When is Isaac Returning? Ruled out for the entire 2021-2022 season

[basketballRob]

I have to go back to the Grant Hill comparison...

Grant was written off those first four years with us when he struggled to stay on the court. But what happened? He played another 9-10 years after that — at a high level, mind you.

Take a breath. Not one of us has to make a decision about his future or form an opinion about whether he'll play again, etc.

Personally, I don't even think about JI and I mean that respectably. If he comes back and can be productive, awesome! But I'm not going to waste time, energy and brain power trying to predict a future I don't control. But y'all do what you want.

He played 6 (really more like 5, that half season with the clippers was barely worth mentioning), and if you consider 13/5/3 a high level...... not sure what to tell you, but if thats the best case scenario for isaac, im walking away right now
Derrick rose is another guy, he played for a while after his injuries, but as a journeyman and definitely not a high level

BUT, you know the difference, those guys arent 7ft tall. Show me some 7fters who have had multiple foot and knee injuries over a 5 year span that returned to previous levels. He more likely to be Greg Oden than say grant hill

He ankle sprains not foot injuries.

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[The Effect]

I have to go back to the Grant Hill comparison...

Grant was written off those first four years with us when he struggled to stay on the court. But what happened? He played another 9-10 years after that — at a high level, mind you.

Take a breath. Not one of us has to make a decision about his future or form an opinion about whether he'll play again, etc.

Personally, I don't even think about JI and I mean that respectably. If he comes back and can be productive, awesome! But I'm not going to waste time, energy and brain power trying to predict a future I don't control. But y'all do what you want.

He played 6 (really more like 5, that half season with the clippers was barely worth mentioning), and if you consider 13/5/3 a high level...... not sure what to tell you, but if thats the best case scenario for isaac, im walking away right now
Derrick rose is another guy, he played for a while after his injuries, but as a journeyman and definitely not a high level

BUT, you know the difference, those guys arent 7ft tall. Show me some 7fters who have had multiple foot and knee injuries over a 5 year span that returned to previous levels. He more likely to be Greg Oden than say grant hill

He ankle sprains not foot injuries.

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ONCE is a sprain, but when this is your injury history, and you miss time in 3 different seasons for "ankle injuries", its not a sprain. His ankles have been issues from day 1. Sorry but dudes body cant handle the NBA

https://www.foxsports.com/nba/jonathan-isaac-player-injuries

08/02/2020 Knee - Hasnt played since
01/01/2020 Knee - missed 30 games
12/18/2019 Hamstring/Back
11/15/2019 Right Ankle - 2 - games
04/09/2019 Concussion
11/02/2018 Right Ankle Sprain - 6 games
04/02/2018 Sore Left Ankle - 6 games (end of season)
03/21/2018 Strained Left Foot - 3 games
12/27/2017 Sore Ankle - 26 games
12/20/2017 Ankle - 2 games
11/12/2017 Sore Ankle - 17 games

[basketballRob]

He played 6 (really more like 5, that half season with the clippers was barely worth mentioning), and if you consider 13/5/3 a high level...... not sure what to tell you, but if thats the best case scenario for isaac, im walking away right now
Derrick rose is another guy, he played for a while after his injuries, but as a journeyman and definitely not a high level

BUT, you know the difference, those guys arent 7ft tall. Show me some 7fters who have had multiple foot and knee injuries over a 5 year span that returned to previous levels. He more likely to be Greg Oden than say grant hill

He ankle sprains not foot injuries.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

ONCE is a sprain, but when this is your injury history, and you miss time in 3 different seasons for "ankle injuries", its not a sprain. His ankles have been issues from day 1. Sorry but dudes body cant handle the NBA

https://www.foxsports.com/nba/jonathan-isaac-player-injuries

08/02/2020 Knee - Hasnt played since
01/01/2020 Knee - missed 30 games
12/18/2019 Hamstring/Back
11/15/2019 Right Ankle - 2 - games
04/09/2019 Concussion
11/02/2018 Right Ankle Sprain - 6 games
04/02/2018 Sore Left Ankle - 6 games (end of season)
03/21/2018 Strained Left Foot - 3 games
12/27/2017 Sore Ankle - 26 games
12/20/2017 Ankle - 2 games
11/12/2017 Sore Ankle - 17 games

You can overcome ankle injuries. The ligaments get stretched out from the repeated sprains and makes it easier to sprain again. I know Curry went through the same thing. It should be completely healed now.

