2023 NBA Draft

[Big J]

Can we start calling Wenbanyama “The Yammer”?

[GreatWhiteStiff]

Hot take? - I think current bigs are more talented than the 90s.

not a super hot take, I kinda agree

Joel Embiid
Nikola Jokic
Karl-Anthony Towns
Anthony Davis
Evan Mobley
Bam Adebayo
Deandre Ayton
Rudy Gobert

you got a bunch of other bigs like Jaren Jackson, Kristaps Porzingis, Jarrett Allen, Jonathan Isaac, Clint Capela, etc.

and you got Chet and Yama coming up

dont think we've seen this many bigs in the league in a long time?

You forgot Precious Achiuwa

[crows2]

I've only started following prospects in this class and I know he has been mentioned in this thread already, but can anyone explain how the hell Brandon Miller is only ranked at #18 on ESPN?

Dude looks like he was made in a modern NBA basketball lab. Tall and long wing/combo forward with shot blocking instincts who initiates offense with impressive handles, really good passing skills (both hands!), composure under pressure, a very promising shot (just needs to create more separation) and the attitude of a go-to scorer. Some of the stuff he does is seriously impressive for someone his size.

Him having to fill out, work on his shot selection and sometimes run the floor harder is really not an issue at all at this point unless there are some broader attitude concerns. But just in terms of overall profile, it hardly gets anymore exciting than that (based on what I have seen from him).

edit: In an ideal world his first step would perhaps be a tad more explosive but that's really criticism at the highest level.

Agreed. I’m super intrigued by his tools after watching him in the McDonald’s scrimmage. His potential really stood out. On the other hand, he could certainly flame out so I assume people are hedging their bets until they see him in college. I’d easily have him in the top 10 right now.

[NYPiston]

Hot take? - I think current bigs are more talented than the 90s.

Yeah, that's pretty hot. I think you forget how insanely talented Shaq (in his early years especially), Hakeem and Robinson were. Sabonis was basically the Jokic of that era. The difference with bigs nowadays is being able to hit the 3 but those 90s guys weren't exactly big oafs that were lumbering down the court and just brutalizing guys with physicality and no skill. Shaq became that later on but early in his career, he was flying up and down the court like a guard.

[eminence]

Hot take? - I think current bigs are more talented than the 90s.

Yeah, that's pretty hot. I think you forget how insanely talented Shaq (in his early years especially), Hakeem and Robinson were. Sabonis was basically the Jokic of that era. The difference with bigs nowadays is being able to hit the 3 but those 90s guys weren't exactly big oafs that were lumbering down the court and just brutalizing guys with physicality and no skill. Shaw became that later on but early in his career, he was flying up and down the court like a guard.

We talking the hypothetical Sabonis we never saw in the NBA? I'll buy a bit of that, real NBA Sabonis, nah, and not even close to Joker. Hell, his son is probably better than he was in the NBA, though not particularly similar as players due to the significant size difference.

[NYPiston]

We talking the hypothetical Sabonis we never saw in the NBA? I'll buy a bit of that, real NBA Sabonis, nah, and not even close to Joker. Hell, his son is probably better than he was in the NBA, though not particularly similar as players due to the significant size difference.

Yeah, I mean pre-NBA Sabonis. He was one of the most talented bigs that ever played, he revolutionized the position actually.

[clyde21]

Hot take? - I think current bigs are more talented than the 90s.

Yeah, that's pretty hot. I think you forget how insanely talented Shaq (in his early years especially), Hakeem and Robinson were. Sabonis was basically the Jokic of that era. The difference with bigs nowadays is being able to hit the 3 but those 90s guys weren't exactly big oafs that were lumbering down the court and just brutalizing guys with physicality and no skill. Shaq became that later on but early in his career, he was flying up and down the court like a guard.

no one is forgetting those guys - obv Hakeem/Shaq were incredible, Robinson, Ewing, Dikembe. not sure why you're including Sabonis tho.

today is still better overall top to bottom, deeper and a much more diversified in terms of skill sets and archetypes.

i didn't even put Giannis on the list either and he's like a modern day Wilt at this point out there.


Joel Embiid
Giannis Antetokounmpo
Nikola Jovic
Karl-Anthony Towns
Anthony Davis
Rudy Gobert
Deandre Ayton
Evan Mobley
Bam Adebayo
Jarrett Allen
Kristaps Porzingis

and guys like Chet Holmgren and Victor Wembanyama coming up too these next couple of years, and there is like a dozen more guys I didn't even list (Nikola V, Jonas V, Drummond, Isaac, JJJ, Siakam, etc.)

very tough to convince me bigs were better than what we currently have from top to bottom at any point in the NBA ever.

