PG: Tank L Kids W

[Separatista]

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I absolutely freaking love this dude. he is the anti-randle.

why is RJ so giddy on this clip? Did he found out that Randle is going to sit for the remainder of the season. Because I would have the exact same reaction if it is.

Anyway, Obi had 6 assist with 0 turnover. This kind of surprise me but at the same time I kind of have an inkling he has some decent court vision.

I think it was the Jazz game. It was a 3 man play. Deuce brought the ball up, asked for a PnR from Sims but got roadblock while Sims has a clear out to the hoop. Deuce pass it to Obi on the wing and Obi immediately pass it to Sims for the alley oop. It was a simple play but the quick realization that Sims was open to the hoop made me think Obi has underrated passing ability.

[Gorilla Monsoon]

God damn I hated how often dudu and Avi would overlook gallo and a Wilson to pad their stats.

Watch your mouth when you speak about D-Lee.

Or what?

Or we can meet in the parking lot of the nearest Starbucks and throw down.

Jk. Relax lol.

[K_ick_God]

animorphs w/o cropping out the background is a classic rookie mistake



if you ever need me to photoshop something for you buzzie - you don't hesitate for a moment ok? your morning gospel deserves to be delivered w/ 100% clarity ...

buzz is on a homemade computer with Russian parts.

[mpharris36]

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I absolutely freaking love this dude. he is the anti-randle.

you mean fans gravitate to a positive player with high energy over someone that sulks and complains all the time???

No way!!!

[thebuzzardman]

Looks like he's always kind of slipped the screen to get a running headstart before the defense could react

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Kind of like Amare

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I forgot how stacked those PHX teams were. Shame they never won one

True.

He'd have probably had a good game.

Per my other post, Knicks need to make some decisions.

Easy ones include jettisoning Noel into the sun, trading Randle. At least for me. Or invert that.

Anyway, Let Mitch go if they insist on keeping Randle and Obi. Either one needs time at the 5. RJ and Cam could use time at the 4.
This probably doesn't work if Thibs is the coach.

Move Randle for Zion. Try to keep Obi. It's unlikely to be the case, but even in this scenario, Noel needs to go. Or Mitch. My preference is Mitch stays, but again, I'd like to see the Knicks make decisions that make some sort of sense.

Once the Knicks resigned Randle, with RJ's extension surely on their mind, the Knicks decided to operate over the cap. We've covered this and Cohen from Macri's thing goes over it well. There are MLE benefits to doing it, at least for a few years. Knicks will have the larger MLE this offseason - the one that alternates.

Just resign Mitch, if he's willing. He might chase the extra 3 million per a team can offer, since the Knicks kind of overpaid him for a few years. But I'd give him the max the Knicks can offer. He'd still be moveable in a future trade, and Knicks kind of committed to operating with trades for the next 4 years anyway.

Richardmany4's or BXetcetc may have different points to make.

What’s your opinion on a Randle for Ayton swap if PHX doesn’t want to pay him

In a second. We'd probably have to send picks though.
Don't see Phoenix doing it.
Maybe giving them Noel (lolz) makes it easier, as they get some highly theoretical defense at the 5 backl

[evevale]

buzz is on a homemade computer with Russian parts.

[thebuzzardman]

Obi has really good instincts on offense. Makes the right passes, knows when to cut, leak out, spot up, and was real good today at attacking. Happy I got to see a nice solid glimpse of what Obi can be. Probably won’t happen here because of king Dubious Handles tho.

I'd still like to point out how Obi is at least a triple fail by the FO and how that bodes really poorly for the future, minus some kind of very large off season shakeup.

Fail #1: Knicks desperately need a PG. A PG who could play off the ball would be particularly nice, since that's good for RJ's development. A tall PG would be really nice for the switching on defense. Knicks pass on Haliburton for Obi.

Fail #2: Knicks know they have a coach who will ride vets. Knicks have just hired Thibs as coach and have Julius on the roster. A problem waiting to happen.

Fail #3: IF the Knicks know, or have a strong feeling that Randle is part of their future core, why draft Obi at 8, when surely there are backup PF's at some point available later in a draft or with the MLE.

