Rank Bud against the other 29 coaches in the NBA

[th87]

I. dont. give. a. ****. about. our. defense. It was fine.

I will listen to this. Do you have numbers related to whether we were better with lopez on the court offensively?

That Im curious about. what were our on/offs with Lopez offensively it might explain the desperation?

And besides we were always going to play Lopez. **** sgtupid to suggest Bud should have completely shelfed him. Like idiot level that he wouldnt play at least 20 minutes. We have no rotation if he doesnt and his backup Ibaka is like a god damn one legged version of him. So i say we gotta stop the tard discussion like playing him wasnt an option. Were we better offensively at least with him out there? Might be time to let ShootingtheJ have his sunshine related to him moving forward. I was on the fence. Perhaps Lopez needs to be done. Our small ball lineup sucked but if our Lopez lineup is consistently worse then its time to move on

Brook had the lowest on court offensive rating of anyone getting major minutes (90.5 pts/100) and Bucks had their best offensive rating with him off the court (105.8 pts/100) compared to any other player off. Though not sure how much of his minutes were stacked without Giannis. Because the Bucks **** sucked with Giannis on the bench this series.

All I know is for sure is that it was ludicrous Jevon Carter couldn't see a minute of meaningful action after game 1.

no real thoughts on javon carter. ive never thought of him as a difference maker in this league.

as it relates to lopez specifically....not playing him should not have been considered practically. just practically the idea he wouldnt play isnt reasonable. he is part of who we are and has been a big part of who we are. you dont just dump a dude like that for a javon carter. thats not how it works..... again practically its not how it works.

it will be interesting to see what we do this summer with lopez moving forward. its not like we were all feeling like the world was fabulous this season when he was out. the small ball lineups we used werent like omg this is who we need to be moviung forward so not sure what the answer for that is. it better not be javon carter thats for sure

either way thanks for sharing his numbers. it will be interesting to see what happens this offseason

Uh what are you talking about with PG Jevon Carter replacing Lopez??

[th87]

I think he's fine but I also think he's unquestionably a guy whose "by the game plan" attitude hurts him far more often then other guys considered high tier coaches. I think the defensive stuff has shown a lot and gets a lot of attention but I also think it shows itself on offensive side a ton as well.

Obviously we're not looking at a 1:1 scenario or anything here but one thing that stood out to me this playoffs. Miami faced off against Atlanta. Anti-PJ dudes loved to point out how Trae got put on PJ who just stood in the corner and couldn't do anything. In our series PJ was guarded by Trae for 20 minutes, shot two shots from three and didn't, and wasn't asked, to do anything else. Fast forward to this series and Atlanta once again tries hiding Trae on PJ. What happens? Spo sends PJ into the post. Spo attacks the mismatch. Trae guarded PJ all of 5 minutes in their series. Why? 14 points and 2 assists on 9 shots, 7/9 coming inside the arc. I think there's a bunch of stuff like this throughout the years that Bud overlooks that just makes life increasingly harder on himself.

Isn't this like basketball 101? How do we expect to be a mini dynasty (for which we have the players) if our coach can't exploit this obvious mismatch?

We will never win again if he isn't removed. He's a Team President type masquerading as a coach

[Baddy Chuck]

I think he's fine but I also think he's unquestionably a guy whose "by the game plan" attitude hurts him far more often then other guys considered high tier coaches. I think the defensive stuff has shown a lot and gets a lot of attention but I also think it shows itself on offensive side a ton as well.

Obviously we're not looking at a 1:1 scenario or anything here but one thing that stood out to me this playoffs. Miami faced off against Atlanta. Anti-PJ dudes loved to point out how Trae got put on PJ who just stood in the corner and couldn't do anything. In our series PJ was guarded by Trae for 20 minutes, shot two shots from three and didn't, and wasn't asked, to do anything else. Fast forward to this series and Atlanta once again tries hiding Trae on PJ. What happens? Spo sends PJ into the post. Spo attacks the mismatch. Trae guarded PJ all of 5 minutes in their series. Why? 14 points and 2 assists on 9 shots, 7/9 coming inside the arc. I think there's a bunch of stuff like this throughout the years that Bud overlooks that just makes life increasingly harder on himself.

Isn't this like basketball 101? How do we expect to be a mini dynasty (for which we have the players) if our coach can't exploit this obvious mismatch?

