Danny 'WaRChEsT' Ainge was playing Chess while much of RealGM was playing Checkers.

[Fencer reregistered]

I always felt the whole "war chest" thing was over exaggerated. They had a lot of picks. They didn't have a lot of good picks. The idea that he failed by not turning a bunch of post-lottery picks into stars is silly because that's not how trades work. The only picks that were ever going to be a factor in star player trades were the Smart/Tatum/Brown picks. And considering timeline and all of that, I think he's long been vindicated that players like Paul George or Jimmy Butler weren't the ones to go for.

My criticisms of Ainge was that he never valued role players enough. That's where he held onto his "war chest" too long on. Most of their picks were in the 20s and even the best drafting teams don't hit at a high rate there over the long haul. This isn't the NFL where there's good value late. Most players taken out of the lottery, heck even in the late lottery, just don't hack it in the NBA. He was always so reluctant to ever trade those low value picks to add role players to good teams and I never got that.

My other criticism is that those back to back #14 picks he got were wasted with Langford/Nesmith. Again, those are too late to trade for stars. But you really gotta hit at least one of them. BUT, to be fair, he managed to hit two homerun picks in the 20s with Rob and Grant Williams though and that really covered for the misses there. But totally whiffing on those picks was a tough miss.

I think the Kyrie move was one he had to go for. Didn't work, but I don't fault him. Hard to place any blame on the Hayward flop signing just due to the injury. I know Kemba flamed out, but he was actually phenomenal for them until he hurt his knee halfway through that first year. I don't blame Ainge for that signing either. I don't hold those against him really.

He let go of good role players he did have too easily, sometimes, especially ones who added to team chemistry. James Posey and Tony Allen are classic examples. Kendrick Perkins is an even bigger one, arguably.

(Admittedly, Tony Allen became a chemistry leader only after going to Memphis.)

[Fencer reregistered]

In hindsight, Ainge made a huge mistake dumping Horford for Walker. Luckily, Stevens fixed Ainge's mistake, or Boston wouldn't be in the finals right now.

Except he didn't do that. Horford wanted to leave and the sixers gave him a ridiculous offer that no one saw coming. The only team that dumped Horford was the Sixers a year later.

He could have matched Philly's bid if he weren't set on getting Walker.

[robbie84]

Wild concept to me to gloat about someone else’s accomplishments to tell off a bunch on strangers on the internet about it.

But have at it. Celtics are having a great season.

Right, because the RealGM general board has never had threads with haters gloating and telling a bunch of Celtics fans about Danny Ainge being a failure for holding onto his assets for too long or wasting his 'war chest'.

[Buckeye-NBAFan]

In hindsight, Ainge made a huge mistake dumping Horford for Walker. Luckily, Stevens fixed Ainge's mistake, or Boston wouldn't be in the finals right now.

Except he didn't do that. Horford wanted to leave and the sixers gave him a ridiculous offer that no one saw coming. The only team that dumped Horford was the Sixers a year later.

Yes, you are correct, Horford left because Philly offered him more money, and he would have stayed if Boston had offered more, but they maxed Kemba instead.

Read on Twitter

Anyway, I wouldn't have paid Horford that much, but it doesn't change the fact that Stevens had the balls to pull the trigger on a bold deal that went a long way toward pushing Boston over the top in the East, and which also happened to reserve a swap Ainge had made 2 years earlier.

[JimmyPlopper]

Wild concept to me to gloat about someone else’s accomplishments to tell off a bunch on strangers on the internet about it.

But have at it. Celtics are having a great season.

Right, because the RealGM general board has never had threads with haters gloating and telling a bunch of Celtics fans about Danny Ainge being a failure for holding onto his assets for too long or wasting his 'war chest'.

I haven't been around long enough here to know about what you're talking about, re: the warchest references. But if it was true, wouldn't you rather ignore those folks rather than playing into their game?

[sp6r=underrated]

Eh, Ainge was always great.

He got one ring, and he would have had at least another if he didn't constantly have previously injury free all-stars either fall to injury in their primes: IT, Kemba, Hayward. Or mental issues in Irving (at least he was always injury prone so that wasn't new).

What other team has had 4 20 something all-stars without injury issues fall off the cliff due to injuries in about 6 years?

Injuries is what stopped Ainge from a second ring. Hell one might even argue KG's injury in 2009 did the same thing but at least he was in his 30s so those things happen and are within the realm of normal probability events.

This is pretty much my take but I slightly disagree with your take on the KG era Celtics. They actually had very good health in the post-season considering the age of their big 3. Only 1 post-season out of 5 did they suffer a major injury.

[HoopsterJones]

Wild concept to me to gloat about someone else’s accomplishments to tell off a bunch on strangers on the internet about it.

