Around the NBA - the sharp end of the playoffs - Randle snubbed for All NBA

[spree2kawhi]

Wiggins has been the 2nd best player for the Warriors. Brown is the 2nd best Celtic. Versatile wings remain highly valuable. Another win for team RJ!

RJ Porter?

[Montmorencie]

Warriors have 4 second best players.

[Clyde_Style]

It was always ridiculous to try and take something away from Curry‘s all time great status or legacy. Pathetic or stupid actually.

All those narratives are nothing but BS and of course that’s also regardless of the outcome of this series.

I don’t get into any of these debates, including the ones about KD being fake for joining the warriors. I consider any team that is champs in the NBA earned it. It is just too long a season and too difficult to accomplish for me to take that away from anyone.

As far as Steph goes I will never forget one of the finals against the Cavs (don’t know which year) when I remember him literally running laps around the perimeter over and over again in order to get freed to receive the ball late in the game. He was panting and completely exhausted, but he just kept going and pushing. It was one of the greatest displays of effort and tenacity in the sport that I’ve ever seen. Steph could miss every shot the rest of his career and it wouldn’t take away from his accomplishments.

[KnicksGadfly]

People gotta stop disrespecting Tatum by calling him Randle. The front runner for the Randle award in this series is Draymond Green.

[spree2kawhi]

People gotta stop disrespecting Tatum by calling him Randle. The front runner for the Randle award in this series is Draymond Green.

Green was still so good that Randle wouldn’t have helped the Warriors over him. It’s the vision.

[EricAnderson]

It was always ridiculous to try and take something away from Curry‘s all time great status or legacy. Pathetic or stupid actually.

All those narratives are nothing but BS and of course that’s also regardless of the outcome of this series.

I don’t get into any of these debates, including the ones about KD being fake for joining the warriors. I consider any team that is champs in the NBA earned it. It is just too long a season and too difficult to accomplish for me to take that away from anyone.

As far as Steph goes I will never forget one of the finals against the Cavs (don’t know which year) when I remember him literally running laps around the perimeter over and over again in order to get freed to receive the ball late in the game. He was panting and completely exhausted, but he just kept going and pushing. It was one of the greatest displays of effort and tenacity in the sport that I’ve ever seen. Steph could miss every shot the rest of his career and it wouldn’t take away from his accomplishments.

Nah KD going to GS made the league non competitive for a few years.

We’ve never seen a player lose a classic 7 game series then join that team

Would have been like Jordan joining the Pistons instead of trying to beat them or Ewing joining the Bulls after 93.

[spree2kawhi]

It would do a lot for resume to win a finals mvp as it’s one of the main criticisms when compared to other all time greats

I think he was robbed of FMVP in 2015, and I count that year as a FMVP year for him.

One of the great robberies in the history of the NBA, along with LAL-DET game 6, LAL-SAC game 6 and HOU-GSW (2018) game 7.

some would agree with that but at the end of the day it’s still a talking point, winning this one would put that to rest

It would do a lot to shut up idiots and casuals. However, apart from what such low life keep saying, Curry has already entered top 10 all time and easily best PG ever status by carrying such a team like only true legends do.

[spree2kawhi]

It was always ridiculous to try and take something away from Curry‘s all time great status or legacy. Pathetic or stupid actually.

All those narratives are nothing but BS and of course that’s also regardless of the outcome of this series.

I don’t get into any of these debates, including the ones about KD being fake for joining the warriors. I consider any team that is champs in the NBA earned it. It is just too long a season and too difficult to accomplish for me to take that away from anyone.

As far as Steph goes I will never forget one of the finals against the Cavs (don’t know which year) when I remember him literally running laps around the perimeter over and over again in order to get freed to receive the ball late in the game. He was panting and completely exhausted, but he just kept going and pushing. It was one of the greatest displays of effort and tenacity in the sport that I’ve ever seen. Steph could miss every shot the rest of his career and it wouldn’t take away from his accomplishments.

Nah KD going to GS made the league non competitive for a few years.

We’ve never seen a player lose a classic 7 game series then join that team

Would have been like Jordan joining the Pistons instead of trying to beat them or Ewing joining the Bulls after 93.

This is just such a bad take and also doesn’t take anything away from Curry‘s greatness. Where would you have gone? Back to OKC and Westbrook? Definitely not.

[Reign23]

current draymond is one of the worst offensive players I've ever seen.
in the finals he is averaging 4.3 pts on 30.7% FG / 0% 3FG / 17.9% FT.
yikes.

