Highest all-time ranked player who was never best/top 5/top 10 in the league?

[ceiling raiser]

Title.

Was thinking about this recently. I think I go:

Never best in the league: Durant, West, Robertson, Robinson, Nash (11-15 all-time for me)
Never top 5 in the league: Stockton, Kidd, Kobe, Miller, Kidd (20-24 all-time, though maybe I'm a bit higher on this group than most)
Never top 10 in the league: No clue here. Ray Allen maybe? He probably was top 10 though at least one year. Is there anybody like this in the top 50?

[jalengreen]

is it a popular take that kobe has never been top 5?

[Doctor MJ]

If I go down the Top 100 list, top guys who never appear at #1 in my POY lists:

1. Oscar Robertson
2. Karl Malone
3. Charles Barkley
4. Chris Paul
5. John Stockton

Nash would be the 6th guy on that list, and I'll just say that he'd rank higher than 6 on my personal list.

Never in my Top 5? This will probably piss more people off.

Looks like:

1. Clyde Drexler
2. Isiah Thomas
3. Chauncey Billups
4. Bob Lanier
5. Dikembe Mutombo

Drexler I'm sure surprises people - it surprises me. Isiah I know pisses people off. Billups probably raises eyebrows given how much momentum he's had lately. Lanier may bother folks who know the '70s well. Mutombo I'd guess people would be fine with.

Top 10 is hard because I don't formally track beyond the Top 5. I'm pretty confident in saying all 5 of the players listed make my Top 10 at least once. When I look at the 100 list, I see some guys who might not make it, but none that I feel confident saying "They absolutely never had a Top 10 year!"

[LAL1947]

Title.

Was thinking about this recently. I think I go:

Never best in the league: Durant, West, Robertson, Robinson (11-15 all-time for me))
Never top 5 in the league: Stockton, Kidd, Kobe, Miller, Kidd (20-24 all-time, though maybe I'm a bit higher on this group than most)
Never top 10 in the league: No clue here. Ray Allen maybe? He probably was top 10 though at least one year. Is there anybody like this in the top 50?

Ahh... there he is... the self-admitted Kobe-hater pops his head out again.

Where you been hibernating? I was just waiting for you to show up since we've had a lot of Kobe discussion the last few days... and there you are with a thread that starts off by saying Kobe was never Top 5 in the league.

Warning issued as this type of post attacking a poster rather than answering a post is clearly a violation of the Board Code of Conduct.

[LAL1947]

is it a popular take that kobe has never been top 5?

No. It's just the OP.

[Doctor MJ]

Title.

Was thinking about this recently. I think I go:

Never best in the league: Durant, West, Robertson, Robinson, Nash (11-15 all-time for me)
Never top 5 in the league: Stockton, Kidd, Kobe, Miller, Kidd (20-24 all-time, though maybe I'm a bit higher on this group than most)
Never top 10 in the league: No clue here. Ray Allen maybe? He probably was top 10 though at least one year. Is there anybody like this in the top 50?

So, not arguing with you, but just to comment on these guys:

I have Durant, West, Robinson & Kobe each making #1 once (and only once), and all the other make my Top 5 at least once including Ray Allen.

[Doctor MJ]

Title.

Was thinking about this recently. I think I go:

Never best in the league: Durant, West, Robertson, Robinson (11-15 all-time for me))
Never top 5 in the league: Stockton, Kidd, Kobe, Miller, Kidd (20-24 all-time, though maybe I'm a bit higher on this group than most)
Never top 10 in the league: No clue here. Ray Allen maybe? He probably was top 10 though at least one year. Is there anybody like this in the top 50?

Ahh... there he is... the self-admitted Kobe-hater pops his head out again.

Where you been hibernating? I was just waiting for you to show up since we've had a lot of Kobe discussion the last few days... and there you are with a thread that starts off by saying Kobe was never Top 5 in the league.

We don't need this attitude. You have a right to your opinion, and others have a right to theirs. Participate constructively or just leave the thread alone.

