OT: Russia-Ukraine War

[HarthorneWingo]

I would just add that regardless of whether it's a midterm or general election, Democrats generally don't vote as often as Republicans. Correct me if I'm wrong, but if Democrats votes in equal percentages as Republicans, we'd be doing much better. I haven't checked the stats recently, but that's what I recall.

this is correct. minored in social sciences, with an emphasis in political science.

democrats outnumber republicans, (at least around 2005-2009 when i was in college), around 3:2.

there are a lot of crazy factors that play into when republicans end up winning any of the elections, including being as stupid as the weather playing a role.

Yet none of our past predicted so much of the GOP leadership being batchit crazy. I think the playbook of the GOP was well established and the alt right methods have been working hard at brainwashing the public for half a century, but the one thing we can't predict is how swing voters are going to behave now.

I'm more than ready to accept that most Americans have their party allegiances etched in stone and they don't care if their representatives are fascists, but since so many electoral contests are so close that element of disgust at the GOP may play into this next election.

That is hardly a vote of confidence for the Democrats, but it could play to their advantage.

What's a "swing voter" when one side thinks that the Democrats are involved in a pedophile ring?

[Clyde_Style]

this is correct. minored in social sciences, with an emphasis in political science.

democrats outnumber republicans, (at least around 2005-2009 when i was in college), around 3:2.

there are a lot of crazy factors that play into when republicans end up winning any of the elections, including being as stupid as the weather playing a role.

Yet none of our past predicted so much of the GOP leadership being batchit crazy. I think the playbook of the GOP was well established and the alt right methods have been working hard at brainwashing the public for half a century, but the one thing we can't predict is how swing voters are going to behave now.

I'm more than ready to accept that most Americans have their party allegiances etched in stone and they don't care if their representatives are fascists, but since so many electoral contests are so close that element of disgust at the GOP may play into this next election.

That is hardly a vote of confidence for the Democrats, but it could play to their advantage.

What's a "swing voter" when one side thinks that the Democrats are involved in a pedophile ring?

There's probably still at least a couple million people out there who don't do that nonsense who still vote Republican, perhaps more. The GOP's extremism and support of January 6th did cause hundreds of thousands of Republicans to switch parties a year ago. Well, not everyone goes to those lengths, but may be similarly disturbed by the anti-democratic tactics of their party.

I think this has been completely overlooked and not baked in. Of course, it can't be because it is wildly unpredictable, but the allegiance to Putin and the upcoming hearings means there will continue to be steady reminders of the fascist tendencies of the GOP.

I'm friendly with an 85 year old Korean war vet and ex-cop from Boston. He loved JFK, but he also voted Republican part of his life. And he is appalled by Jan. 6th. He votes.

[Pointgod]

The world is becoming more and more complicated every day.

Viktor Orban has just won re-election in Hungary. He will be speaking at CPAC, the largest American Conservative conference to be held in Budapest. Try to rap your heads around this, the Conservative Political Action Conference is being held in Hungary with Orban, no friend of democratic nations, a longtime supporter of Vladimir Putin, as the keynote speaker. Also, Hungary is a member of NATO so that could prove to be a challenge for the alliance going forward.

Marine Le Pen the far-right candidate in France is closing the gap with Emmanuel Macron ahead of the country's presidential election.

China and India, the two most populated countries in the world, are both unwilling to criticize Russia and take part in any sanctioning of said country.

Elon Musk buys 9.2% of twitter, joins the board. How long until Trump is reinstated?

Interesting times indeed.

J

There’s a common thread linking all of the people you named. None of those people you listed believe in Democracy. They don’t care about accountability, the rule of law, global cooperation, they all care about raw naked power and will gladly erode minority and human rights. There’s a reason they’ve all chosen to cozy up to Putin or remain silent. I wish voters would take their head out of their ass and vote pro democracy politicians.

[Pointgod]

things are getting in motion

just wait until winter when half of Europe is freezing their balls off. It will be x 10 worse.

Do you really think that the French will go along with cozying up to China and Russia, et al.? I find that difficult to imagine.

The world needs to get a away from fossil fuel now anyhow if you saw the recent UN Report on Climate Change. We're basically on the brink.

Not immediately. But yes. Just read some on Marine Le Pen and you will see.

This is a marathon.

The world needs to get a away from fossil fuel now anyhow if you saw the recent UN Report on Climate Change. We're basically on the brink.

"We need to get away from fossil fuel" shouldn't be some kind of silver-lining in all of this. People still need to stay warm inside their homes. And they still gotta pay for gas going to work.

USA doesn't have the power grid to do so. It will be the next recession if we try to force it.

I think the average cost of an EV is over 50 grand. People can't afford that right now.

What do people think is going to happen with leaders that cozy up to Russia? The stronger the dependence on fossil fuels, the more power Russia, Saudi etc will exert. You don’t think they’ll raise prices if they either want to coerce or punish countries?