You should maybe watch him pass and screen.

I know what he does. but you have to make a basket every once in a while to keep the defense honest.
still a good player, but I would cut his minutes a little If I am Steve Kerr tbh. Warriors looked a lot better with Looney + a small lineup.

[Clyde_Style]

It was always ridiculous to try and take something away from Curry‘s all time great status or legacy. Pathetic or stupid actually.

All those narratives are nothing but BS and of course that’s also regardless of the outcome of this series.

I don’t get into any of these debates, including the ones about KD being fake for joining the warriors. I consider any team that is champs in the NBA earned it. It is just too long a season and too difficult to accomplish for me to take that away from anyone.

As far as Steph goes I will never forget one of the finals against the Cavs (don’t know which year) when I remember him literally running laps around the perimeter over and over again in order to get freed to receive the ball late in the game. He was panting and completely exhausted, but he just kept going and pushing. It was one of the greatest displays of effort and tenacity in the sport that I’ve ever seen. Steph could miss every shot the rest of his career and it wouldn’t take away from his accomplishments.

Nah KD going to GS made the league non competitive for a few years.

We’ve never seen a player lose a classic 7 game series then join that team

Would have been like Jordan joining the Pistons instead of trying to beat them or Ewing joining the Bulls after 93.

I’m not on board with this or the apparent consensus about player motives for signing with any club. If KD’s contract was up and it was time to sign a new one he could have stayed in OKC which he didn’t want to do. If he had signed with a struggling small market club then I suppose that would make him a man a character. I think the whole premise is bollocks no matter what choice a player makes.

We all know KD’s personality is sort of fragile and he makes his choices for reasons that may include not wanting to deal with the heat generated by our crazy fan base. But it still means zip to me that he chose GS when it was time to pick a club to go to. Lebron is a an all-time great and he chose to take his talents to South Beach.

Fukem both if that is how you feel, but it still takes nothing away from either one in my opinion when they won their rings. They deserved the honor of being called a champion no matter what snotty fans say. And fck KD for tearing his achilles in the finals when he tried to help out his club when he should have been recuperating instead. What a loser.

[cgmw]

I don’t get into any of these debates, including the ones about KD being fake for joining the warriors. I consider any team that is champs in the NBA earned it. It is just too long a season and too difficult to accomplish for me to take that away from anyone.

As far as Steph goes I will never forget one of the finals against the Cavs (don’t know which year) when I remember him literally running laps around the perimeter over and over again in order to get freed to receive the ball late in the game. He was panting and completely exhausted, but he just kept going and pushing. It was one of the greatest displays of effort and tenacity in the sport that I’ve ever seen. Steph could miss every shot the rest of his career and it wouldn’t take away from his accomplishments.

Nah KD going to GS made the league non competitive for a few years.

We’ve never seen a player lose a classic 7 game series then join that team

Would have been like Jordan joining the Pistons instead of trying to beat them or Ewing joining the Bulls after 93.

I’m not on board with this or the apparent consensus about player motives for signing with any club. If KD’s contract was up and it was time to sign a new one he could have stayed in OKC which he didn’t want to do. If he had signed with a struggling small market club then I suppose that would make him a man a character. I think the whole premise is bollocks no matter what choice a player makes.

We all know KD’s personality is sort of fragile and he makes his choices for reasons that may include not wanting to deal with the heat generated by our crazy fan base. But it still means zip to me that he chose GS when it was time to pick a club to go to. Lebron is a an all-time great and he chose to take his talents to South Beach.

Fukem both if that is how you feel, but it still takes nothing away from either one in my opinion when they won their rings. They deserved the honor of being called a champion no matter what snotty fans say. And fck KD for tearing his achilles in the finals when he tried to help out his club when he should have been recuperating instead. What a loser.

I dont typically have a dog in the fight when it comes to Durant, but that’s a very strange take.

You don’t see any relevance to the Warriors being the defending champs, having the best record in the history of the sport, and literally beating KD’s Thunder the season before KD joined the Warriors?

The concept of greatness is arbitrary and ultimately a matter of popular opinion, but Durant’s greatness will always be questioned because of the decision to join up with an already great team that was already steam rolling opponents (including him) without him.

[Clyde_Style]

Nah KD going to GS made the league non competitive for a few years.

We’ve never seen a player lose a classic 7 game series then join that team

Would have been like Jordan joining the Pistons instead of trying to beat them or Ewing joining the Bulls after 93.