[LAL1947]

Never top 5 in the league: Stockton, Kidd, Kobe, Miller, Kidd (20-24 all-time, though maybe I'm a bit higher on this group than most)

Lebron says you're wrong, he thinks Kobe was the best player in the league in 2009 and 2010. Kobe was the best player in the league for other years of the 2000-10 decade too. You can hate it all you like, and make all these posts and threads... but it won't change anything.

Quote from 2009:

Watch on YouTube

Quote from 2010:

Watch on YouTube

Title.

Was thinking about this recently. I think I go:

Never best in the league: Durant, West, Robertson, Robinson (11-15 all-time for me))
Never top 5 in the league: Stockton, Kidd, Kobe, Miller, Kidd (20-24 all-time, though maybe I'm a bit higher on this group than most)
Never top 10 in the league: No clue here. Ray Allen maybe? He probably was top 10 though at least one year. Is there anybody like this in the top 50?

Ahh... there he is... the self-admitted Kobe-hater pops his head out again.

Where you been hibernating? I was just waiting for you to show up since we've had a lot of Kobe discussion the last few days... and there you are with a thread that starts off by saying Kobe was never Top 5 in the league.

We don't need this attitude. You have a right to your opinion, and others have a right to theirs. Participate constructively or just leave the thread alone.

Fine, then I will stay out of this thread.

Also, I have written exactly what came out of the horse's mouth, ironically, when he made this same post a few weeks ago and was asked why he left Kobe out (see quote from him below). Sometimes, it is good to know the intent behind the posts/threads that are made here. Should I open a slew of threads on discussable topics but with nonsensical opening posts regarding Tim Duncan's or Lebron James's place in history to balance this out? That will then devolve into arguing or discussion lacking in quality because of the obviously untrue opening post that I will have made in these hypothetical threads. I think doing stuff like this should be discouraged... and that is my constructive criticism.

Link

Thing is, how many players have been top 5 in the league for 10+ years?

Definitely:
Russell
Kareem
Jordan
Duncan
LeBron

Maybe:
West
Oscar
Bird
Magic
Hakeem
Shaq
Garnett
Durant
Curry

(I'm sure I'm missing someone)

I am admittedly a Kobe hater. I was always a Shaq fan and never respected Kobe's contributions. I am very biased.

[ceiling raiser]

So, not arguing with you, but just to comment on these guys:

I have Durant, West, Robinson & Kobe each making #1 once (and only once), and all the other make my Top 5 at least once including Ray Allen.

Durant - Which year, 2014? I can see the argument. I have recently had CP3 1st that season. KD has an argument though.
West - This one is tough. What year would he qualify, 1969? Oscar still feels better. 1970 I think Kareem is best in the league year one.
Robinson - I just can't see myself taking him over Shaq or Hakeem any of those mid 90s seasons. His best argument might ironically be post injury. 99 the league was shallow and I see an (unlikely) argument.
Kobe - I just don't see a case for him. He had seven years when he was in the conversation to me:

2001
2002
2003
2006
2007
2008
2009

Guys like Shaq, Duncan, Garnett, Nash, LeBron, Wade, Paul, Dirk, and a score of others make it tough to consider Kobe here. I may be higher on him than a lot of people on this board but I don't think I can justify it.

[eminence]

Don't know top 5/10 off the top of my head, but just put together a top 20 list (rough), so here's my top 20 guys I didn't think ever topped the league. A fair number of the 11-20 guys.

10. Oscar - so so close, but Russell was always there
12. Kobe - don't think he ever topped the league, tough tough competition - Shaq/KG/Duncan/etc leading into the GOAT
15. Robinson - has a case against Hakeem, but I side the other way
16. West
18. Karl Malone
19. CP3

[No-more-rings]

is it a popular take that kobe has never been top 5?

No in fact, that take is completely indefensible.

[ceiling raiser]

I am admittedly a Kobe hater. I was always a Shaq fan and never respected Kobe's contributions. I am very biased.

My bias is because of Kobe's level of play. Not because I don't like him as a person. I watched him and Shaq play hundreds of games together. He was never better than late prime Shaq, who was a fringe top 5 player in the NBA.

[LA Bird]

is it a popular take that kobe has never been top 5?