[Pointgod]

I really do not get the fear mongering about the mid-terms. The economy is strong and growing amidst inflation which anyone sensible knows is the result of factors outside of Biden’s control (shutting down a sketchy pipeline project was not one of them).

Biden is doing well considering the razor thin margins he has had to cope with. There were inevitably going to be some failures with Manchin Enema.

He did a 180 degree better job on covid than Trump and made it possible for everyone to get their shots free and easy.

He has been rebuilding the judiciary at a record pace.

Even some of his haters have to be impressed by his response to Putin.

Infrastructure has been partially addressed after four years of blah blah blah

The prosecution of insurrectionists is going to set a whole new tone for the mid-terms too. Any remaining fence-sitting Republicans are going to feel ashamed over the incontrovertible facts of treason committed by their representatives.

I’m not predicting anything, but I think the Democrats have proven to be the clear alternative to the profiteering anarchy offered by the proto-fascist element of the GOP.

And we know that if people are paying their bills they will vote with their pocketbooks. That’s why I expect Biden to go hard on securing oil supply in the next 3-6 months even if it will probably undermine his climate change pledges.

History suggests that the President’s party always loses in the midterms. Look at the district level data and some of the elections as the district level, Republicans are winning in Democratic districts. Not all of the GOP candidates will be trash like Margie Green and Matt Gaetz. Some of them will run like normal candidates.

Biden is doing a good job, but the problem is that the majority of voters don’t care. They don’t understand nuance and they’ll blame whoever is in the Whitehouse for whatever problem they’re facing at the moment. Biden led the country out of a pandemic, he led the recovery to low unemployment, he invested billions into the country, but voters Democrats have done a horrible job selling themselves, exposing the Republicans as a global danger, and getting more wins on the books.

The fact that the Republicans weren’t able to gerrymander a majority may have stopped some bleeding but the midterms don’t paint a positive picture. Foreign policy has been a strong area for Democrats, but still then Americans don’t care, even though it’s directly tied into domestic and economic issues. There’s a direct throughline between Russia’s invasion of Ukraine and the Republican’s anti democratic and anti global community positions.

I would just add that regardless of whether it's a midterm or general election, Democrats generally don't vote as often as Republicans. Correct me if I'm wrong, but if Democrats votes in equal percentages as Republicans, we'd be doing much better. I haven't checked the stats recently, but that's what I recall.

I believe you’re right when it comes to the midterms, especially the Obama years. It’s just a well repeated political trend that the Party that’s out of power is more likely to show up in off year elections. For example if you looked at the Virginia elections for Governor, the Democratic candidate got more votes than the last Governor’s election, one where Democrats turned out but Republican turnout was also way up that it dwarfed Democratic turnout.

Also the Democratic candidate got less votes than Biden, so it was a combination of Republican turnout going up, but also drop off from Presidential votes for the Democratic candidate. The challenge is that how do Democrats sustain their turnout, but also not bleed those voters that are turned off by Trump but not necessarily the Republican Party.

[Stannis]

Do you really think that the French will go along with cozying up to China and Russia, et al.? I find that difficult to imagine.

The world needs to get a away from fossil fuel now anyhow if you saw the recent UN Report on Climate Change. We're basically on the brink.

Not immediately. But yes. Just read some on Marine Le Pen and you will see.

This is a marathon.

The world needs to get a away from fossil fuel now anyhow if you saw the recent UN Report on Climate Change. We're basically on the brink.

"We need to get away from fossil fuel" shouldn't be some kind of silver-lining in all of this. People still need to stay warm inside their homes. And they still gotta pay for gas going to work.

USA doesn't have the power grid to do so. It will be the next recession if we try to force it.

I think the average cost of an EV is over 50 grand. People can't afford that right now.

What do people think is going to happen with leaders that cozy up to Russia? The stronger the dependence on fossil fuels, the more power Russia, Saudi etc will exert. You don’t think they’ll raise prices if they either want to coerce or punish countries?

You really need to do some research on the subject. Russia is resource heavy beyond fossil fuels

Green energy isn't any cheaper. It's actually more expensive. And it's getting worse because Russia holds a lot of aluminum, copper, steel etc. That's why Tesla hiked the prices for their cars.

You can't expect the lower and middle class to go green. Especially families with children.

Closing our pipelines was a mistake. We weren't ready for it.

[HarthorneWingo]

Not immediately. But yes. Just read some on Marine Le Pen and you will see.

This is a marathon.


"We need to get away from fossil fuel" shouldn't be some kind of silver-lining in all of this. People still need to stay warm inside their homes. And they still gotta pay for gas going to work.

USA doesn't have the power grid to do so. It will be the next recession if we try to force it.

I think the average cost of an EV is over 50 grand. People can't afford that right now.

What do people think is going to happen with leaders that cozy up to Russia? The stronger the dependence on fossil fuels, the more power Russia, Saudi etc will exert. You don’t think they’ll raise prices if they either want to coerce or punish countries?