I’m not on board with this or the apparent consensus about player motives for signing with any club. If KD’s contract was up and it was time to sign a new one he could have stayed in OKC which he didn’t want to do. If he had signed with a struggling small market club then I suppose that would make him a man a character. I think the whole premise is bollocks no matter what choice a player makes.

We all know KD’s personality is sort of fragile and he makes his choices for reasons that may include not wanting to deal with the heat generated by our crazy fan base. But it still means zip to me that he chose GS when it was time to pick a club to go to. Lebron is a an all-time great and he chose to take his talents to South Beach.

Fukem both if that is how you feel, but it still takes nothing away from either one in my opinion when they won their rings. They deserved the honor of being called a champion no matter what snotty fans say. And fck KD for tearing his achilles in the finals when he tried to help out his club when he should have been recuperating instead. What a loser.

I dont typically have a dog in the fight when it comes to Durant, but that’s a very strange take.

You don’t see any relevance to the Warriors being the defending champs, having the best record in the history of the sport, and literally beating KD’s Thunder the season before KD joined the Warriors?

The concept of greatness is arbitrary and ultimately a matter of popular opinion, but Durant’s greatness will always be questioned because of the decision to join up with an already great team that was already steam rolling opponents (including him) without him.

He had to sign somewhere and that probably was a narrow pool of choices to begin with. He’s a great player and great players, regardless of anyones’ opinion about their mental makeup, tend to look for winning situations if they move on from the club that drafted them. Again, fans would laud him for choosing a losing club, but they’ll assail him for choosing the best club. If I were KD I’d love the chance to play with greatness like Steph Curry and I cannot blame him that one bit. I think fans tend to petty by nature. I know, I’ve been a Knicks fan and I slag the New Jersey Nets relentlessly, but I don’t really care that KD chose them over us. It’s not a strange take at all to say a player’s personal choice is not something I care to judge. I really do not care at all, whereas it seems 90% of the fan base does. I’m in the minority that’s all.

As far as greatness goes, KD is a HOF player. Is he one of the all-time great top 50 players? Maybe. I don’t think he would have been as effective in the physical era of the 80s and 90s. But out of the three players from OKC I’d still rather have prime KD on my squad than either Westbrook or Harden in their primes. Do I think character influences my feelings about all-time greatness? Sure. But ultimately it is what you do on the court, not what we think about the player as a person. Isiah is a prick, but he was great. MJ x 10. Clyde is the ultimate guy in my book and he was also an all-time great. But that doesn’t make him better than a d-bag like Jordan.

Anyone who wins a ring is a champion in my book. I don’t go for all of this asterisk stuff.

[Chanel Bomber]

I’m not on board with this or the apparent consensus about player motives for signing with any club. If KD’s contract was up and it was time to sign a new one he could have stayed in OKC which he didn’t want to do. If he had signed with a struggling small market club then I suppose that would make him a man a character. I think the whole premise is bollocks no matter what choice a player makes.

We all know KD’s personality is sort of fragile and he makes his choices for reasons that may include not wanting to deal with the heat generated by our crazy fan base. But it still means zip to me that he chose GS when it was time to pick a club to go to. Lebron is a an all-time great and he chose to take his talents to South Beach.

Fukem both if that is how you feel, but it still takes nothing away from either one in my opinion when they won their rings. They deserved the honor of being called a champion no matter what snotty fans say. And fck KD for tearing his achilles in the finals when he tried to help out his club when he should have been recuperating instead. What a loser.

I dont typically have a dog in the fight when it comes to Durant, but that’s a very strange take.

You don’t see any relevance to the Warriors being the defending champs, having the best record in the history of the sport, and literally beating KD’s Thunder the season before KD joined the Warriors?

The concept of greatness is arbitrary and ultimately a matter of popular opinion, but Durant’s greatness will always be questioned because of the decision to join up with an already great team that was already steam rolling opponents (including him) without him.

He had to sign somewhere and that probably was a narrow pool of choices to begin with. He’s a great player and great players, regardless of anyones’ opinion about their mental makeup, tend to look for winning situations if they move on from the club that drafted them. Again, fans would laud him for choosing a losing club, but they’ll assail him for choosing the best club. If I were KD I’d love the chance to play with greatness like Steph Curry and I cannot blame him that one bit. I think fans tend to petty by nature. I know, I’ve been a Knicks fan and I slag the New Jersey Nets relentlessly, but I don’t really care that KD chose them over us. It’s not a strange take at all to say a player’s personal choice is not something I care to judge. I really do not care at all, whereas it seems 90% of the fan base does. I’m in the minority that’s all.

