how ahead of their peers era were 60's all time greats?

[dygaction]

Current Spurs team have not a single player as good as the ones we picked in project. Again, what makes you pick Spurs guards over Richie Guerin or Larry Costello? Can you name their weaknesses?

Do you want a specific year for them to be compared? BTW, I said no competitive team can be formed for their 3rd team all-nba from a specific year, you gave me players from a half decade span peaking at different years, and the years you quoted they were both 2nd team all-nba .

Alright, let's make a random team from 1964/65:

Larry Costello
Terry Dischinger
Chet Walker
Bailey Howell
Walt Bellamy

Adrian Smith
Tom Gola
Johnny Green
Rudy LaRusso
Zelmo Beaty

Would they be worse than non-playoff teams? For your delight, I didn't include Nate Thurmond or Lenny Wilkens who was included into 75 greatest players (even though neither made a single all-nba team). So realistically, this is not 3rd team, but it's good enough.

Strange how you need to twist every sentence to make it sounds more dramatic. I am using Spurs, a borderline playoff team instead of "non-playoff teams" to compare with your team and I am definitely picking Spurs. You should add Nate and Lenny in to make it competitive.

I will pick Spurs' Murray 21.3/8.3/9.3 with modern competition over your two guards combined. Because of the huge gap in pace, shooting efficiency, the difference in available rebounds each game (44.6rpg 2022 vs. 67.3rpg 1965) is gigantic. Murray would convert to 12.5rpg without even needing to play more minutes. He would be another triple double machine giving a run to Oscar. If he were to play 45 min like Big O did instead of 34mpg, we would be looking at another 30/10/10 player, and that numbers are projected to be modest. In a season Wilt averaging 34.7rpg, Larry Costello's 2.6rpg sounds like a starting guard now cannot pick up 1rpg.

You need to justify why your team can give the Spurs a run. What are they good at after adjusting for today's pace? You can put big names all star together but how are they going to make up the gap in spacing and shooting?

[70sFan]

Strange how you need to twist every sentence to make it sounds more dramatic. I am using Spurs, a borderline playoff team instead of "non-playoff teams" to compare with your team and I am definitely picking Spurs. You should add Nate and Lenny in to make it competitive.

They are 10th in the WC, the only reason why you call them "playoff team" is because of the ridiculous format created in last few years.

I will pick Spurs' Murray 21.3/8.3/9.3 with modern competition over your two guards combined. Because of the huge gap in pace, shooting efficiency, the difference in available rebounds each game (44.6rpg 2022 vs. 67.3rpg 1965) is gigantic. Murray would convert to 12.5rpg without even needing to play more minutes. He would be another triple double machine giving a run to Oscar. If he were to play 45 min like Big O did instead of 34mpg, we would be looking at another 30/10/10 player, and that numbers are projected to be modest. In a season Wilt averaging 34.7rpg, Larry Costello's 2.6rpg sounds like a starting guard now cannot pick up 1rpg.

1. If you have the slightest idea of how the game evolved, you'd know that three point shot increased perimeter players rebounding percentage. You can't adjust stats that way.

2. If you decided to pick Murray because of his rebounding rate, then it shows the level of your evaluation.

3. I'm not surprised that you focused on boxscore numbers, because you have no idea how 1960s players played.

You need to justify why your team can give the Spurs a run. What are they good at after adjusting for today's pace? You can put big names all star together but how are they going to make up the gap in spacing and shooting?

Well, for starters the idea that Spurs have some gigantic edge in shooting is questionable. Spurs are one of the worst three point shooting teams in the league. They have three decent shooters in the entire roster. Meanwhile my team has two excellent shooters in Larry Costello (who relied heavily on long range setshots and crafty layups, very modern-ish style of play) and Adrian Smith (your typical catch and shoot guy who could also create his shot off the dribble). Bailey Howell and Chet Walker were midrange scoring forwards and LaRusso was a stretch 4. Zelmo Beaty was also known for his shooting.

We don't know how good they would be at three point shooting, but I don't see any reason to doubt that Smith, Costello and LaRusso would be able to hit threes at strong level given some time to adjust. Walker and Howell should be fine with it as well.

Secondly, my team is full of strong defenders. Costello was a pesky, quick defender with a lot of experience. Gola was a shutdown defender with a size of forward. Dischinger was also big and long. Walker was a decent defender, Green was an athletic freak who was a defensive specialist. LaRusso was all-defensive level player in his prime and Beaty was very smart and quick defender at center. Bellamy wasn't elite defender, but he was big and athletic.

Thirdly, my team is full of players who could create his own shots, Spurs have very few such players.

