If the Warriors win title #4 but Steph has no FMVP's, how does that affect his legacy?

Godymas · Post #61 » by **Godymas** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 10:40 am

it just confirms that he always had great teammates

his legacy is kind of set rn, one more title just brings something else up to the conversation when ppl want to argue him vs. Magic Johnson

it does hurt his legacy if this year he DOESN'T get the FMVP though, like who else would be stealing it from him? Draymond? Klay?

but it doesn't actually do anything to his legacy, just adds a negative to it. hence why i voted "minor hit to legacy"

Lalouie · Post #62 » by **Lalouie** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 1:05 pm

Impuniti wrote:
JN61 wrote:
Lalouie wrote:it doesn't because that's not his legacy

Poor 4th quarter player in the NBA finals is absolutely huge part of his legacy and one of reasons why he isn't top 25 player.

He's statistically had one of the greatest 4th quarters ever in NBA history in 2015, but you being both salty and wrong about him as usual is about what's expected.

his LEGACY, the thing he leaves behind, is his contribution to the 3, not what he does or doesn't do in the 4th

it's something YOU might remember but i guarantee no one else will

and i ain't no fanboy

Rodwilliams · Post #63 » by **Rodwilliams** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 2:13 pm

Myth wrote:
LAL1947 wrote:For the last 15-20 years, we've been told that Shaq winning FMVPs needed to be held against Kobe, even though Kobe was the true FMVP in 2001-02 and he went on to win 2 more FMVPs of his own in 2008-09 and 2009-10, and without building super-teams... by a lot of the same people who are now trying to say that Curry winning 0 of 3 FMVPs, 0 of 4 FMVPs, or 1 of 4 FMVPs should not affect his legacy.

HOGWASH!

1. Who are these people that say Kobe winning three championships was a negative? People say they don’t have as much weight, but I’ve never seen anybody call them anything but a positive on his resume. This idea people propose Kobe would be better with only his 2 championships later in his career is preposterous and I would be very surprised if you found one person in the media or on this site that makes that claim. I’d be more surprised if it is one of the people above.

2. Shaq dominated the 2002 Finals. Kobe was not close to taking that FMVP from him.

Were you living under a rock back then? There were plenty of people who tried to disqualify Kobe by saying he only won cause he had Shaq, he was Shaq robin and can’t do it by himself before he won those 2 other rings. Even some people today try to disqualify him as top 10 all time today because he won 3 with Shaq.

michaelm · Post #64 » by **michaelm** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 2:19 pm

Godymas wrote:it just confirms that he always had great teammates

his legacy is kind of set rn, one more title just brings something else up to the conversation when ppl want to argue him vs. Magic Johnson

it does hurt his legacy if this year he DOESN'T get the FMVP though, like who else would be stealing it from him? Draymond? Klay?

but it doesn't actually do anything to his legacy, just adds a negative to it. hence why i voted "minor hit to legacy"

A 4th title helps his legacy any way you want to slice it. Afaik Tim Duncan didn't try to give that 5th title back because Kawhi won MVP.

Myth · Post #65 » by **Myth** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 2:30 pm

Rodwilliams wrote:
Myth wrote:
LAL1947 wrote:For the last 15-20 years, we've been told that Shaq winning FMVPs needed to be held against Kobe, even though Kobe was the true FMVP in 2001-02 and he went on to win 2 more FMVPs of his own in 2008-09 and 2009-10, and without building super-teams... by a lot of the same people who are now trying to say that Curry winning 0 of 3 FMVPs, 0 of 4 FMVPs, or 1 of 4 FMVPs should not affect his legacy.

HOGWASH!

1. Who are these people that say Kobe winning three championships was a negative? People say they don’t have as much weight, but I’ve never seen anybody call them anything but a positive on his resume. This idea people propose Kobe would be better with only his 2 championships later in his career is preposterous and I would be very surprised if you found one person in the media or on this site that makes that claim. I’d be more surprised if it is one of the people above.