As far as greatness goes, KD is a HOF player. Is he one of the all-time great top 50 players? Maybe. I don’t think he would have been as effective in the physical era of the 80s and 90s. But out of the three players from OKC I’d still rather have prime KD on my squad than either Westbrook or Harden in their primes. Do I think character influences my feelings about all-time greatness? Sure. But ultimately it is what you do on the court, not what we think about the player as a person. Isiah is a prick, but he was great. MJ x 10. Clyde is the ultimate guy in my book and he was also an all-time great. But that doesn’t make him better than a d-bag like Jordan.

Anyone who wins a ring is a champion in my book. I don’t go for all of this asterisk stuff.

The issue is that KD gets elevated by some and tries to elevate himself as one of the upper-tier greats of the sport when he's only led his team to the Finals once, and that was with two future MVPs on his team. It's not the fact that he's factually a champion that is problematic, it's the way those two rings he won contribute to and inflate his greatness or legacy from a historical perspective, especially since it comes at the expense of others who had to go through much harder paths to win theirs.

Durant might be technically a champion. But he's not a champion in the way that Curry, Dirk, Kobe or Giannis are.

Even LeBron had to kill a behemoth in 2016, and the Heat had everything to prove still when the big 3 joined forces, although they were a juggernaut.

And I think anybody who's been in a locker room (or most) would understand that he stabbed his teammates in the back by joining Golden State. He betrayed his teammates (not for leaving, but for joining that team specifically).

[cgmw]

I’m not on board with this or the apparent consensus about player motives for signing with any club. If KD’s contract was up and it was time to sign a new one he could have stayed in OKC which he didn’t want to do. If he had signed with a struggling small market club then I suppose that would make him a man a character. I think the whole premise is bollocks no matter what choice a player makes.

We all know KD’s personality is sort of fragile and he makes his choices for reasons that may include not wanting to deal with the heat generated by our crazy fan base. But it still means zip to me that he chose GS when it was time to pick a club to go to. Lebron is a an all-time great and he chose to take his talents to South Beach.

Fukem both if that is how you feel, but it still takes nothing away from either one in my opinion when they won their rings. They deserved the honor of being called a champion no matter what snotty fans say. And fck KD for tearing his achilles in the finals when he tried to help out his club when he should have been recuperating instead. What a loser.

I dont typically have a dog in the fight when it comes to Durant, but that’s a very strange take.

You don’t see any relevance to the Warriors being the defending champs, having the best record in the history of the sport, and literally beating KD’s Thunder the season before KD joined the Warriors?

The concept of greatness is arbitrary and ultimately a matter of popular opinion, but Durant’s greatness will always be questioned because of the decision to join up with an already great team that was already steam rolling opponents (including him) without him.

He had to sign somewhere and that probably was a narrow pool of choices to begin with. He’s a great player and great players, regardless of anyones’ opinion about their mental makeup, tend to look for winning situations if they move on from the club that drafted them. Again, fans would laud him for choosing a losing club, but they’ll assail him for choosing the best club. If I were KD I’d love the chance to play with greatness like Steph Curry and I cannot blame him that one bit. I think fans tend to petty by nature. I know, I’ve been a Knicks fan and I slag the New Jersey Nets relentlessly, but I don’t really care that KD chose them over us. It’s not a strange take at all to say a player’s personal choice is not something I care to judge. I really do not care at all, whereas it seems 90% of the fan base does. I’m in the minority that’s all.

As far as greatness goes, KD is a HOF player. Is he one of the all-time great top 50 players? Maybe. I don’t think he would have been as effective in the physical era of the 80s and 90s. But out of the three players from OKC I’d still rather have prime KD on my squad than either Westbrook or Harden in their primes. Do I think character influences my feelings about all-time greatness? Sure. But ultimately it is what you do on the court, not what we think about the player as a person. Isiah is a prick, but he was great. MJ x 10. Clyde is the ultimate guy in my book and he was also an all-time great. But that doesn’t make him better than a d-bag like Jordan.

Anyone who wins a ring is a champion in my book. I don’t go for all of this asterisk stuff.

I think the point is people admire the greats for their competitive drive more than their god-given talents, and by joining the dominant Warriors it sure looks like other All-Time Greats worked harder and wanted it more than Durant. Lebron is another lightning rod of controversy. Anyway, as you said, f*ckemboth. I’m gonna go enjoy my Sunday.

