2021-22 regular season thread

[JonFromVA]

We're 28th in the league in turnovers, which is a sign even the simple stuff we're running is problematic.

I dont think it has anything to do with playcall, what I have noticed is that the Cavs are super prone to having mental/effort lapses.

There are so many turnovers in games from guys throwing lazy entry passes or handoffs on the perimeter. Guys on the receiving end not running towards the passer when they are stuck/trapped. As dumb as this sounds, not grabbing the pass with conviction (Mobley/Love) and the fact that they have the worst hands of any group in the NBA.

So many turnovers from fumbling, bumbling, stumbling over the ball. JUST GRAB IT. Squeeze it for god sake.

Mobley plays with a lot of finesse but man that ball seems to be a wet bar of soap whenever he is dribbling and he gets ripped in the post regularly because he dribbles the ball 4 ft. away from his body. The one team trait this Cavs roster lacks more than anything is strong hands.

I just need to see 1 game where we pass the ball with conviction and the receiver grab the pass with conviction.

That's part of it, but poor spacing makes everything harder. That Evan is able to do anything other than turn the ball over operating in a packed paint is a credit to the rook.

[KuruptedCav]

I just need to see 1 game where we pass the ball with conviction and the receiver grab the pass with conviction.

That comes from experience, generally in the form of high leverage experience. This team hasn’t had it; even most of the players on it, haven’t had it, at any level.

Anyone can throw a punch, you aren’t a boxer until you learn how to take one and respond. This team hasn’t gotten there; no reason to believe they won’t.


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[JonFromVA]

I just need to see 1 game where we pass the ball with conviction and the receiver grab the pass with conviction.

That comes from experience, generally in the form of high leverage experience. This team hasn’t had it; even most of the players on it, haven’t had it, at any level.

Anyone can throw a punch, you aren’t a boxer until you learn how to take one and respond. This team hasn’t gotten there; no reason to believe they won’t.

The defense is our big problem at the moment - which affects our ability to gets easy points on offense. As for the offense we're missing Ricky's veteran influence and ability to create offense when things bog down, and of course Allen who was often the focus of our offense, his offensive rebounding, etc, and even Dean Wade.

Isaac has been stepping up with his corner 3's lately, and LeVert is a work in progress that's been delayed to injuries and the guy he was supposed to have established chemistry with (Allen).

But the amazing thing earlier in the season is how well we were punching back and still every now and then we see our defense step up and completely shut opponents down. JBB seems to feel like we're not sustaining the energy level. Which likely gets at another problem ... like Thib's teams and Brad Steven's teams we were trying hard when other team's weren't and benefiting from it, and now teams like Indiana and Detroit are giving us struggles when they simply play hard.

In other words, at the moment, we are playing slightly better than some of the worst teams in the league ... which is why we're currently struggling to stay out of the play-in.

We've had a series of days off, hopefully JBB/staff has used the time to do more than admonish the guys to play harder ...

[toooskies]

Or is it more fair to say that we're struggling to stay out of the play-in because we've been missing an all-star for most of February (in Garland) and most of March (in Allen), in addition to injuries to Wade, Rondo, LeVert, and Markkanen in those two months?

And we're still 10-11 since February 1st. 10-11 while missing an all-star in all but 6 of those games, and often multiple other rotation players as well. Yeah, the schedule's been easy, but this is still the NBA.

One reason the defense may be off is that so many players are in different roles-- we're starting Stevens at the 3 instead of three bigs, Markkanen is guarding Cs and PFs, the backups don't always have one of Allen/Mobley behind them, we're typically playing smaller all the time, LeVert hasn't settled into a role....

Offense isn't much better with DG just taking all the scoring opportunities as Allen was replaced with another low-volume guy in Stevens, Love losing his mojo a bit, Goodwin not really having much off-ball game, and no one on the team able to set a decent screen with Allen out.

And we're still treading water here. Kind of amazing.

[JonFromVA]

Or is it more fair to say that we're struggling to stay out of the play-in because we've been missing an all-star for most of February (in Garland) and most of March (in Allen), in addition to injuries to Wade, Rondo, LeVert, and Markkanen in those two months?

