PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics]

[jalengreen]

can't stand going without basketball today, anyone got a recommendation for a historic game that's on youtube?

[Doctor MJ]

MLBPA seems most focused on making sure its best players get paid. The contracts for the stars in baseball are absolutely absurd. I think their union is pretty strong, just focused on different things. NBAPA worries more about some quality of life issues in addition to the bottom line and the NBA is happy to play along because they get other benefits by conceding on things they don't really care about anyway.

Eh, on aggregate, MLBPA and its players have way less power than the NBAPA and its players. Sure the big stars get big contracts but that might be the only thing I can see big a "plus" over the NBAPA if that is even a plus given the issues with general player treatment, treatment of players in the minors etc.

how can a players union be so...well, united, to strike for a full season, then not be able to use that leverage to have a good CBA?

it sounds honestly baffling

So first, I'd argue that these unions have been drastically more successful than most other unions given how much salaries have spiked since unionization. Some of the things they've fought for and won facilitated the salaries we now see. Point being: If we're seeing anything worse than the best of breed as "bad", that's a skewed perspective.

Second, it's important not to assume that labor solidarity necessarily leads to an optimal set of priorities in negotiation for all involved.

[falcolombardi]

can't stand going without basketball today, anyone got a recommendation for a historic game that's on youtube?

last old game i watched was spurs vs heat game 7, it was good but not as great as i remembered it

[ardee]

can't stand going without basketball today, anyone got a recommendation for a historic game that's on youtube?

Thunder-Warriors RS game from Feb 2016.

[70sFan]

can't stand going without basketball today, anyone got a recommendation for a historic game that's on youtube?

I am too late, but I was watching 1970s Pistons games in tribute to Bob Lanier yesterday.

[LA Bird]

Just noticed basketball reference added All NBA Voting Shares. I think it's a less meaningful stat than MVP shares but still somewhat interesting. Example - https://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/awards_2020.html#leading_all_nba

Annual leaders
1966: Oscar Robertson
1967: Rick Barry
1968: Wilt Chamberlain
1969: Billy Cunningham
1970: Jerry West
1971: Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
1972: Jerry West
1973: Tiny Archibald
1974: Walt Frazier
1975: Rick Barry
1976: Rick Barry
1977: Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
1978: Bill Walton
1979: Moses Malone
1980: Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
1981: Julius Erving
1982: Larry Bird
1983: Larry Bird
1984: Larry Bird
1985: Larry Bird
1986: Larry Bird
1987: Magic Johnson
1988: Michael Jordan
1989: Karl Malone
1990: Magic Johnson
1991: Michael Jordan
1992: Michael Jordan
1993: Michael Jordan / Charles Barkley
1994: Scottie Pippen
1995: Karl Malone
1996: Michael Jordan
1997: Michael Jordan / Karl Malone
1998: Michael Jordan / Karl Malone
1999: Karl Malone
2000: Shaquille O'Neal
2001: Allen Iverson
2002: Shaquille O'Neal / Tim Duncan
2003: Tim Duncan
2004: Kevin Garnett
2005: Shaquille O'Neal
2006: LeBron James
2007: Steve Nash
2008: Kobe Bryant
2009: LeBron James
2010: LeBron James / Dwight Howard
2011: LeBron James
2012: LeBron James
2013: LeBron James
2014: Kevin Durant
2015: LeBron James / Stephen Curry
2016: Stephen Curry
2017: James Harden
2018: LeBron James / James Harden
2019: Giannis Antetokounmpo / James Harden
2020: LeBron James / Giannis Antetokounmpo
2021: Giannis Antetokounmpo

Most times leading the league - LeBron (9), Jordan (7), Bird (5), Malone (5), Giannis (3), Barry (3), Kareem (3), Shaq (3), Harden (3)

[Texas Chuck]

so this is totally random, but ran into a guy I played high school basketball with at a conference this week and so of course we talked about the old days and it got me thinking.

So I played in the early 90's and we were a good team, won our conference all four years I was there, but we were mediocre at best offensively, we won on the back of a stifling defense and while we definitely played some man, we also played a ton of 1-3-1 zone.

Not sure how many of you are familiar with the principles of that since its an outdated defense that I don't know that anyone is playing today, but essentially its a guy at the top of the key pressuring the ball, 3 guys lined up foul line extended and then a guy running the baseline. Essentially a defense whose hole is in the corners. Crazy to imagine we were basically trying to concede what is now essentially the best shot in the game--the corner 3.

Anyway totally random, but goes to show how the game has changed in 30 years. We won on the strength of a defense that would get absolutely obliterated by any competent team today. And man did I love playing that one, except being the baseline guy, but that was never my assignment so....

[Outside]

We ran a 1-3-1 press but not as a half court defense. I wonder if the principles were the same though -- pressure, trapping, forcing bad passes for turnovers. We did run a 1-2-2 trapping defense that I liked a lot. As a youth coach, there's not enough time to teach a nuanced offense, so I relied on pressure defense to generate turnovers and spark the fast break, no offense needed. It would be interesting to see what works now.

[Colbinii]

We ran a 1-3-1 defense when I played in U12 and U13 and I remember having so many steals as a team. It was super fun.

[MyUniBroDavis]

so this is totally random, but ran into a guy I played high school basketball with at a conference this week and so of course we talked about the old days and it got me thinking.

So I played in the early 90's and we were a good team, won our conference all four years I was there, but we were mediocre at best offensively, we won on the back of a stifling defense and while we definitely played some man, we also played a ton of 1-3-1 zone.

Not sure how many of you are familiar with the principles of that since its an outdated defense that I don't know that anyone is playing today, but essentially its a guy at the top of the key pressuring the ball, 3 guys lined up foul line extended and then a guy running the baseline. Essentially a defense whose hole is in the corners. Crazy to imagine we were basically trying to concede what is now essentially the best shot in the game--the corner 3.