[cgmw]

I’m not on board with this or the apparent consensus about player motives for signing with any club. If KD’s contract was up and it was time to sign a new one he could have stayed in OKC which he didn’t want to do. If he had signed with a struggling small market club then I suppose that would make him a man a character. I think the whole premise is bollocks no matter what choice a player makes.

We all know KD’s personality is sort of fragile and he makes his choices for reasons that may include not wanting to deal with the heat generated by our crazy fan base. But it still means zip to me that he chose GS when it was time to pick a club to go to. Lebron is a an all-time great and he chose to take his talents to South Beach.

Fukem both if that is how you feel, but it still takes nothing away from either one in my opinion when they won their rings. They deserved the honor of being called a champion no matter what snotty fans say. And fck KD for tearing his achilles in the finals when he tried to help out his club when he should have been recuperating instead. What a loser.

I dont typically have a dog in the fight when it comes to Durant, but that’s a very strange take.

You don’t see any relevance to the Warriors being the defending champs, having the best record in the history of the sport, and literally beating KD’s Thunder the season before KD joined the Warriors?

The concept of greatness is arbitrary and ultimately a matter of popular opinion, but Durant’s greatness will always be questioned because of the decision to join up with an already great team that was already steam rolling opponents (including him) without him.

He had to sign somewhere and that probably was a narrow pool of choices to begin with. He’s a great player and great players, regardless of anyones’ opinion about their mental makeup, tend to look for winning situations if they move on from the club that drafted them. Again, fans would laud him for choosing a losing club, but they’ll assail him for choosing the best club. If I were KD I’d love the chance to play with greatness like Steph Curry and I cannot blame him that one bit. I think fans tend to petty by nature. I know, I’ve been a Knicks fan and I slag the New Jersey Nets relentlessly, but I don’t really care that KD chose them over us. It’s not a strange take at all to say a player’s personal choice is not something I care to judge. I really do not care at all, whereas it seems 90% of the fan base does. I’m in the minority that’s all.

As far as greatness goes, KD is a HOF player. Is he one of the all-time great top 50 players? Maybe. I don’t think he would have been as effective in the physical era of the 80s and 90s. But out of the three players from OKC I’d still rather have prime KD on my squad than either Westbrook or Harden in their primes. Do I think character influences my feelings about all-time greatness? Sure. But ultimately it is what you do on the court, not what we think about the player as a person. Isiah is a prick, but he was great. MJ x 10. Clyde is the ultimate guy in my book and he was also an all-time great. But that doesn’t make him better than a d-bag like Jordan.

Anyone who wins a ring is a champion in my book. I don’t go for all of this asterisk stuff.

I think the point is people admire the greats for their competitive drive more than just their god-given talents, and by joining the dominant Warriors it sure looks like other All-Time Greats worked harder and wanted it more than Durant. Lebron is another lightning rod of controversy for similar reasons, which is why he went back to Cleveland for a couple years to prove himself.

Anyway, as you said, f*ckemboth. I’m gonna go enjoy my Sunday.

[Clyde_Style]

I dont typically have a dog in the fight when it comes to Durant, but that’s a very strange take.

You don’t see any relevance to the Warriors being the defending champs, having the best record in the history of the sport, and literally beating KD’s Thunder the season before KD joined the Warriors?

The concept of greatness is arbitrary and ultimately a matter of popular opinion, but Durant’s greatness will always be questioned because of the decision to join up with an already great team that was already steam rolling opponents (including him) without him.

He had to sign somewhere and that probably was a narrow pool of choices to begin with. He’s a great player and great players, regardless of anyones’ opinion about their mental makeup, tend to look for winning situations if they move on from the club that drafted them. Again, fans would laud him for choosing a losing club, but they’ll assail him for choosing the best club. If I were KD I’d love the chance to play with greatness like Steph Curry and I cannot blame him that one bit. I think fans tend to petty by nature. I know, I’ve been a Knicks fan and I slag the New Jersey Nets relentlessly, but I don’t really care that KD chose them over us. It’s not a strange take at all to say a player’s personal choice is not something I care to judge. I really do not care at all, whereas it seems 90% of the fan base does. I’m in the minority that’s all.

As far as greatness goes, KD is a HOF player. Is he one of the all-time great top 50 players? Maybe. I don’t think he would have been as effective in the physical era of the 80s and 90s. But out of the three players from OKC I’d still rather have prime KD on my squad than either Westbrook or Harden in their primes. Do I think character influences my feelings about all-time greatness? Sure. But ultimately it is what you do on the court, not what we think about the player as a person. Isiah is a prick, but he was great. MJ x 10. Clyde is the ultimate guy in my book and he was also an all-time great. But that doesn’t make him better than a d-bag like Jordan.