And we're still 10-11 since February 1st. 10-11 while missing an all-star in all but 6 of those games, and often multiple other rotation players as well. Yeah, the schedule's been easy, but this is still the NBA.

One reason the defense may be off is that so many players are in different roles-- we're starting Stevens at the 3 instead of three bigs, Markkanen is guarding Cs and PFs, the backups don't always have one of Allen/Mobley behind them, we're typically playing smaller all the time, LeVert hasn't settled into a role....

Offense isn't much better with DG just taking all the scoring opportunities as Allen was replaced with another low-volume guy in Stevens, Love losing his mojo a bit, Goodwin not really having much off-ball game, and no one on the team able to set a decent screen with Allen out.

And we're still treading water here. Kind of amazing.

The whole season has been like that with the injuries and Covid, the difference is guys kept fighting through it and stepping up. Now, it certainly didn't hurt that the teams we were facing were often missing players too, but the same Lakers team missing Davis that had been struggling to beat anyone - beat us pretty handily. And on the other hand, we managed to beat Denver for the season sweep.

*shrugs*

I'll just get back in my seat on the rollercoaster and see whether we're heading up or down tonight.

[LivingLegend]

Is it me or is this Cavs team kinda *** at rebounding even though they play a bunch of bigs. I see far too many offensive rebounds off missed 3s by other teams for a team playing 4 Centers.

[toooskies]

Is it me or is this Cavs team kinda *** at rebounding even though they play a bunch of bigs. I see far too many offensive rebounds off missed 3s by other teams for a team playing 4 Centers.

Rebounding is a lot about strength and weight. While we play guys who are really tall, we're usually weaker and lighter than the other team at the PF and C spots.

And most teams get rebounding help from their guards. But Okoro is 6th from the bottom among qualified players in DREB% and Garland is 12th. The truth is that we're often outnumbered.

When Jarrett isn't out there, we're at a disadvantage everywhere.

I just wish that guys like Siakam and Augustin would stop being nearly perfect from three point range against us. (Which is partly because we keep giving them uncontested looks.)

[jbk1234]

Turnovers are killing us. LeVert's handle is too loose for a guy who likes to dribble into traffic. I can deal with inefficient midrange and (bad IMO) contested shots, but he really needs to stop turning the ball over. Frankly, Lauri needs to be more involved in the offense in late game situations and I don't count absurdly long three point shots with shot clock winding down. Opposing teams won't double Lauri around the paint so long as Mobley and Garland are on the floor with him. Using Lauri as a spacer so LeVert, or increasingly Garland, can dribbling into a crowded paint ain't it. We're coughing up the ball too often.

[JonFromVA]

Is it me or is this Cavs team kinda *** at rebounding even though they play a bunch of bigs. I see far too many offensive rebounds off missed 3s by other teams for a team playing 4 Centers.

Rebounding is a lot about strength and weight. While we play guys who are really tall, we're usually weaker and lighter than the other team at the PF and C spots.

And most teams get rebounding help from their guards. But Okoro is 6th from the bottom among qualified players in DREB% and Garland is 12th. The truth is that we're often outnumbered.

When Jarrett isn't out there, we're at a disadvantage everywhere.

I just wish that guys like Siakam and Augustin would stop being nearly perfect from three point range against us. (Which is partly because we keep giving them uncontested looks.)

Overhelping to defend the paint is a dangerous game, that we were winning more often than not early in the season. I just watched all of Siakim's 3pt makes via nba.com's video box score and only noticed one play where Garland and Lauri had a miscommunication leading to the open 3, and one time Barnes set an off ball screen on Lauri. Most of them seemed due to Lauri helping in the P&R and collapsing in the paint to help with drives. Sometimes another player got out to contest, but late contests are pretty junky by nature, and one time Evan was there in time but probably setup a step short, relying on his length, and Siakim had no problem shooting over him.

