Is Grizzlies' winning helping Ja Morant's MVP ranking?

_NoMas · Post #21 » by **_NoMas** » Thu Mar 24, 2022 1:38 pm

It’s more the 17 games missed for me that’s an issue. Hard to compare performances when you are sitting that many games, and the advantage it gives in terms of freshness to perform at a higher level then guys showing out night after night.

At this point Ja is no longer in the top 5 for me, Tatum 4 and Luka 5th…

BodieB · Post #22 » by **BodieB** » Thu Mar 24, 2022 1:59 pm

Been more impressed with Luka and Tatum the latter half of the season honestly. Availability isn't valued enough in the voting.

Post #23 » by **Duke4life831** » Thu Mar 24, 2022 2:10 pm

I think them winning without Ja goes to show Tyus Jones is a capable starting PG in this league.

I also can't see an argument for anything higher than 6th for Ja. This is how I view it.

Top 3 in some order:
Jokic
Giannis
Embiid

Gap to the next two guys:
Tatum
Luka

Gap again to the next group. This would be the group with guys like Ja and DeRozan.

BarbaGrizz · Post #24 » by **BarbaGrizz** » Thu Mar 24, 2022 2:13 pm

It´s Jokic/Giannis/Embiid and then Ja/Luka/Tatum

TheSheriff · Post #25 » by **TheSheriff** » Thu Mar 24, 2022 2:54 pm

He’s somewhere below Giannis, Embiid, Tatum and Jokic.

old skool · Post #26 » by **old skool** » Thu Mar 24, 2022 3:36 pm

"Top 5" implies that a candidate deserves serious consideration for MVP. When there is such significant separation between the top 3 contenders and the rest of the field, the "Top 5" designation becomes pointless.

They don't hand out trophies for "Top 5". No one celebrates receiving virtually no consideration for MVP, but being among the best of those who also were not in the MVP conversation.

No one cares about being an also ran.

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GSP · Post #27 » by **GSP** » Fri Mar 25, 2022 1:50 am

Read on Twitter

Up 36 against Indiana as we speak

imagine the delusion levels youd need to have to act like this is HELPING Jas Mvp ranking. He shouldnt be sniffing top 5 and not only that if he doesnt make the Wcf with this juggernaut his career is in jeopardy

homecourtloss · Post #28 » by **homecourtloss** » Fri Mar 25, 2022 2:01 am

Pennebaker wrote:
dygaction wrote:Grizzlies currently are 50W-23L
with Morant played: 35W-21L
without Morant: 15W-2L

Grizzlies have the second best record in the league. Morant is the best player on the second best team. With team winning, does it more strengthen his second best team part, or hurt his "valuable" argument?
Do you still have him top 5 in MVP voting?

The 35-21 is much more convincing than 15-2. 56 games of evidence versus 17 games. Their record without Morant could be due to things that have nothing to do with Ja Morant, there arent enough games there to say. How would the Grizz fare over 56 games without Morant? They certainly would not maintain an .882 winning percentage. It would probably end up worse than the .625 winning percentage they have with Morant.

Yes, but the Grizzlies have played nearly 1,700 minutes with Morant off court and are +6.5 points per 100 possessions in these minutes. +6.5 per 100 possessions is usually a 60 win team and would be the third best net rating this season. Additionally, in games in which Morant doesn’t play at all, the Grizzlies are a wild +17 per 100 possessions.

The Grizzlies are +3.7 per 100 with Morant on court. It becomes hard to say he has MVP impact when everyone has been so good around him when he’s not playing.

Pelly24 · Post #29 » by **Pelly24** » Fri Mar 25, 2022 2:43 am

Ja is a great player, but i think he's definitely not an MVP caliber player yet. He's in a situation where he just has to do what he has to do, and he does very well, to have a very good team. He's not as good as 2017-2021 Dame, for instance. The NBA is a lot about narratives and the circumstances you find yourself in. A lot of +4 or so BPM players would look great in Memphis. But still, Ja is a top 15 guy in my eyes when everyone is healthy.

nikster · Post #30 » by **nikster** » Fri Mar 25, 2022 2:47 am

GSP wrote:

Read on Twitter

Up 36 against Indiana as we speak

imagine the delusion levels youd need to have to act like this is HELPING Jas Mvp ranking. He shouldnt be sniffing top 5 and not only that if he doesnt make the Wcf with this juggernaut his career is in jeopardy

It helps to a point. If they were terrible without him and put them with a mediocre spot in the standings he wouldn’t be getting any MVP talk

LukaTheGOAT · Post #31 » by **LukaTheGOAT** » Fri Mar 25, 2022 3:21 am

GSP wrote:

Read on Twitter

Up 36 against Indiana as we speak

imagine the delusion levels youd need to have to act like this is HELPING Jas Mvp ranking. He shouldnt be sniffing top 5 and [b]not only that if he doesnt make the Wcf with this juggernaut his career is in jeopardy[/b]

Okay let's chill on that part lol

Cubbies2120 · Post #32 » by **Cubbies2120** » Fri Mar 25, 2022 3:25 am

Pennebaker wrote:
Jaivl wrote:Grizzlies' record is basically the only case favoring Morant for MVP as he's not close to the top 5 in the league, so absolutely yes.