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[Kent]

I have to go back to the Grant Hill comparison...

Grant was written off those first four years with us when he struggled to stay on the court. But what happened? He played another 9-10 years after that — at a high level, mind you.

Take a breath. Not one of us has to make a decision about his future or form an opinion about whether he'll play again, etc.

Personally, I don't even think about JI and I mean that respectably. If he comes back and can be productive, awesome! But I'm not going to waste time, energy and brain power trying to predict a future I don't control. But y'all do what you want.

He played 6 (really more like 5, that half season with the clippers was barely worth mentioning), and if you consider 13/5/3 a high level...... not sure what to tell you, but if thats the best case scenario for isaac, im walking away right now
Derrick rose is another guy, he played for a while after his injuries, but as a journeyman and definitely not a high level

BUT, you know the difference, those guys arent 7ft tall. Show me some 7fters who have had multiple foot and knee injuries over a 5 year span that returned to previous levels. He more likely to be Greg Oden than say grant hill

If you want to debate "high level," okay, sure, I'll concede there. But he played 9 seasons more starting in 2004 and the majority as a starter. That's something for a guy many people said wouldn't play again let alone contribute.

And they're only separated by three inches. I get the big man comparison but as bad as Grant's ankle was, he made it work.

Neither of us know what will happen next for the guy and, frankly, I don't care if I'm right or wrong.

I think what it is for me is I'm a glass half full guy and I've taken it personally when not everyone else is. So that's on me.

This will go down as just another post on RealGM but I want to truly thank you for helping me realize this about myself. The power of RealGM, people!

Edit: omitted comma before "people."

[pepe1991]

Just watching Zingis playing like every third game since ACL tear and looking like shadow of former self, i think that's execlly how Isaac will look and last after he finally returns.
Being 7 footer with broken knee probably won't age well for player who made name for himself being fast twitching defender

[BadMofoPimp]

I agree that Slim may never be the same as pre-injury, but he should still be a capable contributor to this team and can still earn his money albeit on a smaller scale off the bench or limited starter. I don't think he will ever be the same as before due to his 7' skinny frame and style of play.

[KillMonger]

i mean what a way to botch this....is this how a professional organization handles this? what's the harm in admitting that he has a setback? Or are we really pulling what OKC did last season?

[zaymon]

Just watching Zingis playing like every third game since ACL tear and looking like shadow of former self, i think that's execlly how Isaac will look and last after he finally returns.
Being 7 footer with broken knee probably won't age well for player who made name for himself being fast twitching defender

Thats why we rehab him for so long. Porzingis was out for 20 months.

[pepe1991]

Just watching Zingis playing like every third game since ACL tear and looking like shadow of former self, i think that's execlly how Isaac will look and last after he finally returns.
Being 7 footer with broken knee probably won't age well for player who made name for himself being fast twitching defender

Thats why we rehab him for so long. Porzingis was out for 20 months.

And plays like 40 games a year. That's imo, realistic scenario for Isaac. 50-60% of games and being less mobile than before. Jumpshot will sometimes go in, sometimes it won't.

[jezzerinho]

This FO isnt going to

1) Push JI back into the lineup and risk another injury in meaningless games
2) risk the tank
3) waive a player under the injury exemption whose injury profile scarcely merited the contract he was given. They would look like fools.

So, they're going to trot JI out in the new season, having wasted a ton of money on a sunk asset and probably then getting a subpar return for their investment, given all the injuries and lack of playing time.

I can barely contain my excitement.

[zaymon]

Just watching Zingis playing like every third game since ACL tear and looking like shadow of former self, i think that's execlly how Isaac will look and last after he finally returns.
Being 7 footer with broken knee probably won't age well for player who made name for himself being fast twitching defender

Thats why we rehab him for so long. Porzingis was out for 20 months.