But have at it. Celtics are having a great season.

Right, because the RealGM general board has never had threads with haters gloating and telling a bunch of Celtics fans about Danny Ainge being a failure for holding onto his assets for too long or wasting his 'war chest'.

Just means you’re sensitive about negative sentiment towards your favorite team and it bothered you enough for you to unnecessarily gloat about it now as some sort a retribution because it makes you feel good. Who cares what people think about the Celtics? Doesn’t change the fact they made it to the Finals and have an opportunity to win it all. Enjoy the ride brother.

[scottyno]

Eh, Ainge was always great.

He got one ring, and he would have had at least another if he didn't constantly have previously injury free all-stars either fall to injury in their primes: IT, Kemba, Hayward. Or mental issues in Irving (at least he was always injury prone so that wasn't new).

What other team has had 4 20 something all-stars without injury issues fall off the cliff due to injuries in about 6 years?

Injuries is what stopped Ainge from a second ring. Hell one might even argue KG's injury in 2009 did the same thing but at least he was in his 30s so those things happen and are within the realm of normal probability events.

This is pretty much my take but I slightly disagree with your take on the KG era Celtics. They actually had very good health in the post-season considering the age of their big 3. Only 1 post-season out of 5 did they suffer a major injury.

2009: KG missed the entire playoffs, with him the Cs would have been the favorites to repeat
2010: Lost Perkins in game 6 of the finals, got killed on the glass in g7, they likely win that game with him
2011: You're going to laugh, but missing Shaq in the playoffs was massive. With him the Cs were the best team in the league, and if he somehow stays healthy they have a great shot at a title. Though at his age him being unavailable wasn't a huge shock.
2012: Ray Allen was invisible in the playoffs because he was dealing with bone spurs. They still went 7 with the Miami super team.

Only one post season out of 5 were they actually healthy.

[celticfan42487]

Eh, Ainge was always great.

He got one ring, and he would have had at least another if he didn't constantly have previously injury free all-stars either fall to injury in their primes: IT, Kemba, Hayward. Or mental issues in Irving (at least he was always injury prone so that wasn't new).

What other team has had 4 20 something all-stars without injury issues fall off the cliff due to injuries in about 6 years?

Injuries is what stopped Ainge from a second ring. Hell one might even argue KG's injury in 2009 did the same thing but at least he was in his 30s so those things happen and are within the realm of normal probability events.

This is pretty much my take but I slightly disagree with your take on the KG era Celtics. They actually had very good health in the post-season considering the age of their big 3. Only 1 post-season out of 5 did they suffer a major injury.

Sure but the KG 09' injury is the only thing that matters.

Hell do the same thing to Ray Allen but still have an in prime KG and the Celtics roll without an issue. Probably couldn't replace Pierce or KG but yeah KG needed to be an MVP level player and he wasn't after that.

In the same way that Hayward is still playing but a shell of himself, KG was still playing but a shell of himself from 2009 onward. That is a major injury.

That said given their age it's not unexpected. Anyone over 30 and these things will happen.

[robbie84]

Wild concept to me to gloat about someone else’s accomplishments to tell off a bunch on strangers on the internet about it.

But have at it. Celtics are having a great season.

Right, because the RealGM general board has never had threads with haters gloating and telling a bunch of Celtics fans about Danny Ainge being a failure for holding onto his assets for too long or wasting his 'war chest'.

Just means you’re sensitive about negative sentiment towards your favorite team and it bothered you enough for you to unnecessarily gloat about it now as some sort a retribution because it makes you feel good. Who cares what people think about the Celtics? Doesn’t change the fact they made it to the Finals and have an opportunity to win it all. Enjoy the ride brother.

I just think Ainge doesn't get the credit he deserves- and he's often mocked when he should be respected.
I don't see anything wrong with posting in support of him or bringing up the fact that he's been dogged by many here.
Being a fan is different for everybody. I could just as easily tell you that you don't need to reply or give your two cents about my post lol.
Why do you care? (Rhetorical)
Anyway,I'm enjoying the ride, and reading realgm negativity about the Celtics and Ainge over the past decade here are making that ride just a little sweeter.
Hope that makes sense. Thankyou, I know you're not being a douche. Will enjoy the finals and hopefully the Celtics somehow overcome the Warriors dynasty.

[MrBigShot]

Eh, Ainge was always great.

He got one ring, and he would have had at least another if he didn't constantly have previously injury free all-stars either fall to injury in their primes: IT, Kemba, Hayward. Or mental issues in Irving (at least he was always injury prone so that wasn't new).

What other team has had 4 20 something all-stars without injury issues fall off the cliff due to injuries in about 6 years?

Injuries is what stopped Ainge from a second ring. Hell one might even argue KG's injury in 2009 did the same thing but at least he was in his 30s so those things happen and are within the realm of normal probability events.