[clyde21]

obviously a lot of it is due to the greatest collection of international players we've ever seen at this point in the NBA, especially the bigs.

[Big J]

Hot take? - I think current bigs are more talented than the 90s.

Yeah, that's pretty hot. I think you forget how insanely talented Shaq (in his early years especially), Hakeem and Robinson were. Sabonis was basically the Jokic of that era. The difference with bigs nowadays is being able to hit the 3 but those 90s guys weren't exactly big oafs that were lumbering down the court and just brutalizing guys with physicality and no skill. Shaq became that later on but early in his career, he was flying up and down the court like a guard.

no one is forgetting those guys - obv Hakeem/Shaq were incredible, Robinson, Ewing, Dikembe. not sure why you're including Sabonis tho.

today is still better overall top to bottom, deeper and a much more diversified in terms of skill sets and archetypes.

i didn't even put Giannis on the list either and he's like a modern day Wilt at this point out there.


Joel Embiid
Giannis Antetokounmpo
Nikola Jovic
Karl-Anthony Towns
Anthony Davis
Rudy Gobert
Deandre Ayton
Evan Mobley
Bam Adebayo
Jarrett Allen
Kristaps Porzingis

and guys like Chet Holmgren and Victor Wembanyama coming up too these next couple of years, and there is like a dozen more guys I didn't even list (Nikola V, Jonas V, Drummond, Isaac, JJJ, Siakam, etc.)

very tough to convince me bigs were better than what we currently have from top to bottom at any point in the NBA ever.

Giannis is no where close to being Wilt. Wilt freaking dominated the league for years and set numerous untouchable records. Giannis is not doing that.

[Duke4life831]

So where do others have Dariq Whitehead compared to previous 2 guards that we have seen

Ivey
Green
Edwards
Sharpe

Not going to lie, the more I watch him the higher and higher I have him. I'm starting to think he's going to be in the special category this time next year.

With the constant growth with that jumper, is getting harder and harder to find any major flaws with his game. And it's not like there is anything about him physically that is going to lower his ceiling.

[The-Power]

Another player I really like after watching some of his games is Dillon Mitchell. Reminds me of Kendall Brown (similar size, excellent athlete, not ball-dominant, solid passer, rudimentary shot) except that Mitchell actually uses his athleticism to rebound at a high level and block shots.

I also have the impression that Felix Okpara is underrated. Excellent rim protector and post-defender, and it feels like he could add the necessary skills to his game in time.

Generally speaking, I like this class more than the last one at first glance. Not sure if there are many offensive anchors in this class, but there are many good athletes with size and defensive versatility. I think this could be a really good class for impactful defensive players in the modern NBA mold.

[The-Power]

Giannis is no where close to being Wilt. Wilt freaking dominated the league for years and set numerous untouchable records. Giannis is not doing that.

Very different game, vastly different talent pool. Adjusted for pace and minutes, Giannis actually compares favorable to Wilt. But if records and raw numbers are your criteria, I suppose you have Wilt as the undisputed GOAT and Oscar Robertson right up there, too?

[clyde21]

So where do others have Dariq Whiteside compared to previous 2 guards that we have seen

Ivey
Green
Edwards
Sharpe

Not going to lie, the more I watch him the higher and higher I have him. I'm starting to think he's going to be in the special category this time next year.

With the constant growth with that jumper, is getting harder and harder to find any major flaws with his game. And it's not like there is anything about him physically that is going to lower his ceiling.

yea, big on DWH.

[reanimator]

Another player I really like after watching some of his games is Dillon Mitchell. Reminds me of Kendall Brown (similar size, excellent athlete, not ball-dominant, solid passer, rudimentary shot) except that Mitchell actually uses his athleticism to rebound at a high level and block shots.

Good call. Reminded me of a mini Ben Simmons when I saw him at a few EYBL sessions. Also like his teammate Emmanuel Sharpe if he can get in shape.

[The-Power]

Another player I really like after watching some of his games is Dillon Mitchell. Reminds me of Kendall Brown (similar size, excellent athlete, not ball-dominant, solid passer, rudimentary shot) except that Mitchell actually uses his athleticism to rebound at a high level and block shots.

Good call. Reminded me of a mini Ben Simmons when I saw him at a few EYBL sessions. Also like his teammate Emmanuel Sharpe if he can get in shape.

I'll have to check out EYBL tape if it's available. For Montverde he was pretty much in an off ball role. He flashed some passing instincts but more as a connector and not an on-ball creator, and he hardly handled the ball in general.

[Big J]

Giannis is no where close to being Wilt. Wilt freaking dominated the league for years and set numerous untouchable records. Giannis is not doing that.