Anyway totally random, but goes to show how the game has changed in 30 years. We won on the strength of a defense that would get absolutely obliterated by any competent team today. And man did I love playing that one, except being the baseline guy, but that was never my assignment so....

I was either the middle or the baseline guy.

Running any type of zone when no one else knows what they’re doing is infuriating

[GSP]

Anyone else following Nhl................boy Connor Mcdavid............he could go down as Goat at this pace. Unreal talent up there with just about anyone Ive ever seen

[Dr Positivity]

Anyone else following Nhl................boy Connor Mcdavid............he could go down as Goat at this pace. Unreal talent up there with just about anyone Ive ever seen

His game 7 against LA was probably the most dominant I've seen a hockey player play

[jalengreen]

anyone watch the CL final? that was an absolutely legendary goalkeeping performance, my goodness

what a run from real madrid. to think PSG had the great chance to eliminate them

[70sFan]

anyone watch the CL final? that was an absolutely legendary goalkeeping performance, my goodness

what a run from real madrid. to think PSG had the great chance to eliminate them

Of course, it was one of the best performance I've ever seen from a GK.

You just can't beat Real in the CL Finals. Hala Madrid!

[Jaivl]

¿Cómo no te voy a querer? ¡Si fuiste campeón de Europa por... erm... décimo cuarta vez!

They just cannot lose.

Spanish teams vs non-spanish teams in the last 17 UCL/EL finals: 17 wins.

[jalengreen]

always great watching djokovic and nadal duke it out

[ceiling raiser]

Random question, maybe not the best place to ask, but what is the best current source for clean regular season NPI RAPM from 96-97 through 21-22? Continuity of method is most important.

[sp6r=underrated]

can't stand going without basketball today, anyone got a recommendation for a historic game that's on youtube?

last old game i watched was spurs vs heat game 7, it was good but not as great as i remembered it

I re-watched this Lebron game recently and it is fascinating. Well worth anyone's time if they haven't seen it

You give 2008 Lebron the 2013 one's brain and Cleveland wins this despite being comically outgunned. Not trying to imply he was dim here he just wasn't savant level yet.

Watch on YouTube

Also this game to me is one of the all-time great single outcome change history. You think KG discussions are polarized now. Imagine if Boston loses this and they make it to a G7 without him the next year too.

All of the plus/minus data & box score stating pointing to him having a top 5 argument would be there. But man would his skeptics not budge.

[sp6r=underrated]

so this is totally random, but ran into a guy I played high school basketball with at a conference this week and so of course we talked about the old days and it got me thinking.

So I played in the early 90's and we were a good team, won our conference all four years I was there, but we were mediocre at best offensively, we won on the back of a stifling defense and while we definitely played some man, we also played a ton of 1-3-1 zone.

Not sure how many of you are familiar with the principles of that since its an outdated defense that I don't know that anyone is playing today, but essentially its a guy at the top of the key pressuring the ball, 3 guys lined up foul line extended and then a guy running the baseline. Essentially a defense whose hole is in the corners. Crazy to imagine we were basically trying to concede what is now essentially the best shot in the game--the corner 3.

Anyway totally random, but goes to show how the game has changed in 30 years. We won on the strength of a defense that would get absolutely obliterated by any competent team today. And man did I love playing that one, except being the baseline guy, but that was never my assignment so....

always fascinating to me to learn details about posters I've been reading for years. I would not have guessed you were in HS in 1994.

[sp6r=underrated]

Just noticed basketball reference added All NBA Voting Shares. I think it's a less meaningful stat than MVP shares but still somewhat interesting. Example - https://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/awards_2020.html#leading_all_nba

Annual leaders
1966: Oscar Robertson
1967: Rick Barry
1968: Wilt Chamberlain
1969: Billy Cunningham
1970: Jerry West
1971: Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
1972: Jerry West
1973: Tiny Archibald
1974: Walt Frazier
1975: Rick Barry
1976: Rick Barry
1977: Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
1978: Bill Walton
1979: Moses Malone
1980: Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
1981: Julius Erving
1982: Larry Bird
1983: Larry Bird
1984: Larry Bird
1985: Larry Bird
1986: Larry Bird
1987: Magic Johnson
1988: Michael Jordan
1989: Karl Malone
1990: Magic Johnson
1991: Michael Jordan
1992: Michael Jordan
1993: Michael Jordan / Charles Barkley
1994: Scottie Pippen
1995: Karl Malone
1996: Michael Jordan
1997: Michael Jordan / Karl Malone
1998: Michael Jordan / Karl Malone
1999: Karl Malone
2000: Shaquille O'Neal
2001: Allen Iverson
2002: Shaquille O'Neal / Tim Duncan
2003: Tim Duncan
2004: Kevin Garnett
2005: Shaquille O'Neal
2006: LeBron James
2007: Steve Nash
2008: Kobe Bryant
2009: LeBron James
2010: LeBron James / Dwight Howard
2011: LeBron James
2012: LeBron James
2013: LeBron James
2014: Kevin Durant
2015: LeBron James / Stephen Curry
2016: Stephen Curry
2017: James Harden
2018: LeBron James / James Harden
2019: Giannis Antetokounmpo / James Harden
2020: LeBron James / Giannis Antetokounmpo
2021: Giannis Antetokounmpo

Most times leading the league - LeBron (9), Jordan (7), Bird (5), Malone (5), Giannis (3), Barry (3), Kareem (3), Shaq (3), Harden (3)

This hits me as a tool that will be useful in how guys in the 9-25 range were gaged historically. Obviously you need to take into account positions but I do think it is useful to think how people at the time saw them.