Official Spec Thread: Heart and Hustle Magic 2.0

[LDNMagic90]

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Welcome back

[MoMM]

Suggs ruled out again for tomorrow against Goldens State.

Suggs is carrying on the tradition of Weltman top draft picks in Orlando.

Games played in rookie year:

2017-18 -- Isaac -- 27 games
2018-19 -- Bamba -- 47 games
2019-20 -- Okeke -- 0 games
2020-21 -- Anthony -- 47 games
2021-22 -- Suggs -- 46 games

It's actually unbelievable how unproductive their top draft picks have been. (And before you say Franz, yes, he's been durable, but he wasn't their top pick in this draft. This list compares the players they selected first).

Wow, way to nitpick to force a narrative, as if Franz wasnt a top 8 pick in a loaded draft that they absolutely nailed

Exactly, no need to do something like this to force the narrative when it's pretty clear our 1st round picks are unproductive.

[drsd]

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Welcome back

Well: sounds like Suggs is done for the season then.


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[drsd]

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[Knightro]

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Incredible stat when you factor in the laughly bad defensive performances against Brooklyn and Detroit.

[Bergmaniac]

It feels strange that a 109.4 DRTG is the best in the league during a month long stretch, it wasn't that long ago that only the worst defensive teams in the league had such defensive ratings. In the 2014-15 season a 109.4 DRTG would have made the team with it the second worst defense in the league.

[Skybox]

It feels strange that a 109.4 DRTG is the best in the league during a month long stretch, it wasn't that long ago that only the worst defensive teams in the league had such defensive ratings. In the 2014-15 season a 109.4 DRTG would have made the team with it the second worst defense in the league.

Agree...we like defense, we want defense, but "Defense wins Championships" is not the NBA of today...We need shooting to open up our other offensive talents. I don't want anymore guys that "project to be shooters"...we need a couple of flat out, can't be left alone, snipers...not only will they score but Fultz, Suggs, and Franz will be all over the rim, and more oops to WCJ & Bamba will appear. I love good defense, but this is no longer the age of locking down anybody in the league. Even if a really good defensive team wins the ring, it won't be without a potent offense too. It is, IMO, possible for an explosive offensive team with a mediocre (not terrible) defense to win it all. The rules change and the league evolves to what is perceived as fan-friendly scoring explosions.

[pepe1991]

It feels strange that a 109.4 DRTG is the best in the league during a month long stretch, it wasn't that long ago that only the worst defensive teams in the league had such defensive ratings. In the 2014-15 season a 109.4 DRTG would have made the team with it the second worst defense in the league.

Agree...we like defense, we want defense, but "Defense wins Championships" is not the NBA of today...We need shooting to open up our other offensive talents. I don't want anymore guys that "project to be shooters"...we need a couple of flat out, can't be left alone, snipers...not only will they score but Fultz, Suggs, and Franz will be all over the rim, and more oops to WCJ & Bamba will appear. I love good defense, but this is no longer the age of locking down anybody in the league. Even if a really good defensive team wins the ring, it won't be without a potent offense too. It is, IMO, possible for an explosive offensive team with a mediocre (not terrible) defense to win it all. The rules change and the league evolves to what is perceived as fan-friendly scoring explosions.

Last year 4 out of top 5 defensive teams either missed playoffs or didn't pass first round. One who did were 76ers, who got bounced by Atlanta that played no defense and still sniped them out.


Defense is still important, non less ,but days of grind and pound, hard nose defense and keeping team under 85 points are simply gone. Today defense is all about limiting something and does not require superior defensive talent, rather very good discipline, Minessota, Clippers and Warriors are good example of it for various reasons.

[SOUL]

Defense is always important in the playoffs no matter what happens in regular season. We see the game slow down a bit and coaches go deeper in their playbooks

[PrimeThyme]

Situational defense will always matter. The best teams are able to get stops when they have to.

[Xatticus]

Defense is always important in the playoffs no matter what happens in regular season. We see the game slow down a bit and coaches go deeper in their playbooks

Defense is always important. Period.

The Hawks have the number 3 offense in the league in efficiency. They are a game under .500 and destined for the play-in games because they are 27th in defensive efficiency.

We can have a conversation about whether it is cheaper or easier to acquire offensive or defensive talent. We can have a conversation about the actual value of a player or team's offense or defense. But arguing that offense is more important than defense is nonsensical. There is no difference between two points saved and two points gained. A failure to understand this is a failure to understand statistics at the most fundamental level.

[KillMonger]

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Welcome back

Well: sounds like Suggs is done for the season then.


