hakeem didn't have the best season, Ewing declined from his prime years and Shaq missed a lot of games. I think he would make all-nba 2nd team, losing the spot to peak Robinson. 1997 would be even more interesting, as without Robinson and with Shaq missing games, he'd have a case for the best center in the league. Assuming good team record, he could even get MVP that year. He'd fight for accolades in 1999 with Mourning, then he'd be clearly the 2nd best center in the league in 2001-04 period (of course, not counting Duncan).

I think I would rank him similary as I already do. He's on Patrick Ewing level career-wise for me.

[countryboy667]

Don't know where to rank him, but like Nate Thurmond I consider him seriously underrated. He's a guy who in his prime would be among the elite fives in today's NBA.

[kcktiny]

Nate Thurmond was the 3rd best C of the Chamberlain/Russell era (late 50s to early 70s). Imho if Thurmond had played for the Celtics and not Russell we'd be talking about who the best C was of that era Chamberlain or Thurmond.

Gilmore was the 3rd best C the decade after the NBA/ABA merger behind Jabbar and Malone. I would compare a peak NBA/ABA Gilmore to a peak Dwight Howard.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

[penbeast0]

Nate Thurmond was the 3rd best C of the Chamberlain/Russell era (late 50s to early 70s). Imho if Thurmond had played for the Celtics and not Russell we'd be talking about who the best C was of that era Chamberlain or Thurmond.

Gilmore was the 3rd best C the decade after the NBA/ABA merger behind Jabbar and Malone. I would compare a peak NBA/ABA Gilmore to a peak Dwight Howard.

Thurmond v. Russell -- Thurmond scored more, on comparably bad efficiency (better than Russell but later in time as the league was advancing rapidly). Thurmond was the better man defender, Russell was the better rim protector, the better passer, and more capable of changing people shots out on the floor and getting back to the rim. Also the better rebounder and more of a coach on the floor. Russell also did it more consistently for longer and Golden State winning a ring the year they traded Thurmond for Clifford Ray to play center hurts his case too.

Thurmond v. Gilmore is closer but still not reasonable equivalents. Gilmore has a massive offensive edge as a higher volume, much more efficient scorer. Thurmond probably the better defender, though Gilmore in the ABA was much more active than he was in the NBA (some people blame injuries, others say it was the defensive schemes just as the offensive schemes had him much closer to the rim so less shots but even more efficient, some say Gilmore quit working as hard). I'd have Artis well above Nate if you include the ABA years, using just the NBA years it's much closer.

I have Gilmore just behind Pat Ewing on my all time centers list for careers though I'm not quite as high on him as I used to be due to posters here who have cast more doubts on his impact in Chicago and later. Gilmore v. Dwight Howard or Alonzo Mourning are the big fights and again, a lot depends on how you rate their prime defensive impacts.

[migya]

Nate Thurmond was the 3rd best C of the Chamberlain/Russell era (late 50s to early 70s). Imho if Thurmond had played for the Celtics and not Russell we'd be talking about who the best C was of that era Chamberlain or Thurmond.

Gilmore was the 3rd best C the decade after the NBA/ABA merger behind Jabbar and Malone. I would compare a peak NBA/ABA Gilmore to a peak Dwight Howard.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Marvelous footage, Thankyou very much

Both these guys very underrated alltime. Thurmond's outlet passes were amazing. Gilmore's skyhook wasn't far off Kareem's.

[70sFan]

I won't be humble, but I think I did quite a good job of bringing Artis Gilmore basketball career back to life. When I started my basketball journey here, there has been like 5 Gilmore games available online at most. For now, I have over 50 Gilmore games in my collection (without counting his last season).

[kcktiny]

Your YouTube channel is great, and there must a be a few hundred old NBA games on YouTube.

But for the life of me I can't understand why you can't just go to the NBA.com website, click on an "Old Games" link, click on a year, and then click on any of many old NBA games from particular seasons. The NBA is a multi-billion dollar enterprise, I'd be willing to bet they have an archive of many old games, but that have yet to be made public, no?

Even if they charged you a few cents or even a buck to watch an old game, or you had to pay for a membership to the archives, I think they'd make out quite well.

[70sFan]

Your YouTube channel is great, and there must a be a few hundred old NBA games on YouTube.

But for the life of me I can't understand why you can't just go to the NBA.com website, click on an "Old Games" link, click on a year, and then click on any of many old NBA games from particular seasons. The NBA is a multi-billion dollar enterprise, I'd be willing to bet they have an archive of many old games, but that have yet to be made public, no?

Even if they charged you a few cents or even a buck to watch an old game, or you had to pay for a membership to the archives, I think they'd make out quite well.

I don't understand it either, but they are not interested in that. I contacted them a few times and they are not willing to even give the access to some of their games, let alone make it available for everyone.

[Dr Positivity]

I have him as worse than Ewing so All NBA teams in the mid 90s would be hard to come by

[migya]

I have him as worse than Ewing so All NBA teams in the mid 90s would be hard to come by

I think that too but there were seasons in the late 90s where some of the stars were injured and he could've gotten one or two Allnba team spurs.

[70sFan]

I have him as worse than Ewing so All NBA teams in the mid 90s would be hard to come by

I don't think it's clear cut that hr's worse than Ewing, but even if so, we have to look at the timeline. He would make the league in 1992, so his best seasons (1975-78) would be 1996-99. This version of Ewing wasn't much of a threat for peak Gilmore. He'd definitely make all-nba team in 1997 without Robinson and likely in 1998-99 as well, unless you think Mourning would steal his accolades. Then 1979 Gilmore in 2000 is a lock all-nba player. With Mourning injury and Robinson getting old, I don't see anyone taking his spots away in 2002-04 either.

