The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

[tiderulz]

Rookies in the NBA get better as they adjust.

Some insurmountably and some not so much. That’s the whole point of a scouting department.

Gauging whether a player will meet their perceived potential (or not) is part of the draft process.

How do people not believe this?

Every player in the league was a rookie.

to add to this, some players develop differently. Some come out like gang busters their rookie year and regress. Some start slow and get better. Some come into horrible coaching situations and some come into structured environments. So many different paths for the NBA players.

Look at the scouting report for Kawhi Leonard

Does not have one aspect offensively that stands out or which allows him to consistently score the ball … With his size and frame, will almost certainly be a perimeter player at the next level, but he lacks the polish and skill necessary to consistently operate on the wing … He does not have break down ability off the dribble and he is especially shaky handling the ball with his left hand … His jumpshot (while definitely improved) is still very inconsistent

Leonard is not only an average ball-handler, but he also struggles to make shots consistently from beyond the arc. His 0.743 points per shots on jumpers ranks 16th of 17 in the class, where he shot an abysmal 31% from the field. His struggles extend both to his catch and shoot jumpers (32%) and pull-ups (28%).

However, given Leonard's 6'7'' frame, he will be forced to play on the perimeter on the next level. Leonard is a great athlete, but simply does not have the ballhandling or the frame of mind to play small forward at a high level.

But good situation given time and forced by a coach to work on parts of his game. yes, not every player will be able to improve certain aspects and that is what scouts are paid to identify who can improve and who cant.

True. People really don’t take situation into account as much as they should. It can completely define a players entire career based on where they start.

shoot, look at the difference of Draymond under Mark Jackson vs Steve Kerr. Green sometimes mentioned as possible HOF, but no way that would have happened on how he was used by Jackson.

[pepe1991]

Nba draft Leonard

Strengths: A hybrid forward with terrific length … He has a high motor and plays the game with a lot of energy … Spends majority of the time on the perimeter, but occasionally shows the ability to play with his back to the basket … Uses an effective turnaround jumper inside when posting up … An agile athlete, his strides are extremely long and he covers a lot of space when running the floor … Shows improvement in majority of areas from freshman to sophomore seasons … His shooting has improved and he has become a respectable threat from the outside … Operating out of the triple threat, he combines a nice jab with a fairly quick and long first step to create separation … He has a strong preference going to his pull-up jumper, and once he gets into a rhythm he can string a number makes together (his length and high release make it a difficult shot to contest) … He is fairly comfortable handling the ball in the open court and is capable of pushing it out off the rebound when the situation calls for it … Even with the improvements to his offensive game, he still continues to contribute heavily in the rebounding department … His huge hangs, length, energy and great timing, allow him to snatch balls on both ends that are well outside of his rebounding area … An extremely quick jumper, he is very good at tipping the ball and keeping it alive on the rim … Has the instincts and shows potential in becoming a very solid defender … His ability to get out in the passing lanes and also contest shots inside make him a very dangerous weapon on the defensive end



Players do improve. Players improve better on taem that gives them defined role they can handle and expend game later. Situation where player lands is more important than draft slot. Kawhi Leonard spent rookie year playing Bruce Bown role, hustling on defense, getting some rebounds, doing nothing but catch& shoot . Spurs won championship with him being 3rd team scorer. He didn't take massive role on offense until he was in his 5th nba season. If he was here people would cry to get Manu , Parker and Duncan off team so he can average 25 poitns on 15 wins team during his second year.

[yoyojw17]

Nba draft Leonard

Strengths: A hybrid forward with terrific length … He has a high motor and plays the game with a lot of energy … Spends majority of the time on the perimeter, but occasionally shows the ability to play with his back to the basket … Uses an effective turnaround jumper inside when posting up … An agile athlete, his strides are extremely long and he covers a lot of space when running the floor … Shows improvement in majority of areas from freshman to sophomore seasons … His shooting has improved and he has become a respectable threat from the outside … Operating out of the triple threat, he combines a nice jab with a fairly quick and long first step to create separation … He has a strong preference going to his pull-up jumper, and once he gets into a rhythm he can string a number makes together (his length and high release make it a difficult shot to contest) … He is fairly comfortable handling the ball in the open court and is capable of pushing it out off the rebound when the situation calls for it … Even with the improvements to his offensive game, he still continues to contribute heavily in the rebounding department … His huge hangs, length, energy and great timing, allow him to snatch balls on both ends that are well outside of his rebounding area … An extremely quick jumper, he is very good at tipping the ball and keeping it alive on the rim … Has the instincts and shows potential in becoming a very solid defender … His ability to get out in the passing lanes and also contest shots inside make him a very dangerous weapon on the defensive end



Players do improve. Players improve better on taem that gives them defined role they can handle and expend game later. Situation where player lands is more important than draft slot. Kawhi Leonard spent rookie year playing Bruce Bown role, hustling on defense, getting some rebounds, doing nothing but catch& shoot . Spurs won championship with him being 3rd team scorer. He didn't take massive role on offense until he was in his 5th nba season. If he was here people would cry to get Manu , Parker and Duncan off team so he can average 25 poitns on 15 wins team during his second year.