You really need to do some research on the subject. Russia is resource heavy beyond fossil fuels

Green energy isn't any cheaper. It's actually more expensive. And it's getting worse because Russia holds a lot of aluminum, copper, steel etc. That's why Tesla hiked the prices for their cars.

You can't expect the lower and middle class to go green. Especially families with children.

Closing our pipelines was a mistake. We weren't ready for it.

There are refining issues with our oil.

[thebuzzardman]

Yet none of our past predicted so much of the GOP leadership being batchit crazy. I think the playbook of the GOP was well established and the alt right methods have been working hard at brainwashing the public for half a century, but the one thing we can't predict is how swing voters are going to behave now.

I'm more than ready to accept that most Americans have their party allegiances etched in stone and they don't care if their representatives are fascists, but since so many electoral contests are so close that element of disgust at the GOP may play into this next election.

That is hardly a vote of confidence for the Democrats, but it could play to their advantage.

What's a "swing voter" when one side thinks that the Democrats are involved in a pedophile ring?

There's probably still at least a couple million people out there who don't do that nonsense who still vote Republican, perhaps more. The GOP's extremism and support of January 6th did cause hundreds of thousands of Republicans to switch parties a year ago. Well, not everyone goes to those lengths, but may be similarly disturbed by the anti-democratic tactics of their party.

I think this has been completely overlooked and not baked in. Of course, it can't be because it is wildly unpredictable, but the allegiance to Putin and the upcoming hearings means there will continue to be steady reminders of the fascist tendencies of the GOP.

I'm friendly with an 85 year old Korean war vet and ex-cop from Boston. He loved JFK, but he also voted Republican part of his life. And he is appalled by Jan. 6th. He votes.

My neighbor is a retired marine, absolutely conservative - in a normal way, and voted for Trump mainly out of hating Hilary and the prospect of change. He's not very religious, which may be important, as he now hates Trump and was absolutely disgusted by Jan 06th. He also takes special glee as former enlisted man in the marine major who basically threw his entire career and retirement in the dumpster for that pile of sh*t Trump. Quote "I have zero sympathy for that officer. F*ck that guy"

I have another long term friend, definitely got way more into their catholicism over the last 15 years, definitely a regular consumer of Fox news. Otherwise someone who I would have formerly described as a run of the mill conservative, slightly more right of center, but not much, definitely nursing the usual conservative cultural grudges how religion is "sh*t on" and "all the woke bs" and generally feeling screwed over by the elites (well, that seems accurate enough). Anyway, I had a normal conversation suddenly go off the rails talking about Jan 06th and Trump talking that BS about the stolen election. And the response was "Well, the election was stolen". My counter was "You know they lost 60 lawsuits right?" and to paraphrase, the response was "That was "THEM" rigging stuff". Of course, no solid definition of who "THEY" are, other than "the rich" and so on.

It was a disturbing reminder how batsh*t crazy stuff that used to circulate among John Birch Society folks has leeched into many mainstream conservative's thoughts.
And I knew and hung with some Birchers back in the day, so I'm pretty well informed with the thought processes.

[Pointgod]

Not immediately. But yes. Just read some on Marine Le Pen and you will see.

This is a marathon.


"We need to get away from fossil fuel" shouldn't be some kind of silver-lining in all of this. People still need to stay warm inside their homes. And they still gotta pay for gas going to work.

USA doesn't have the power grid to do so. It will be the next recession if we try to force it.

I think the average cost of an EV is over 50 grand. People can't afford that right now.

What do people think is going to happen with leaders that cozy up to Russia? The stronger the dependence on fossil fuels, the more power Russia, Saudi etc will exert. You don’t think they’ll raise prices if they either want to coerce or punish countries?

You really need to do some research on the subject. Russia is resource heavy beyond fossil fuels

Green energy isn't any cheaper. It's actually more expensive. And it's getting worse because Russia holds a lot of aluminum, copper, steel etc. That's why Tesla hiked the prices for their cars.

You can't expect the lower and middle class to go green. Especially families with children.

Closing our pipelines was a mistake. We weren't ready for it.

Green energy maybe be more expensive now, but like all new technologies it will get cheaper as it scales. How long has the world been putting off investments and making the switch to green energy citing costs? I’m not trying oversimplify the situation but if the world governments flipped a switch tomorrow, all the major energy companies and car companies would roll out a green energy strategy the next day. I’ve done consulting work for one and they had a green energy plan. There are oil companies just sitting on drilling rights because it’s more profitable for them to benefit from the high prices. I might be wrong, but the pipelines that were shut down would have exported oil, they weren’t for domestic consumption.

And the current high costs of green energy for consumers can be subsidized by the government. Literally stop all the oil company subsidies and give them back to people to encourage the use of green energy and products. The world can’t just look away from bad actors like Putin because of energy dependence, because other countries are taking notes. It won’t end with Ukraine, hell I’m sure Russia will definitely try to invade again in the future but other dictators and authoritarians are taking notes. But I guess it’s better to give power to people like Marine Lapen who are worst option in every conceivable way because lies are more comforting than the truth.