We will never win again if he isn't removed. He's a Team President type masquerading as a coach

That's like the weird thing for me with him though, he does do it......... sometimes. Giannis goes out in our Atlanta series and one random game he let's Brook feast down low, then we haven't seen it again which like is fine if everything is going great but like it's a weapon that's there on the mismatch. When Brook is being guarded a whole series by Bruce Brown we camp Brook at the three point line like he's Jason Kapono. We saw Midds get that a bunch last year which was nice but also guys like Jrue and Giannis are also more than capable in the post but he rarely see that, even when we're just running down the court and watching them dribble for 24 seconds for a whole quarter. Bobby gets cooked the Brooklyn series so he's pretty much permanently planted on the bench by game 5 but then Grayson Allen, Brook and George Hill get the largest leash ever when they're getting cooked even worse.

Personally I think he's in the upper half of coaches. After the playoffs last year I felt pretty good that he was working his way up that list and building off his failures. With Midds out and the owners just not bringing back a championship piece I don't put all the weight on his shoulders, but he certainly reverted back to some of his old ways in my eyes which isn't ideal.

[Fotis St]

He is #30 ... he is the worst coach FOR US.
Afrer winning the ring by dumping his stubborness and adjusting game by game, I expected to losen up and make even better adjustments on the fly. I expected the best version of Bud this year. On the contrary, he got to his old stubborness and vet love that got us nowhere. So in my mind it is not a matter of coaching skills , its about timing and fit. Bud is clearly a piece of puzzle that is old concrete, has rough edges that can't be cut. As someone else said it earlier, I remember Jrue and PJ Tucker called BUD out of his @$$ with his stup** scheme and Bud was more forced to adjust his schemes than wanted by his own will.
Horst is to blame too for the roster and the vet washed collection he surrounded Giannis with.

Fire BUD & HORST

[BroncoBuck]

He is #30 ... he is the worst coach FOR US.
Afrer winning the ring by dumping his stubborness and adjusting game by game, I expected to losen up and make even better adjustments on the fly. I expected the best version of Bud this year. On the contrary, he got to his old stubborness and vet love that got us nowhere. So in my mind it is not a matter of coaching skills , its about timing and fit. Bud is clearly a piece of puzzle that is old concrete, has rough edges that can't be cut. As someone else said it earlier, I remember Jrue and PJ Tucker called BUD out of his @$$ with his stup** scheme and Bud was more forced to adjust his schemes than wanted by his own will.
Horst is to blame too for the roster and the vet washed collection he surrounded Giannis with.

Fire BUD & HORST

You praised the Semi Ojeleye signing…

[midranger]

I think he's fine but I also think he's unquestionably a guy whose "by the game plan" attitude hurts him far more often then other guys considered high tier coaches. I think the defensive stuff has shown a lot and gets a lot of attention but I also think it shows itself on offensive side a ton as well.

Obviously we're not looking at a 1:1 scenario or anything here but one thing that stood out to me this playoffs. Miami faced off against Atlanta. Anti-PJ dudes loved to point out how Trae got put on PJ who just stood in the corner and couldn't do anything. In our series PJ was guarded by Trae for 20 minutes, shot two shots from three and didn't, and wasn't asked, to do anything else. Fast forward to this series and Atlanta once again tries hiding Trae on PJ. What happens? Spo sends PJ into the post. Spo attacks the mismatch. Trae guarded PJ all of 5 minutes in their series. Why? 14 points and 2 assists on 9 shots, 7/9 coming inside the arc. I think there's a bunch of stuff like this throughout the years that Bud overlooks that just makes life increasingly harder on himself.

Isn't this like basketball 101? How do we expect to be a mini dynasty (for which we have the players) if our coach can't exploit this obvious mismatch?

We will never win again if he isn't removed. He's a Team President type masquerading as a coach

Brook Lopez was the tallest guy in the Celtics series by how many inches…..?

[CharityStripe34]

I think he's fine but I also think he's unquestionably a guy whose "by the game plan" attitude hurts him far more often then other guys considered high tier coaches. I think the defensive stuff has shown a lot and gets a lot of attention but I also think it shows itself on offensive side a ton as well.

Obviously we're not looking at a 1:1 scenario or anything here but one thing that stood out to me this playoffs. Miami faced off against Atlanta. Anti-PJ dudes loved to point out how Trae got put on PJ who just stood in the corner and couldn't do anything. In our series PJ was guarded by Trae for 20 minutes, shot two shots from three and didn't, and wasn't asked, to do anything else. Fast forward to this series and Atlanta once again tries hiding Trae on PJ. What happens? Spo sends PJ into the post. Spo attacks the mismatch. Trae guarded PJ all of 5 minutes in their series. Why? 14 points and 2 assists on 9 shots, 7/9 coming inside the arc. I think there's a bunch of stuff like this throughout the years that Bud overlooks that just makes life increasingly harder on himself.