And the best part about it is... they have guidance from players closer to their age that have seen success. I've never been the type that would think that free reign is the best.... Players get bad habits and misdirection that they find hard to break. That's why successful teams... with successful players.... proven system.... and common goals will result in drawing out the best of what would have been "another teams trash". Wiggins... meh... goes to golden state... allstar. Same thing with Kuminga.... I wanted him in the draft... but... wasn't mad that we didn't because... I felt like without structure .... it might be a tougher road. when he got selected by GS... the Kuminga/leonard comparison became more tangible in my head.... whether or not it will happen.... eh. lol

[LDNMagic90]

Learning curve for everything does not start at age of 18. All studies prove it kind a ends there.
Player can settle in, can adjust to new system, learn about new league, get nutrition and practice in check and normally by year 3- or 4he is finished product.
At average, nba player turns into allstar at age of 24, by default, for most players that's their 3rd or 4th nba season.

Players do get better, but they get better within skills they showed in past. Player, at age of 19, entering nba , already played that sport for 9 years at least.
Players rarly to never learn new skills in nba, ones that they showed no flashes off in past. College brick shooter ( MKG; MCW, Ben Simmons and others) almost never turn into even average nba shooters, let alone great ones.
Players without post moves ( Bamba, Isaac to name a few) almost never later become good at it.

Last year i called Okeke bench Ariza, you said i'm too impatient. Funny how this year you are yet to mention once that his rookie year was actually better than his sophmore year. So, i guess we need to wait additional 10 years ? Or maybe, just maybe i was right?

We just played Suns, they have that one 10th overall Magic lottery pick that were everybody was up in arms he will become good shooter "just give him time". He was DNP-CD guy tonight, like he is most of the season.
His rookie 3% was 26,2%. His career average is 28,8%, including with exponetional decline in usage of shot and usage of him as nba player as he never got any better at it. And this is execlly how expected progress looks like. 2-5% until your coach and GM figure that's not your game.
AG , rookie 27% ,career 32% , change of team , wide open looks, much easier role to fill, still 32% . That's his reality.

Ofc you can dig up everybody's favorite Chauncey Billups ( drafted 25 years ago and 1440 players later) and Kyle Lowry drafted 14 years ago and 780 players later, but ask yourself simple question: if my best hope is one out of seven hundred eighty how f*** am I?

What's your opinion about Jarret Culver ?
How about Killian Hayes.
How about our kid Cole Anthony ?

You telling me they can develop new skills, so why don't we collect all 19 yeras old scrubs and see how that goes?
Just keep in mind Killian Hayes is 20, soo... by your logic...just proper development and he is Lebron James in no time.

To me this is crazy talk .Player will enter nba with some skills ,either work on them and get nba- level good at it, or will simply not translate and his skillset will be wasteful. Every nba player has some skills and NO nba player has all the skills. Jarret Culver / Josh Jackson might be way more all around talented player than Duncan Robinson, but Duncan can do his role at nba level, where not a Jackson / Culver don't have clear plus size skill for nba, therfore they are not nba players. But all around, no dubt, Jackson is waaaaaaaay more talented and skilled than Duncan Robinson.

1 - show me all these studies that say you cant learn anything after age 18.
2 - Tim Duncan, HOF'r, didnt start playing basketbal until 14. many do but many dont start until later as they may have been playing a different sport.
3 - Okeke has been hurt this year, kind of hard to evaluate a player when they are still hurt.
4 - you always like to throw out this idea that "everyone said X and I said X and look now" when many times you are not the only voice in the cold.

I'm done, you've insulted me before too. keep talking down to people on here. You still have never said why you like the Magic, other than coming on here to berate posters. I lived in Orlando, went to many games, mostly when we were bad. Why do you, on the other side of the world, keep coming onto the Magic board when you hate so much about the team unless you obviously enjoy just insulting everyone?