[aq_ua]

What do people think is going to happen with leaders that cozy up to Russia? The stronger the dependence on fossil fuels, the more power Russia, Saudi etc will exert. You don’t think they’ll raise prices if they either want to coerce or punish countries?

You really need to do some research on the subject. Russia is resource heavy beyond fossil fuels

Green energy isn't any cheaper. It's actually more expensive. And it's getting worse because Russia holds a lot of aluminum, copper, steel etc. That's why Tesla hiked the prices for their cars.

You can't expect the lower and middle class to go green. Especially families with children.

Closing our pipelines was a mistake. We weren't ready for it.

Green energy maybe be more expensive now, but like all new technologies it will get cheaper as it scales. How long has the world been putting off investments and making the switch to green energy citing costs? I’m not trying oversimplify the situation but if the world governments flipped a switch tomorrow, all the major energy companies and car companies would roll out a green energy strategy the next day. I’ve done consulting work for one and they had a green energy plan. There are oil companies just sitting on drilling rights because it’s more profitable for them to benefit from the high prices. I might be wrong, but the pipelines that were shut down would have exported oil, they weren’t for domestic consumption.

And the current high costs of green energy for consumers can be subsidized by the government. Literally stop all the oil company subsidies and give them back to people to encourage the use of green energy and products. The world can’t just look away from bad actors like Putin because of energy dependence, because other countries are taking notes. It won’t end with Ukraine, hell I’m sure Russia will definitely try to invade again in the future but other dictators and authoritarians are taking notes. But I guess it’s better to give power to people like Marine Lapen who are worst option in every conceivable way because lies are more comforting than the truth.

https://news.un.org/en/story/2021/08/1097572

Nuclear power is a low-carbon energy source that has avoided about 74Gt of CO2 emissions over this period, nearly two years’ worth of total global energy-related emissions, it noted.

Yet nuclear power currently provides 20 per cent of electricity generated in the UNECE region and 43 per cent of low-carbon generation.

It's not a popular one by any means, but the math suggests a green energy strategy requires another look. The energy cost savings in this environment with super high fossil fuel prices alone would be substantial.

[HarthorneWingo]

You really need to do some research on the subject. Russia is resource heavy beyond fossil fuels

Green energy isn't any cheaper. It's actually more expensive. And it's getting worse because Russia holds a lot of aluminum, copper, steel etc. That's why Tesla hiked the prices for their cars.

You can't expect the lower and middle class to go green. Especially families with children.

Closing our pipelines was a mistake. We weren't ready for it.

Green energy maybe be more expensive now, but like all new technologies it will get cheaper as it scales. How long has the world been putting off investments and making the switch to green energy citing costs? I’m not trying oversimplify the situation but if the world governments flipped a switch tomorrow, all the major energy companies and car companies would roll out a green energy strategy the next day. I’ve done consulting work for one and they had a green energy plan. There are oil companies just sitting on drilling rights because it’s more profitable for them to benefit from the high prices. I might be wrong, but the pipelines that were shut down would have exported oil, they weren’t for domestic consumption.

And the current high costs of green energy for consumers can be subsidized by the government. Literally stop all the oil company subsidies and give them back to people to encourage the use of green energy and products. The world can’t just look away from bad actors like Putin because of energy dependence, because other countries are taking notes. It won’t end with Ukraine, hell I’m sure Russia will definitely try to invade again in the future but other dictators and authoritarians are taking notes. But I guess it’s better to give power to people like Marine Lapen who are worst option in every conceivable way because lies are more comforting than the truth.

https://news.un.org/en/story/2021/08/1097572

Nuclear power is a low-carbon energy source that has avoided about 74Gt of CO2 emissions over this period, nearly two years’ worth of total global energy-related emissions, it noted.

Yet nuclear power currently provides 20 per cent of electricity generated in the UNECE region and 43 per cent of low-carbon generation.

It's not a popular one by any means, but the math suggests a green energy strategy requires another look. The energy cost savings in this environment with super high fossil fuel prices alone would be substantial.

I don't know the ins and outs of this. On a rudimentary level, it would seem to make sense as a transitional energy source though we still have no handle, as I understand it, on nuclear waste. I wouldn't be against it so long as it was part of a detailed plan to transition over to green energy within a specific timeline.

[aq_ua]

Green energy maybe be more expensive now, but like all new technologies it will get cheaper as it scales. How long has the world been putting off investments and making the switch to green energy citing costs? I’m not trying oversimplify the situation but if the world governments flipped a switch tomorrow, all the major energy companies and car companies would roll out a green energy strategy the next day. I’ve done consulting work for one and they had a green energy plan. There are oil companies just sitting on drilling rights because it’s more profitable for them to benefit from the high prices. I might be wrong, but the pipelines that were shut down would have exported oil, they weren’t for domestic consumption.

