2019-2020 College/Draft thread (Part 4)

[3toheadmelo]

3 times as many votes for Mikal than for Trae Young

I voted Sexton but I’m still holding a big L on Trae Young

I liked Trae, I think at this point I knew there was no way in hell he’d be there 9th though and didn’t see it as realistic

I didn’t even want him at 9 ban me

[HEZI]

If you were to redo the 2018 draft Mikal doesn't even crack the lotto

Devonte Graham and Mitchell Robinson both went in the 2nd round that year. Shamet probably goes higher than him too. I would even take Donte Divincenco over Mikal at this point. Definitely taking Anfernee Simons over him. Yo, Mikal aint even better than Troy Brown Jr. Melo where you at?

[robillionaire]

My new draft strategy is to wait until after the lotto so we can include a poll and then support us drafting whoever has the lowest percentage.

[3toheadmelo]

If you were to redo the 2018 draft Mikal doesn't even crack the lotto

Devonte Graham and Mitchell Robinson both went in the 2nd round that year. Shamet probably goes higher than him too. I would even take Donte Divincenco over Mikal at this point. Definitely taking Anfernee Simons over him. Yo, Mikal aint even better than Troy Brown Jr. Melo where you at?

Facts

Troy Brown still that n*gga! He can run the point better than Frank no cap

[HarthorneWingo]

If you were to redo the 2018 draft Mikal doesn't even crack the lotto

Devonte Graham and Mitchell Robinson both went in the 2nd round that year. Shamet probably goes higher than him too. I would even take Donte Divincenco over Mikal at this point. Definitely taking Anfernee Simons over him. Yo, Mikal aint even better than Troy Brown Jr. Melo where you at?

Is he better than Knox?

[HEZI]

If you were to redo the 2018 draft Mikal doesn't even crack the lotto

Devonte Graham and Mitchell Robinson both went in the 2nd round that year. Shamet probably goes higher than him too. I would even take Donte Divincenco over Mikal at this point. Definitely taking Anfernee Simons over him. Yo, Mikal aint even better than Troy Brown Jr. Melo where you at?

Is he better than Knox?

Not really

[Deeeez Knicks]

If you were to redo the 2018 draft Mikal doesn't even crack the lotto

Devonte Graham and Mitchell Robinson both went in the 2nd round that year. Shamet probably goes higher than him too. I would even take Donte Divincenco over Mikal at this point. Definitely taking Anfernee Simons over him. Yo, Mikal aint even better than Troy Brown Jr. Melo where you at?

Facts

Troy Brown still that n*gga! He can run the point better than Frank no cap

You guys just don't value defense enough. Mikal is turning into one of the best defensive players in the league. And he is not a liability on offense with a 62% ts%. He does a little of everything. At #9/#10, you are most likely getting just a solid starter and Mikal is turning into that.

Not bpa, but still better then Miles/Knox.

Knox pretty much is a liability on both ends. Miles is ok, but just not efficient. A player like Mikal is more valuable

[Capn'O]

If you were to redo the 2018 draft Mikal doesn't even crack the lotto

Devonte Graham and Mitchell Robinson both went in the 2nd round that year. Shamet probably goes higher than him too. I would even take Donte Divincenco over Mikal at this point. Definitely taking Anfernee Simons over him. Yo, Mikal aint even better than Troy Brown Jr. Melo where you at?

Facts

Troy Brown still that n*gga! He can run the point better than Frank no cap

You guys just don't value defense enough. Mikal is turning into one of the best defensive players in the league. And he is not a liability on offense with a 62% ts%. He does a little of everything. At #9/#10, you are most likely getting just a solid starter and Mikal is turning into that.

Not bpa, but still better then Miles/Knox.

Knox pretty much is a liability on both ends. Miles is ok, but just not efficient. A player like Mikal is more valuable

Knox could still end up better. I see a path for it. But right now, yes, much worse.

[mpharris36]

You guys just don't value defense enough. Mikal is turning into one of the best defensive players in the league. And he is not a liability on offense with a 62% ts%. He does a little of everything. At #9/#10, you are most likely getting just a solid starter and Mikal is turning into that.

Not bpa, but still better then Miles/Knox.

Knox pretty much is a liability on both ends. Miles is ok, but just not efficient. A player like Mikal is more valuable

its pretty obvious isn't it.

[robillionaire]

If you were to redo the 2018 draft Mikal doesn't even crack the lotto

Devonte Graham and Mitchell Robinson both went in the 2nd round that year. Shamet probably goes higher than him too. I would even take Donte Divincenco over Mikal at this point. Definitely taking Anfernee Simons over him. Yo, Mikal aint even better than Troy Brown Jr. Melo where you at?