But their record with Morant is still impressive. Even if you remove their 15-2 record without Morant, he would still be an MVP candidate with a .625 winning percentage.

A .625 win percentage (which is the Grizzlies 35-21 record with Morant) would have the Grizzlies as the #2 seed in the East and a top 5 record in the NBA overall.

Yes but now we see that the Grizzlies are capable of a .625 record with or without him.

We can’t just pretend they aren’t chugging along without him. They are.

Hobo4President · Post #33 » by **Hobo4President** » Fri Mar 25, 2022 4:07 am

There are several players far more deserving to be in contention, outside the big 3 this year (Jokic, Giannis, Embiid) you have other guys who have been more impactful than him like Tatum, Luka, Steph, etc. Honestly Ja Might not make my list for top 10 most valuable players this year.

Crizzle · Post #34 » by **Crizzle** » Fri Mar 25, 2022 7:20 am

Im gonna tell you what the real story with the record issue is.

We were a below 500 team 18-20 games into the season. Our defense was hot **** garbage, WORST IN THE LEAGUE, and helped us pick up 9 or 10 quick L's, all of which Ja played in. Believe that they would have lost those with or without him. Then we sell our souls or something just as wild and become the most dominant defense basically overnight. All of a sudden we arent playing like the inexperienced kids we are and have an identity. Ja is not the MVP, but he is certainly in the field of 5 or so players that have an argument. Even with that said, hes the most exciting player to emerge since curry blasted off. And theres an argument hes more entertaining even than that. At 22 the kid is leading the best grizzlies team ever . Us fans are just riding the wave and trying to convince ourselves that this is reality . Someone pinch me

GSP · Post #35 » by **GSP** » Sun Mar 27, 2022 2:33 am

Read on Twitter

17-2........Just beat the Bucks and Nets b2b w/ Giannis, Khris, Kd and Kyrie all playing........at this point youd have to be a blockhead to deny what a juggernaut this team is without Ja

Wolfgang630 · Post #36 » by **Wolfgang630** » Sun Mar 27, 2022 2:54 am

GSP wrote:

Read on Twitter

17-2........Just beat the Bucks and Nets b2b w/ Giannis, Khris, Kd and Kyrie all playing........at this point youd have to be a blockhead to deny what a juggernaut this team is without Ja

I know. This is insane how good this team is. It’s like wtf did this come from. I saw their coach. I never seen the guy before, but he’s coach of the year hands down

Peregrine01 · Post #37 » by **Peregrine01** » Sun Mar 27, 2022 4:32 am

I think a ball-dominant guard who can’t really shoot isn’t as valuable as many think he is. Ja’s offense is a lot like OKC Westbrook’s.

jefe · Post #38 » by **jefe** » Sun Mar 27, 2022 5:07 am

This team is good without Ja - Bane should/will be an Allstar eventually, and JJJ should be DPOY. So long as they can front run on a team, they're good, but they need Ja to get a bucket in crunch time in a half court set. Bane may get there, but not yet. Ja is critical to this team.

Bank Shot · Post #39 » by **Bank Shot** » Sun Mar 27, 2022 5:09 am

He shouldn't get many votes. He's been awesome but he's a fringe top-5 guy at absolute best (I wouldn't have him that high) who is going to miss 25ish games. That is a ton of missed games.

_NoMas · Post #40 » by **_NoMas** » Sun Mar 27, 2022 9:10 am

Pennebaker wrote:
Jaivl wrote:Grizzlies' record is basically the only case favoring Morant for MVP as he's not close to the top 5 in the league, so absolutely yes.

But their record with Morant is still impressive. Even if you remove their 15-2 record without Morant, he would still be an MVP candidate with a .625 winning percentage.

A .625 win percentage (which is the Grizzlies 35-21 record with Morant) would have the Grizzlies as the #2 seed in the East and a top 5 record in the NBA overall.

The probken with this argument is you’d need to compare that grizzlies record with Ja to the other MVP candidates when they play:

Tatum (44-26) - .629
Luka (37-20) - .649
Jokic (42-26) - .618
Giannis (40-21) - .656
Embiid (41-19) - .683
Curry (45-19) - .703
Booker (52-11) - .825

All but one of the other MVP candidates has a better win rate, and they all have played more games then Ja. Hard to make any case for Ja to be a top 5 MVP candidate at this point.

Where do you have Morant in MVP voting?