Isn't this like basketball 101? How do we expect to be a mini dynasty (for which we have the players) if our coach can't exploit this obvious mismatch?

We will never win again if he isn't removed. He's a Team President type masquerading as a coach

Brook Lopez was the tallest guy in the Celtics series by how many inches…..?

And it took PG Gianni in Game 7 to motion for Brook to post up White for an easy And 1 layup.

Sent from my LM-K500 using RealGM mobile app

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

Brook had the lowest on court offensive rating of anyone getting major minutes (90.5 pts/100) and Bucks had their best offensive rating with him off the court (105.8 pts/100) compared to any other player off. Though not sure how much of his minutes were stacked without Giannis. Because the Bucks **** sucked with Giannis on the bench this series.

All I know is for sure is that it was ludicrous Jevon Carter couldn't see a minute of meaningful action after game 1.

no real thoughts on javon carter. ive never thought of him as a difference maker in this league.

as it relates to lopez specifically....not playing him should not have been considered practically. just practically the idea he wouldnt play isnt reasonable. he is part of who we are and has been a big part of who we are. you dont just dump a dude like that for a javon carter. thats not how it works..... again practically its not how it works.

it will be interesting to see what we do this summer with lopez moving forward. its not like we were all feeling like the world was fabulous this season when he was out. the small ball lineups we used werent like omg this is who we need to be moviung forward so not sure what the answer for that is. it better not be javon carter thats for sure

either way thanks for sharing his numbers. it will be interesting to see what happens this offseason

Uh what are you talking about with PG Jevon Carter replacing Lopez??

lopez is the guy in the rotation everybody wanted out and carters the guy everybody said should have played. all the coaching gurus on the board wanted hill out too. i havent heard anybody mention ibaka or nwora or mamu or anybody else needed to play just carter. am i confused here?

so if im clear the fan/coach savants wanted a playoff rotation of.....

jrue / carter
allen / carter
wes / pat
giannis/ pat
portis/ pat

no lopez or hill add carter. this seems to be the thinking mans rotation

[Baddy Chuck]

lopez is the guy in the rotation everybody wanted out and carters the guy everybody said should have played. all the coaching gurus on the board wanted hill out too. i havent heard anybody mention ibaka or nwora or mamu or anybody else needed to play just carter. am i confused here?

so if im clear the fan/coach savants wanted a playoff rotation of.....

jrue / carter
allen / carter
wes / pat
giannis/ pat
portis/ pat

no lopez or hill add carter. this seems to be the thinking mans rotation

I mean........... it's probably not far off? You laugh it off but a lineup of Jrue/Wes/Pat/Bobby/Giannis was pretty much our best lineup in that series (33 minutes - 2nd most, +26.2 netrtg). Limiting Hill/Allen/Lopez showed to have worked throughout the series as even in our 3 wins they had a negative net rating. I mean it is what it is, but they got played off the court. Obviously you're probably not looking at cutting them completely, especially with how short manned we were, but when the opposition is playing guys like Theis and Pritchard it's probably more or less the times you look to work them in rather then pushing them out there for their scheduled minutes since game 1. You stick with what works in a 7 game series. And that isn't always what worked against the Bulls or the regular season.

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

lopez is the guy in the rotation everybody wanted out and carters the guy everybody said should have played. all the coaching gurus on the board wanted hill out too. i havent heard anybody mention ibaka or nwora or mamu or anybody else needed to play just carter. am i confused here?

so if im clear the fan/coach savants wanted a playoff rotation of.....

jrue / carter
allen / carter
wes / pat
giannis/ pat
portis/ pat

no lopez or hill add carter. this seems to be the thinking mans rotation

I mean........... it's probably not far off? You laugh it off but a lineup of Jrue/Wes/Pat/Bobby/Giannis was pretty much our best lineup in that series (33 minutes - 2nd most, +26.2 netrtg). Limiting Hill/Allen/Lopez showed to have worked throughout the series as even in our 3 wins they had a negative net rating. I mean it is what it is, but they got played off the court. Obviously you're probably not looking at cutting them completely, especially with how short manned we were, but when the opposition is playing guys like Theis and Pritchard it's probably more or less the times you look to work them in rather then pushing them out there for their scheduled minutes since game 1. You stick with what works in a 7 game series. And that isn't always what worked against the Bulls or the regular season.

