2022 NBA Draft

[clyde21]

Dalen Terry's passes to cutters are some of the best I've seen in recent years. He looked like Haliburton yesterday (and over the course of the season, looked like a less talented version of Haliburton). I really, really like his glue-guy potential.

me too - the scoring/shooting is a tough pill to swallow but I love his baseline.

[SNPA]

Gabriele Procida

Anyone familiar. Looks like a nice chance to take on a second round wing shooter.

[Big J]

Dalen Terry's passes to cutters are some of the best I've seen in recent years. He looked like Haliburton yesterday (and over the course of the season, looked like a less talented version of Haliburton). I really, really like his glue-guy potential.

me too - the scoring/shooting is a tough pill to swallow but I love his baseline.

Sounds a lot like Killian Hayes.

[eminence]

I could see thinking about Terry in the early 2nd, much higher than that seems too optimistic on his upside.

I'd be considering Murray as high as #3 (not super high on Banchero). Chet/Jabari 1/2 in some order.

EJ Liddell is a guy I'm high on I haven't seen a ton of hype on.

[SNPA]

I could see thinking about Terry in the early 2nd, much higher than that seems too optimistic on his upside.

I'd be considering Murray as high as #3 (not super high on Banchero). Chet/Jabari 1/2 in some order.

EJ Liddell is a guy I'm high on I haven't seen a ton of hype on.

Agree on Murray and EJ who seems like a good mid-first replacement prize for a team wanting Murray.

[clyde21]

I could see thinking about Terry in the early 2nd, much higher than that seems too optimistic on his upside.

I'd be considering Murray as high as #3 (not super high on Banchero). Chet/Jabari 1/2 in some order.

EJ Liddell is a guy I'm high on I haven't seen a ton of hype on.

i like EJ

[eminence]

I could see thinking about Terry in the early 2nd, much higher than that seems too optimistic on his upside.

I'd be considering Murray as high as #3 (not super high on Banchero). Chet/Jabari 1/2 in some order.

EJ Liddell is a guy I'm high on I haven't seen a ton of hype on.

i like EJ

How high you thinking?

Just looks like a good defender who will be able to do nice things as a ~3rd offensive guy at the next level.

[clyde21]

I could see thinking about Terry in the early 2nd, much higher than that seems too optimistic on his upside.

I'd be considering Murray as high as #3 (not super high on Banchero). Chet/Jabari 1/2 in some order.

EJ Liddell is a guy I'm high on I haven't seen a ton of hype on.

i like EJ

How high you thinking?

Just looks like a good defender who will be able to do nice things as a ~3rd offensive guy at the next level.

glue guy type possibly, reminds me a little bit of PJ Tucker if things break right for him...bottom of the 1st maybe?

[babyjax13]

i like EJ

How high you thinking?

Just looks like a good defender who will be able to do nice things as a ~3rd offensive guy at the next level.

glue guy type possibly, reminds me a little bit of PJ Tucker if things break right for him...bottom of the 1st maybe?

I agree. I have him #27 to Miami in my mock, ironically.

[shangrila]

How high you thinking?

Just looks like a good defender who will be able to do nice things as a ~3rd offensive guy at the next level.

glue guy type possibly, reminds me a little bit of PJ Tucker if things break right for him...bottom of the 1st maybe?

I agree. I have him #27 to Miami in my mock, ironically.

I want to like him but that rebounding and the steal rate make me nervous.

I wouldn't be surprised if he's more of an undersized 5 than someone who can guard guys on the perimeter, which makes him more situational than I'd like if I'm investing a 1st round pick into him.

[Nuntius]

What’s the highest any of you would take Duren? I’m thinking he could get to as high as 5. Looks like he’s figuring it out and has an extremely high floor in the league.

Top 10. Definitely a lotto pick, imo. I just wouldn't want to be the one drafting him.

Put him with an elite playmaker and give him 30 minutes, he’s a 12 and 10 guy from day one.