No. Kobe was voted top 5 by this board every season from 2001 to 2010 except for 2005. OP is most likely the only poster who doesn't have him in the top 5 at least once during his entire career.

Anyway, Kobe talks aside, I would pick

Never top 1: Oscar Robertson
Never top 5: John Stockton
Never top 10: LaMarcus Aldridge

Not too sure about the last one because I don't have a comprehensive list of top 10s for every season but Aldridge seems like the best choice - long career, no outlier peaks, and played in a period with strong competition in top end talent.

[BmanInBigD]

The best thing worth reading on this thread is the fact that someone actually puts any value on player rankings from Lebron.

[trex_8063]

Highest rank never top 10??

Off the cuff, I'd suggest Horace Grant. I'm as high on Grant as probably anyone on this forum, but he was never a top 10 player (though I do think he probably had a couple seasons as fringe top 15), had several seasons in the top 25-30; solid longevity overall (was a "useful" player basically all 17 seasons of his career, and mostly injury-free). Legacy points for instantly integrating on multiple contenders.....over and over and over again in his career; that's basically all he did.


Highest that was never top 5??
idk, I'd have to think about it.

[RoyceDa59]

Durant was absolutely the best for a year or two around 2017-2018.

Kobe never TOP 5 is laughable. Kobe never #1 is debatable. He was top 5 for a decade easily.

[HeartBreakKid]

Never top 5 in the league: Stockton, Kidd, Kobe, Miller, Kidd (20-24 all-time, though maybe I'm a bit higher on this group than most)

Lebron says you're wrong, he thinks Kobe was the best player in the league in 2009 and 2010. Kobe was the best player in the league for other years of the 2000-10 decade too. You can hate it all you like, and make all these posts and threads... but it won't change anything.

Quote from 2009:

Watch on YouTube

Quote from 2010:

Watch on YouTube

Ahh... there he is... the self-admitted Kobe-hater pops his head out again.

Where you been hibernating? I was just waiting for you to show up since we've had a lot of Kobe discussion the last few days... and there you are with a thread that starts off by saying Kobe was never Top 5 in the league.

We don't need this attitude. You have a right to your opinion, and others have a right to theirs. Participate constructively or just leave the thread alone.

Fine, then I will stay out of this thread.

Also, I have written exactly what came out of the horse's mouth, ironically, when he made this same post a few weeks ago and was asked why he left Kobe out (see quote from him below). Sometimes, it is good to know the intent behind the posts/threads that are made here. Should I open a slew of threads on discussable topics but with nonsensical opening posts regarding Tim Duncan's or Lebron James's place in history to balance this out? That will then devolve into arguing or discussion lacking in quality because of the obviously untrue opening post that I will have made in these hypothetical threads. I think doing stuff like this should be discouraged... and that is my constructive criticism.

Link

Thing is, how many players have been top 5 in the league for 10+ years?

Definitely:
Russell
Kareem
Jordan
Duncan
LeBron

Maybe:
West
Oscar
Bird
Magic
Hakeem
Shaq
Garnett
Durant
Curry

(I'm sure I'm missing someone)

I am admittedly a Kobe hater. I was always a Shaq fan and never respected Kobe's contributions. I am very biased.

Lebron also said Russell Westbrook would be good on the Lakers. So...good job agreeing with him lol.

[RoyceDa59]

I absolutely need to hear the argument as to which 5 players from 2000-2015 were better than Kobe each year. This should be entertaining.

[HeartBreakKid]

I absolutely need to hear the argument as to which 5 players from 2000-2015 were better than Kobe each year. This should be entertaining.

Why would you include 2014 and 2015? He barely played and was terrible in those years. It'd be easier to list the players that weren't better than him.

[falcolombardi]

Durant was absolutely the best for a year or two around 2017-2018.

Kobe never TOP 5 is laughable. Kobe never #1 is debatable. He was top 5 for a decade easily.

i dont even think he was the best player in his team those seasons, although is fairly close between him and curry, let alone the league

i think he was top 3-4 with lebron,curry and kawhi(in 2017*) those years, maybe harden has an argument ober him too