Embiid also didn't start playing till he was 15 years old as well I swear? He's probably a very good example of being a 'late' bloomer in the present day NBA.

[IllMagic04]

This is one of dummest things people like to say and think here and by default always leads teams to draft half baked, untalented kids with good physical profiles and little to non basketball skills because of "potential".

Jabari Smith, much like any 18,19 years old college players, plays basketball for years. Being close to youth basketball circles for years and being nba fan for 20 years now one thing i learned long time ago. Young kids in basketball, much like in any other sport figure out what they are good at and stick to it . Fat kid will always have tendency to turn back to opponent and push him inside, good shooter will camp at 3 key circles ( corner and straight to rim , easiest shots to make ) , kids good at non will always play hard to hustle below rim.

This does not mean player can't learn new things at age of 19, but much like it was case with Hezonja and dribbling, Payton and shooting, Gordon and shooting, Ja Morant and shooting, Josh Jackson and shooting, Steph Curry and defense or any other player and his weaknesses THEY NEVER GOT NBA GOOD AT THEIR WEAKNESSES! PERIOD!

"bUT hE iS 18 hE WiLl LeARN ". True and false. He will learn how to be more assertive and better at next level. That learning curve will never be nba good for skills who still does not have at age of 19 because it simply means it's too late and not part of his game. And that's fine. But it's delusional to think different.
Why Bamba didn't learn post moves 4 years into nba? Why Isaac didn't learn post moves? Why Howard and Amare were paying $50 000 to attent Hakeem teaching classes and never were able to post up with efficiency?

This is one of most annoying american -mindsets about basketball on this forum. Just because somebody is young that does not give him unlimited potental. Being young just means being born later than others.

As for Chet vs Jabari, the one thing I'd say is that a lot of Chet's value is tied up in rebounding and shot-blocking. These are two things he does very well at the college level. So if you put him out on the wing, you're not getting the most out of him. (Maybe you have to do it -- temporarily or permanently -- if he can't handle the physical game inside, but it's a real compromise. it cuts into his value. I don't think you draft him with the intent of moving him.)

As for Jabari... I mean, I don't know. He's a good shooter, he knocks down open college threes, that's cool. He also just... doesn't do much else? He's an inefficient scorer inside the arc, and can't finish around the basket. His rebounding is mediocre at best. Nobody's calling him a plus defender or passer/handler. I get that he's young, and I'm not saying he's a bad prospect. I'm just not seeing a real game-changing skill set here. Unlike Chet, where the question is "he has it, but can he use it at the next level?," there are real "does he have it?" questions with Jabari.


SO i'm asking you, why don't every player at age of 18 does not turn in lebron james? You think young = unlimited potential so why not? Why Magic don't draft bunch of 16 years old kids and turn them into 10 Lebron's? Maybe, just maybe for same reason why every draft has always same bust arytypes , ones that Magic love the most " athletic, can't shoot, long limbs" ( minus Wagner, who, suprise suprise, is best prospect they drafted in 15 years, and pretty much only one who does not fit their mold)

Bottom line: young player entering nba will almost never addopt new skillset, one that he never showed before and become nba level good ( or elite ) at it. NBA player, entering league at age of 19, more often than not, played basketball for 10 years already and his previous basketball experience along with countless amount of hours they spent with their coaches, playing street ball, playing youth tournaments molded him as player that made him sucessful to that date ( Cole being chucker is example i used on other thread for same ). If you have guy who stands at 6'10, is good shooter but isn't good rebounder, isn't good passer , isn't post presence, isn't pick&roll finisher, can't play center, can't play SF, can't put ball on the floor, can't drive left, can't drive much in general, isn't anything special defender ( but plays along side one ) than we can look at Marvin Willimas, Tobias Harris, maybe Rashard Lewis , very limited Towns arhytype. People here LOVE to use Jaren Jackson Jr as comp for him, issue is, Jarret Jackson Jr plays with Ja Morant AND spents almost 50% of his PT at center. Jabari will never be able to play center sucessful ( same reasons why Bamba can't, not good at pick&roll, no inside presence, poor skills at postups) so you are stuck with him at PF. In general "streach PF" who are "elite " almost don't exist in nba.Shheesh i wonder why is that? Maybe because today "PF is basically taller SF, and all good ones are super versitale. Jabari simply isn't. He is very tall shooter. Cool. That's not usless, but also not skill worth top pick.

when you start off calling me dumb and acting like you are the only one with basketball knowledge, im back to not engaging with you.