Very different game, vastly different talent pool. Adjusted for pace and minutes, Giannis actually compares favorable to Wilt. But if records and raw numbers are your criteria, I suppose you have Wilt as the undisputed GOAT and Oscar Robertson right up there, too?

Nah, more of a legacy thing bro. You Gen Z people always think the thing happening today is the greatest thing the league has seen. Give it 20 years after he retires and people won’t be referring back to Giannis as this larger than life figure like they are Wilt. He just doesn’t dominate the game to the extent that wilt did.

[The-Power]

tentative prelim top 5ish

Victor Wembanyama
Scoot Henderson
Dariq Whitehead
Keyontae George
Anthony Black
Brandon Miller
Nick Smith Jr.

really liking the class overall, won't be as good as 21 but clearly ahead of 22 imo.

Have to see a bit more but I'd add Jarace Walker to this list. If he can defend in space (hard to fully grasp that at the HS level) then that's a pretty special package on both ends. Not completely sold on any of the scoring Guards yet, I'm not sure how they will translate. I have the highest hopes for Scoot, though. But these guys are certainly more intriguing than last year's Guards. Also, where are you on Jaden Bradley?

I'll also keep a close eye on Julian Phillips. Top 5 seems a bit of a stretch at this point but if his shot fully translates then I can see him being considered in the mid-lottery. I'm also looking forward to seeing more of Filipowski. He looks super intriguing at first glance but I have only seen him in highlight clips. And what's your take on Whitmore? His powerful athleticism is eye-popping, but he'll need to find a consistent role and that likely means his shot will have to become consistent so that he can play more at the perimeter at the next level.

Oh, and while Duke obviously has an impressive Freshman class coming in, I'm really looking forward to following the tandems at Texas (Mitchell & Morris) and Alabama (Bradley & Miller). I really like all four prospects for different reasons. And of course Arkansas is going to be fun.

[Duke4life831]

I know on the first page I said I thought Filip was the better prospect compared to Lively for the Duke big guys. I will admit I was on a high for him coming off the FIBA 3x3 championships. Watching the Hoop Summit right now, the lack of explosiveness is far easier to see in the 5 on 5 setting against other elite guys. Definitely pumping my breaks on him at the moment. Still like the skillset he has, but he's going to have to become a really good passer and shooter for him to make any kind of noise in the NBA.

[clyde21]

tentative prelim top 5ish

Victor Wembanyama
Scoot Henderson
Dariq Whitehead
Keyontae George
Anthony Black
Brandon Miller
Nick Smith Jr.

really liking the class overall, won't be as good as 21 but clearly ahead of 22 imo.

Have to see a bit more but I'd add Jarace Walker to this list. If he can defend in space (hard to fully grasp that at the HS level) then that's a pretty special package on both ends. Not completely sold on any of the scoring Guards yet, I'm not sure how they will translate. I have the highest hopes for Scoot, though. But these guys are certainly more intriguing than last year's Guards. Also, where are you on Jaden Bradley?

I'll also keep a close eye on Julian Phillips. Top 5 seems a bit of a stretch at this point but if his shot fully translates then I can see him being considered in the mid-lottery. I'm also looking forward to seeing more of Filipowski. He looks super intriguing at first glance but I have only seen him in highlight clips. And what's your take on Whitmore? His powerful athleticism is eye-popping, but he'll need to find a consistent role and that likely means his shot will have to become consistent so that he can play more at the perimeter at the next level.

Oh, and while Duke obviously has an impressive Freshman class coming in, I'm really looking forward to following the tandems at Texas (Mitchell & Morris) and Alabama (Bradley & Miller). I really like all four prospects for different reasons. And of course Arkansas is going to be fun.

ehhh on Bradley, we'll see, don't really see anything special there, first glance Nick Smith Jr. looks a lot better to me.

i like like Julian Phillips, also Jordan Walsh is intriguing, Whitmore is a good blank slate guy b/c of the physical profile but skill set still needs a lot of development imo. wing class in general looks a lot more promising. obviously the Thompson twins as well.

Anthony Black is the guy no one is talking about that I like the most.

really just seems to be a much more interesting class to me overall in terms of archetypes and diversity of players.

[clyde21]

I know on the first page I said I thought Filip was the better prospect compared to Lively for the Duke big guys. I will admit I was on a high for him coming off the FIBA 3x3 championships. Watching the Hoop Summit right now, the lack of explosiveness is far easier to see in the 5 on 5 setting against other elite guys. Definitely pumping my breaks on him at the moment. Still like the skillset he has, but he's going to have to become a really good passer and shooter for him to make any kind of noise in the NBA.

Duke's really gonna need a couple of upperclassmen lead guards to put it all together if Roach doesn't come back.