And the current high costs of green energy for consumers can be subsidized by the government. Literally stop all the oil company subsidies and give them back to people to encourage the use of green energy and products. The world can’t just look away from bad actors like Putin because of energy dependence, because other countries are taking notes. It won’t end with Ukraine, hell I’m sure Russia will definitely try to invade again in the future but other dictators and authoritarians are taking notes. But I guess it’s better to give power to people like Marine Lapen who are worst option in every conceivable way because lies are more comforting than the truth.

https://news.un.org/en/story/2021/08/1097572

Nuclear power is a low-carbon energy source that has avoided about 74Gt of CO2 emissions over this period, nearly two years’ worth of total global energy-related emissions, it noted.

Yet nuclear power currently provides 20 per cent of electricity generated in the UNECE region and 43 per cent of low-carbon generation.

It's not a popular one by any means, but the math suggests a green energy strategy requires another look. The energy cost savings in this environment with super high fossil fuel prices alone would be substantial.

I don't know the ins and outs of this. On a rudimentary level, it would seem to make sense as a transitional energy source though we still have no handle, as I understand it, on nuclear waste. I wouldn't be against it so long as it was part of a detailed plan to transition over to green energy within a specific timeline.

Neither do I - but the work being done by Gates/TerraPower is quite interesting.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/bill-gates-terrapower-wins-8-193839059.html

Among other things, TerraPower’s method would harness the volatility of chloride salts at high temperatures during a key step in the uranium recovery process. Work would begin with surrogate nuclear fuel, and progress to a demonstration with actual oxide-based fuel.

If the method works as expected, the amount of nuclear waste going to repositories could be reduced by a factor of 10 or more, TerraPower says.

In addition to working on the reactor concept, TerraPower has a program that focuses on medical applications of nuclear technology — applications that could make use of spent nuclear fuel.

[Stannis]

Green energy maybe be more expensive now, but like all new technologies it will get cheaper as it scales. How long has the world been putting off investments and making the switch to green energy citing costs? I’m not trying oversimplify the situation but if the world governments flipped a switch tomorrow, all the major energy companies and car companies would roll out a green energy strategy the next day. I’ve done consulting work for one and they had a green energy plan. There are oil companies just sitting on drilling rights because it’s more profitable for them to benefit from the high prices. I might be wrong, but the pipelines that were shut down would have exported oil, they weren’t for domestic consumption.

And the current high costs of green energy for consumers can be subsidized by the government. Literally stop all the oil company subsidies and give them back to people to encourage the use of green energy and products. The world can’t just look away from bad actors like Putin because of energy dependence, because other countries are taking notes. It won’t end with Ukraine, hell I’m sure Russia will definitely try to invade again in the future but other dictators and authoritarians are taking notes. But I guess it’s better to give power to people like Marine Lapen who are worst option in every conceivable way because lies are more comforting than the truth.

I really don't think that is true. Solar and Wind has a lot of maintenance on top of the installation costs. That's actually how most of these solar companies and wind companies make their money. Hydrogen is still in the early stages.

Now is not the time to play around with ideas. Most of these companies aren't even profitable. Lot of solar is dependent on China. Interest rates are going up. And inflation is hitting families.

I used to invest in a lot of these companies, but they all burn cash. And everything is still in the early stages. Not much product going out. All ideas and promises. So I sold out. Gave up on them. So I definitely don't see a reason why the government would invest anything in them.

Let's be real for a second, we had over a decade to make strides in renewable energy. But 2010 and onward was a shale boom. War is at our doorstep imo. Now they want everyone to buy an EV???

The articles Aqua posted are very interesting and the USA needs to revisit Nuclear power. It's the clear solution, imho. And would actually make a big difference as far as carbon emissions go.

[Clyde_Style]

Green energy maybe be more expensive now, but like all new technologies it will get cheaper as it scales. How long has the world been putting off investments and making the switch to green energy citing costs? I’m not trying oversimplify the situation but if the world governments flipped a switch tomorrow, all the major energy companies and car companies would roll out a green energy strategy the next day. I’ve done consulting work for one and they had a green energy plan. There are oil companies just sitting on drilling rights because it’s more profitable for them to benefit from the high prices. I might be wrong, but the pipelines that were shut down would have exported oil, they weren’t for domestic consumption.

And the current high costs of green energy for consumers can be subsidized by the government. Literally stop all the oil company subsidies and give them back to people to encourage the use of green energy and products. The world can’t just look away from bad actors like Putin because of energy dependence, because other countries are taking notes. It won’t end with Ukraine, hell I’m sure Russia will definitely try to invade again in the future but other dictators and authoritarians are taking notes. But I guess it’s better to give power to people like Marine Lapen who are worst option in every conceivable way because lies are more comforting than the truth.

I really don't think that is true. Solar and Wind has a lot of maintenance on top of the installation costs. That's actually how most of these solar companies and wind companies make their money. Hydrogen is still in the early stages.

Now is not the time to play around with ideas. Most of these companies aren't even profitable. Lot of solar is dependent on China. Interest rates are going up. And inflation is hitting families.