He is 100% capable of being a double-double machine from the get go but how useful is that nowadays? He is going to be a good starter and a very solid contributor, yes, but will he be a star or a max contract player? His player type works against him, imo.

Even someone like Bam who brings more to the table than that isn't quite a bonafide star. Not yet, at least. The only real star of that type is Gobert and that's because he is a historically dominant defender. Duren definitely has elite defensive tools and great potential on that end but he doesn't quite project to be Gobert level. He doesn't have that insane length that Gobert does. No one does. It's just Gobert and Wembanyama, the projected #1 pick in next year's draft.

That's why I wouldn't want to be the one drafting him. He will 100% be great at what he does, imo, but that's not enough to make him a star which means that I'd rather roll the dice on someone who could be a star instead.

[MemphisX]

What’s the highest any of you would take Duren? I’m thinking he could get to as high as 5. Looks like he’s figuring it out and has an extremely high floor in the league.

Top 10. Definitely a lotto pick, imo. I just wouldn't want to be the one drafting him.

Put him with an elite playmaker and give him 30 minutes, he’s a 12 and 10 guy from day one.

He is 100% capable of being a double-double machine from the get go but how useful is that nowadays? He is going to be a good starter and a very solid contributor, yes, but will he be a star or a max contract player? His player type works against him, imo.

Even someone like Bam who brings more to the table than that isn't quite a bonafide star. Not yet, at least. The only real star of that type is Gobert and that's because he is a historically dominant defender. Duren definitely has elite defensive tools and great potential on that end but he doesn't quite project to be Gobert level. He doesn't have that insane length that Gobert does. No one does. It's just Gobert and Wembanyama, the projected #1 pick in next year's draft.

That's why I wouldn't want to be the one drafting him. He will 100% be great at what he does, imo, but that's not enough to make him a star which means that I'd rather roll the dice on someone who could be a star instead.

Bam had a way more desirable situation than Duren has in Memphis. Even so, Duren has arguably been better than him at a younger age. Duren likely has way better physical measurements and is a better athlete. I think people are really pigeonholing Duren into an archetype that is insanely valuable in the NBA but somehow derided among draftniks.

Teams without rim protectors are dead in the water. No ifs ands or buts. Now add in the fact that he can be put into a switching system and should punish teams that go small. He seems to be an ok passer. Shot is not broken.

I don't know. I thought Duren was a little more limited earlier in the season. After really watching him, not only has he improved but I think he should start getting looks right after Chet/Jabari. Bam hasn't really shot 3s yet at all so i do not see that as something that is even needed. He doesn't have to provide an outside threat if he is a vertical threat like Gobert. I think his length/vertical/athleticism puts him in that Gobert potential conversation.

It is just my gripe with the prevailing draft thought of dismissing the value of bigs that lack offensive versatility. For me, Duren's archetype is much more valuable to winning NBA games than Banchero.

[jezzerinho]

What’s the highest any of you would take Duren? I’m thinking he could get to as high as 5. Looks like he’s figuring it out and has an extremely high floor in the league.

Top 10. Definitely a lotto pick, imo. I just wouldn't want to be the one drafting him.

Put him with an elite playmaker and give him 30 minutes, he’s a 12 and 10 guy from day one.

He is 100% capable of being a double-double machine from the get go but how useful is that nowadays? He is going to be a good starter and a very solid contributor, yes, but will he be a star or a max contract player? His player type works against him, imo.

Even someone like Bam who brings more to the table than that isn't quite a bonafide star. Not yet, at least. The only real star of that type is Gobert and that's because he is a historically dominant defender. Duren definitely has elite defensive tools and great potential on that end but he doesn't quite project to be Gobert level. He doesn't have that insane length that Gobert does. No one does. It's just Gobert and Wembanyama, the projected #1 pick in next year's draft.

That's why I wouldn't want to be the one drafting him. He will 100% be great at what he does, imo, but that's not enough to make him a star which means that I'd rather roll the dice on someone who could be a star instead.