And plays like 40 games a year. That's imo, realistic scenario for Isaac. 50-60% of games and being less mobile than before. Jumpshot will sometimes go in, sometimes it won't.

We dont know that. You dont have access to medical documentation so you cant make realistic prognosis.

[MoMM]

I thought teams could cut a player due to career ending injury or something. I mean, if he ain't coming back for 2-3 years, that is career ending to me.

called guaranteed contracts. But, if a player has to retire due to health issues, a team can usually get salary relief. Also, the Magic supposed had an injury clause in his contract, they would just have to use it. I imagine all options will be looked at this summer he is still cant play

Player will get paid, but probably it won't be us paying, it will be an insurance company.

[MoMM]

I have to go back to the Grant Hill comparison...

Grant was written off those first four years with us when he struggled to stay on the court. But what happened? He played another 9-10 years after that — at a high level, mind you.

Take a breath. Not one of us has to make a decision about his future or form an opinion about whether he'll play again, etc.

Personally, I don't even think about JI and I mean that respectably. If he comes back and can be productive, awesome! But I'm not going to waste time, energy and brain power trying to predict a future I don't control. But y'all do what you want.

He played 6 (really more like 5, that half season with the clippers was barely worth mentioning), and if you consider 13/5/3 a high level...... not sure what to tell you, but if thats the best case scenario for isaac, im walking away right now
Derrick rose is another guy, he played for a while after his injuries, but as a journeyman and definitely not a high level

Yes, and we are talking about MVP players (Rose was, Hill should have been if not for the injuries). I know that JI is a D player, but in his best season he averaged almost 12/7, which is the "high level" Hill after injuries, the only problem is that JI did it BEFORE this bigger injury, so I am not expecting more than a backup and often injured player who gets paid a lot...

[PrimeThyme]

Weltman is just the absolute worst. Leave it to him to coin the phrase “recalibrate our timeline” so that he and the rest of this organization can continue to leave fans in the dark.

But I guess when you have games like last night where the fans in your home arena are chanting the names of an opposing player despite losing in a historic home loss he knows that he will never be held accountable for anything he does.

[OrlChamps2030]

It’s semantics at this point to debate whether or not Isaac suffered a setback. Both Isaac and Weltman both admitted rehab didn’t go as planned.

Regarding Isaac returning as the team’s best player or being a franchise player.. he’s played 136 games in 5 seasons. A simple thought exercise to undergo is imagine he played for Sacramento or Washington.. you would not still be saying he will return as a franchise player. We just need to hope he can return and contribute as a role player whenever he’s available to play as a role player next season.

Like others have said, you can’t really factor in Isaac on draft night.

[Magic_Kingdom]

In the real world, Weltman’s decision to make Isaac the highest-paid employee in the organization would be a fireable offense. Imagine you’re the CEO of a tech company and you sign a programmer to a long contract extension making them the highest-paid employee in the company while they’re recovering from brain surgery. The employee also has a history of brain issues and was only able to work about half the time leading up to this latest problem. After signing the extension, the employee doesn’t recover from the surgery as expected and spends the first year of the $70 million contract at home. They don’t design a single program or even contribute to the design of one. It is unlikely they will be the same when they come back, if they ever do. Were they one of the best programmers in the industry pre-surgery? No, but they had potential. Did they ever lead the company to the top of their field? No, they didn’t even report to work enough to do that. Can you imagine the shareholder questions?

[VFX]

In the real world, Weltman’s decision to make Isaac the highest-paid employee in the organization would be a fireable offense. Imagine you’re the CEO of a tech company and you sign a programmer to a long contract extension making them the highest-paid employee in the company while they’re recovering from brain surgery. The employee also has a history of brain issues and was only able to work about half the time leading up to this latest problem. After signing the extension, the employee doesn’t recover from the surgery as expected and spends the first year of the $70 million contract at home. They don’t design a single program or even contribute to the design of one. It is unlikely they will be the same when they come back, if they ever do. Were they one of the best programmers in the industry pre-surgery? No, but they had potential. Did they ever lead the company to the top of their field? No, they didn’t even report to work enough to do that. Can you imagine the shareholder questions?

