Nikola Jokic wins MVP(again)

Raps in 4 · Post #401 » by **Raps in 4** » Mon May 9, 2022 6:56 pm

DoItALL9 wrote:Analytics also said prime Harden was better than Jordan offensively

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Except they didn't.

Harden had 3 seasons with an OBPM over +8.0. Jordan had 7.

Harden had one season with a BPM over +10.0. Jordan had 7.

Harden had a higher TS% multiple seasons, sure, but so did two dozen other players this decade. You can't just compare TS% across eras without context.

Fortunately, we are comparing two players who are the same age, play the same position, and play in the same era here. It's a straightforward comparison, and Jokic had the better season.

dhsilv2 · Post #402 » by **dhsilv2** » Mon May 9, 2022 6:57 pm

BoatsNZones wrote:
dhsilv2 wrote:
Red8911 wrote:Why do they have to announce the MVP so late ? The awards should be given a day after the season is over.

They want ratings for their stupid award show i guess?

They canned that nonsense.

MVP being announced in the 2nd round is standard.

This is old news for anyone following though. He won in a landslide and rightfully so. Embiid got 2nd. Giannis 3rd.

well props there then, but yeah 2nd round sounds about right historically. I don't get why they don't do this during the play in crap, could be a fun thing...

Profound23 · Post #403 » by **Profound23** » Mon May 9, 2022 6:57 pm

nomansland wrote:Seeing Sixers fans (and a few Bucks fans) whinge about this is delicious.

The best part is Jokic cares less about the award than whiny fans.

Nobody should be whining about anything. There were a lot of good candidates and I had no problem with anyone getting it. Just figured it would be someone different because that is what the NBA likes to do. I figured it would be Embiid this year before we move on to Luka, Ja, etc.

There are too many great players to be arguing over who is the MVP.

FrobeBryant · Post #404 » by **FrobeBryant** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:01 pm

Good, saves the collective heads of Real GM’ers from exploding

AbeVigodaLive · Post #405 » by **AbeVigodaLive** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:01 pm

jokeboy86 wrote:To me it always came down to who was doing more with less. Aaron Gordon was the Nuggets 2nd best player this year and I think anyone would agree he's not better than these players:

Holiday
Middleton
Harris
Maxey
less than Harden

After that Denver's depth simply can't compare to the depth of the Bucks and 76ers.

One thing I don't get is the national talking heads vitriol towards analytics(which has been cited for Jokic)when it comes to NBA discussions. Are they intimidated by analytics or something because you don't hear the anger this intensely when it comes to NFL or MLB.

I don't understand the analytics/Jokic thing. Does that really change anything?

The counting stats were incredible for all of them:

- Jokic — 27.1 ppg / 13.8 reb / 7.9 apg / 58.3% fg / 81% ft
- Embiid — 30.6 ppg / 11.7 reb / 4.2 apg / 49.9% fg / 81.4% ft
- Giannis — 29.9 ppg / 11.6 reb / 5.8 apg / 55.3% fg / 72.2% ft

Are people claiming Jokic isn't right there with them with the counting stats?

cpower · Post #406 » by **cpower** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:04 pm

KembaWalker wrote:We're all in agreement that Giannis is the actual best and most valuable player in the league right? He just doesn't win because his teammates didn't get hurt till the playoffs? So weird

he was chilling in the RS. otherwise he could have make them win 60 games at least.

dhsilv2 · Post #407 » by **dhsilv2** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:08 pm

KembaWalker wrote:We're all in agreement that Giannis is the actual best and most valuable player in the league right? He just doesn't win because his teammates didn't get hurt till the playoffs? So weird

We do not. Jokic is the best player in the league right now with Giannis a legit close 2nd imo, but it's a real debate. Jokic and Giannis are this era's Magic and Bird.

UcanUwill · Post #408 » by **UcanUwill** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:09 pm

Jadoogar wrote:
Hussien Fatal wrote:Lol Another 1st round exit MVP, congrats but they need to start giving this award to players that actually win.

Almost as if this is a regular season award and there is context required in these discussions.

So many hypocrites. I wonder would Hussien said the same if Philly lost in first round, which is not out of realm of possibility, and Embiid got MVP. We all know the answer to that, hypocrisy is strong here, this was also first Jokic loss in the first round. So many hot takes and hypocrites, its just a waste of time trying to read any of that.

UcanUwill · Post #409 » by **UcanUwill** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:12 pm

Raps in 4 wrote:
DoItALL9 wrote:Analytics also said prime Harden was better than Jordan offensively

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Except they didn't.

Harden had 3 seasons with an OBPM over +8.0. Jordan had 7.

Harden had one season with a BPM over +10.0. Jordan had 7.

Harden had a higher TS% multiple seasons, sure, but so did two dozen other players this decade. You can't just compare TS% across eras without context.

Fortunately, we are comparing two players who are the same age, play the same position, and play in the same era here. It's a straightforward comparison, and Jokic had the better season.

These anti analytics guys always remind me of that Futurama scene - I don't understand evolution, and I protect my kids from understanding it. Just replace the word evolution to analytics, its sad that the most ignorant ones are often the loudest.

Cubbies2120 · Post #410 » by **Cubbies2120** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:13 pm

UcanUwill wrote:
Jadoogar wrote:
Hussien Fatal wrote:Lol Another 1st round exit MVP, congrats but they need to start giving this award to players that actually win.

Almost as if this is a regular season award and there is context required in these discussions.

So many hypocrites. I wonder would Hussien said the same if Philly lost in first round, which is not out of realm of possibility, and Embiid got MVP. We all know the answer to that, hypocrisy is strong here, this was also first Jokic loss in the first round. So many hot takes and hypocrites, its just a waste of time trying to read any of that.