Fail #4: The Knicks have hired Thibs as their coach. They have Mitchell Robinson on the roster. They make a point of signing, and then resigning Noel. They also sign Taj, probably at Thib's request. Thibs hates small ball lineups. Even though it would probably be a good idea to give Randle or Obi both some time at the 5, or at least play them together, the Knicks FO stuffs the roster with offensively limited C's, who you'd think they'd know wants to feature defensive bigs, thereby blocking any small chance Randle and Obi might play together. Also, If Thibs likes his big defensive C, and a team is going to resign or feature Randle, what is the point of Obi - at least at draft time.

I'm willing to let the FO off the hook on the Obi pick IF they move Randle, but they didn't move Randle or let his contract expire, they signed him to 4 years at 30 million per, which is going to be hard to move.

These are just the fails around drafting Obi with Thibs as coach and Randle on the roster.

Also, your post is good, I just used this as an opportunity for a vent I've been storing about the FO's lack of BBall IQ/Roster building and vision. F*ckning clown car, it is.

Yes, hiring Thibs and drafting Obi at the same time was a fail, but just fellate Obi and get it over with

Sorry, you've been bogarting his joint


It's not a critique of Obi. It's that the FO doesn't operate with any vision or sense of planning.
Even if Obi turns out to be only ok - or good - or excellent, it doesn't change the point of the post, which is within the space of a year, their approach was completely f*cked up, planning and vision wise.

I don't this is a premature judgement, where I'll usually go "well, there are some other moves they need to make".

They made the moves. They drafted Obi, then maxed Randle, then signed and resigned Noel. With Thibs as coach.

It's laughable.

[Richard4444]

Obi has really good instincts on offense. Makes the right passes, knows when to cut, leak out, spot up, and was real good today at attacking. Happy I got to see a nice solid glimpse of what Obi can be. Probably won’t happen here because of king Dubious Handles tho.

I'd still like to point out how Obi is at least a triple fail by the FO and how that bodes really poorly for the future, minus some kind of very large off season shakeup.

Fail #1: Knicks desperately need a PG. A PG who could play off the ball would be particularly nice, since that's good for RJ's development. A tall PG would be really nice for the switching on defense. Knicks pass on Haliburton for Obi.

Fail #2: Knicks know they have a coach who will ride vets. Knicks have just hired Thibs as coach and have Julius on the roster. A problem waiting to happen.

Fail #3: IF the Knicks know, or have a strong feeling that Randle is part of their future core, why draft Obi at 8, when surely there are backup PF's at some point available later in a draft or with the MLE.

Fail #4: The Knicks have hired Thibs as their coach. They have Mitchell Robinson on the roster. They make a point of signing, and then resigning Noel. They also sign Taj, probably at Thib's request. Thibs hates small ball lineups. Even though it would probably be a good idea to give Randle or Obi both some time at the 5, or at least play them together, the Knicks FO stuffs the roster with offensively limited C's, who you'd think they'd know wants to feature defensive bigs, thereby blocking any small chance Randle and Obi might play together. Also, If Thibs likes his big defensive C, and a team is going to resign or feature Randle, what is the point of Obi - at least at draft time.

I'm willing to let the FO off the hook on the Obi pick IF they move Randle, but they didn't move Randle or let his contract expire, they signed him to 4 years at 30 million per, which is going to be hard to move.

These are just the fails around drafting Obi with Thibs as coach and Randle on the roster.

Also, your post is good, I just used this as an opportunity for a vent I've been storing about the FO's lack of BBall IQ/Roster building and vision. F*ckning clown car, it is.

I think it was almost clear that we tried to trade Randle after drafting Obi. But I guess we did not find good offers. I guess the other teams lowball us because it was an obvious move. So, we ride with Randle for the past season to increase his trade value. He was in really great shape. And he was the Thibs hope to not be forced to play too many young players and try to win. But he went all-star. So we gave up the plan to trade him and re-sign him. It would look very bad if we trade an all-star player for smaller talent or picks if we did not another star to replace him.

I agree it will not work having Randle and Topin. We need to trade one of the two. Otherwise, Toppin will be wasted; it will disrupt his development. But I don't know if we can get a fair return for Randle and Obi right now. The first was exposed as an inefficient chucker this season (but he has the potential to have another all-star season in the future). The second one did not have enough minutes to build trade value.