That’s a good way of putting it. Isaac had this history before he was handed that money.

I even question Isaac’s work ethic and desire to play at this point. Anyone that WANTS to get on the court and contribute would have something to say by now. His actions and his comments don’t illustrate that’s he’s itching to come back.

[yoyojw17]

In the real world, Weltman’s decision to make Isaac the highest-paid employee in the organization would be a fireable offense. Imagine you’re the CEO of a tech company and you sign a programmer to a long contract extension making them the highest-paid employee in the company while they’re recovering from brain surgery. The employee also has a history of brain issues and was only able to work about half the time leading up to this latest problem. After signing the extension, the employee doesn’t recover from the surgery as expected and spends the first year of the $70 million contract at home. They don’t design a single program or even contribute to the design of one. It is unlikely they will be the same when they come back, if they ever do. Were they one of the best programmers in the industry pre-surgery? No, but they had potential. Did they ever lead the company to the top of their field? No, they didn’t even report to work enough to do that. Can you imagine the shareholder questions?

That’s a good way of putting it. Isaac had this history before he was handed that money.

I even question Isaac’s work ethic and desire to play at this point. Anyone that WANTS to get on the court and contribute would have something to say by now. His actions and his comments don’t illustrate that’s he’s itching to come back.

Weltman said... that Isaac has been working his butt off... and he is the most disappointed of all of us. Work ethic has NEVER been an issue with Isaac... I don't see why now.

[basketballRob]

In the real world, Weltman’s decision to make Isaac the highest-paid employee in the organization would be a fireable offense. Imagine you’re the CEO of a tech company and you sign a programmer to a long contract extension making them the highest-paid employee in the company while they’re recovering from brain surgery. The employee also has a history of brain issues and was only able to work about half the time leading up to this latest problem. After signing the extension, the employee doesn’t recover from the surgery as expected and spends the first year of the $70 million contract at home. They don’t design a single program or even contribute to the design of one. It is unlikely they will be the same when they come back, if they ever do. Were they one of the best programmers in the industry pre-surgery? No, but they had potential. Did they ever lead the company to the top of their field? No, they didn’t even report to work enough to do that. Can you imagine the shareholder questions?

That’s a good way of putting it. Isaac had this history before he was handed that money.

I even question Isaac’s work ethic and desire to play at this point. Anyone that WANTS to get on the court and contribute would have something to say by now. His actions and his comments don’t illustrate that’s he’s itching to come back.

Weltman said... that Isaac has been working his butt off... and he is the most disappointed of all of us. Work ethic has NEVER been an issue with Isaac... I don't see why now.

Clifford praised Isaac every year he was here, for always being in the gym and working hard.

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[Kent]

In the real world, Weltman’s decision to make Isaac the highest-paid employee in the organization would be a fireable offense. Imagine you’re the CEO of a tech company and you sign a programmer to a long contract extension making them the highest-paid employee in the company while they’re recovering from brain surgery. The employee also has a history of brain issues and was only able to work about half the time leading up to this latest problem. After signing the extension, the employee doesn’t recover from the surgery as expected and spends the first year of the $70 million contract at home. They don’t design a single program or even contribute to the design of one. It is unlikely they will be the same when they come back, if they ever do. Were they one of the best programmers in the industry pre-surgery? No, but they had potential. Did they ever lead the company to the top of their field? No, they didn’t even report to work enough to do that. Can you imagine the shareholder questions?

I can appreciate the analogy but it's still apples to oranges.

In "the real world," a tech company isn't working with a salary cap and a limited pool of contractable programmers. The FO is playing a hand of cards, so to speak. You can only play the hand you have and bet accordingly. The FO is betting on JI.

Also, to draw out the analogy, us fans aren't stakeholders. We don't deserve to know every detail. And it's not us fans who the FO answers to. As fans, our capital is declaring what team is our favorite.

I get where you're coming from but JI is still an asset even if it's quite variable. Our financial situation is still favorable all things considered.