Knicks Draft Post Mortem

[duetta]

"This is a good trade because the FO is incompetent, therefore lotto picks are worthless" is a hell of a take.

You assume that our management is incompetent - but I see no reason to assume that.

I KNOW that most Knicks fans are hopelessly toxic, due to having to live through decades of franchise futility. You just have to read this board after a loss to recognize how hopelessly toxic we are as a group.

Our current management team has a particular style and vision - and I am waiting to see if they can realize that vision, in one fashion or another, despite being saddled with an owner who is not known for being comfortable with taking the long view.

[Priggy Smalls]

I can't imagine we go that hard after ivey if we have a promise from brunson and if we did all this without a promise from brunson this fo is even more pathetic than I thought.

[cgmw]

I like the complete trade, but I fear that we might not get Brunson and then the same thing as always happens:
they feel like they HAVE to spend the money and sign multiple mediocre vets to block the young players.

Exactly. But fear not, we have Brock Aller and a bevy of future picks to clean up our mess in future years.

1) Position for stars
2) Fail to acquire stars
3) Sign consolation vets
4) Consolation vets fail
5) Attach draft picks to jettison failed vets

Begin again.

[Ma10]

Who are we fooling. We all know what will happen next. We will either resign Mitch for way to much money or he will get hurt and never be the same. Brunson, if he is signing with us, turns out was a one hit wonder, playing like an allstar, just to get max money. 2 or 3 players taken after 11 will become allstars. Our starting linup for opening night: Taj, Randle, Burks, Fournier, Rose.

[3toheadmelo]

Like, all this, right

And we're still 10 mil off from being able to almost give Brunson what he wants

That's what makes this trade so stupid, besides the everything else, is that we still need to make moves to clear enough cap space

D+ could have been worse.

They literally did this just to get picks they can use to dump Burks and Noel this is hilariously bad

[3toheadmelo]

Bruh the only thing I liked was we got Montero. A fking undrafted guy

[DOT]

You assume that our management is incompetent - but I see no reason to assume that.

No, that's what you said

The implication of your post was that the FO didn't view anybody on the board as being worth a lottery pick. I can guarantee you that at least one person taken after 11 was worth a lottery pick, so you're left with 2 options:

1, the FO is incompetent at scouting and could not identify talent

2, the FO is lazy and didn't do their due diligence

Also:

Knick management targeted Ivey and perhaps another player in this draft and once they were off the board, made the decision to bail out of the first round

Panicking and bailing when your first choice is off the board is not the sign of competent management. Having no backup plan is not a sign of good management

This is the 2nd year in a row we've made a panic move to trade out of the 1st when we couldn't do the first thing we wanted. That tells me we either get hyper focused on one outcome and don't plan for any deviations, or that we're too arrogant to assume things aren't gonna go the way we want.

[cgmw]

If their plan was to get Ivey, we’d have Ivey. Their one and only draft plan sure seems to be: Get Brunson.

Attach 11 to Kemba for $12m that goes to Brunson and Leon’s son. Attach the newly acquired future picks to Noel and/or Burks to secure the rest of the Brunson and Rose families’ money.

[DOT]

Like, all this, right

And we're still 10 mil off from being able to almost give Brunson what he wants

That's what makes this trade so stupid, besides the everything else, is that we still need to make moves to clear enough cap space

D+ could have been worse.

They literally did this just to get picks they can use to dump Burks and Noel this is hilariously bad

We got guys slobbering over the FO for overpaying to fix mistakes nobody forced them to make

Like, we're gonna legit trade multiple first round picks to get out of expiring contracts and people think this is good?

And like I said in another post, even if we dump those two and get Brunson, one of Grimes or Cam is still f*cked for minutes because that's how much of a log jam we got going on

I can't wait for us to trade a top 10 pick next year to get out of Fournier's expiring deal and for these guys to be like "no, this is good actually".

[duetta]

Really though?

A) the picks are highly protected;
B) our coach hates rookies; and
C) isn’t it obvious FO views FRPs as trade chips only?

I don’t know how much more blatant they can be about what they value. The future picks will never become drafted rotation players for the Knicks.