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couldn't tell with as hard as he's celebrating on the sideline.....i really hate these kind of things man, it really sullies the sport...i remember mike and kobe use to say that people pay their hard earn money to watch the best in the world play so they would try and play even when injured....now look whats going on, you got legit stars like SGA allowing their teams to play that game with them...injured against us but perfectly fine the next game like nothing happened...we're doing it too to be fair but it's just...i'm sick of it

[pepe1991]

In last 40 years only 3 nba teams didnt' rank in either: top 5 defense, top 5 offense ( or non ). EDIT. : and won championship ( i figured i forgot to add that as context, but it's kind a logical what i was refering )

1994 Rockets are worst offense that won championship in last 25 years. (15th ) , 2001 Lakers are worst defense ( 21st).

In general you want both, offense and defense ( duuh), but two way players are by far most expensive players on market. So at the end of a day it comes down to who is your superstar and how many of them you have. New nba shows that some happy medium is 2 superstars that carry offense, don't tank defense and supporting cast around them to cover up.

What changed is perception of offense and defense.
105,8 Celtics are best defensive team in nba. That defensive rating in 2011-12 would be 6th worst defensive rating in nba.
110 Spurs in 2011-12 were best offensive team in nba. That offensive rating today would not crack top 20.

Pace, 3 point shot, nba set of rule changes simply moved point of emphasis to offense.

Pistons won championship with 18th offensive rating.
Just look difference between thier best defense to today's best defense Celtics.
Pistons held opponents under 90 points- 58 times. Only once anybody scored +105 points on them ( allowed 100 points 4 times total).

11 times Pistons held opponents under 70 points. Whole year long, they scored over 110 points- once.


Today, already mentioned Celtics held teams under 90 points- 10 times. Under 80- 4 times.
They were held sub 90 points- 5 times.


Right now, by default, 4 worst nba teams are : Pistons, Magic, OKC and Houston. Guess 4 worst offensive teams? Intrudor are Hawks.
4 teams with worst defense are: Houston, Kings, Blazers, Pacers.

Last year 4 worst nba offensive teams were: OKC, Cavs, Magic,Houston, Pistons -execlly same 5 teams who were worst teams in nba.
Worst defensive teams were: Kings, (31-41), Blazers ( 42-30), Wolves, Houston, Magic

Bottom of the line, you are going nowhere with incompetent offense nor defense, but defense stopped being point of emphesis 15 years ago.
And last note, you can hide worst defender on offense, guys like Harden, Lillard, Curry, Trae still can at least try hard. Good luck trying to hide Bledsoe, Thybulle or Noel on offense.

[drsd]

Bottom of the line, you are going nowhere with incompetent offense nor defense, but defense stopped being point of emphesis 15 years ago.
And last note, you can hide worst defender on offense, guys like Harden, Lillard, Curry, Trae still can at least try hard. Good luck trying to hide Bledsoe, Thybulle or Noel on offense.

A player like Jonathan Clay "Alligator Arms" Redick can be taught to play competent team defense. But (for some reason) teams cannot train their players to hit jumpers (look at Gordon as Example A).

This is why I rate Mathurin so very highly in the NBA draft. He already has the most important modern NBA skill and has a body-type suggesting mediocre -to- competent team defense can be taught.

(( And it is kind of an illustration of why Suggs and Fultz cannot co-exist as starters ))


As this roster is flushing out, it is clear that the Magic need high volume efficiency at the 2. Such a player need not play a lick of defense (and this is why I am still crying Orlando did not get Jalen Green's rights).
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[drsd]

As a follow-up, Orlando's two best players on eFG% are, unsuprisibngly, Carter and M-Wagner. But the best non-big is Harris.

There is a real narrative to be built on resigning Harris if there is no guard drafted.


EDIT: Assuming Suggs is done for the season, this means his eFG% will be below 40% on the year (it's 39.9% currently).
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[3ddman23]

Anyone have tickets for tomorrow game against the kings? Looking for decent seats but hate paying the fees on the resell apps. Let me know thanks

[BadMofoPimp]

Anyone have tickets for tomorrow game against the kings? Looking for decent seats but hate paying the fees on the resell apps. Let me know thanks

I get great deals from Scalpers out front. Heck, one time I got 5th row behind the bench for $50 per ticket by showing up at gametime of 7pm as scalpers get desperate. They even waited as the ticket people scanned my ticket to make sure not a scam after I asked them to.

[pepe1991]

Fun fact:Franz Wagner has to score 17 points a game ( 113 points total ) to surpass Jonathan Isaac in career points scored over 5 years.

[Jiwol]

Fun fact:Franz Wagner has to score 17 points a game ( 113 points total ) to surpass Jonathan Isaac in career points scored over 5 years.

Is JI our best player though?

[drsd]

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Welcome back

Downtin logged minutes and is now a Magic man for life!


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