Bam had a way more desirable situation than Duren has in Memphis. Even so, Duren has arguably been better than him at a younger age. Duren likely has way better physical measurements and is a better athlete. I think people are really pigeonholing Duren into an archetype that is insanely valuable in the NBA but somehow derided among draftniks.

Teams without rim protectors are dead in the water. No ifs ands or buts. Now add in the fact that he can be put into a switching system and should punish teams that go small. He seems to be an ok passer. Shot is not broken.

I don't know. I thought Duren was a little more limited earlier in the season. After really watching him, not only has he improved but I think he should start getting looks right after Chet/Jabari. Bam hasn't really shot 3s yet at all so i do not see that as something that is even needed. He doesn't have to provide an outside threat if he is a vertical threat like Gobert. I think his length/vertical/athleticism puts him in that Gobert potential conversation.

It is just my gripe with the prevailing draft thought of dismissing the value of bigs that lack offensive versatility. For me, Duren's archetype is much more valuable to winning NBA games than Banchero.

I can buy your thesis on the archetype but I'd say Duren is a good bit further behind Koloko and Kamagate in terms of reaching it. In Koloko's case, he's older (though his jump really only came this year) but Kamagate is arguably much further along the rim protector role curve than Duren.

Jalen has a ton of potential, I'm not in any way denying that. You'll just have to wait longer to profit than with some others in the draft. Pure rim protection is Kessler's domain, though I'm not as high on him as the other two mentioned.

[SeattleJazzFan]

What’s the highest any of you would take Duren? I’m thinking he could get to as high as 5. Looks like he’s figuring it out and has an extremely high floor in the league.

Top 10. Definitely a lotto pick, imo. I just wouldn't want to be the one drafting him.

Put him with an elite playmaker and give him 30 minutes, he’s a 12 and 10 guy from day one.

He is 100% capable of being a double-double machine from the get go but how useful is that nowadays? He is going to be a good starter and a very solid contributor, yes, but will he be a star or a max contract player? His player type works against him, imo.

Even someone like Bam who brings more to the table than that isn't quite a bonafide star. Not yet, at least. The only real star of that type is Gobert and that's because he is a historically dominant defender. Duren definitely has elite defensive tools and great potential on that end but he doesn't quite project to be Gobert level. He doesn't have that insane length that Gobert does. No one does. It's just Gobert and Wembanyama, the projected #1 pick in next year's draft.

That's why I wouldn't want to be the one drafting him. He will 100% be great at what he does, imo, but that's not enough to make him a star which means that I'd rather roll the dice on someone who could be a star instead.

Bam had a way more desirable situation than Duren has in Memphis. Even so, Duren has arguably been better than him at a younger age. Duren likely has way better physical measurements and is a better athlete. I think people are really pigeonholing Duren into an archetype that is insanely valuable in the NBA but somehow derided among draftniks.

Teams without rim protectors are dead in the water. No ifs ands or buts. Now add in the fact that he can be put into a switching system and should punish teams that go small. He seems to be an ok passer. Shot is not broken.

I don't know. I thought Duren was a little more limited earlier in the season. After really watching him, not only has he improved but I think he should start getting looks right after Chet/Jabari. Bam hasn't really shot 3s yet at all so i do not see that as something that is even needed. He doesn't have to provide an outside threat if he is a vertical threat like Gobert. I think his length/vertical/athleticism puts him in that Gobert potential conversation.

It is just my gripe with the prevailing draft thought of dismissing the value of bigs that lack offensive versatility. For me, Duren's archetype is much more valuable to winning NBA games than Banchero.

i agree with the overall point of your post. rim protectors and screeners/elite rim runners are incredibly valuable in the nba. i see it with Rudy every day.

having said that, i think Duren is more Capela than Rudy - which is okay, ftr. I seem him being more effective on the offensive end in terms of punishing smaller guys than Rudy, but probably never reaching Rudy's level of rim protecting dominance simply due to the lack of height/length in comparison to Rudy.

[Nuntius]

Bam had a way more desirable situation than Duren has in Memphis. Even so, Duren has arguably been better than him at a younger age. Duren likely has way better physical measurements and is a better athlete.