Personally, I fully expect them to trade those picks along with RJ, Obi, IQ and/or Grimes.

First off, by mid-decade, the picks are completely achievable. Secondly, if the plan is to bring in a pseudo-franchise talent (which is what everyone aside from a truly generational talent, like Lebron, truly is), they have more ammunition to do that.

And what does everyone on this board constantly call for - the acquisition of a fake franchise talent (Melo, Mitchell, etc.). We now have picks to sweeten the pot for that kind of deal without completely gutting our core.

I don't want that kind of player at that price - but most fans on this board do. Let's be honest. Many fans on this board are just as impatient as our owner, D-Hole.

[cgmw]

Really though?

A) the picks are highly protected;
B) our coach hates rookies; and
C) isn’t it obvious FO views FRPs as trade chips only?

I don’t know how much more blatant they can be about what they value. The future picks will never become drafted rotation players for the Knicks.

Personally, I fully expect them to trade those picks along with RJ, Obi, IQ and/or Grimes.

First off, by mid-decade, the picks are completely achievable. Secondly, if the plan is to bring in a pseudo-franchise talent (which is what everyone aside from a truly generational talent, like Lebron, truly is), they have more ammunition to do that.

And what does everyone on this board constantly call for - the acquisition of a fake franchise talent (Melo, Mitchell, etc.). We now have picks to sweeten the pot for that kind of deal without completely gutting our core.

I don't want that kind of player at that price - but most fans on this board do. Let's be honest. Many fans on this board are just as impatient as our owner, D-Hole.

The day Leon pulls the trigger on his inevitable Starphucking trade is the day he finally comes out of the shadows to address the media because, frankly, fans will go apesh*t for whatever shiny new toy he acquires. Cue the Dolan/Leon/Spida big cheese press conference and Mailchimp distro informing ticket holders that prices are going up.

[3toheadmelo]

I’m still **** mad

[DaGawd]

Really though?

A) the picks are highly protected;
B) our coach hates rookies; and
C) isn’t it obvious FO views FRPs as trade chips only?

I don’t know how much more blatant they can be about what they value. The future picks will never become drafted rotation players for the Knicks.

Personally, I fully expect them to trade those picks along with RJ, Obi, IQ and/or Grimes.

First off, by mid-decade, the picks are completely achievable. Secondly, if the plan is to bring in a pseudo-franchise talent (which is what everyone aside from a truly generational talent, like Lebron, truly is), they have more ammunition to do that.

And what does everyone on this board constantly call for - the acquisition of a fake franchise talent (Melo, Mitchell, etc.). We now have picks to sweeten the pot for that kind of deal without completely gutting our core.

I don't want that kind of player at that price - but most fans on this board do. Let's be honest. Many fans on this board are just as impatient as our owner, D-Hole.

The picks don’t really sweeten any pot tho.. theyre all of weak value

[Deeeez Knicks]

I was expecting them to trade the pick for Brogdan or a vet anyway. I don’t even feel disappointed when the bar was set low. But yea, management stinks. It’s sad to watch other teams like the Cavs, Pistons, Magic, OKC etc at least trying to form good young teams. They won’t all work out but they are taking shot and actually seem like they are doing decent. The Magic jokes were good, but we can’t even compare to them anymore. It’s just us and the Kings….although can still make fun of the nets when they get knocked out of the playoffs again

[duetta]

You assume that our management is incompetent - but I see no reason to assume that.

No, that's what you said

Sorry, that's your interpretation.

This management has a particular style and approach to evaluating talent and drafting - and they obviously did not want to draft in the first round last night after Ivey and Sharpe were off the board. They could have easily packaged those future picks to get back in if they wanted to do it.

The Knicks likely have enough 'Grade B+/B talents as is to develop. Their problem up to now has been finding them minutes.

[Chanel Bomber]

Really though?

A) the picks are highly protected;
B) our coach hates rookies; and
C) isn’t it obvious FO views FRPs as trade chips only?

I don’t know how much more blatant they can be about what they value. The future picks will never become drafted rotation players for the Knicks.