Is he better than Knox?

He has at least one nba level skill (defense) so he's better than knox. With that said I'd still rather have knox right now. mikal isn't getting any better and knox is 4 years younger and still could although it's unlikely

[moocow007]

Folks still trusting stats a bit too much. Stats in college (even advanced stats) doesn't correctly represent what they can do in the pro's. It's not completely useless and obviously provides a good gauge in some areas but I would not suggest folks reading too much into it as an end all be all.

I will go back to my age old anecdote that I used whenever folks start letting stats become the basis of judgment...

I said the same thing when...again...folks said that Alfonso Soriano will never be able to hit well enough in the majors (cause he struck out a lot and didn't have the best contact rate) and that D'Angelo Jiminez (on account of him being terrific contact rates) was a MUCH BETTER pro prospect. And yep, the stats at the time showed that. Problem? Jiminez couldn't catch up to fastballs that starters at the major league level can throw consistently that minor league pitchers could not. Basically he was a bad ball, junk ball hitter. Have lots of bad balls in the minors...lot less in the majors. Not stat could tell you that. Soriano, was never going to be a great contact guy but I told folks that he's swing was fast and powerful and that he should be able to hit the ball on the screws when he does make contact. And he did. The ball would jump off his bat whenever he made contact. Soriano used to hit the ball so hard that unless it's hit directly at you it's going to be by you before you can get to it. Can't tell by stats (back then), could tell by watching him play. Soriano had skills that would project and play well in the majors, Jiminez did not.

If you want to argue for or against a player, I would rather folks do so based on what they can and can't do and how easy or difficult for them to translate what they currently do (role, strength) to the next level. You can't tell that with stats.

[robillionaire]

If you were to redo the 2018 draft Mikal doesn't even crack the lotto

Devonte Graham and Mitchell Robinson both went in the 2nd round that year. Shamet probably goes higher than him too. I would even take Donte Divincenco over Mikal at this point. Definitely taking Anfernee Simons over him. Yo, Mikal aint even better than Troy Brown Jr. Melo where you at?

Facts

Troy Brown still that n*gga! He can run the point better than Frank no cap

You guys just don't value defense enough. Mikal is turning into one of the best defensive players in the league. And he is not a liability on offense with a 62% ts%. He does a little of everything. At #9/#10, you are most likely getting just a solid starter and Mikal is turning into that.

Not bpa, but still better then Miles/Knox.

Knox pretty much is a liability on both ends. Miles is ok, but just not efficient. A player like Mikal is more valuable

Some people value defense too much. This is an offense oriented league. You can't be a one way defensive player

[HEZI]

If you were to redo the 2018 draft Mikal doesn't even crack the lotto

Devonte Graham and Mitchell Robinson both went in the 2nd round that year. Shamet probably goes higher than him too. I would even take Donte Divincenco over Mikal at this point. Definitely taking Anfernee Simons over him. Yo, Mikal aint even better than Troy Brown Jr. Melo where you at?

Facts

Troy Brown still that n*gga! He can run the point better than Frank no cap

You guys just don't value defense enough. Mikal is turning into one of the best defensive players in the league. And he is not a liability on offense with a 62% ts%. He does a little of everything. At #9/#10, you are most likely getting just a solid starter and Mikal is turning into that.

Not bpa, but still better then Miles/Knox.

Knox pretty much is a liability on both ends. Miles is ok, but just not efficient. A player like Mikal is more valuable

It's a lot easier to appreciate Mikal when you realize he is who he is and you know what role he has. You plug him into lineup as a role player surrounded by stars and ask him to do two things and two things only, play defense on the perimeter and occasionally knock down a jumper, yeah there is value in that. You can do that when you have building blocks in place and stars capable of carrying the weight. You can't do that with a role player when you don't have the building pieces in place.

Mikal isn't even a lethal outside shooter. He averages 34% for his career on outside shots in 3 attempts a game. He's not even a sniper from deep, he's just capable but that's it. His efficiency comes from people sending traps on Booker or double teaming Ayton, so that's pretty easy to sneak in for a layup when all the attention is on your stars and nobody is really worried or cares about you scoring. Mikal isn't even a high end role player, he's on the lower end of it.

So in that regard, you can easily apply Miles and even Knox down the road as he gets better to play those types of roles. Wilson Chandler had a role on a winning Nuggets squad too. So I mean if we really want to talk value when we have to consider the amount of help that needs to be present for that value to really mean something, then you can really just take any NBA player and put them in that scenario.