Anyone who wins a ring is a champion in my book. I don’t go for all of this asterisk stuff.

The issue is that KD gets elevated by some and tries to elevate himself as one of the upper-tier greats of the sport when he's only led his team to the Finals once, and that was two future MVPs on his team. It's not the fact that he's factually a champion that is problematic, it's the way those two rings he won contribute to and inflate his greatness or legacy from a historical perspective, especially since it comes at the expense of others who had to go through much harder paths to win theirs.

And I think anybody who's been in a locker room (or most) would understand that he stabbed his teammates in the back by joining Golden State. He betrayed his teammates.

That’s all grist for the mill AFAIK. IOW, you may be 100% correct about his character flaws. I totally get that KD is his own worst enemy and he may be quite insecure about his legacy. It certainly is a better policy to zip it in his case.

As far as OKC, he may have pledged something personally to his teammates and then gone back on his word and they felt betrayed. Or maybe it is simply that he joined the team that just beat them. Or both.

Still does not change my personal orientation which is IDGAF what a players does with their life. Fans act like they owe us something, but it is an illusion. It’s a lie. They don’t owe you or I jack. It’s a business decision and a personal decision and I don’t care to meddle in personal affairs.

Sports is the ultimate loyalty test war zone. Fans make it that way more than the players. We’re talking about us more than we are talking about the player.

Me? I’d sign with GS to play with Steph who is the greatest offensive player of his generation. He’s better than KD so I see no shame in KD signing up to be his second fiddle. Some will say that’s cowardly which I find ridiculous.

[Chanel Bomber]

He had to sign somewhere and that probably was a narrow pool of choices to begin with. He’s a great player and great players, regardless of anyones’ opinion about their mental makeup, tend to look for winning situations if they move on from the club that drafted them. Again, fans would laud him for choosing a losing club, but they’ll assail him for choosing the best club. If I were KD I’d love the chance to play with greatness like Steph Curry and I cannot blame him that one bit. I think fans tend to petty by nature. I know, I’ve been a Knicks fan and I slag the New Jersey Nets relentlessly, but I don’t really care that KD chose them over us. It’s not a strange take at all to say a player’s personal choice is not something I care to judge. I really do not care at all, whereas it seems 90% of the fan base does. I’m in the minority that’s all.

As far as greatness goes, KD is a HOF player. Is he one of the all-time great top 50 players? Maybe. I don’t think he would have been as effective in the physical era of the 80s and 90s. But out of the three players from OKC I’d still rather have prime KD on my squad than either Westbrook or Harden in their primes. Do I think character influences my feelings about all-time greatness? Sure. But ultimately it is what you do on the court, not what we think about the player as a person. Isiah is a prick, but he was great. MJ x 10. Clyde is the ultimate guy in my book and he was also an all-time great. But that doesn’t make him better than a d-bag like Jordan.

Anyone who wins a ring is a champion in my book. I don’t go for all of this asterisk stuff.

The issue is that KD gets elevated by some and tries to elevate himself as one of the upper-tier greats of the sport when he's only led his team to the Finals once, and that was two future MVPs on his team. It's not the fact that he's factually a champion that is problematic, it's the way those two rings he won contribute to and inflate his greatness or legacy from a historical perspective, especially since it comes at the expense of others who had to go through much harder paths to win theirs.

And I think anybody who's been in a locker room (or most) would understand that he stabbed his teammates in the back by joining Golden State. He betrayed his teammates.

That’s all grist for the mill AFAIK. IOW, you may be 100% correct about his character flaws. I totally get that KD is his own worst enemy and he may be quite insecure about his legacy. It certainly is a better policy to zip it in his case.

As far as OKC, he may have pledged something personally to his teammates and then gone back on his word and they felt betrayed. Or maybe it is simply that he joined the team that just beat them. Or both.

Still does not change my personal orientation which is IDGAF what a players does with their life. Fans act like they owe us something, but it is an illusion. It’s a lie. They don’t owe you or I jack. It’s a business decision and a personal decision and I don’t care to meddle in personal affairs.

Sports is the ultimate loyalty test war zone. Fans make it that way more than the players. We’re talking about us more than we are talking about the player.

Me? I’d sign with GS to play with Steph who is the greatest offensive player of his generation. He’s better than KD so I see no shame in KD signing up to be his second fiddle. Some will say that’s cowardly which I find ridiculous.