I'm calling your opinion dumb, not you. Difference is clear.
Learning curve for everything does not start at age of 18. All studies prove it kind a ends there.
Player can settle in, can adjust to new system, learn about new league, get nutrition and practice in check and normally by year 3- or 4he is finished product.
At average, nba player turns into allstar at age of 24, by default, for most players that's their 3rd or 4th nba season.

Players do get better, but they get better within skills they showed in past. Player, at age of 19, entering nba , already played that sport for 9 years at least.
Players rarly to never learn new skills in nba, ones that they showed no flashes off in past. College brick shooter ( MKG; MCW, Ben Simmons and others) almost never turn into even average nba shooters, let alone great ones.
Players without post moves ( Bamba, Isaac to name a few) almost never later become good at it.

Last year i called Okeke bench Ariza, you said i'm too impatient. Funny how this year you are yet to mention once that his rookie year was actually better than his sophmore year. So, i guess we need to wait additional 10 years ? Or maybe, just maybe i was right?

We just played Suns, they have that one 10th overall Magic lottery pick that were everybody was up in arms he will become good shooter "just give him time". He was DNP-CD guy tonight, like he is most of the season.
His rookie 3% was 26,2%. His career average is 28,8%, including with exponetional decline in usage of shot and usage of him as nba player as he never got any better at it. And this is execlly how expected progress looks like. 2-5% until your coach and GM figure that's not your game.
AG , rookie 27% ,career 32% , change of team , wide open looks, much easier role to fill, still 32% . That's his reality.

Ofc you can dig up everybody's favorite Chauncey Billups ( drafted 25 years ago and 1440 players later) and Kyle Lowry drafted 14 years ago and 780 players later, but ask yourself simple question: if my best hope is one out of seven hundred eighty how f*** am I?

What's your opinion about Jarret Culver ?
How about Killian Hayes.
How about our kid Cole Anthony ?

You telling me they can develop new skills, so why don't we collect all 19 yeras old scrubs and see how that goes?
Just keep in mind Killian Hayes is 20, soo... by your logic...just proper development and he is Lebron James in no time.

To me this is crazy talk .Player will enter nba with some skills ,either work on them and get nba- level good at it, or will simply not translate and his skillset will be wasteful. Every nba player has some skills and NO nba player has all the skills. Jarret Culver / Josh Jackson might be way more all around talented player than Duncan Robinson, but Duncan can do his role at nba level, where not a Jackson / Culver don't have clear plus size skill for nba, therfore they are not nba players. But all around, no dubt, Jackson is waaaaaaaay more talented and skilled than Duncan Robinson.

I feel what your saying but I cant completely get behind players cant improve on weaknesses argument. AG did become a better shooter then I ever expected. He showed nothing but raw athleticism at Arizona. He got his percentage up to the mid 30s. To your point though hes a carrer 32% but thats better then I woulda thought coming in. Something else to keep in mind is players are sometimes held back in the good of the teams system. Look at Franz. Does he even look like the same player as he was a Michigan? Kwahi absolutely improved his shot from college. JJ Redick improved his defense from college. It can be done. I do think you make some valid points though.

Sent from my SM-G970U using RealGM mobile app

[Petre1978]

Learning curve for everything does not start at age of 18. All studies prove it kind a ends there.
Player can settle in, can adjust to new system, learn about new league, get nutrition and practice in check and normally by year 3- or 4he is finished product.
At average, nba player turns into allstar at age of 24, by default, for most players that's their 3rd or 4th nba season.

Players do get better, but they get better within skills they showed in past. Player, at age of 19, entering nba , already played that sport for 9 years at least.
Players rarly to never learn new skills in nba, ones that they showed no flashes off in past. College brick shooter ( MKG; MCW, Ben Simmons and others) almost never turn into even average nba shooters, let alone great ones.
Players without post moves ( Bamba, Isaac to name a few) almost never later become good at it.

Last year i called Okeke bench Ariza, you said i'm too impatient. Funny how this year you are yet to mention once that his rookie year was actually better than his sophmore year. So, i guess we need to wait additional 10 years ? Or maybe, just maybe i was right?

We just played Suns, they have that one 10th overall Magic lottery pick that were everybody was up in arms he will become good shooter "just give him time". He was DNP-CD guy tonight, like he is most of the season.
His rookie 3% was 26,2%. His career average is 28,8%, including with exponetional decline in usage of shot and usage of him as nba player as he never got any better at it. And this is execlly how expected progress looks like. 2-5% until your coach and GM figure that's not your game.
AG , rookie 27% ,career 32% , change of team , wide open looks, much easier role to fill, still 32% . That's his reality.