I didn't follow NCAA basketball until this season so I have no idea how Bam looked in college. I have indeed heard that Memphis' guard situation isn't ideal and that definitely affects a big like Duren.

Teams without rim protectors are dead in the water. No ifs ands or buts. Now add in the fact that he can be put into a switching system and should punish teams that go small. He seems to be an ok passer. Shot is not broken.

I fully agree with that, especially the rim protector part. Rim protection is vital.

I don't know. I thought Duren was a little more limited earlier in the season. After really watching him, not only has he improved but I think he should start getting looks right after Chet/Jabari. Bam hasn't really shot 3s yet at all so i do not see that as something that is even needed. He doesn't have to provide an outside threat if he is a vertical threat like Gobert. I think his length/vertical/athleticism puts him in that Gobert potential conversation.

A 3 isn't necessary, no, but Bam does have attributes that make him a threat beyond 8 feet. He has a decent mid-range jumper and, more importantly, is an excellent passer for a big. Bam averaged more than 5 APG for two straight seasons. Having the ability to make the right reads in the short roll is vital for a PnR big. Having a decent enough handle to enable DHOs is also important for a big and to do that successfully you need to have some counters when the defenses anticipates the DHO and blows up the pass. If you don't, you stall your offense out. Bam is pretty effective in both of these which is why he's important to Miami's offense. And he still isn't what one would call a bonafide star. He is an All-Star, just not a top 25 type of guy.

Duren has showed some potential as a passer in these roles as his reads are generally good but his actual passing ability is still very raw. Maybe he gets there, maybe he won't.

I think people are really pigeonholing Duren into an archetype that is insanely valuable in the NBA but somehow derided among draftniks.

It is just my gripe with the prevailing draft thought of dismissing the value of bigs that lack offensive versatility. For me, Duren's archetype is much more valuable to winning NBA games than Banchero.

I combined these two parts since they argue practically the same point.

I will readily admit that I am pigeonholing Duren here. He could be more than what he has showed so far as he is indeed the youngest player in the draft.

I will say, though, that I'm not really deriding the role that I have pigeonholed Duren into. I do recognize it as a very vital role. It is a role that every team needs. My only issue is that players who fulfill this role are not stars. They aren't top 25-30 guys. And since it's not a role that produces star-level players, it is also not a role that I would want to draft in the top 5 of any draft. When you're drafting in the top 5, you have to pick a player that has a chance to become a star, imo. That's my whole issue with it. You can usually find players who can fulfill that role lower in the draft. There are examples of such players in this draft as well. Yes, Duren has much more potential than the players I'm talking about (Kessler, Mark Williams, Koloko et cetera) which is why he'll go higher in the draft but I do feel that his role puts a cap in his potential.

To put it in more concise terms, there is an opportunity cost when you draft that particular role over other roles at the top of the lottery which is why a lot of people are against doing that.

And it all has to do with the NBA era we're in, by the way. It's not intrinsic. Not for me, at least. It's due to the way that the NBA is playing right now that the value of this role is depreciated. Because the NBA doesn't value that role as much as it values others good players who fulfill that role often fall lower in the draft than they should. So, if you target that role in the 2nd round, you're likely to get a steal.

From an asset management stand-point, it makes much more sense to draft a player whose projected role can lead to stardom at the top of the lottery and then target a rim runner/rim protector with your second round pick.

[eminence]

I appear to be a bit higher on Liddell than most then, I was thinking later lotto for rankings.

[SNPA]

I appear to be a bit higher on Liddell than most then, I was thinking later lotto for rankings.

I have him going teens or early twenties. I see an NBA player who is good value there.

[Big J]

Chet stinking it up in another big game. This is becoming a pattern for him.

[retrobro90]

Chet stinking it up in another big game. This is becoming a pattern for him.

He's got 12pts/15rbs/4ast/1stl/6blks on 50% shooting with 7 minutes to go

[clyde21]

Chet stinking it up in another big game. This is becoming a pattern for him.

12/15/4 with 6 blocks?