I mean players are obviously entitled to make their own decisions, as people should in general, within the confines (broadly speaking) of legality. But in the same manner people are entitled to form and express judgement, within those confines as well.

I have two issues with the moves:

I think it was a cowardly and treacherous move because he used the Warriors to purposely inflate his individual legacy, and not to be part of a team. It was incredibly opportunistic, to a level that I find (personally, emotionally, instinctively) absolutely repulsive. He has never given Curry any credit publicly, because he doesn't want Curry to outshine him. It's utterly classless.

He betrayed Westbrook and the Thunder, as I already said. He broke the code of team sports. And just as he was entitled to make a decision regardless of the ethics of it (admittedly an arbitrary concept that is massively driven by emotion), I am entitled to attach normative value to his action and judge it.

[Clyde_Style]

I dont typically have a dog in the fight when it comes to Durant, but that’s a very strange take.

You don’t see any relevance to the Warriors being the defending champs, having the best record in the history of the sport, and literally beating KD’s Thunder the season before KD joined the Warriors?

The concept of greatness is arbitrary and ultimately a matter of popular opinion, but Durant’s greatness will always be questioned because of the decision to join up with an already great team that was already steam rolling opponents (including him) without him.

He had to sign somewhere and that probably was a narrow pool of choices to begin with. He’s a great player and great players, regardless of anyones’ opinion about their mental makeup, tend to look for winning situations if they move on from the club that drafted them. Again, fans would laud him for choosing a losing club, but they’ll assail him for choosing the best club. If I were KD I’d love the chance to play with greatness like Steph Curry and I cannot blame him that one bit. I think fans tend to petty by nature. I know, I’ve been a Knicks fan and I slag the New Jersey Nets relentlessly, but I don’t really care that KD chose them over us. It’s not a strange take at all to say a player’s personal choice is not something I care to judge. I really do not care at all, whereas it seems 90% of the fan base does. I’m in the minority that’s all.

As far as greatness goes, KD is a HOF player. Is he one of the all-time great top 50 players? Maybe. I don’t think he would have been as effective in the physical era of the 80s and 90s. But out of the three players from OKC I’d still rather have prime KD on my squad than either Westbrook or Harden in their primes. Do I think character influences my feelings about all-time greatness? Sure. But ultimately it is what you do on the court, not what we think about the player as a person. Isiah is a prick, but he was great. MJ x 10. Clyde is the ultimate guy in my book and he was also an all-time great. But that doesn’t make him better than a d-bag like Jordan.

Anyone who wins a ring is a champion in my book. I don’t go for all of this asterisk stuff.

I think the point is people admire the greats for their competitive drive more than their god-given talents, and by joining the dominant Warriors it sure looks like other All-Time Greats worked harder and wanted it more than Durant. Lebron is another lightning rod of controversy. Anyway, as you said, f*ckemboth. I’m gonna go enjoy my Sunday.

On the court I don’t believe KD is a slacker. As I said already, it was bad judgment on his part and the GS medical staff, but the man did try to come back during the finals to help GS and he paid for it with a torn achilles. Whom am I to say that he made this bad choice because he was haunted by accusations of being a front-runner? The fact is he hobbled on to the court and tried to help them win whatever his motivation was.

The person called KD being judged harshly is mostly the guy he is off the court. IOW, he is not well liked as a person. But does that mean he doesn’t give real effort on the court? I doubt it. Mostly, I think this is personal bias bleeding over into judgment of what he does on the court. That he only won when he went to GS does not minimize his ring. But that’s me. Whatever floats each person’s boat. This is all highly subjective no matter how we frame it

[Clyde_Style]

:evil:

The issue is that KD gets elevated by some and tries to elevate himself as one of the upper-tier greats of the sport when he's only led his team to the Finals once, and that was two future MVPs on his team. It's not the fact that he's factually a champion that is problematic, it's the way those two rings he won contribute to and inflate his greatness or legacy from a historical perspective, especially since it comes at the expense of others who had to go through much harder paths to win theirs.

And I think anybody who's been in a locker room (or most) would understand that he stabbed his teammates in the back by joining Golden State. He betrayed his teammates.

That’s all grist for the mill AFAIK. IOW, you may be 100% correct about his character flaws. I totally get that KD is his own worst enemy and he may be quite insecure about his legacy. It certainly is a better policy to zip it in his case.

As far as OKC, he may have pledged something personally to his teammates and then gone back on his word and they felt betrayed. Or maybe it is simply that he joined the team that just beat them. Or both.