Personally, I fully expect them to trade those picks along with RJ, Obi, IQ and/or Grimes.

First off, by mid-decade, the picks are completely achievable. Secondly, if the plan is to bring in a pseudo-franchise talent (which is what everyone aside from a truly generational talent, like Lebron, truly is), they have more ammunition to do that.

And what does everyone on this board constantly call for - the acquisition of a fake franchise talent (Melo, Mitchell, etc.). We now have picks to sweeten the pot for that kind of deal without completely gutting our core.

I don't want that kind of player at that price - but most fans on this board do. Let's be honest. Many fans on this board are just as impatient as our owner, D-Hole.

Honestly at this point I'd settle for a solid 3-year run of competitive basketball like the first Melo years, with one peak season that gives you the illusion of having a chance.

We're so far away from winning a championship.

At some point, I just want to have some new positive memories to hold on to for the next decade of misery.

The Jason Williams Kings never really went far yet they're one of my favorite teams of all time. I'd settle for that.

Championship is asking too much (not that you mentioned that, I just wanted to share thoughts on impatience).

[mpharris36]

Really though?

A) the picks are highly protected;
B) our coach hates rookies; and
C) isn’t it obvious FO views FRPs as trade chips only?

I don’t know how much more blatant they can be about what they value. The future picks will never become drafted rotation players for the Knicks.

Personally, I fully expect them to trade those picks along with RJ, Obi, IQ and/or Grimes.

First off, by mid-decade, the picks are completely achievable. Secondly, if the plan is to bring in a pseudo-franchise talent (which is what everyone aside from a truly generational talent, like Lebron, truly is), they have more ammunition to do that.

And what does everyone on this board constantly call for - the acquisition of a fake franchise talent (Melo, Mitchell, etc.). We now have picks to sweeten the pot for that kind of deal without completely gutting our core.

I don't want that kind of player at that price - but most fans on this board do. Let's be honest. Many fans on this board are just as impatient as our owner, D-Hole.

The picks don’t really sweeten any pot tho.. theyre all of weak value

Yes, agreed. The picks have just enough value to potentially move off all the mistakes they made last year signing guys

Those heavily protected 1sts don't move the needs in trades for actually good players or to move up in a future draft. They probably will be moved to shed more salary.

[cgmw]

Really though?

A) the picks are highly protected;
B) our coach hates rookies; and
C) isn’t it obvious FO views FRPs as trade chips only?

I don’t know how much more blatant they can be about what they value. The future picks will never become drafted rotation players for the Knicks.

Personally, I fully expect them to trade those picks along with RJ, Obi, IQ and/or Grimes.

First off, by mid-decade, the picks are completely achievable. Secondly, if the plan is to bring in a pseudo-franchise talent (which is what everyone aside from a truly generational talent, like Lebron, truly is), they have more ammunition to do that.

And what does everyone on this board constantly call for - the acquisition of a fake franchise talent (Melo, Mitchell, etc.). We now have picks to sweeten the pot for that kind of deal without completely gutting our core.

I don't want that kind of player at that price - but most fans on this board do. Let's be honest. Many fans on this board are just as impatient as our owner, D-Hole.

The picks don’t really sweeten any pot tho.. theyre all of weak value

No, they’re just valuable enough to attach to Noel/Burks so Leon’s son can get his cut of Brunson’s upcoming max contract. Or so Leon can say “you got it, boss” when Dolan demands Kyrie.

[thebuzzardman]

Wow. Would love to see which fools gave it a B.

[DOT]

You assume that our management is incompetent - but I see no reason to assume that.

No, that's what you said

Sorry, that's your interpretation.

This management has a particular style and approach to evaluating talent and drafting - and they obviously did not want to draft in the first round last night after Ivey and Sharpe were off the board. They could have easily packaged those future picks to get back in if they wanted to do it.

The Knicks likely have enough 'Grade B+/B talents as is to develop. Their problem up to now has been finding them minutes.

So, management gets hyperfocused on one or two guys, and are too lazy to scout anyone else

Picture of competence, that. As we all know, they're scouting geniuses with extensive histories of drafting stars, so we should trust them.