[Deeeez Knicks]

Facts

Troy Brown still that n*gga! He can run the point better than Frank no cap

You guys just don't value defense enough. Mikal is turning into one of the best defensive players in the league. And he is not a liability on offense with a 62% ts%. He does a little of everything. At #9/#10, you are most likely getting just a solid starter and Mikal is turning into that.

Not bpa, but still better then Miles/Knox.

Knox pretty much is a liability on both ends. Miles is ok, but just not efficient. A player like Mikal is more valuable

Some people value defense too much. This is an offense oriented league. You can't be a one way defensive player

True, but great teams all still defend and have guys like Mikal that play well off the ball and do the little things. You can't have 5 guys looking to iso and need the ball or you end up like the knicks.

Mikal is developing into a 2-way player.

Is that worth a #10 pick? Maybe. I mean your probably not getting Kawhi there. Most likely your just getting a solid player/starter.

Even looking at this draft, someone like Hali might be more along the lines of a Mikal where he isn't going to score a ton of points but does a lot of little things. I want to shoot for upside, but it is what it is when your picking later and its hard to nail every pick. If we end up with a solid starter im ok with that.

Again, just going back to the point i think Mikal was playing like a solid starter. Not the best player available but wouldn't call him a bust.

Would def prefer a star, but if we find a solid starter am ok with that.

[HEZI]

Role players come in different forms so it really depends on your construct as a team and what you need at that time. If you need a microwave scorer off the bench then that is more valuable than a 3/D stand in the corner catch and shoot wing. If you need a playmaking role player who will move the ball then that is more valuable than a 3/D wing. If you want a stretch 4? Slasher? Rebounder? Shot blocker? Role players come in different form so the value of one over the other really depends on the construct of the team and who needs what at that time.

[TheGreenArrow]

LaMelo ball folks LaMelo ball

[Deeeez Knicks]

Facts

Troy Brown still that n*gga! He can run the point better than Frank no cap

You guys just don't value defense enough. Mikal is turning into one of the best defensive players in the league. And he is not a liability on offense with a 62% ts%. He does a little of everything. At #9/#10, you are most likely getting just a solid starter and Mikal is turning into that.

Not bpa, but still better then Miles/Knox.

Knox pretty much is a liability on both ends. Miles is ok, but just not efficient. A player like Mikal is more valuable

It's a lot easier to appreciate Mikal when you realize he is who he is and you know what role he has. You plug him into lineup as a role player surrounded by stars and ask him to do two things and two things only, play defense on the perimeter and occasionally knock down a jumper, yeah there is value in that. You can do that when you have building blocks in place and stars capable of carrying the weight. You can't do that with a role player when you don't have the building pieces in place.

Mikal isn't even a lethal outside shooter. He averages 34% for his career on outside shots in 3 attempts a game. He's not even a sniper from deep, he's just capable but that's it. His efficiency comes from people sending traps on Booker or double teaming Ayton, so that's pretty easy to sneak in for a layup when all the attention is on your stars and nobody is really worried or cares about you scoring. Mikal isn't even a high end role player, he's on the lower end of it.

So in that regard, you can easily apply Miles and even Knox down the road as he gets better to play those types of roles. Wilson Chandler had a role on a winning Nuggets squad too. So I mean if we really want to talk value when we have to consider the amount of help that needs to be present for that value to really mean something, then you can really just take any NBA player and put them in that scenario.

True on needing stars, but odds are low on finding a star at #9/#10. Miles Bridges isnt a no star either last i checked

I dont see how he can be a good pick, and Mikal is a bad pick. I prefer Mikal, but they aren't that far apart either way. Its an ok pick for that range. It just is what it is in that the odds are low at finding a star.

And again, Mikal was coming around and Suns fans really seem to like him a lot.

24 games as a starter this year
11.4ppg/4.6rpg/2.7apg/1bpg/1.5spg/52%fg/42%3pt/66%ts, along with great defense and 1.5 3s a game.

Def benefits and is a nice fit on the sun's, but not everyone can do that and play great d.

Chandler was a good pick too. He was pretty decent before he got hurt.

[god shammgod]

i value good role players, i just don't value drafting them high in the lottery or overpaying them in free agency before you have the stars you need. i've seen many good teams change role players every other year and it doesn't really affect the team all that much. if you have the stars to build around, keeping a specific role player isn't nearly as important. they're a lot more replaceable. you can approximate their value to the team with a close to equivalent player quite often. why waste a high draft pick on someone who has very little potential to be better than that.

[god shammgod]

like if frank starts hitting 3s, he can be a good role player. but it will have taken him 4 years to become that. and so now faced with the fact that we have to pay him, unless he signs for cheap, the likely smart thing to do at this point is let him walk. you can find a similar player later when you have your main players in place.

[King of Canada]

.

Been following the BAF playoffs?