Ofc you can dig up everybody's favorite Chauncey Billups ( drafted 25 years ago and 1440 players later) and Kyle Lowry drafted 14 years ago and 780 players later, but ask yourself simple question: if my best hope is one out of seven hundred eighty how f*** am I?

What's your opinion about Jarret Culver ?
How about Killian Hayes.
How about our kid Cole Anthony ?

You telling me they can develop new skills, so why don't we collect all 19 yeras old scrubs and see how that goes?
Just keep in mind Killian Hayes is 20, soo... by your logic...just proper development and he is Lebron James in no time.

To me this is crazy talk .Player will enter nba with some skills ,either work on them and get nba- level good at it, or will simply not translate and his skillset will be wasteful. Every nba player has some skills and NO nba player has all the skills. Jarret Culver / Josh Jackson might be way more all around talented player than Duncan Robinson, but Duncan can do his role at nba level, where not a Jackson / Culver don't have clear plus size skill for nba, therfore they are not nba players. But all around, no dubt, Jackson is waaaaaaaay more talented and skilled than Duncan Robinson.

1 - show me all these studies that say you cant learn anything after age 18.
2 - Tim Duncan, HOF'r, didnt start playing basketbal until 14. many do but many dont start until later as they may have been playing a different sport.
3 - Okeke has been hurt this year, kind of hard to evaluate a player when they are still hurt.
4 - you always like to throw out this idea that "everyone said X and I said X and look now" when many times you are not the only voice in the cold.

I'm done, you've insulted me before too. keep talking down to people on here. You still have never said why you like the Magic, other than coming on here to berate posters. I lived in Orlando, went to many games, mostly when we were bad. Why do you, on the other side of the world, keep coming onto the Magic board when you hate so much about the team unless you obviously enjoy just insulting everyone?

I fully agree with you.
This guy is annoying.
Hard to believe he is a Magic fan.

[AaronB]

Learning curve for everything does not start at age of 18. All studies prove it kind a ends there.
Player can settle in, can adjust to new system, learn about new league, get nutrition and practice in check and normally by year 3- or 4he is finished product.
At average, nba player turns into allstar at age of 24, by default, for most players that's their 3rd or 4th nba season.

Players do get better, but they get better within skills they showed in past. Player, at age of 19, entering nba , already played that sport for 9 years at least.
Players rarly to never learn new skills in nba, ones that they showed no flashes off in past. College brick shooter ( MKG; MCW, Ben Simmons and others) almost never turn into even average nba shooters, let alone great ones.
Players without post moves ( Bamba, Isaac to name a few) almost never later become good at it.

Last year i called Okeke bench Ariza, you said i'm too impatient. Funny how this year you are yet to mention once that his rookie year was actually better than his sophmore year. So, i guess we need to wait additional 10 years ? Or maybe, just maybe i was right?

We just played Suns, they have that one 10th overall Magic lottery pick that were everybody was up in arms he will become good shooter "just give him time". He was DNP-CD guy tonight, like he is most of the season.
His rookie 3% was 26,2%. His career average is 28,8%, including with exponetional decline in usage of shot and usage of him as nba player as he never got any better at it. And this is execlly how expected progress looks like. 2-5% until your coach and GM figure that's not your game.
AG , rookie 27% ,career 32% , change of team , wide open looks, much easier role to fill, still 32% . That's his reality.

Ofc you can dig up everybody's favorite Chauncey Billups ( drafted 25 years ago and 1440 players later) and Kyle Lowry drafted 14 years ago and 780 players later, but ask yourself simple question: if my best hope is one out of seven hundred eighty how f*** am I?

What's your opinion about Jarret Culver ?
How about Killian Hayes.
How about our kid Cole Anthony ?

You telling me they can develop new skills, so why don't we collect all 19 yeras old scrubs and see how that goes?
Just keep in mind Killian Hayes is 20, soo... by your logic...just proper development and he is Lebron James in no time.

To me this is crazy talk .Player will enter nba with some skills ,either work on them and get nba- level good at it, or will simply not translate and his skillset will be wasteful. Every nba player has some skills and NO nba player has all the skills. Jarret Culver / Josh Jackson might be way more all around talented player than Duncan Robinson, but Duncan can do his role at nba level, where not a Jackson / Culver don't have clear plus size skill for nba, therfore they are not nba players. But all around, no dubt, Jackson is waaaaaaaay more talented and skilled than Duncan Robinson.