This is pretty much my take but I slightly disagree with your take on the KG era Celtics. They actually had very good health in the post-season considering the age of their big 3. Only 1 post-season out of 5 did they suffer a major injury.

Sure but the KG 09' injury is the only thing that matters.

Hell do the same thing to Ray Allen but still have an in prime KG and the Celtics roll without an issue. Probably couldn't replace Pierce or KG but yeah KG needed to be an MVP level player and he wasn't after that.

In the same way that Hayward is still playing but a shell of himself, KG was still playing but a shell of himself from 2009 onward. That is a major injury.

That said given their age it's not unexpected. Anyone over 30 and these things will happen.

Dunno if the celtics win with KG but no Ray, but I did just check KG's stats and wow he really did fall off a cliff after the 2009 injury.

As far as Ainge goes, he also drafted Al Jefferson at 15, Tony Allen at 25, Avery Bradley at 19, Rozier at 16. Drafting plays a pretty critical role in winning championships historically. Magic, Bird, MJ, Duncan, Steph, Kobe...30 championships between the six of them, all drafted by teams they played for their entire careers.

He is more responsible for building this team than anyone else and absolutely deserves credit for drafting so well.

[SelfishPlayer]

Ainge failed.

[Johnny Bball]

Walker was an ironman before he joined the C's, as you've been reminded of before. Fournier was a punt to see if he'd help get us over the hump. What were thr long term percussions of trading a 2nd rounder for an expiring Fournier?
He'll they almost made the finals with an injured Kemba and injured Hayward.
Ainges luck with injuries was simply awful.

Neither played defence and neither was a good fit in the first place. If by punt you mean bad decision and just gambling.. sure thing.

Neither played defense but Kemba was an All NBA player and scorer, who suffered a career crashing injury after being an ironman his entire NBA career.
Not sure how that's Ainges fault? Let me guess, you think we should have re-signed Isaiah Thomas too?

You also didn't answer my question about Fournier. What were the awful long term implications of trading a 2nd rounder for Fournier?

You'd just prefer to ignore the entire list of players he drafted that got us to the finals here, and instead point out the 2nd rounder we lost for Fournier, and the knee injury to Kemba that Ainge should've seen coming looking into the future.

We wouldn't be in the finals this year if Danny Ainge hadn't built this house.

The implications are he was eating up 20 mil in cap space that could be better used.

Stevens got two seconds for fournier I think and had to trade firsts to get rid of Walker and clean up ainge bad cap mess. ainge let so many other players just walk wasting assets. You can look at my posts but I thought he was toast the year (or maybe a bit longer) before they fired him. But Ainge was finally fired..and he was fired for good reason. He couldn’t finish building a winner (he’s cheap and doesn’t negotiate in good faith) and at least stevens has given himself a better shot in only one year.

And yet, here the Celtics are in the finals and here some Celtic fans are actually defending the guy like he never should have been canned. The Celtics would not be in the finals if ainge wasn’t canned. It’s crazy. I wish you all got,your wish and had ainge as a gm still, so I could watch someone else in the finals but alas.

[ForeverTFC]

Huh? This year is a clear example of why Ainge was flawed. Not everything needs to be a home run or a steal. Stevens gave up value for Horford and White and got rewarded. Ainge isn’t making either trade.

[LordCovington33]

The majority said the Jaylen Brown deal was bad? Unless proof, I call BS. That was a great deal at the time.

[Exp0sed]

OP just setting himself up for some humble pie in a week

not really..28 teams aren't in the finals and most of those haven't been in the finals (or close to it) for years

If they fail to win it this year, this core is still young and healthy and should be competing for championships in the coming years as well

Ainge (along with Stevens) got them there, there are no guarantees
That's his job as an exec and he did a good one despite Realgm hating on him

[bradybunch]

GOAT level.

[WolfAddict]

Wild concept to me to gloat about someone else’s accomplishments to tell off a bunch on strangers on the internet about it.

But have at it. Celtics are having a great season.

For someone who's been around for a while, this shouldn't seem too wild bro... this IS the GB after all

[Reeko]

The majority said the Jaylen Brown deal was bad? Unless proof, I call BS. That was a great deal at the time.

Yeah that one made me say "Huh?". Pretty sure most people thought it was a great contract at the time and that Brown would have gotten way more had he been an RFA.

[robbie84]

The majority said the Jaylen Brown deal was bad? Unless proof, I call BS. That was a great deal at the time.

Yeah that one made me say "Huh?". Pretty sure most people thought it was a great contract at the time and that Brown would have gotten way more had he been an RFA.

Oh there were numerous posts about how the Celtics would be hamstrung by a guy who was barely an All Star etc...