I used to invest in a lot of these companies, but they all burn cash. And everything is still in the early stages. Not much product going out. All ideas and promises. So I sold out. Gave up on them. So I definitely don't see a reason why the government would invest anything in them.

Let's be real for a second, we had over a decode to make strides in renewable energy. But 2010 and onward was a shale boom. War is at our doorstep imo. Now they want everyone to buy an EV???

The articles Aqua posted are very interesting and the USA needs to revisit Nuclear power. It's the clear solution, imho. And would actually make a big difference as far as carbon emissions go.

Nuclear is going to make a comeback

From a holistic perspective, Gaia can handle a few nuclear plant accidents better than the carbon overload this planet has to bear now

Humans can learn to better protect themselves from future accidents and make nuclear a viable option

There will have to be airtight safeguards against hackers to prevent industrial sabotage

[Knickfan1982]

Not immediately. But yes. Just read some on Marine Le Pen and you will see.

This is a marathon.


"We need to get away from fossil fuel" shouldn't be some kind of silver-lining in all of this. People still need to stay warm inside their homes. And they still gotta pay for gas going to work.

USA doesn't have the power grid to do so. It will be the next recession if we try to force it.

I think the average cost of an EV is over 50 grand. People can't afford that right now.

What do people think is going to happen with leaders that cozy up to Russia? The stronger the dependence on fossil fuels, the more power Russia, Saudi etc will exert. You don’t think they’ll raise prices if they either want to coerce or punish countries?

You really need to do some research on the subject. Russia is resource heavy beyond fossil fuels

Green energy isn't any cheaper. It's actually more expensive. And it's getting worse because Russia holds a lot of aluminum, copper, steel etc. That's why Tesla hiked the prices for their cars.

You can't expect the lower and middle class to go green. Especially families with children.

Closing our pipelines was a mistake. We weren't ready for it.

The problem wasn't closing our pipelines its been dragging our feet on efficiency. This is everyone on both sides of the aisle and the American people as well. Every time a Republican President gets into office they reverse any fuel economy mandates a Democratic President creates with executive action. Democrats don't want to piss any voters off or poison the well with big business so they don't really put any teeth in any laws or executive orders they create. American people don't want to change zoning laws so that more multi-family homes and apartment buildings can be built in their neighborhoods to protect their investments in the homes. Now with urban sprawl people have to drive everywhere to get to work in a lot of places. And Americans love to drive around in their big pickup trucks and SUVs even if they aren't contractors or doing anything that justifies such a big vehicle. Then gas prices go through the roof and they scream poverty. Play stupid games win stupid prizes.

[Knickfan1982]

I really don't think that is true. Solar and Wind has a lot of maintenance on top of the installation costs. That's actually how most of these solar companies and wind companies make their money. Hydrogen is still in the early stages.

Now is not the time to play around with ideas. Most of these companies aren't even profitable. Lot of solar is dependent on China. Interest rates are going up. And inflation is hitting families.

I used to invest in a lot of these companies, but they all burn cash. And everything is still in the early stages. Not much product going out. All ideas and promises. So I sold out. Gave up on them. So I definitely don't see a reason why the government would invest anything in them.

Let's be real for a second, we had over a decade to make strides in renewable energy. But 2010 and onward was a shale boom. War is at our doorstep imo. Now they want everyone to buy an EV???

The articles Aqua posted are very interesting and the USA needs to revisit Nuclear power. It's the clear solution, imho. And would actually make a big difference as far as carbon emissions go.

Many of these so called shale boom companies are unprofitable and out of business as well. The Shale Boom was fool's gold anyway. It irritates me that everyone was talking about this new fuel source as if we didn't know it was there for decades. It just wasn't economical to up until fairly recently.

[url]
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-shale-bankruptcy-graphic/u-s-oil-producers-on-pace-for-most-bankruptcies-since-last-oil-downturn-idUSKBN26M7EM[/url]

Thirty-six producers with $51 billion in debt filed for bankruptcy protection in the first eight months of the year, according to the law firm Haynes and Boone. The coronavirus pandemic crushed fuel demand and left debt-laden producers without access to credit.The number of companies filing still lags 2016, when 70 companies filed for bankruptcy. However, those firms were generally smaller and left a total of $56 billion in debt.

The United States grew to become the world’s largest oil producer at nearly 13 million barrels per day (bpd), led by shale companies. However, those companies, in order to maintain high levels of production, need to keep drilling new wells to offset the swift decline rates from each site. Many shale producers took on heavy debt to finance their operations.Despite the industry’s growth, investor returns have been weak for years, and share prices struggled even as the broader Standard & Poor’s 500 stock index set ever-higher records.

The coronavirus pandemic caused fuel demand to slump by one-third globally, and U.S. prices briefly plunged through negative-$40 a barrel. Prices have recovered to roughly $40 but that is still not considered high enough to keep many companies afloat.