Opponents are going to attack DG, Lauri, and Kev rather than Isaac, Lamar, and Evan. When we had both Evan and Jarrett it seemed usually one of them was available to help in the paint, but the Raptors were often able to pull Evan out of the play.

So, Jarrett just might be the lynch-pin that helps turn those outcomes in our favor, or maybe JBB's defense is just flawed and short of super human effort to help & recover we're going to give up wide open 3's to any team that plans to exploit our weaker defenders and moves the ball.

They made a point in the Cavs broadcast that JBB wasn't piling on too many minutes on Darius (even considering his back injury) - protecting the shield I guess - but his level of play begs to differ. I wonder if JBB is refusing to play Goodwin more because he wasn't added to the roster and isn't eligible for the playoffs ...

[toooskies]

Is it me or is this Cavs team kinda *** at rebounding even though they play a bunch of bigs. I see far too many offensive rebounds off missed 3s by other teams for a team playing 4 Centers.

Rebounding is a lot about strength and weight. While we play guys who are really tall, we're usually weaker and lighter than the other team at the PF and C spots.

And most teams get rebounding help from their guards. But Okoro is 6th from the bottom among qualified players in DREB% and Garland is 12th. The truth is that we're often outnumbered.

When Jarrett isn't out there, we're at a disadvantage everywhere.

I just wish that guys like Siakam and Augustin would stop being nearly perfect from three point range against us. (Which is partly because we keep giving them uncontested looks.)

Overhelping to defend the paint is a dangerous game, that we were winning more often than not early in the season. I just watched all of Siakim's 3pt makes via nba.com's video box score and only noticed one play where Garland and Lauri had a miscommunication leading to the open 3, and one time Barnes set an off ball screen on Lauri. Most of them seemed due to Lauri helping in the P&R and collapsing in the paint to help with drives. Sometimes another player got out to contest, but late contests are pretty junky by nature, and one time Evan was there in time but probably setup a step short, relying on his length, and Siakim had no problem shooting over him.

Opponents are going to attack DG, Lauri, and Kev rather than Isaac, Lamar, and Evan. When we had both Evan and Jarrett it seemed usually one of them was available to help in the paint, but the Raptors were often able to pull Evan out of the play.

So, Jarrett just might be the lynch-pin that helps turn those outcomes in our favor, or maybe JBB's defense is just flawed and short of super human effort to help & recover we're going to give up wide open 3's to any team that plans to exploit our weaker defenders and moves the ball.

They made a point in the Cavs broadcast that JBB wasn't piling on too many minutes on Darius (even considering his back injury) - protecting the shield I guess - but his level of play begs to differ. I wonder if JBB is refusing to play Goodwin more because he wasn't added to the roster and isn't eligible for the playoffs ...

Goodwin doesn't really do much without the ball in his hands, he disappears when DG or Caris is out there.

[JonFromVA]

Rebounding is a lot about strength and weight. While we play guys who are really tall, we're usually weaker and lighter than the other team at the PF and C spots.

And most teams get rebounding help from their guards. But Okoro is 6th from the bottom among qualified players in DREB% and Garland is 12th. The truth is that we're often outnumbered.

When Jarrett isn't out there, we're at a disadvantage everywhere.

I just wish that guys like Siakam and Augustin would stop being nearly perfect from three point range against us. (Which is partly because we keep giving them uncontested looks.)

Overhelping to defend the paint is a dangerous game, that we were winning more often than not early in the season. I just watched all of Siakim's 3pt makes via nba.com's video box score and only noticed one play where Garland and Lauri had a miscommunication leading to the open 3, and one time Barnes set an off ball screen on Lauri. Most of them seemed due to Lauri helping in the P&R and collapsing in the paint to help with drives. Sometimes another player got out to contest, but late contests are pretty junky by nature, and one time Evan was there in time but probably setup a step short, relying on his length, and Siakim had no problem shooting over him.

Opponents are going to attack DG, Lauri, and Kev rather than Isaac, Lamar, and Evan. When we had both Evan and Jarrett it seemed usually one of them was available to help in the paint, but the Raptors were often able to pull Evan out of the play.