Yep, Jokic in each of his last 3 seasons where he was an MVP candidate lost to either the champion, a team that won some games in the Finals, or the current favorites to win it all (remember Embiid fans were all about dem Vegas odds boiiii)

The teams that beat Embiid in those years were…Celtics, Hawks, and TBD…

:banghead:

alebaba · Post #411 » by **alebaba** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:14 pm

Hussien Fatal wrote:Lol Another 1st round exit MVP, congrats but they need to start giving this award to players that actually win.

Mvp is a regular season award, do you have any idea what mvp stands for?

BelgradeNugget · Post #412 » by **BelgradeNugget** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:14 pm

KembaWalker wrote:i don't like that the award has transitioned from best player on the best (or on a great) team to a discussion about who has the least help like its a charity pity party award. MVP should be better than that

KembaWalker wrote:We're all in agreement that Giannis is the actual best and most valuable player in the league right? He just doesn't win because his teammates didn't get hurt till the playoffs? So weird

Man, if you want to argue try to find some real arguments, because this way you simply sound like troll/hater. What Giannis has to do with best player on the best (or on a great) team. His team had 7th best record in the NBA, 3rd in the east. So try to find another favorite like Booker/CP3, Desmond Bane/Ja, Jimmy Butler, Curry/Poole, Luka/Brunson or Tatum if you hate Jokic so much, you will have a little less laughable argument.

Ryoga Hibiki · Post #413 » by **Ryoga Hibiki** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:16 pm

Tim Kempton wrote:Somebody help the 6ers and Bucks fans...

Bucks fan don't really care, I would say.
To be honest, neither Jokic neither Giannis seemed to care that much.
Embiid mybe a bit more.

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iBall101 · Post #414 » by **iBall101** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:17 pm

Well……. He deserves it again I guess.
Joker the walking triple double. I mean he must be annoyed of playing so hard and not getting far in the playoffs.

Sharkboy242 · Post #415 » by **Sharkboy242** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:18 pm

Ryoga Hibiki wrote:
Tim Kempton wrote:Somebody help the 6ers and Bucks fans...

Bucks fan don't really care, I would say.
To be honest, neither Jokic neither Giannis seemed to care that much.
Embiid mybe a bit more.

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Read on Twitter

Maybe maybe maybe

KembaWalker · Post #416 » by **KembaWalker** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:18 pm

BelgradeNugget wrote:
KembaWalker wrote:i don't like that the award has transitioned from best player on the best (or on a great) team to a discussion about who has the least help like its a charity pity party award. MVP should be better than that

KembaWalker wrote:We're all in agreement that Giannis is the actual best and most valuable player in the league right? He just doesn't win because his teammates didn't get hurt till the playoffs? So weird

Man, if you want to argue try to find some real arguments, because this way you simply sound like troll/hater. What Giannis has to do with best player on the best (or on a great) team. His team had 7th best record in the NBA, 3rd in the east. So try to find another favorite like Booker/CP3, Desmond Bane/Ja, Jimmy Butler, Curry/Poole, Luka/Brunson or Tatum if you hate Jokic so much, you will have a little less laughable argument.

The difference is, Giannis help goes down and we all still know he's going to beat the 2 seed. Jokic loses his help and we have to hear a season long of pre excuses for him to lose
The bar for Jokic is so low

Ryoga Hibiki · Post #417 » by **Ryoga Hibiki** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:23 pm

Watch on YouTube

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hardenASG13 · Post #418 » by **hardenASG13** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:24 pm

KembaWalker wrote:We're all in agreement that Giannis is the actual best and most valuable player in the league right? He just doesn't win because his teammates didn't get hurt till the playoffs? So weird

I agree and dont see how anyone would argue it at this point that is watching the playoffs. Jokic had great RS numbers, and Denver cleaned up vs. bad teams all season while struggling against teams over .500 (like you see in the games that matter, the playoffs). They did so because Jokic was the best player on the floor in most all of those games. Yet people act like it was some miracle that he dragged their roster to a quick out in the playoffs, despite him being a top player in the league. How many healthy elite players missed the playoffs this year? It wasnt some magical occurence that they made it. He didnt stand out as the best player in the playoffs.

Jokic was the 6th leading scorer in the league, this season, and people try to claim it was among the best seasons ever! Just absurd when you think about it.

BoatsNZones · Post #419 » by **BoatsNZones** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:24 pm

dhsilv2 wrote:
KembaWalker wrote:We're all in agreement that Giannis is the actual best and most valuable player in the league right? He just doesn't win because his teammates didn't get hurt till the playoffs? So weird

We do not. Jokic is the best player in the league right now with Giannis a legit close 2nd imo, but it's a real debate. Jokic and Giannis are this era's Magic and Bird.

I mean there's no Magic/Bird comp when there's zero rivalry. And both are great, but far from head and shoulders above the pack. Definitely disagree with his take. The NBA does not have a "best player" currently.

dhsilv2 · Post #420 » by **dhsilv2** » Mon May 9, 2022 7:30 pm

BoatsNZones wrote:
dhsilv2 wrote:
KembaWalker wrote:We're all in agreement that Giannis is the actual best and most valuable player in the league right? He just doesn't win because his teammates didn't get hurt till the playoffs? So weird

We do not. Jokic is the best player in the league right now with Giannis a legit close 2nd imo, but it's a real debate. Jokic and Giannis are this era's Magic and Bird.

I mean there's no Magic/Bird comp when there's zero rivalry. And both are great, but far from head and shoulders above the pack. Definitely disagree with his take. The NBA does not have a "best player" currently.

These guys are well on their way to challenging for top 10 all time man. We are seeing two absolute living legends in their prime right now.