In the first three quarters of 2019, there were 33 producer bankruptcies, and 22 in the same period in 2018.

There were more U.S. crude producer bankruptcies in the second quarter than in any period since 2016, and without a continued recovery in the oil price, more are expected, said Chris Duncan, research analyst at Brandes Investment Partners, which has $18 billion in assets under management.

In addition to oil producers filing for bankruptcy protection, 37 oilfield service companies have also filed, the Haynes and Boone said.

We should have been getting people to buy EVs and hybrids for a long time. Non-hybrid or EV vehicles shouldn't even be made anymore.

[Jethrobodine123]

What's a "swing voter" when one side thinks that the Democrats are involved in a pedophile ring?

There's probably still at least a couple million people out there who don't do that nonsense who still vote Republican, perhaps more. The GOP's extremism and support of January 6th did cause hundreds of thousands of Republicans to switch parties a year ago. Well, not everyone goes to those lengths, but may be similarly disturbed by the anti-democratic tactics of their party.

I think this has been completely overlooked and not baked in. Of course, it can't be because it is wildly unpredictable, but the allegiance to Putin and the upcoming hearings means there will continue to be steady reminders of the fascist tendencies of the GOP.

I'm friendly with an 85 year old Korean war vet and ex-cop from Boston. He loved JFK, but he also voted Republican part of his life. And he is appalled by Jan. 6th. He votes.

My neighbor is a retired marine, absolutely conservative - in a normal way, and voted for Trump mainly out of hating Hilary and the prospect of change. He's not very religious, which may be important, as he now hates Trump and was absolutely disgusted by Jan 06th. He also takes special glee as former enlisted man in the marine major who basically threw his entire career and retirement in the dumpster for that pile of sh*t Trump. Quote "I have zero sympathy for that officer. F*ck that guy"

I have another long term friend, definitely got way more into their catholicism over the last 15 years, definitely a regular consumer of Fox news. Otherwise someone who I would have formerly described as a run of the mill conservative, slightly more right of center, but not much, definitely nursing the usual conservative cultural grudges how religion is "sh*t on" and "all the woke bs" and generally feeling screwed over by the elites (well, that seems accurate enough). Anyway, I had a normal conversation suddenly go off the rails talking about Jan 06th and Trump talking that BS about the stolen election. And the response was "Well, the election was stolen". My counter was "You know they lost 60 lawsuits right?" and to paraphrase, the response was "That was "THEM" rigging stuff". Of course, no solid definition of who "THEY" are, other than "the rich" and so on.

It was a disturbing reminder how batsh*t crazy stuff that used to circulate among John Birch Society folks has leeched into many mainstream conservative's thoughts.
And I knew and hung with some Birchers back in the day, so I'm pretty well informed with the thought processes.

On one hand I can sympathize with some of these people, they just don't have a chance, too much money and influence lined up against them for it to be a fair fight. They consume so much right wing media that they begin to believe the lies, especially when it's the only information they get, they have no chance, none. If you put aside the racists, the truly mentally challenged, and that makes up for quite a large segment unfortunately, the other ones who believe the lies and favour the Republicans for the most part are voting against their own self interest. It's very sad to see this going on, the "them" "the elites" who are rigging everything and controlling their lives are the unbelievably wealthy minority whom they have absolutely nothing in common with and I do mean nothing. I've always said that it's far too easy to distract the average Joe away from the real important issues that affect their lives. So they're essentially being used as pawns by the .01% who's goal is to get even more political power so that they can avoid paying taxes, end all regulations and all accountability. It gets even worse, they are so ruthless and relentless that they are willing to bring down democracy to achieve their goals. It's all heading the wrong way and I can't for the life of me see how we turn it around.

J

[Jethrobodine123]

The media and thus the public are slowly beginning to lose interest in the war, you can see it on a daily basis when watching the major media outlets. It was inevitable, as the longer it goes on, people tend to move on. I feel sorry for the Ukrainians who will be fighting this brutal battle by themselves. Sure, they will receive some assistance from other countries but for the most part, they will have to defeat the Russians by themselves and I'm beginning to believe that the only way this war will end is for the Ukrainians to win it outright.

J

[HarthorneWingo]

There's probably still at least a couple million people out there who don't do that nonsense who still vote Republican, perhaps more. The GOP's extremism and support of January 6th did cause hundreds of thousands of Republicans to switch parties a year ago. Well, not everyone goes to those lengths, but may be similarly disturbed by the anti-democratic tactics of their party.

I think this has been completely overlooked and not baked in. Of course, it can't be because it is wildly unpredictable, but the allegiance to Putin and the upcoming hearings means there will continue to be steady reminders of the fascist tendencies of the GOP.

I'm friendly with an 85 year old Korean war vet and ex-cop from Boston. He loved JFK, but he also voted Republican part of his life. And he is appalled by Jan. 6th. He votes.