2. Shaq dominated the 2002 Finals. Kobe was not close to taking that FMVP from him.

Were you living under a rock back then? There were plenty of people who tried to disqualify Kobe by saying he only won cause he had Shaq, he was Shaq robin and can’t do it by himself before he won those 2 other rings. Even some people today try to disqualify him as top 10 all time today because he won 3 with Shaq.

Again, who?

People definitely called him Robin. They also tried to reduce his role’s significance to discredit their value. But I have never seen somebody say they are a negative that he won a championship but didn’t win FMVP. Arguing to diminish the value of those championships is not the same as saying they are negatives. With regards to Curry in this thread, the people pointing out that another championship without a FMVP is a positive are not saying it holds the same weight as a championship with a FMVP.

WarriorGM · Post #66 » by **WarriorGM** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 2:34 pm

Godymas wrote:it just confirms that he always had great teammates

Might as well say that for every other championship team in history.

There is less proof of the capacities of Curry's teammates independently of him than for the stars of most other championship teams.

Godymas wrote:it does hurt his legacy if this year he DOESN'T get the FMVP though, like who else would be stealing it from him? Draymond? Klay?

but it doesn't actually do anything to his legacy, just adds a negative to it. hence why i voted "minor hit to legacy"

Sounds like Putin could convince you that his "special military operation" isn't a war too. FMVPs are determined in drawing rooms by propagandists.

Roger Murdock · Post #67 » by **Roger Murdock** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 3:00 pm

It might add to his legacy

What makes Steph special is that he is able to be the most impactful player on the court while allowing everyone else to also shine

He does this to a greater degree than any superstar I’ve ever seen.

KembaWalker · Post #68 » by **KembaWalker** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 3:04 pm

Stephen Curry moulded the entire league in his image, thats his legacy. Michael Jordan changed the game for wings and we got a bunch of lesser clones after that, until Stephen Curry came around.

Tacoma · Post #69 » by **Tacoma** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 3:07 pm

FMVP Durant has 2 rings, none without Curry. As hypothesized by the OP, Poole gets his FMVP with Curry. FMVP Iggy has won 4 rings (including 2022 hypothetical), ZERO without Curry. The key common denominator for those FMVP's and Championships: is Curry.

What it says then is opponents are so focused on stopping Curry, it allows others like Iggy, Durant and Poole to excel, win FVMP's and Championships. Win Championships by making other players better - that's a great enhancement to his legacy.

CS707 · Post #70 » by **CS707** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 3:07 pm

How much? Not nearly as much as OP hopes it would.

Impuniti · Post #71 » by **Impuniti** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 3:14 pm

Lalouie wrote:
Impuniti wrote:
JN61 wrote:Poor 4th quarter player in the NBA finals is absolutely huge part of his legacy and one of reasons why he isn't top 25 player.

He's statistically had one of the greatest 4th quarters ever in NBA history in 2015, but you being both salty and wrong about him as usual is about what's expected.

his LEGACY, the thing he leaves behind, is his contribution to the 3, not what he does or doesn't do in the 4th

it's something YOU might remember but i guarantee no one else will

and i ain't no fanboy

You realize I did not quote you right?

Woodsanity · Post #72 » by **Woodsanity** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 4:49 pm

It should not hurt his legacy at all unless he is god awful in the finals. A ring should always be a positive. Unless Curry averages like 15 ppg on 30ish% in the finals it should be a plus. Lets say Klay gets 30 ppg on 50% shooting in the finals somehow and wins FMVP. That doesn't hurt Curry's legacy if he played fine.

phanman · Post #73 » by **phanman** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 6:12 pm

JN61 wrote:He will always be looked as a poor finals performer if so. Someone who never managed to play like the best player of the floor in the finals. That level of mental midgetness matters. He is already there but another such year would be pretty rough to him

JN61 wrote:
Lalouie wrote:it doesn't because that's not his legacy

Poor 4th quarter player in the NBA finals is absolutely huge part of his legacy and one of reasons why he isn't top 25 player.