1 - show me all these studies that say you cant learn anything after age 18.
2 - Tim Duncan, HOF'r, didnt start playing basketbal until 14. many do but many dont start until later as they may have been playing a different sport.
3 - Okeke has been hurt this year, kind of hard to evaluate a player when they are still hurt.
4 - you always like to throw out this idea that "everyone said X and I said X and look now" when many times you are not the only voice in the cold.

I'm done, you've insulted me before too. keep talking down to people on here. You still have never said why you like the Magic, other than coming on here to berate posters. I lived in Orlando, went to many games, mostly when we were bad. Why do you, on the other side of the world, keep coming onto the Magic board when you hate so much about the team unless you obviously enjoy just insulting everyone?

Embiid also didn't start playing till he was 15 years old as well I swear? He's probably a very good example of being a 'late' bloomer in the present day NBA.

Mozart taught himself how to play the harpsichord at age 3. Just sayin' ...

[Skin]

Learning curve for everything does not start at age of 18. All studies prove it kind a ends there.
Player can settle in, can adjust to new system, learn about new league, get nutrition and practice in check and normally by year 3- or 4he is finished product.
At average, nba player turns into allstar at age of 24, by default, for most players that's their 3rd or 4th nba season.

Players do get better, but they get better within skills they showed in past. Player, at age of 19, entering nba , already played that sport for 9 years at least.
Players rarly to never learn new skills in nba, ones that they showed no flashes off in past. College brick shooter ( MKG; MCW, Ben Simmons and others) almost never turn into even average nba shooters, let alone great ones.
Players without post moves ( Bamba, Isaac to name a few) almost never later become good at it.

Last year i called Okeke bench Ariza, you said i'm too impatient. Funny how this year you are yet to mention once that his rookie year was actually better than his sophmore year. So, i guess we need to wait additional 10 years ? Or maybe, just maybe i was right?

We just played Suns, they have that one 10th overall Magic lottery pick that were everybody was up in arms he will become good shooter "just give him time". He was DNP-CD guy tonight, like he is most of the season.
His rookie 3% was 26,2%. His career average is 28,8%, including with exponetional decline in usage of shot and usage of him as nba player as he never got any better at it. And this is execlly how expected progress looks like. 2-5% until your coach and GM figure that's not your game.
AG , rookie 27% ,career 32% , change of team , wide open looks, much easier role to fill, still 32% . That's his reality.

Ofc you can dig up everybody's favorite Chauncey Billups ( drafted 25 years ago and 1440 players later) and Kyle Lowry drafted 14 years ago and 780 players later, but ask yourself simple question: if my best hope is one out of seven hundred eighty how f*** am I?

What's your opinion about Jarret Culver ?
How about Killian Hayes.
How about our kid Cole Anthony ?

You telling me they can develop new skills, so why don't we collect all 19 yeras old scrubs and see how that goes?
Just keep in mind Killian Hayes is 20, soo... by your logic...just proper development and he is Lebron James in no time.

To me this is crazy talk .Player will enter nba with some skills ,either work on them and get nba- level good at it, or will simply not translate and his skillset will be wasteful. Every nba player has some skills and NO nba player has all the skills. Jarret Culver / Josh Jackson might be way more all around talented player than Duncan Robinson, but Duncan can do his role at nba level, where not a Jackson / Culver don't have clear plus size skill for nba, therfore they are not nba players. But all around, no dubt, Jackson is waaaaaaaay more talented and skilled than Duncan Robinson.

1 - show me all these studies that say you cant learn anything after age 18.
2 - Tim Duncan, HOF'r, didnt start playing basketbal until 14. many do but many dont start until later as they may have been playing a different sport.
3 - Okeke has been hurt this year, kind of hard to evaluate a player when they are still hurt.
4 - you always like to throw out this idea that "everyone said X and I said X and look now" when many times you are not the only voice in the cold.

I'm done, you've insulted me before too. keep talking down to people on here. You still have never said why you like the Magic, other than coming on here to berate posters. I lived in Orlando, went to many games, mostly when we were bad. Why do you, on the other side of the world, keep coming onto the Magic board when you hate so much about the team unless you obviously enjoy just insulting everyone?

I fully agree with you.
This guy is annoying.
Hard to believe he is a Magic fan.

Pepe is a fan of pepe.

This whole age debate is silly. Age is not relevant as much as good given talent, self awareness, and work ethic to unlock that talent is.

Justin Beiber no matter how young and how much he tries, will never play in the NBA.

...and Franz Wagner is never gonna be a platinum record pop star.