My neighbor is a retired marine, absolutely conservative - in a normal way, and voted for Trump mainly out of hating Hilary and the prospect of change. He's not very religious, which may be important, as he now hates Trump and was absolutely disgusted by Jan 06th. He also takes special glee as former enlisted man in the marine major who basically threw his entire career and retirement in the dumpster for that pile of sh*t Trump. Quote "I have zero sympathy for that officer. F*ck that guy"

I have another long term friend, definitely got way more into their catholicism over the last 15 years, definitely a regular consumer of Fox news. Otherwise someone who I would have formerly described as a run of the mill conservative, slightly more right of center, but not much, definitely nursing the usual conservative cultural grudges how religion is "sh*t on" and "all the woke bs" and generally feeling screwed over by the elites (well, that seems accurate enough). Anyway, I had a normal conversation suddenly go off the rails talking about Jan 06th and Trump talking that BS about the stolen election. And the response was "Well, the election was stolen". My counter was "You know they lost 60 lawsuits right?" and to paraphrase, the response was "That was "THEM" rigging stuff". Of course, no solid definition of who "THEY" are, other than "the rich" and so on.

It was a disturbing reminder how batsh*t crazy stuff that used to circulate among John Birch Society folks has leeched into many mainstream conservative's thoughts.
And I knew and hung with some Birchers back in the day, so I'm pretty well informed with the thought processes.

On one hand I can sympathize with some of these people, they just don't have a chance, too much money and influence lined up against them for it to be a fair fight. They consume so much right wing media that they begin to believe the lies, especially when it's the only information they get, they have no chance, none. If you put aside the racists, the truly mentally challenged, and that makes up for quite a large segment unfortunately, the other ones who believe the lies and favour the Republicans for the most part are voting against their own self interest. It's very sad to see this going on, the "them" "the elites" who are rigging everything and controlling their lives are the unbelievably wealthy minority whom they have absolutely nothing in common with and I do mean nothing. I've always said that it's far too easy to distract the average Joe away from the real important issues that affect their lives. So they're essentially being used as pawns by the .01% who's goal is to get even more political power so that they can avoid paying taxes, end all regulations and all accountability. It gets even worse, they are so ruthless and relentless that they are willing to bring down democracy to achieve their goals. It's all heading the wrong way and I can't for the life of me see how we turn it around.

J

The right has successfully used social/religious wedge issues on them. Now that it looks like Roe will be overturned this session, they’ve finally delivered for them. What’s next?

[thebuzzardman]

My neighbor is a retired marine, absolutely conservative - in a normal way, and voted for Trump mainly out of hating Hilary and the prospect of change. He's not very religious, which may be important, as he now hates Trump and was absolutely disgusted by Jan 06th. He also takes special glee as former enlisted man in the marine major who basically threw his entire career and retirement in the dumpster for that pile of sh*t Trump. Quote "I have zero sympathy for that officer. F*ck that guy"

I have another long term friend, definitely got way more into their catholicism over the last 15 years, definitely a regular consumer of Fox news. Otherwise someone who I would have formerly described as a run of the mill conservative, slightly more right of center, but not much, definitely nursing the usual conservative cultural grudges how religion is "sh*t on" and "all the woke bs" and generally feeling screwed over by the elites (well, that seems accurate enough). Anyway, I had a normal conversation suddenly go off the rails talking about Jan 06th and Trump talking that BS about the stolen election. And the response was "Well, the election was stolen". My counter was "You know they lost 60 lawsuits right?" and to paraphrase, the response was "That was "THEM" rigging stuff". Of course, no solid definition of who "THEY" are, other than "the rich" and so on.

It was a disturbing reminder how batsh*t crazy stuff that used to circulate among John Birch Society folks has leeched into many mainstream conservative's thoughts.
And I knew and hung with some Birchers back in the day, so I'm pretty well informed with the thought processes.

On one hand I can sympathize with some of these people, they just don't have a chance, too much money and influence lined up against them for it to be a fair fight. They consume so much right wing media that they begin to believe the lies, especially when it's the only information they get, they have no chance, none. If you put aside the racists, the truly mentally challenged, and that makes up for quite a large segment unfortunately, the other ones who believe the lies and favour the Republicans for the most part are voting against their own self interest. It's very sad to see this going on, the "them" "the elites" who are rigging everything and controlling their lives are the unbelievably wealthy minority whom they have absolutely nothing in common with and I do mean nothing. I've always said that it's far too easy to distract the average Joe away from the real important issues that affect their lives. So they're essentially being used as pawns by the .01% who's goal is to get even more political power so that they can avoid paying taxes, end all regulations and all accountability. It gets even worse, they are so ruthless and relentless that they are willing to bring down democracy to achieve their goals. It's all heading the wrong way and I can't for the life of me see how we turn it around.

J

The right has successfully used social/religious wedge issues on them. Now that it looks like Roe will be overturned this session, they’ve finally delivered for them. What’s next?

https://onwardtexas.org/trending/is-it-illegal-to-own-more-than-six-dildos-in-texas-yes-it-is/