Still does not change my personal orientation which is IDGAF what a players does with their life. Fans act like they owe us something, but it is an illusion. It’s a lie. They don’t owe you or I jack. It’s a business decision and a personal decision and I don’t care to meddle in personal affairs.

Sports is the ultimate loyalty test war zone. Fans make it that way more than the players. We’re talking about us more than we are talking about the player.

Me? I’d sign with GS to play with Steph who is the greatest offensive player of his generation. He’s better than KD so I see no shame in KD signing up to be his second fiddle. Some will say that’s cowardly which I find ridiculous.

I mean players are obviously entitled to make their own decisions, as people should in general, within the confines (broadly speaking) of legality. But in the same manner people are entitled to form and express judgement, within those confines as well.

I have two issues with the moves:

I think it was a cowardly and treacherous move because he used the Warriors to purposely inflate his individual legacy, and not to be part of a team. It was incredibly opportunistic, to a level that I find (personally, emotionally, instinctively) absolutely repulsive. He has never given Curry any credit publicly, because he doesn't want Curry to outshine him. It's utterly classless.

He betrayed Westbrook and the Thunder, as I already said. He broke the code of team sports. And just as he was entitled to make a decision regardless of the ethics of it (admittedly an arbitrary concept that is massively driven by emotion), I am entitled to attach normative value to his action and judge it.

You are entitled to form a subjective opinion. And because it is that it can be discussed or even argued, but it cannot be said to be definitive. And that is what I did. I weighed in and said I still consider his ring as valid as any other player’s ring. If there is anything that separates our thought processes is I do think your take is definitely driven by emotions I don’t have around it. I do not care that he left OKC and I think the code you speak of is fan fiction basically.

If any of our Knicks sign with someone else I’ll wish them luck. In Randle’s case I’ll drive him to the airport. But I won’t waste any energy on hating them for choosing another club.

[Chanel Bomber]

:evil:

That’s all grist for the mill AFAIK. IOW, you may be 100% correct about his character flaws. I totally get that KD is his own worst enemy and he may be quite insecure about his legacy. It certainly is a better policy to zip it in his case.

As far as OKC, he may have pledged something personally to his teammates and then gone back on his word and they felt betrayed. Or maybe it is simply that he joined the team that just beat them. Or both.

Still does not change my personal orientation which is IDGAF what a players does with their life. Fans act like they owe us something, but it is an illusion. It’s a lie. They don’t owe you or I jack. It’s a business decision and a personal decision and I don’t care to meddle in personal affairs.

Sports is the ultimate loyalty test war zone. Fans make it that way more than the players. We’re talking about us more than we are talking about the player.

Me? I’d sign with GS to play with Steph who is the greatest offensive player of his generation. He’s better than KD so I see no shame in KD signing up to be his second fiddle. Some will say that’s cowardly which I find ridiculous.

I mean players are obviously entitled to make their own decisions, as people should in general, within the confines (broadly speaking) of legality. But in the same manner people are entitled to form and express judgement, within those confines as well.

I have two issues with the moves:

I think it was a cowardly and treacherous move because he used the Warriors to purposely inflate his individual legacy, and not to be part of a team. It was incredibly opportunistic, to a level that I find (personally, emotionally, instinctively) absolutely repulsive. He has never given Curry any credit publicly, because he doesn't want Curry to outshine him. It's utterly classless.

He betrayed Westbrook and the Thunder, as I already said. He broke the code of team sports. And just as he was entitled to make a decision regardless of the ethics of it (admittedly an arbitrary concept that is massively driven by emotion), I am entitled to attach normative value to his action and judge it.

You are entitled to form a subjective opinion. And because it is that it can be discussed or even argued, but it cannot be said to be definitive. And that is what I did. I weighed in and said I still consider his ring as valid as any other player’s ring. If there is anything that separates our thought processes is I do think your take is definitely driven by emotions I don’t have around it. I do not care that he left OKC and I think the code you speak of is fan fiction basically.

If any of our Knicks sign with someone else I’ll wish them luck. In Randle’s case I’ll drive him to the airport. But I won’t waste any energy on hating them for choosing another club.

Ethics are inevitably influenced by emotion. For any human being.

Also he didn't just leave anywhere. I don't think he would have received much if any criticism if he had joined a team like Boston for instance. But he joined the team that had just beaten him. What he did was the equivalent of Patrick Ewing joining the Bulls as a free agent in 1992, winning two championships in Chicago, and never acknowledging Jordan.

People do go way too far when they burn jerseys, throw objects, or harass athletes. Same for the guy who spat on Trae Young.