Lastly, my bench is so much better that I won't even touch this, comparing any Spurs bench player to Zelmo Beaty or Rudy LaRusso is ridiculous.

You mentioned only Murray who is by far the best Spurs player. Can't wait to see you trying to convince anybody that Keldon Johnson is better than Chet Walker, or that Poeltl is better than Walt freaking Bellamy.

[dygaction]

Strange how you need to twist every sentence to make it sounds more dramatic. I am using Spurs, a borderline playoff team instead of "non-playoff teams" to compare with your team and I am definitely picking Spurs. You should add Nate and Lenny in to make it competitive.

They are 10th in the WC, the only reason why you call them "playoff team" is because of the ridiculous format created in last few years.

I will pick Spurs' Murray 21.3/8.3/9.3 with modern competition over your two guards combined. Because of the huge gap in pace, shooting efficiency, the difference in available rebounds each game (44.6rpg 2022 vs. 67.3rpg 1965) is gigantic. Murray would convert to 12.5rpg without even needing to play more minutes. He would be another triple double machine giving a run to Oscar. If he were to play 45 min like Big O did instead of 34mpg, we would be looking at another 30/10/10 player, and that numbers are projected to be modest. In a season Wilt averaging 34.7rpg, Larry Costello's 2.6rpg sounds like a starting guard now cannot pick up 1rpg.

1. If you have the slightest idea of how the game evolved, you'd know that three point shot increased perimeter players rebounding percentage. You can't adjust stats that way.

2. If you decided to pick Murray because of his rebounding rate, then it shows the level of your evaluation.

3. I'm not surprised that you focused on boxscore numbers, because you have no idea how 1960s players played.

You need to justify why your team can give the Spurs a run. What are they good at after adjusting for today's pace? You can put big names all star together but how are they going to make up the gap in spacing and shooting?

Well, for starters the idea that Spurs have some gigantic edge in shooting is questionable. Spurs are one of the worst three point shooting teams in the league. They have three decent shooters in the entire roster. Meanwhile my team has two excellent shooters in Larry Costello (who relied heavily on long range setshots and crafty layups, very modern-ish style of play) and Adrian Smith (your typical catch and shoot guy who could also create his shot off the dribble). Bailey Howell and Chet Walker were midrange scoring forwards and LaRusso was a stretch 4. Zelmo Beaty was also known for his shooting.

We don't know how good they would be at three point shooting, but I don't see any reason to doubt that Smith, Costello and LaRusso would be able to hit threes at strong level given some time to adjust. Walker and Howell should be fine with it as well.

Secondly, my team is full of strong defenders. Costello was a pesky, quick defender with a lot of experience. Gola was a shutdown defender with a size of forward. Dischinger was also big and long. Walker was a decent defender, Green was an athletic freak who was a defensive specialist. LaRusso was all-defensive level player in his prime and Beaty was very smart and quick defender at center. Bellamy wasn't elite defender, but he was big and athletic.

Thirdly, my team is full of players who could create his own shots, Spurs have very few such players.

Lastly, my bench is so much better that I won't even touch this, comparing any Spurs bench player to Zelmo Beaty or Rudy LaRusso is ridiculous.

You mentioned only Murray who is by far the best Spurs player. Can't wait to see you trying to convince anybody that Keldon Johnson is better than Chet Walker, or that Poeltl is better than Walt freaking Bellamy.

I guess you take your 65 team and I take my Spurs and we both feel happy about it.
Murray at 6'4 would be a physical freak among 60s guards. He is an elite rebounder even in today's standard. Can you imagine 7'1 245lb how Poeltl would dominate defensive and offensive rebounding? Cannot see how he could not average 20rpg.

[70sFan]

I guess you take your 65 team and I take my Spurs and we both feel happy about it.
Murray at 6'4 would be a physical freak among 60s guards. He is an elite rebounder even in today's standard. Can you imagine 7'1 245lb how Poeltl would dominate defensive and offensive rebounding? Cannot see how he could not average 20rpg.

You really think 6'4 guards didn't exist in that era? I literally picked two taller guards than Murray.

Yes, I can imagine what 7'1 245 lbs center could do in 1965. Reggie Harding was that size and he averaged 12.0/11.6. Poeltl isn't even a good rebounder, I don't see any reason why he'd average 20 rpg in the league in which athletic freaks like Thurmond or Bellamy averaged less than that.

You have no idea what you're talking about. You don't know anything about these players outside of their basketball reference pages.

[penbeast0]

I'm going to close this thread as it has devolved into a personal shade throwing contest. Please be respectful of the opinions of others on this board, even if you completely and utterly disagree with them.