2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
Moderators: Clyde Frazier, Doctor MJ, trex_8063, penbeast0, PaulieWal
2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
-
- Pro Prospect
- Posts: 928
- And1: 249
- Joined: Jun 03, 2013
2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
Who had the more impressive playoff run?
Re: 2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
-
- RealGM
- Posts: 29,899
- And1: 25,242
- Joined: Aug 11, 2015
-
Re: 2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
The highest level imaginable from both. You can argue all you want which one is better or more impressive, but it's more of a matter of preference than actual difference in quality.
Re: 2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
-
- Analyst
- Posts: 3,264
- And1: 2,973
- Joined: Dec 25, 2019
-
Re: 2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
I'll go 2012 Lebron. I think he was a true all-timer on the offensive end, while being in discussion for arguably the best non-big perimeter defender ever.
Lebron averaged an Inflation Adjusted 31.6 points per 75 possessions on a rTS% of 6.5%. Believe it or not, this PS run actually puts him in the same air as some of 92 and 93 MJ's PS scoring performances, despite having quite a player beside him in Wade sharing possessions on ball, who was still an easy top 10 player (and top 10 offensive player at this point). I think being that Lebron's scoring was so stellar as I mentioned, along with being a top 5 playmaker ever, puts him in special air on the offensive end.
The 2012 Heat actually had a better rORTG rating than any Bulls Championship run other than 1992...I compare Lebron to MJ not to start arguments, but rather because MJ is his closest perimeter wing star in terms of offensive brilliance; in other words, I am trying to put into context just how special his 2012 PS run was. I don't think many consider 12 Lebron to be close to his offensive peak (It seems like, 12, 14, 16-18 all get brought up before it), but in terms of actual performance, 12 Lebron might be underrated in this sense.
Continuing on, the opponent faced on average an opponent with a rDRTG of -3.4 in the 2012 PS, which is absurdly high. The only championship winning teams since 2000 to have faced a higher average quality of opponent defense were the 01 and 02 Lakers (faced a rDRTG of -3.6), and the Miami Heat in their 2013 Championship run (faced a rDRTG of -3.9). For the Heat to have performed so well offensively considering the stiff competition is noteworthy. Also the Heat's 3rd best offensive player in Chris Bosh only played in 14 of the 23 PS games.
That combined with his outlier defense, makes me side with him.
Lebron averaged an Inflation Adjusted 31.6 points per 75 possessions on a rTS% of 6.5%. Believe it or not, this PS run actually puts him in the same air as some of 92 and 93 MJ's PS scoring performances, despite having quite a player beside him in Wade sharing possessions on ball, who was still an easy top 10 player (and top 10 offensive player at this point). I think being that Lebron's scoring was so stellar as I mentioned, along with being a top 5 playmaker ever, puts him in special air on the offensive end.
The 2012 Heat actually had a better rORTG rating than any Bulls Championship run other than 1992...I compare Lebron to MJ not to start arguments, but rather because MJ is his closest perimeter wing star in terms of offensive brilliance; in other words, I am trying to put into context just how special his 2012 PS run was. I don't think many consider 12 Lebron to be close to his offensive peak (It seems like, 12, 14, 16-18 all get brought up before it), but in terms of actual performance, 12 Lebron might be underrated in this sense.
Continuing on, the opponent faced on average an opponent with a rDRTG of -3.4 in the 2012 PS, which is absurdly high. The only championship winning teams since 2000 to have faced a higher average quality of opponent defense were the 01 and 02 Lakers (faced a rDRTG of -3.6), and the Miami Heat in their 2013 Championship run (faced a rDRTG of -3.9). For the Heat to have performed so well offensively considering the stiff competition is noteworthy. Also the Heat's 3rd best offensive player in Chris Bosh only played in 14 of the 23 PS games.
That combined with his outlier defense, makes me side with him.
Re: 2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
-
- RealGM
- Posts: 12,170
- And1: 13,700
- Joined: Dec 04, 2013
Re: 2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
2012 LeBron was second on this list behind 1991 Jordan and just ahead of 2003 Tim Duncan who was third,so very close!...This list were from 2018
https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/23651740/ranking-50-greatest-individual-postseasons-modern-nba-history
https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/23651740/ranking-50-greatest-individual-postseasons-modern-nba-history
Re: 2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
-
- Head Coach
- Posts: 7,104
- And1: 3,912
- Joined: Oct 04, 2018
Re: 2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
2012 is peak Lebron, i’ll take him. In my mind there’s probably only 3 or 4 postseason runs in history better than that one.
Re: 2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
- homecourtloss
- RealGM
- Posts: 11,395
- And1: 18,798
- Joined: Dec 29, 2012
Re: 2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
LukaTheGOAT wrote:I'll go 2012 Lebron. I think he was a true all-timer on the offensive end, while being in discussion for arguably the best non-big perimeter defender ever.
Lebron averaged an Inflation Adjusted 31.6 points per 75 possessions on a rTS% of 6.5%. Believe it or not, this PS run actually puts him in the same air as some of 92 and 93 MJ's PS scoring performances, despite having quite a player beside him in Wade sharing possessions on ball, who was still an easy top 10 player (and top 10 offensive player at this point). I think being that Lebron's scoring was so stellar as I mentioned, along with being a top 5 playmaker ever, puts him in special air on the offensive end.
The 2012 Heat actually had a better rORTG rating than any Bulls Championship run other than 1992...I compare Lebron to MJ not to start arguments, but rather because MJ is his closest perimeter wing star in terms of offensive brilliance; in other words, I am trying to put into context just how special his 2012 PS run was. I don't think many consider 12 Lebron to be close to his offensive peak (It seems like, 12, 14, 16-18 all get brought up before it), but in terms of actual performance, 12 Lebron might be underrated in this sense.
Continuing on, the opponent faced on average an opponent with a rDRTG of -3.4 in the 2012 PS, which is absurdly high. The only championship winning teams to have faced a higher average quality of opponent defense were the 01 and 02 Lakers (faced a rDRTG of -3.6), and the Miami Heat in their 2013 Championship run (faced a rDRTG of -3.9). For the Heat to have performed so well offensively considering the stiff competition is noteworthy.
That combined with his outlier defense, makes me side with him.
Good stuff as always. It was interesting to see how effective James/Wade combo was in both the regular season and post season before Wade declined hard with his injuries and the league moving towards greater spacing.
Do you Backpicks #s for Duncan 2003 and James 2012?
lessthanjake wrote:Kyrie was extremely impactful without LeBron, and basically had zero impact whatsoever if LeBron was on the court.
lessthanjake wrote: By playing in a way that prevents Kyrie from getting much impact, LeBron ensures that controlling for Kyrie has limited effect…
Re: 2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
-
- Pro Prospect
- Posts: 928
- And1: 249
- Joined: Jun 03, 2013
Re: 2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
Which postseason runs do you consider better than Lebron's 2012 run?No-more-rings wrote:2012 is peak Lebron, i’ll take him. In my mind there’s probably only 3 or 4 postseason runs in history better than that one.
Re: 2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
-
- Head Coach
- Posts: 7,104
- And1: 3,912
- Joined: Oct 04, 2018
Re: 2003 Tim Duncan vs 2012 LeBron James. Who's playoff run was more impressive?
AMW27 wrote:Which postseason runs do you consider better than Lebron's 2012 run?No-more-rings wrote:2012 is peak Lebron, i’ll take him. In my mind there’s probably only 3 or 4 postseason runs in history better than that one.
Probably just 90 Jordan, 91 Jordan and 2009 Lebron.