If we jump to Top4 in the lottery, although at the very small odds, we may be forced to get another PF and it will further complicate things.

[F N 11]

40 (!!!) minutes for Obi

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I damn sure did not forget Obi showed flashes of being a high level passer.

[F N 11]

Fun to see Obi in a late-season meaningless romp, but at the end of the day, MSG/Dolan will still insist on paying for a cheap-thrill fool’s gold marquee name on the billboard. Regardless of whether it’s better for the team, fans, or even the longterm financial future of the Knicks. The only way Randle leaves is if we get an even dumber marquee name in return.

#backupQB

I hear you but meaningless? Hornets playing for playoff position and so was hawks.

[F N 11]

obi having 6 assists despite not having as many touches as bum ass randle regularly would shows just how badly knicks need to stop making randle the focal point.

he’s not good, anyone can average assists if they get 500 touches per game.

And only pass when there’s a double.

[thebuzzardman]

Yes, hiring Thibs and drafting Obi at the same time was a fail, but just fellate Obi and get it over with

The only thing I'd say in defense of drafting Obi vs Julius and I'm not gonna give FO too much credit is remember. The yr they drafted Obi Randle had underperformed. Remember we sortve felt about Randle that yr as we do this yr and I think going into that yr it was the last yr of his contract if we didn't extend him. Also take into account Obi was like 22 at the time and just won CPOTY. Still though, no matter what age you're drafted there's a learning process as a Rookie.

In other words I'm sure the Knicks felt we'd draft Obi and then by his second yr he'd be ramped up and ready to start, at which point we simply wouldn't resign Randle. Then Randle had his MIP season and Thibs got the roster to overachieve.


So from that POV it isn't crazy. I just think it's crazy within the context of us desperately needing a PG and that player being right there for the taking and we passed on them. And technically 2 when you consider Cole Anthony buy I wasn't enamored by Cole like I was about Haliburton.

Correct, Randle was probably viewed as a disappointment with only one guaranteed year left on his contract so they drafted Obi to replace him. Then Randle blew up for one season.

Still, drafting a player whose playing style does not match Thibs coaching style in any way was still a fail.

I think Obi can be a really good ancillary player that averages 15 PPG getting easy buckets in an uptempo offense that moves the ball like we just saw with Randle on the bench.

The young guys like playing with Obi. They don't like playing with Randle. That doesn't make Obi a stud, but it does mean he's a better fit. Randle is a monkey wrench to a well-run offense and he does jack on defense now. Obi tries to play defense even if he's up and down there.

They should have drafted a PG. I always feel that way. No knock on Obi, but roster building is about fit and needs, something this franchise fails at with regularity.

It's still that visionary fail. Either you should have an idea what Randle is about or not. Meaning, not be sold on him before he blows up, or are sold. I get humans are involved, nothing is perfect. Then Randle goes and has what could be an outlier year. Knicks go all in, HARD. Now Randle has appeared to have reverted, possibly worse.

Good GM's, that can properly scout their own players and the league, are supposed to avoid stuff like this. So, even if we throw away the issues around the draft/Thibs/Randle, it still leaves a big fail around the proper assessment of Randle.

Then again, Scott Perry and Zanin are the guys who are theoretically in charge of knowing stuff like that and Perry's track record is of sucking balls at pro player scouting and apparently Zanin is right there with him.

[thebuzzardman]

Randle's face needs to be on Eyore, stat!

i hope this lives up to your expectations ...

Spoiler:

Quite awesome!

[thebuzzardman]

buzz is on a homemade computer with Russian parts.

KnicksGod:





I worked with a guy who I swear could be that guy, but with weirder hair.

Very much "Pat" from that SNL skit from way back.
To the point that people stared when we all went to lunch as a team.
Super nice guy (possibly) though.

[F N 11]

Let the kids keep cooking

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I know we have a good record when Deuce plays as well.

[Clyde_Style]

I'd still like to point out how Obi is at least a triple fail by the FO and how that bodes really poorly for the future, minus some kind of very large off season shakeup.