[HeartBreakKid]

Your YouTube channel is great, and there must a be a few hundred old NBA games on YouTube.

But for the life of me I can't understand why you can't just go to the NBA.com website, click on an "Old Games" link, click on a year, and then click on any of many old NBA games from particular seasons. The NBA is a multi-billion dollar enterprise, I'd be willing to bet they have an archive of many old games, but that have yet to be made public, no?

Even if they charged you a few cents or even a buck to watch an old game, or you had to pay for a membership to the archives, I think they'd make out quite well.

Cost resources to do that and they'd likely feel the need to remaster the older footage

[70sFan]

Your YouTube channel is great, and there must a be a few hundred old NBA games on YouTube.

But for the life of me I can't understand why you can't just go to the NBA.com website, click on an "Old Games" link, click on a year, and then click on any of many old NBA games from particular seasons. The NBA is a multi-billion dollar enterprise, I'd be willing to bet they have an archive of many old games, but that have yet to be made public, no?

Even if they charged you a few cents or even a buck to watch an old game, or you had to pay for a membership to the archives, I think they'd make out quite well.

Cost resources to do that and they'd likely feel the need to remaster the older footage

They do it anyway though. We have a lot of short videos uploaded by them on various occasions from games we have never seen before. Most of them look like they are remastered.

[HeartBreakKid]

Your YouTube channel is great, and there must a be a few hundred old NBA games on YouTube.

But for the life of me I can't understand why you can't just go to the NBA.com website, click on an "Old Games" link, click on a year, and then click on any of many old NBA games from particular seasons. The NBA is a multi-billion dollar enterprise, I'd be willing to bet they have an archive of many old games, but that have yet to be made public, no?

Even if they charged you a few cents or even a buck to watch an old game, or you had to pay for a membership to the archives, I think they'd make out quite well.

Cost resources to do that and they'd likely feel the need to remaster the older footage

They do it anyway though. We have a lot of short videos uploaded by them on various occasions from games we have never seen before. Most of them look like they are remastered.

They do short clips for deliberate purposes, that's different than essentially creating a netflix type of library of their entire NBA archive. It's resource heavy and there are probably licensing issues they'd have to get through (maybe not complex ones but more trouble than their worth).

It's more work for content that doesn't have much demand out there. There are archive collections of much pre 80 or 90s media in many different sports that are in the same boat.

Long story short, there's just not enough demand for them to do it.

[Dr Positivity]

I have him as worse than Ewing so All NBA teams in the mid 90s would be hard to come by

I don't think it's clear cut that hr's worse than Ewing, but even if so, we have to look at the timeline. He would make the league in 1992, so his best seasons (1975-78) would be 1996-99. This version of Ewing wasn't much of a threat for peak Gilmore. He'd definitely make all-nba team in 1997 without Robinson and likely in 1998-99 as well, unless you think Mourning would steal his accolades. Then 1979 Gilmore in 2000 is a lock all-nba player. With Mourning injury and Robinson getting old, I don't see anyone taking his spots away in 2002-04 either.

Mourning finished 2nd/3rd in MVP so it's plausible they would vote for him over Gilmore. However 3rd team is easy to get in those years.

[70sFan]

Cost resources to do that and they'd likely feel the need to remaster the older footage

They do it anyway though. We have a lot of short videos uploaded by them on various occasions from games we have never seen before. Most of them look like they are remastered.

They do short clips for deliberate purposes, that's different than essentially creating a netflix type of library of their entire NBA archive. It's resource heavy and there are probably licensing issues they'd have to get through (maybe not complex ones but more trouble than their worth).

It's more work for content that doesn't have much demand out there. There are archive collections of much pre 80 or 90s media in many different sports that are in the same boat.

Long story short, there's just not enough demand for them to do it.

I've heard they have some licensing issues, but they likely don't apply to most footage they collected, at least from the old 1950-80 era. I agree it's probably caused by lack of demand, but at the same time they are not willing to help individual persons/buissnesses that want to create documentaries or do research. I contacted them twice in last 3 years and I had no success, at the beginning they created a lot of odd requirements and when I managed to fulfill them, they said that they won't help me after a few months of our conversation.

Last year I really hoped that they'd decide to do something special for 75th anniversary. Outside of few clips in Archive 75 series, they gave us nothing new.

I wouldn't expect them to create netflix-like platform, but at least they could make their NBA Classic series bigger with some new material.

[70sFan]

I have him as worse than Ewing so All NBA teams in the mid 90s would be hard to come by

I don't think it's clear cut that hr's worse than Ewing, but even if so, we have to look at the timeline. He would make the league in 1992, so his best seasons (1975-78) would be 1996-99. This version of Ewing wasn't much of a threat for peak Gilmore. He'd definitely make all-nba team in 1997 without Robinson and likely in 1998-99 as well, unless you think Mourning would steal his accolades. Then 1979 Gilmore in 2000 is a lock all-nba player. With Mourning injury and Robinson getting old, I don't see anyone taking his spots away in 2002-04 either.

Mourning finished 2nd/3rd in MVP so it's plausible they would vote for him over Gilmore. However 3rd team is easy to get in those years.

Yeah, maybe. It would depend on Gilmore's team success I guess. I think Artis was better than Mourning, but it's not always about the level of play. That said, 3rd team would be a lock for him, as you said.