So, Jarrett just might be the lynch-pin that helps turn those outcomes in our favor, or maybe JBB's defense is just flawed and short of super human effort to help & recover we're going to give up wide open 3's to any team that plans to exploit our weaker defenders and moves the ball.

They made a point in the Cavs broadcast that JBB wasn't piling on too many minutes on Darius (even considering his back injury) - protecting the shield I guess - but his level of play begs to differ. I wonder if JBB is refusing to play Goodwin more because he wasn't added to the roster and isn't eligible for the playoffs ...

Goodwin doesn't really do much without the ball in his hands, he disappears when DG or Caris is out there.

Caris didn't do much with the ball in his hands, either.

Just makes me wonder how much Ricky was our defacto coach in terms of suggesting plays, getting guys prepared or if it was more just his ability to create something out of nothing and lock down the opposing point on D at times.

[jbk1234]

Once the Raptors get up on us by two or more games for the sixth seed, the Cavs need to think long and hard about going for the 10th seed and keeping their pick. That pick should've been protected top 16 to avoid the current scenario, but it wasn't, and if they're not guaranteed a four-games series, they've got to think about next year.

[JonFromVA]

Once the Raptors get up on us by two or more games for the sixth seed, the Cavs need to think long and hard about going for the 10th seed and keeping their pick. That pick should've been protected top 16 to avoid the current scenario, but it wasn't, and if they're not guaranteed a four-games series, they've got to think about next year.

It was reported we traded a lottery protected pick ... if we lose in the play-in, we're a lottery team and the pick doesn't convey to the Pacers.

Otherwise we're in the playoffs, and I doubt Altman or JBB care how we made it as long as we're reasonably healthy and our young players are gaining the experience of playing games that matter.

[jbk1234]

Once the Raptors get up on us by two or more games for the sixth seed, the Cavs need to think long and hard about going for the 10th seed and keeping their pick. That pick should've been protected top 16 to avoid the current scenario, but it wasn't, and if they're not guaranteed a four-games series, they've got to think about next year.

It was reported we traded a lottery protected pick ... if we lose in the play-in, we're a lottery team and the pick doesn't convey to the Pacers.

Otherwise we're in the playoffs, and I doubt Altman or JBB care how we made it as long as we're reasonably healthy and our young players are gaining the experience of playing games that matter.

I'm not entirely sure that's how it works but I'll take your word for it rather than look it up.

[JonFromVA]

Once the Raptors get up on us by two or more games for the sixth seed, the Cavs need to think long and hard about going for the 10th seed and keeping their pick. That pick should've been protected top 16 to avoid the current scenario, but it wasn't, and if they're not guaranteed a four-games series, they've got to think about next year.

It was reported we traded a lottery protected pick ... if we lose in the play-in, we're a lottery team and the pick doesn't convey to the Pacers.

Otherwise we're in the playoffs, and I doubt Altman or JBB care how we made it as long as we're reasonably healthy and our young players are gaining the experience of playing games that matter.

I'm not entirely sure that's how it works but I'll take your word for it rather than look it up.

It's not that hard to demonstrate ... the Warriors had the better record, but got beat in the play-in last season by Memphis yet they ended up with the 14th pick in the draft rather than Memphis who ended up with the 17th. If you're still not sold, you can look up the 2021 draft lottery results and confirm that the Warriors ended up 14th while Memphis was not listed.

The only other tidbit is the protections on the draft pick we sent out, and we can only work with what's been reported.

Chicago seems to be in free fall, but if you're lucky, the Cavs defense will right their ship tomorrow night and we'll be a step closer to keeping our pick.

Whether there's going to be a viable wing at #14 will be the big question, from what little I've heard it's nowhere near as deep of a draft compared to 2021.

[jbk1234]

It was reported we traded a lottery protected pick ... if we lose in the play-in, we're a lottery team and the pick doesn't convey to the Pacers.

Otherwise we're in the playoffs, and I doubt Altman or JBB care how we made it as long as we're reasonably healthy and our young players are gaining the experience of playing games that matter.