[VFX]

to add to this, some players develop differently. Some come out like gang busters their rookie year and regress. Some start slow and get better. Some come into horrible coaching situations and some come into structured environments. So many different paths for the NBA players.

Look at the scouting report for Kawhi Leonard





But good situation given time and forced by a coach to work on parts of his game. yes, not every player will be able to improve certain aspects and that is what scouts are paid to identify who can improve and who cant.

True. People really don’t take situation into account as much as they should. It can completely define a players entire career based on where they start.

shoot, look at the difference of Draymond under Mark Jackson vs Steve Kerr. Green sometimes mentioned as possible HOF, but no way that would have happened on how he was used by Jackson.

Yeah, this is why I think the context of a teams situation matters a whole hell of a lot more than the blanket ideology of “pick bpa”.

BPA means different things to different scouts and different teams in different situations.

Draymond Green under Jackson, with 4 other forwards splitting minutes, doesn’t become the player he is today.

[AaronB]

1 - show me all these studies that say you cant learn anything after age 18.
2 - Tim Duncan, HOF'r, didnt start playing basketbal until 14. many do but many dont start until later as they may have been playing a different sport.
3 - Okeke has been hurt this year, kind of hard to evaluate a player when they are still hurt.
4 - you always like to throw out this idea that "everyone said X and I said X and look now" when many times you are not the only voice in the cold.

I'm done, you've insulted me before too. keep talking down to people on here. You still have never said why you like the Magic, other than coming on here to berate posters. I lived in Orlando, went to many games, mostly when we were bad. Why do you, on the other side of the world, keep coming onto the Magic board when you hate so much about the team unless you obviously enjoy just insulting everyone?

I fully agree with you.
This guy is annoying.
Hard to believe he is a Magic fan.

Pepe is a fan of pepe.

This whole age debate is silly. Age is not relevant as much as good given talent, self awareness, and work ethic to unlock that talent is.

Justin Beiber no matter how young and how much he tries, will never play in the NBA.

...and Franz Wagner is never gonna be a platinum record pop star.

Let's move this away from discussing an individual poster and to the age-related discussions.

Little known facts:

Colonel Sanders franchised his first restaurant at 62 years old.

Einstein is recognized for 4 theoretical developments (photoelectric effect, Brownian motion, relativity, and the equivalence of mass and energy) any one of which would place him on the Mt Rushmore of scientists.

However, all 4 theoretical science advances were completed and delivered as scientific papers in the year 1905 at the tender age of 26. He spent the rest of his life wasting his intellectual prospects and chasing skirts (if the rumors are true), not to mention marrying his cousin.

[anothermagicfan]

I fully agree with you.
This guy is annoying.
Hard to believe he is a Magic fan.

Pepe is a fan of pepe.

This whole age debate is silly. Age is not relevant as much as good given talent, self awareness, and work ethic to unlock that talent is.

Justin Beiber no matter how young and how much he tries, will never play in the NBA.

...and Franz Wagner is never gonna be a platinum record pop star.

Let's move this away from discussing an individual poster and to the age-related discussions.

Little known facts:

Colonel Sanders franchised his first restaurant at 62 years old.

Einstein is recognized for 4 theoretical developments (photoelectric effect, Brownian motion, relativity, and the equivalence of mass and energy) any one of which would place him on the Mt Rushmore of scientists.

However, all 4 theoretical science advances were completed and delivered as scientific papers in the year 1905 at the tender age of 26. He spent the rest of his life wasting his intellectual prospects and chasing skirts (if the rumors are true), not to mention marrying his cousin.

I just had an epiphany reading these posts.
I now know how the Orlando magic win the nba championship next year.

It's a 4 step process.
1-pepe becomes our new gm/head coach
2-Justin Bieber is our new starting 2 guard
3-colonel sanders is our new starting center
4- Einstein is our new starting point guard.

Good job guys. Keep up the good work!

[anothermagicfan]

Pepe is a fan of pepe.

This whole age debate is silly. Age is not relevant as much as good given talent, self awareness, and work ethic to unlock that talent is.

Justin Beiber no matter how young and how much he tries, will never play in the NBA.

...and Franz Wagner is never gonna be a platinum record pop star.

Let's move this away from discussing an individual poster and to the age-related discussions.

Little known facts:

Colonel Sanders franchised his first restaurant at 62 years old.

Einstein is recognized for 4 theoretical developments (photoelectric effect, Brownian motion, relativity, and the equivalence of mass and energy) any one of which would place him on the Mt Rushmore of scientists.