What what world are these numbers an indication of a poor finals performer? :roll:

2015: 26pts, 5.2reb, 6.3ast, 1.8stl on 58.5%TS or 44/39/89 in 42.5mpg

2017: 26.8pts, 8reb, 9.4ast, 2.2stl on 61.9%TS or 44/39/90 in 37.7mpg

2018: 27.5pts, 6reb, 6.8ast, 1.5stl, 0.8blk on 56%TS or 40/42/100 in 40.6mpg

Honestly posts like yours answer the OP's question. This is exactly how his legacy will be affected with posters/analysts like yourself.

WarriorGM · Post #74 » by **WarriorGM** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 7:14 pm

phanman wrote:
JN61 wrote:He will always be looked as a poor finals performer if so. Someone who never managed to play like the best player of the floor in the finals. That level of mental midgetness matters. He is already there but another such year would be pretty rough to him

JN61 wrote:
Lalouie wrote:it doesn't because that's not his legacy

Poor 4th quarter player in the NBA finals is absolutely huge part of his legacy and one of reasons why he isn't top 25 player.

What what world are these numbers an indication of a poor finals performer?

2015: 26pts, 5.2reb, 6.3ast, 1.8stl on 58.5%TS or 44/39/89 in 42.5mpg

2017: 26.8pts, 8reb, 9.4ast, 2.2stl on 61.9%TS or 44/39/90 in 37.7mpg

2018: 27.5pts, 6reb, 6.8ast, 1.5stl, 0.8blk on 56%TS or 40/42/100 in 40.6mpg

Honestly posts like yours answer the OP's question. This is exactly how his legacy will be affected with posters/analysts like yourself.

The craziness of some of the assertions is eye-roll inducing. Curry's performance in 4th quarters of the finals is being questioned? Whose is supposed to be better?

From 2019 but still:

Read on Twitter

Steph had 5 of the 15 highest scoring 4th Quarters of NBA Finals in the past 10 years (as of 2019).

AbeVigodaLive · Post #75 » by **AbeVigodaLive** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 7:23 pm

How could a title not help his legacy?

bradybunch · Post #76 » by **bradybunch** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 8:17 pm

He was finals MVP in 15.

And it would further prove he's the most unselfish superstar of all time.

PistolPeteJR · Post #77 » by **PistolPeteJR** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 8:21 pm

The High Cyde wrote:We can just retcon the whole thing and give him the four FMVPs, because there’s no Golden State Warriors dynasty without him, not even a title.

I get the point you’re making here, but FWIW, they still win in 2018 without him.

WarriorGM · Post #78 » by **WarriorGM** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 8:24 pm

PistolPeteJR wrote:
The High Cyde wrote:We can just retcon the whole thing and give him the four FMVPs, because there’s no Golden State Warriors dynasty without him, not even a title.

I get the point you’re making here, but FWIW, they still win in 2018 without him.

That's hardly a given. The Warriors were down by double digits in game 7 and then Curry came along and either assisted or scored in something like the next 20 points.

PistolPeteJR · Post #79 » by **PistolPeteJR** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 8:25 pm

WarriorGM wrote:
PistolPeteJR wrote:
The High Cyde wrote:We can just retcon the whole thing and give him the four FMVPs, because there’s no Golden State Warriors dynasty without him, not even a title.

I get the point you’re making here, but FWIW, they still win in 2018 without him.

That's hardly a given. The Warriors were down by double digits in game 7 and then Curry came along and either assisted or scored in something like the next 20 points.

Okay. 99%.

shoresy69 · Post #80 » by **shoresy69** » Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:48 pm

PistolPeteJR wrote:
WarriorGM wrote:
PistolPeteJR wrote:
I get the point you’re making here, but FWIW, they still win in 2018 without him.

That's hardly a given. The Warriors were down by double digits in game 7 and then Curry came along and either assisted or scored in something like the next 20 points.

Okay. 99%.

The Rockets were good enough that year they would definitely be favored to win if you took either Curry or KD off the Warriors.

If the Warriors win 4 titles but Steph has no FMVP's, how is his legacy affected?