I'm not entirely sure that's how it works but I'll take your word for it rather than look it up.

It's not that hard to demonstrate ... the Warriors had the better record, but got beat in the play-in last season by Memphis yet they ended up with the 14th pick in the draft rather than Memphis who ended up with the 17th. If you're still not sold, you can look up the 2021 draft lottery results and confirm that the Warriors ended up 14th while Memphis was not listed.

The only other tidbit is the protections on the draft pick we sent out, and we can only work with what's been reported.

Chicago seems to be in free fall, but if you're lucky, the Cavs defense will right their ship tomorrow night and we'll be a step closer to keeping our pick.

Whether there's going to be a viable wing at #14 will be the big question, from what little I've heard it's nowhere near as deep of a draft compared to 2021.

I'd settle for a backup PG or even drafting for someone else and making a move involving either Sexton or LeVert.

[toooskies]

I'm not entirely sure that's how it works but I'll take your word for it rather than look it up.

It's not that hard to demonstrate ... the Warriors had the better record, but got beat in the play-in last season by Memphis yet they ended up with the 14th pick in the draft rather than Memphis who ended up with the 17th. If you're still not sold, you can look up the 2021 draft lottery results and confirm that the Warriors ended up 14th while Memphis was not listed.

The only other tidbit is the protections on the draft pick we sent out, and we can only work with what's been reported.

Chicago seems to be in free fall, but if you're lucky, the Cavs defense will right their ship tomorrow night and we'll be a step closer to keeping our pick.

Whether there's going to be a viable wing at #14 will be the big question, from what little I've heard it's nowhere near as deep of a draft compared to 2021.

I'd settle for a backup PG or even drafting for someone else and making a move involving either Sexton or LeVert.

Funny, I'd prefer a backup C with some bulk so that Mobley can stay at PF more or less full-time. Although maybe Edey or Tshiebwe are available in the 2nd round?

[JonFromVA]

It's not that hard to demonstrate ... the Warriors had the better record, but got beat in the play-in last season by Memphis yet they ended up with the 14th pick in the draft rather than Memphis who ended up with the 17th. If you're still not sold, you can look up the 2021 draft lottery results and confirm that the Warriors ended up 14th while Memphis was not listed.

The only other tidbit is the protections on the draft pick we sent out, and we can only work with what's been reported.

Chicago seems to be in free fall, but if you're lucky, the Cavs defense will right their ship tomorrow night and we'll be a step closer to keeping our pick.

Whether there's going to be a viable wing at #14 will be the big question, from what little I've heard it's nowhere near as deep of a draft compared to 2021.

I'd settle for a backup PG or even drafting for someone else and making a move involving either Sexton or LeVert.

Funny, I'd prefer a backup C with some bulk so that Mobley can stay at PF more or less full-time. Although maybe Edey or Tshiebwe are available in the 2nd round?

I've got Isaiah Mobley slotted in with that 2nd round pick that originally belonged to Miami for that role.

jbk's ideas if we end up with our first rounder are reasonable. I'd love to bring Ricky back, but it's going to be a while before he's able to play let alone see what he can still do.

[toooskies]

I'd settle for a backup PG or even drafting for someone else and making a move involving either Sexton or LeVert.

Funny, I'd prefer a backup C with some bulk so that Mobley can stay at PF more or less full-time. Although maybe Edey or Tshiebwe are available in the 2nd round?

I've got Isaiah Mobley slotted in with that 2nd round pick that originally belonged to Miami for that role.

jbk's ideas if we end up with our first rounder are reasonable. I'd love to bring Ricky back, but it's going to be a while before he's able to play let alone see what he can still do.

Isaiah is shorter than his brother and always played a forward spot, he isn't an NBA center.

[JonFromVA]

So... this would be a good game to jump on the Magic and step on their necks from the tip (as Austin Carr would put it), maybe even try to gain some momentum for the rest of the season; or we can just play it down the wire, perhaps double OT like we've done in other games we were supposed to easily win.