in our 3 wins....

lopez was -8 in 77 minutes

should that play any role in our thinking? that he was soaking up effective minutes in the gamnes we won? or still we bench him proactively in game 6/7 for the services of javon carter?

i think we got beat because without middleton they were just better than us. honestly i think by the end of the series with what they figured out they probably would have won 9 out of the next 10 games. bud threw at them the best we had. it worked...alot. but once they adjusted and got their confidence there wasnt really anything left to do unless this was like a 82 game series where we could experiment with more off the wall lineups like what are being suggested here.

[M-C-G]

We made it stupidly far with such horrendous shooting efforts from three while giving up so many good looks from three. I can't blame Bud for us missing threes but I can sure give him some of the blame that everyone has to have a foot in the paint which makes giving up open threes happen on every other possession.

Top 10 coach that isn't a top 5 coach could be if he just made some minor adjustments. Also, we would have won the series with some average shooting from guys, maybe even below average, but they sucked in the spotlight.

[James1980]

Kerr's adjustments last night should end any debate between him and Bud.

[GHOSTofSIKMA]

Kerr's adjustments last night should end any debate between him and Bud.

meh... after game 1 against boston bud was the goat too

[BroncoBuck]

Kerr's adjustments last night should end any debate between him and Bud.

Ask James Wiseman about Steve Kerr’s inability to make adjustments.

[James1980]

Kerr's adjustments last night should end any debate between him and Bud.

Ask James Wiseman about Steve Kerr’s inability to make adjustments.

Hasn't he been hurt all year?

[Milbucks96]

It’s hard to judge Kerr(or any coach like previously stated) because he’s coached 2 all time greats in Steph/KD, 2 other hof all in their primes plus iggy, plus multiple quality guys on vet mins just because of the city/talent that was already there. David west would never turn down millions to play in Milwaukee. Even the biggest Bud hater knows that he would have crazy success in the same situation. I still think Kerr is better though.

Bud really has one of the most impressive active resumes with a lot less talent than the other guys above him. Other than Giannis and maybe horford after this run, nobody else is even close to a hof. You can call Khris and Jrue underrated all you want but they ain’t perennial all star/all nba guys because they ain’t on that level. We’ve seen the top guys without stacked teams and it ain’t pretty.

A lot of the criticism is 100% correct but Bud is a good coach, maybe not great but definitely a good coach.

[skones]

Bud is a top 10 coach, I'm just not sure this team doesn't need a new voice for them to take the next step. We just play stupid basketball. We played stupid basketball into one championship, but I'm not sure we can do it again.

[Perseus1966]

I dont believe there is a good coach in nba ,first of all they do not coach they are managers ,look Bartzokas ,he took a team with 1/3 of the money of real or barca to the F4 ,he deserves a chance especially in bucks

[old skool]

Over the last four seasons, Budenholzer has been the most successful coach in the NBA. He has won more regular season games, more playoff games and more playoff series than any other coach.

Much of that success is surely due to having great talent, but great talent does not guarantee success. Bud had to put the pieces together and make it work. He deserves some credit for that success.

I think most fans undervalue Bud's ability to keep individual players happy and focused on team goals. DiVincenzo was focused all last season despite being 99.99% traded to for Bogdanovic. Portis liked his role enough to come back on a team friendly deal and accepted his bench role when Lopez returned from back surgery. Hill and Mathews returned willingly. Lopez is content to close out games on the bench. Every iteration of Bud's Bucks seem to like each other and play for the team over themselves. That should count for something.

[th87]

Over the last four seasons, Budenholzer has been the most successful coach in the NBA. He has won more regular season games, more playoff games and more playoff series than any other coach.

Much of that success is surely due to having great talent, but great talent does not guarantee success. Bud had to put the pieces together and make it work. He deserves some credit for that success.

I think most fans undervalue Bud's ability to keep individual players happy and focused on team goals. DiVincenzo was focused all last season despite being 99.99% traded to for Bogdanovic. Portis liked his role enough to come back on a team friendly deal and accepted his bench role when Lopez returned from back surgery. Hill and Mathews returned willingly. Lopez is content to close out games on the bench. Every iteration of Bud's Bucks seem to like each other and play for the team over themselves. That should count for something.

This is a good point. But the flipside is that players might play that maybe shouldn't.