Fail #1: Knicks desperately need a PG. A PG who could play off the ball would be particularly nice, since that's good for RJ's development. A tall PG would be really nice for the switching on defense. Knicks pass on Haliburton for Obi.

Fail #2: Knicks know they have a coach who will ride vets. Knicks have just hired Thibs as coach and have Julius on the roster. A problem waiting to happen.

Fail #3: IF the Knicks know, or have a strong feeling that Randle is part of their future core, why draft Obi at 8, when surely there are backup PF's at some point available later in a draft or with the MLE.

Fail #4: The Knicks have hired Thibs as their coach. They have Mitchell Robinson on the roster. They make a point of signing, and then resigning Noel. They also sign Taj, probably at Thib's request. Thibs hates small ball lineups. Even though it would probably be a good idea to give Randle or Obi both some time at the 5, or at least play them together, the Knicks FO stuffs the roster with offensively limited C's, who you'd think they'd know wants to feature defensive bigs, thereby blocking any small chance Randle and Obi might play together. Also, If Thibs likes his big defensive C, and a team is going to resign or feature Randle, what is the point of Obi - at least at draft time.

I'm willing to let the FO off the hook on the Obi pick IF they move Randle, but they didn't move Randle or let his contract expire, they signed him to 4 years at 30 million per, which is going to be hard to move.

These are just the fails around drafting Obi with Thibs as coach and Randle on the roster.

Also, your post is good, I just used this as an opportunity for a vent I've been storing about the FO's lack of BBall IQ/Roster building and vision. F*ckning clown car, it is.

Yes, hiring Thibs and drafting Obi at the same time was a fail, but just fellate Obi and get it over with

Sorry, you've been bogarting his joint


It's not a critique of Obi. It's that the FO doesn't operate with any vision or sense of planning.
Even if Obi turns out to be only ok - or good - or excellent, it doesn't change the point of the post, which is within the space of a year, their approach was completely f*cked up, planning and vision wise.

I don't this is a premature judgement, where I'll usually go "well, there are some other moves they need to make".

They made the moves. They drafted Obi, then maxed Randle, then signed and resigned Noel. With Thibs as coach.

It's laughable.

I agree with your core premise. I think we all agree on this. The haphazard strategy towards roster fit and development is only possible to overcome if they get lucky and capture lightning in a bottle with a draft pick that transforms the franchise.

Even with the snafus, they doubled down on Randle after he played like a scared turkey vs. ATL. The double irony was Obi was one of our only players who shined in that series. And they still over-committed to Randle. It remains their # 1 firable offense and there is no way to excuse it.

[F N 11]

Spoiler:

Let the kids keep cooking

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Wish Mitch could have been part of it! Might of had 20

Would of clogged the paint.

[Clyde_Style]

buzz is on a homemade computer with Russian parts.

KnicksGod:





I worked with a guy who I swear could be that guy, but with weirder hair.

Very much "Pat" from that SNL skit from way back.
To the point that people stared when we all went to lunch as a team.
Super nice guy (possibly) though.

It’s Pat is one of the funniest SNL characters. The weird noise they made was like a gurgle and a purr mashed together. Icky funny

[Iron Mantis]

Randle is a 5. He should be playing there to provide some spacing...for himself as well as others. Probably a better defender at the 5 as well. His passing would even be better for the team at the 5. It would make a lot of things better for the entire team. Thibs is a moron. The FO is pretty bad at team fit as well. I have been saying Randle should be playing the 5 and his actual best role on any team is a bench big. The FO decided to pay him and the HC decided to play him as a #1 option point forward. Ridiculous. Hopefully he can be traded along with Burks and Noel this summer. Get a real PG and we have a shot at looking like an actual team next year. Build from there. Enough with washed vets playing out of position and having no accountability.

I've been calling for this for a while.

Rim protection will suffer, but the team's foot speed on defense, and the offense will be much more potent.

It will be difficult for big centers to chase Randle around and contest his 3's.

[Clyde_Style]

It looks like this FO is letting Mitch walk for nothing because they have Sims. That’s the only conclusion I can draw. It’s dumb, because at least they could have locked up Mitch a long time ago on a quality deal. Then they could have used him for a trade if they wanted to go with Sims. Another head scratcher.

They could still sign Mitch, but it will cost much more now