However, all 4 theoretical science advances were completed and delivered as scientific papers in the year 1905 at the tender age of 26. He spent the rest of his life wasting his intellectual prospects and chasing skirts (if the rumors are true), not to mention marrying his cousin.

I just had an epiphany reading these posts.
I now know how the Orlando magic win the nba championship next year.

It's a 4 step process.
1-pepe becomes our new gm/head coach
2-Justin Bieber is our new starting 2 guard
3-colonel sanders is our new starting center
4- Einstein is our new starting point guard.

Good job guys. Keep up the good work!

On a serious note though pepe has never attacked me for any of my posts on here. And if he did I'd probably agree with him when he was done lol. On the flip side, several of the folks on here that turn into crybabies when pepe gives his honest opinion have attacked me for posts, which is why I don't even bother too anymore.

SO PEPE 1991-YOU KEEP BEING YOU AND I,LL KEEP ON READING

[Knightro]

I'm pro Pepe.

[OrlChamps2030]

I do kind of agree with Pepe to an extent that generally prospects strengthen their strengths, and its rare for their weaknesses to develop significantly. He is definitely a hard-liner on this subject though. This discussion happens every year in our draft thread

It seems like spot-up shooting and team defense can improve. But going from a negative to a positive in categories like shot-creation, ball handling, off-ball ability, motor, etc. seem to be more rare. Of course there are always exceptions. But for each exception there are countless Payton’s, Bamba’s, Hezonja’s, etc.

[AaronB]

Pepe is a fan of pepe.

This whole age debate is silly. Age is not relevant as much as good given talent, self awareness, and work ethic to unlock that talent is.

Justin Beiber no matter how young and how much he tries, will never play in the NBA.

...and Franz Wagner is never gonna be a platinum record pop star.

Let's move this away from discussing an individual poster and to the age-related discussions.

Little known facts:

Colonel Sanders franchised his first restaurant at 62 years old.

Einstein is recognized for 4 theoretical developments (photoelectric effect, Brownian motion, relativity, and the equivalence of mass and energy) any one of which would place him on the Mt Rushmore of scientists.

However, all 4 theoretical science advances were completed and delivered as scientific papers in the year 1905 at the tender age of 26. He spent the rest of his life wasting his intellectual prospects and chasing skirts (if the rumors are true), not to mention marrying his cousin.

I just had an epiphany reading these posts.
I now know how the Orlando magic win the nba championship next year.

It's a 4 step process.
1-pepe becomes our new gm/head coach
2-Justin Bieber is our new starting 2 guard
3-colonel sanders is our new starting center
4- Einstein is our new starting point guard.

Good job guys. Keep up the good work!

Don't you think Colonel Sanders would make a better wing?

[anothermagicfan]

Let's move this away from discussing an individual poster and to the age-related discussions.

Little known facts:

Colonel Sanders franchised his first restaurant at 62 years old.

Einstein is recognized for 4 theoretical developments (photoelectric effect, Brownian motion, relativity, and the equivalence of mass and energy) any one of which would place him on the Mt Rushmore of scientists.

However, all 4 theoretical science advances were completed and delivered as scientific papers in the year 1905 at the tender age of 26. He spent the rest of his life wasting his intellectual prospects and chasing skirts (if the rumors are true), not to mention marrying his cousin.

I just had an epiphany reading these posts.
I now know how the Orlando magic win the nba championship next year.

It's a 4 step process.
1-pepe becomes our new gm/head coach
2-Justin Bieber is our new starting 2 guard
3-colonel sanders is our new starting center
4- Einstein is our new starting point guard.

Good job guys. Keep up the good work!

Don't you think Colonel Sanders would make a better wing?

Absolutely! Well done AaronB

[Xatticus]

I'm pro Pepe.

I'm not. If pepe had his way, our backcourt right now would be Augustin, Anthony, and DSJ. I finally blocked him months ago and it was the best decision I've made since I joined the forum. I can only handle so much dumb ****.

[AaronB]

I'm pro Pepe.

The older I get, the more pro pepe I become.

Unless it is in the middle of the night, at which point I am anti-pepe, preferring to sleep through the night.

[Knightro]

I'm pro Pepe.

I'm not. If pepe had his way, our backcourt right now would be Augustin, Anthony, and DSJ. I finally blocked him months ago and it was the best decision I've made since I joined the forum. I can only handle so much dumb ****.

I argue with him all the time. But he's harmless

[Skin]

I'm pro Pepe.

It's fine to be pro pepe, but you do have to mod his steps out of bounds or just give up being a mod because it's not a good look for you.